Jump to content
Dante Unbound: Share Bug Reports and Feedback Here! ×

Arbitrations, a missed opportunity. How I would try to improve them.


LordPantaloonsthe3rd
 Share

Recommended Posts

I was really excited for arbitration's back when they were announced but they ended up coming out in a state that is less than desirable. I know it seems a bit late to be posting a feedback thread on them but I wanted to give the mission type a good long time to work itself into my gameplay. I didnt want to do a dozen of the things over the course of two days then come and crap on it. I wanted to see how their existence would factor into what I do in warframe when I log in. After some time I can say that they are presence that is at best fading away in my mind.

Its not a matter of rewards, the drops are fine imo the problem is the missions themselves. If these missions were supposed to be geared towards veteran players why was it decided that arbitration drones would nuke and CC everything around them when they die? With the effect this has on the enemies you might as well rename arbitrations to "Drone Hunt" since its the only thing you actually need to do outside of cleaning up anything that survives the drone dying. That is if the drones actually appear, which sometimes depending on the tile they dont appear or they get stuck somewhere away from the fighting. When this happens it turns arbitrations into normal sortie3+ missions with nothing really special to them.

Additionally why were the Frame power and weapon boosts added? Last time I checked even my non-meta weapons could be classified as weapons of mass destruction so a potential 300% boost on top of that is hilarious overkill and frame power boosts? Aren't we already so powerful that content cant be balanced around our kit? Why do we need to be even stronger? When I went into an arbitration with a 300% boost to oberon my renewal was giving the entire team 980-ish armor and healing for around 160 hp/s. Thats far from unkillable if youre standing still letting the enemy shoot you but against corpus simply walking around at a normal pace is a good way to not get killed since almost all of their weapons are projectile based and with that kind of armor and healing on top of that.... How is the AI supposed to be able to deal with that exactly?

I get the feeling that the boosts were added to try to entice people into playing the mode with the draw of big numbers on their kit but really it ends up doing far far more harm that good to anyone who makes use of them or anyone who joins a game with other people making use of them.

As it stands now I rarely want to play arbitrations. They are far less appealing to me from a gameplay perspective due to how the drones affect enemies when they die and how far the power boosts skew the game. While the enemy level starts at 60 I feel like its actually less of a challenge than just running Mot and I struggle to find the will to carry on further than a few rotations because sniping drones and cleaning up whatever survives doesnt get anymore entertaining even when the enemy level is over 100.

So here's what I think might make this mode something worth playing(no particular order of importance, just what comes to mind)

1. Remove frame power and weapon power boosts completely- Obviously

2. Raise the starting level- Though this is a minor complaint as 60 is still loads better than starchart levels. Going back to 80 like it was before it was released would be nice but staying at 60 wouldnt be a bad thing as the enemy level would still pick up quicker than anywhere else outside of eso.

3. Remove the nuke and knockdown from drone explosions- It does too much damage and the knockdown gives the already hard pressed AI an even harder time of fighting us.

4. Have the invincibility affect from the drones taper off after a drone dies instead of disappearing immediately- For example, after a drone dies any previously affected enemies could have damage/status resistance that reduces over time say 15-20 seconds, starting at 95%-ish and reducing over time. This would make it so you actually still have something tough to fight after they lose their invincibility.

5. Add modifiers like you get on sorties that change every reward rotation- For example, elemental/physical resistances, disable primary/secondary/melee weapons, environmental hazards, reduced energy/health and more eximus units. There could also be shield/health drains, armor decay, temporary ability locking(like simaris does in ESO). Rotations of specific enemy types like an all Grineer heavy rotation consisting of only gunners, bombards, napalms and nox, or an all Ghoul rotation, or Corpus Terra units, or an all Corpus machine rotation with Raptors, Hyena packs, Ambulas and jackals.

 

Just some ideas I really want something I can sink my teeth into that isnt speedrunning eidolons and crabs. I wanted arbitrations to be that thing but as it stands right now it isnt. I think with changes like these or some others though that I could be.

Edited by LordPantaloonsthe3rd
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, LordPantaloonsthe3rd said:

So you dont think a more challenging, more dynamic game mode would be fun?

