Anthem and what Warframe can learn from it

[Zeclem]

8 minutes ago, DatDarkOne said:

Actually that rate equation was/is based on the general conversion rates of premium currency of some other games like Overwatch for example.  It's based on the conversion rate of 1 shard(premium) = $.01.  So, it wasn't something pulled out of their arse, but based on usual conversion rates from some other games.  

Edit:  The real thing is whether EA keeps either the same rate and/or the same purchase cost for cosmetics.  This is the thing we don't know for sure.  BUT going by EA's previous track record, it doesn't look good.  

and how other games values effect this games value? thats as good as making up a random number anyway. 

while yes, EA's track record is, well, worse than S#&$. but one would expect that their suits actually learned their mistake now since their stock price is plummeting ever since the battlefront2 bullS#&$tery and stuff thats going around other big publishers as well. maybe im too optimistic, but i just dont think anybody who knows a few about economics should know that ea needs to clean their name if they want to stop losing money. 

[Falconer777]

9 часов назад, D1sTrust сказал:

I am quite new to Warframe, I started playing about a month ago, actually due to the comments on an Anthem preview. 😉
Discovering Warframe I feel like Alice in Wonderland, it has such a unique design, so much to learn about, so many crazy little things.
And of course the quite special movement/combat, which reminds me of the good old Quake3 times in terms of finesse (Sorry DE, I know you were on the Unreal side...;))

On the Anthem demo I see nothing like that, which is why it doesn`t hook me. Frankly I was bored before the first mission ended, and then forced myself through two more in order to give it a fair chance. It just all feels generic, nothing is bad, but nothing stands out either. In terms of combat I had more fun with Andromeda tbh..
Of course in the end it`s just personal preference, I am sure Anthem will have it`s fans too.

So, to relate to the topic title, aside from the general "something can be learned from everything" I don`t see much for Warframe to learn here.

Same. I passed several missions - and that’s all, I didn’t even go further. In addition, the game constantly flew after each mission. You mentioned Quake ... I remembered that the very last Doom (2016) i had not yet passed)) That's probably what I'll do)

[DatDarkOne]

9 minutes ago, Zeclem said:

maybe im too optimistic, but i just dont think anybody who knows a few about economics should know that ea needs to clean their name if they want to stop losing money. 

Anyone with even a hint of sense would think this.  Sadly I have been an eye witness to how much EA has changed for the worst over the years starting all the way back in 2005.  While I would like for them to change, I just don't see them doing it soon.  Which doubly sux for Bioware. 

I really want Anthem to be successful for two reasons.  First so Bioware doesn't possibly get shutdown as EA tends to do to studios, and second is that Anthem is competition that sparks more from DE and Warframe.  Which would be great for us as players. 

Edited February 4, 2019 by DatDarkOne

[Zeclem]

1 minute ago, DatDarkOne said:

Anyone with even a hint of sense would think this.  Sadly I have been an eye witness to how much EA has changed for the worst over the starting all the way back in 2005.  While I would like for them to change, I just don't see them doing it soon.  Which doubly sux for Bioware. 

I really want Anthem to be successful for two reasons.  First so Bioware doesn't possibly get shutdown as EA tends to do to studios, and second is that Anthem is competition that sparks more from DE and Warframe.  Which would be great for us as players. 

i still miss those days when i loved ea for making games like nfs underground 2 and tiberium wars series. ea pls go back to those. 

[rune_me]

9 hours ago, ChaoticEdge said:

I know, it just that players don't really seem to care to combo the things, grenade launcher just 1 shot no combo. rocket launcher to the floor for no combo, Shotgun shoot in the face and no combo.  the system of combo is simple has no taste in the game.  At the time being everything is put into improvised.

Ah okay, that's fair. From playing the demo, it doesn't seem you can really ignore combos in Anthem, though. It really is the difference between taking half a minute to bring down a bullet-sponge grunt, or killing a whole flock of them in a couple of seconds. This of course is only based on the demo, so take it with a grain of salt. Things may be very different when we have the full game.

[Veridian]

I'll honestly wait a few months, since I have quite a few worries about how the game will play out:

1. No trading at all

2. Cosmetics purchasable with premium currency, which in turn is only acquired through more $$$ and that's just at launch. (EA has never backed out on a word after all /s). Let's not pretend that the way currency can be acquired in game will be sufficient.

