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pook-pook

What I think the is only meaningful fix to Arbitrations (and other "end game" content)

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This post does include suggestions, read on, would love to hear your thoughts!

Arbitrations as they stand today are a fun, challenging game mode that I enjoy playing with my friends and random pugs alike. Until we start dropping to "one-shot" kills, wondering what it even was that killed us.

In almost every Arbitration I've done, at least one has dropped and wondered what the heck actually killed them.

The only change I'd make to Arbitrations is to address that. I fully realise that "one-shot" (or just "sudden") kills of players is a broader issue. So yeah, I'm effectively saying: leave Arbitrations alone and please address the deeper, broader-than-just-Arbitrations issue.

Things to consider:

  • Number one, until other things could be designed and implemented: a kill cam telling us how we died ("you had a viral proc, and a toxin proc, and were hit by a 100,000 damage shot from your radiation-proc'd Chroma team mate, also you were being energy leeched and nullified"), at least giving us some indication of what we might do next time to address it, if that's even possible.
  • Replace current shield implementation with something that works. EHP scales with armor, which you can use to scale up resilience to high level content. Shields just evaporate in the face of high level content. Shield gating has been dismissed. Perhaps it's time to think of a completely different shielding mechanism.
  • Clearer visibility of energy leeching. This is niche, but is critical to survivability built around energy pool and Quick Thinking. It's frustrating in the extreme to suddenly realise that your EHP (aka energy pool) is drained and you don't even know the source of it.

This also applies to other very high level "end game" content which results in sudden player kills (the Profit Taker battle is a good example).

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1 hour ago, pook-pook said:
  • Number one, until other things could be designed and implemented: a kill cam telling us how we died ("you had a viral proc, and a toxin proc, and were hit by a 100,000 damage shot from your radiation-proc'd Chroma team mate, also you were being energy leeched and nullified"), at least giving us some indication of what we might do next time to address it, if that's even possible.
  •  

Shouldn't be too hard, it's in the EE.log

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5 hours ago, Kylo. said:

Shouldn't be too hard, it's in the EE.log

Hmm. Now I'm researching how to write my own thing to display EE.log information as an overlay on top of Warframe. I don't know really much at all about Windows programming though, so I'm struggling to even find any initial information (some hints about "DLL injection" which sound dangerous in an anticheat-ban kinda way). Ideally, DE would add this to their game for me 🙂

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On 2019-01-27 at 5:18 AM, pook-pook said:

Hmm. Now I'm researching how to write my own thing to display EE.log information as an overlay on top of Warframe. I don't know really much at all about Windows programming though, so I'm struggling to even find any initial information (some hints about "DLL injection" which sound dangerous in an anticheat-ban kinda way). Ideally, DE would add this to their game for me 🙂

Rather than interfering with the game (which would possibly be dangerous) I would run in borderless fullscreen and set your form to always show on top. Not sure what language you are using but this thread would be useful if using .NET.

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/683330/how-to-make-a-window-always-stay-on-top-in-net

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Yes I agree that I'd love to at least know what killed me. Because it really is a feelsbadman when my frame just suddenly falls over and I don't know why. I've had it occur to me a few times where I died from a toxin proc that I didn't notice on my UI. But I'm focused on the game. I may tend to miss that toxin proc icon. So when I die now, I have to wonder, "Was it a toxin proc that I didn't notice?" 

Knowing what killed me can act as a sort of behavioral training (for me at least) so for e.g. next time I can try to pay more attention to what procced me etc.

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On 2019-01-26 at 8:18 PM, pook-pook said:

 

  • Number one, until other things could be designed and implemented: a kill cam telling us how we died ("you had a viral proc, and a toxin proc, and were hit by a 100,000 damage shot from your radiation-proc'd Chroma team mate, also you were being energy leeched and nullified"), at least giving us some indication of what we might do next time to address it, if that's even possible.

I agree, a kill cam of some sort would be really cool

  • Replace current shield implementation with something that works. EHP scales with armor, which you can use to scale up resilience to high level content. Shields just evaporate in the face of high level content. Shield gating has been dismissed. Perhaps it's time to think of a completely different shielding mechanism.

There's other ways to make yourself tanky, really. Use an ancient healer specter, change your build a little bit to include more survivability mods, use arcane guardians, etc. 

  • Clearer visibility of energy leeching. This is niche, but is critical to survivability built around energy pool and Quick Thinking. It's frustrating in the extreme to suddenly realise that your EHP (aka energy pool) is drained and you don't even know the source of it.

It can be frustrating, but you get used to it. Just practice keeping an eye on your energy, and if you see it draining too fast rest assured there's a leech somewhere. They tend to hide behind corners and whatnot. Just get some distance between you and where the mobs are coming from to get out of reach of the leech and drop an energy pizza while you look for him. You'll get used to spotting them more easily. 

My replies are in bold

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Am 26.1.2019 um 23:18 schrieb pook-pook:

Replace current shield implementation with something that works. EHP scales with armor, which you can use to scale up resilience to high level content. Shields just evaporate in the face of high level content. Shield gating has been dismissed. Perhaps it's time to think of a completely different shielding mechanism.

Im 100% with you on this.

 

Shield gating might have been dismissed a long time ago because "you dont get killed in 1 but in 2 hits then". But:

  • even that would be better than what we have now
  • if that doesnt work, i agree they have to think about something different

 

vor 10 Stunden schrieb --END--Rikutatis:

There's other ways to make yourself tanky, really. Use an ancient healer specter, change your build a little bit to include more survivability mods, use arcane guardians, etc. 

At some point all that doesnt matter.

If you dont want to stay long in a mission to see it, just spawn a few high level enemies in the simularum, i did that with clanmates recently just for fun to play around with some enemies, and some dont even care if you are a max-ehp inaros with all the arcanes in the world or a frame with 90% damage reduction - you are dead as soon as they see you even when you are bullet-jumping and rolling around like a madman.

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3 hours ago, DreisterDino said:

...

At some point all that doesnt matter.

If you dont want to stay long in a mission to see it, just spawn a few high level enemies in the simularum, i did that with clanmates recently just for fun to play around with some enemies, and some dont even care if you are a max-ehp inaros with all the arcanes in the world or a frame with 90% damage reduction - you are dead as soon as they see you even when you are bullet-jumping and rolling around like a madman.

I'm curious as to what kind of build you were running when you did those tests then. I find that even in relatively squishier frames like excal umbra or khora, the breaking point where enemies start to one shot you regardless of your defenses or a healing specter is around lvl 350-400+

Here's a couple examples of endless runs I did with them: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OjgO9tt-kY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NrfeDhf4ELI

With tank frames like Nidus, you can go to enemy levels well over 1k before they start one shotting you, like here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QHXFrR-524M

 

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On 2019-01-29 at 11:31 PM, Shalath said:

Rather than interfering with the game (which would possibly be dangerous) I would run in borderless fullscreen and set your form to always show on top. Not sure what language you are using but this thread would be useful if using .NET. 

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/683330/how-to-make-a-window-always-stay-on-top-in-net

Ooh, thanks for the pointer!

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