Challenging is up to personal calls, but dynamic yes; if the reward is good enough for the time - that could be fun. It all depends on how its handled. I don't consider just boosting enemy levels a way of doing that. For the most part though, I also wondered about the specific weapon and warframe boosts but largely viewed it as DE's way of encouraging completing one's collection of warframes and weapons - having them available and ready for higher than starchart missions. For the most part, my largest take away from playing arbitration is that its largely not worth the time used on fighting them. I feel that better rewards can act as proper incentives to make the mode more accepted while for now, I find the mode has very little activity.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 hours ago, Urlan said:

Challenging is up to personal calls, but dynamic yes; if the reward is good enough for the time - that could be fun. It all depends on how its handled. I don't consider just boosting enemy levels a way of doing that. For the most part though, I also wondered about the specific weapon and warframe boosts but largely viewed it as DE's way of encouraging completing one's collection of warframes and weapons - having them available and ready for higher than starchart missions. For the most part, my largest take away from playing arbitration is that its largely not worth the time used on fighting them. I feel that better rewards can act as proper incentives to make the mode more accepted while for now, I find the mode has very little activity.

Well it seems we disagree on whether or not the rewards are good enough and I doubt any conversation about that would yield any meaningful results. However I didn't just say "boost their levels" in regards to making the missions harder I did say it would be nice but keeping them at 60 would also be fine. The rest of my points were geared towards mission modifiers and changes to the arbitration drones. Which I feel would do far more to enhance the mission difficulty than just bumping their levels to fluff their numbers.

I can also see where you're coming from with your thoughts on the frame/weapon boosts and I agree that could also be a contributing factor towards to decision to add them. I still think it was a mistake to add them and I think that having them at all is a detriment, even if they were reduced from 300% to 100% or less.

As far as I'm concerned the rewards are very much secondary to the fun I would have fighting worthy enemies, more of a cherry on top type thing. I was wanting arbitrations to be a challenge that was rewarding in the accomplishment of playing and winning more than rewarding in the monetary sense. As they are now they are very much not the former while at least in my mind somewhat accomplish the latter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, LordPantaloonsthe3rd said:

Well it seems we disagree on whether or not the rewards are good enough and I doubt any conversation about that would yield any meaningful results. However I didn't just say "boost their levels" in regards to making the missions harder I did say it would be nice but keeping them at 60 would also be fine. The rest of my points were geared towards mission modifiers and changes to the arbitration drones. Which I feel would do far more to enhance the mission difficulty than just bumping their levels to fluff their numbers.

I can also see where you're coming from with your thoughts on the frame/weapon boosts and I agree that could also be a contributing factor towards to decision to add them. I still think it was a mistake to add them and I think that having them at all is a detriment, even if they were reduced from 300% to 100% or less.

As far as I'm concerned the rewards are very much secondary to the fun I would have fighting worthy enemies, more of a cherry on top type thing. I was wanting arbitrations to be a challenge that was rewarding in the accomplishment of playing and winning more than rewarding in the monetary sense. As they are now they are very much not the former while at least in my mind somewhat accomplish the latter.

Which is absolutely fine, everyone has different ideas of what is fun to them personally. I agree that if the majority of players - not the minority of veteran players - feel the mode needs more stress over rewards, then it should be changed to be so.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 2019-01-16 at 4:31 PM, Urlan said:

Which is absolutely fine, everyone has different ideas of what is fun to them personally. I agree that if the majority of players - not the minority of veteran players - feel the mode needs more stress over rewards, then it should be changed to be so.

There should be a challenging mode for veteran players though, thats what arbitrations were billed as at first then DE went and nerfed them so anyone fresh out of the starchart could manage it. Leaving anyone that wanted an actual challenge out in the cold...again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, LordPantaloonsthe3rd said:

There should be a challenging mode for veteran players though, thats what arbitrations were billed as at first then DE went and nerfed them so anyone fresh out of the starchart could manage it. Leaving anyone that wanted an actual challenge out in the cold...again.

I am a veteran, and I can see that Arbitration and Onslaught are both aimed at that audience of players as is. They don't get much usage in my opinion at least, due to not having very good rewards as incentive. Few allies that I take along with me are willing to run them a second time due to just how unrewarding the missions are, and they prove very little being just less rewarding no revive endless missions. Endless missions which we already run primarily due to non-endless being unrewarding. Veterans are not being left out in the cold, but I would agree that for some players seeking only a challenge, then perhaps Arbitrations are still not that; I would contend though that any mode deserving of design time must be made to be approachable by the majority of players rather than the minority or just get the conclave and Trials situation all over again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...