3. If it has even remotely the levels of grind that Warframe has. Coupled with pt. 1 and longer missions it will be hell to get anywhere.

4. I have a nagging feeling that the usual hamster wheel of MMOs would be applied, in this case no thanks.

5. The solo potential, having teammates is nice and all, but "team play" is the scourge of modern gaming, especially when 80% have no idea what they're doing.

6. Bioware have never been known for their amazing fighting mechanics, something around which this game is focused. They became famous because of their amazing worlds and stories, which is perfect for an SP game, not an MMO. Just see how TOR worked out, given they did copy WoW.

7. The entire progress model may be somewhat similar to a mobile game, thus impossible without certain "buffs", but also in a 60$ package.

8. Anything Bioware released after ME3 was garbage.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Ver1dian

[Kaotyke]

6 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

Riiiight.

I'm not sure what that has to do with anything, but sure.

I think its because Couconut forgot to put the "/s" at the end of that phrase.

Quote

It makes me think it was this price for the demo specifically, and prices will change on launch. /s

The person he quoted made it sound like 25 Gold for each cosmetic is the final price that will be in the game when it fully launches.

[(PSN)cjdreadful]

Why do we feel the need to make two games even more similar? Even Steve said "warframes=javelins" so even the devs agree they are pretty alike. Let anthem have its glory(or utter downfall) and warframe it's own. 

The ONLY thing anthem has that I wish warframe would implement is a difficulty dial that shows the scaling and the drop chances. But we were asking for that before anthem was even a thing.

[SneakyErvin]

16 hours ago, Zeclem said:

actually, thats not completely true. higher tier gear also has more special effects to allow more different playstyles rather than just generic number boosts.

Yeah that doesnt make it any better. I've already played a few games with those systems of progressions and they last a week or two, then you have it all and sit there wondering "how is this different from when I was level 1?". You do the same thing, you feel roughly the same difficulty (or lack there of) and have nothing to look forward to.

Martyr used the same system, it was pretty much dead after the first month. Top tier items were stat sticks with a unique perk on them.

Thunderhammer had something like "20% chance on hit to deal double damage and heal for the amount of damage dealt".

Warp Rods had something like "deal 10% extra damage for each negative effect on the enemy". You could dual wield these for +20% damage per effect.

Greatswords had "Gain your deflect chance as extra damage"

Armor could have "20% chance on crit to recieve a Rosarius effect" i.e you got a 3 second immunity shield.

Completely boring and lackluster effects on otherwise very generic stat sticks. And once you had the pieces you needed, you could never find an upgrade.

 

[Zeclem]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yeah that doesnt make it any better. I've already played a few games with those systems of progressions and they last a week or two, then you have it all and sit there wondering "how is this different from when I was level 1?". You do the same thing, you feel roughly the same difficulty (or lack there of) and have nothing to look forward to.

Martyr used the same system, it was pretty much dead after the first month. Top tier items were stat sticks with a unique perk on them.

Thunderhammer had something like "20% chance on hit to deal double damage and heal for the amount of damage dealt".

Warp Rods had something like "deal 10% extra damage for each negative effect on the enemy". You could dual wield these for +20% damage per effect.

Greatswords had "Gain your deflect chance as extra damage"

Armor could have "20% chance on crit to recieve a Rosarius effect" i.e you got a 3 second immunity shield.

Completely boring and lackluster effects on otherwise very generic stat sticks. And once you had the pieces you needed, you could never find an upgrade.

except you dont do the same thing. and even if that was the case, why are you playing warframe then? its not exactly different here. 

[Guest]

7 hours ago, Zeclem said:

i still miss those days when i loved ea for making games like nfs underground 2 and tiberium wars series. ea pls go back to those. 

Don't worry, we'll get a C&C mobile game because that's totally what everyone asked for.

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, Pr1A said:

Don't worry, we'll get a C&C mobile game because that's totally what everyone asked for.

We all have phones, right?

[SneakyErvin]

1 hour ago, Zeclem said:

except you dont do the same thing. and even if that was the case, why are you playing warframe then? its not exactly different here. 

I dont really think you get the point or idea of why it is bad.

In WF or most other games you have actual levels of enemies, things gradually get harder (though WF is a power fantasy in that regard). In a PL based game like Anthem and Martyr which I mentioned there is just an illusion of progress because you are in reality getting nowhere. It may be less noticable in Anthem because it may not be visually present except on a difficulty option screen or something. But it is still there. It isnt even comparable to the open-ended game that WF is when it comes to progression, few games actually are. Progression here is simply for ourselves what we make it. Pets, weapons, frames, mods, MR, standing etc. There are so many different progression paths to pick from and they all bring us something we need or want.

In Martyr you have strict PL values on gear and missions, so the game plays out 99% the same if you do a PL500 mission at PL250 as it would if you played a PL2500 mission at PL2250. The mobs will do X% more damage to you'll deal Y% less to them. The baseline damage from both of you is the same, so it wouldnt matter how high or low you go aslong as the PL difference is the same. This in turn makes it completely pointless to progress. After you reach level 25 iirc in Martyr you've gotten to the point where gear will have the highest possible stats (well that is semi true becasue the devs added 0.5 extra to certain stats when they released level 60 gear, just because people had complained about the boring system), so the only thing to advance you after that is power levels on gear. This in order to balance stat gains so you dont have 2 million HP and +5000% physical damage at max level etc.

It may look good at paper but in reality it is a complete trash system even if it avoids the inflated damage and health numbers.

So the only things that may actually change are the mobs you fight and the environment, but that gets old after a few play throughs when there is nothing to hunt from said mobs or anything to build further on your character.

[Arcira]

I like how the post is about what anthem does good and what warframe could lern and the first comments I read are things like "the loading screen bug sucks", "we don´t need more powercreep" and "warframe is the better game".

[Rakosta_Kai]

17 minutes ago, Arcira said:

I like how the post is about what anthem does good and what warframe could lern and the first comments I read are things like "the loading screen bug sucks", "we don´t need more powercreep" and "warframe is the better game".

To be fair, your post hasn't addressed the question either.

The general consensus appears to be skins, vinyls, and a color wheel (which will never happen),

Since DE moved to cosmetics as their sustainable revenuer generator forever ago ..None of these are things DE needs to learn insomuch as folks would like them to choose to adopt them... In that case, Anthem wouldn't have taught anything because players have been asking for more of these for years anyway.

The real question is:

What can Anthem learn from Warframe?

The short answer would be.. How to remain profitable for 5 years.

[Arcira]

5 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

To be fair, your post hasn't addressed the question either.

I´m always for improvements and gameplay additions. In fact there is no reason to be against them other than development time in my opinion. Nonetheless a lot of the comments are just random bashing on new ideas and I think it´s important to point them out.

16 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

The general consensus appears to be skins, vinyls, and a color wheel (which will never happen),

Since DE moved to cosmetics as their sustainable revenuer generator forever ago ..None of these are things DE needs to learn insomuch as folks would like them to choose to adopt them... In that case, Anthem wouldn't have taught anything because players have been asking for more of these for years anyway.

You are right nothing of this is really a new idea and no one said Anthem is the perfect game. But that doesn´t mean if a game shows how certain things can be done you are not allowed to take inspiration or lern from it.

Also you can´t know for sure whether something is profitable or not if you don´t try it. I´m not saying every single suggestion need to be tested but if a reasonable amount of people are interested it might be worth a try. Some people love to confuse success with knowledge or effort. There are far more factors which affect the end result like lack of competion or even more simple things like luck. It´s arrogant and dangerous to think you are on the top because you are the best.

21 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

The real question is:

What can Anthem learn from Warframe?

The short answer would be.. How to remain profitable for 5 years.

Definitely disagree on this one. Again I´m not saying there isn´t anything they can improve on but we are in a Warframe not Athem forum.

[(PSN)Boardtodeath_TV]

Do you have ANY Idea on how much Anthem can learn from Warframe? lol 😉 

 

[Rakosta_Kai]

16 minutes ago, Arcira said:

I´m always for improvements and gameplay additions. In fact there is no reason to be against them other than development time in my opinion. Nonetheless a lot of the comments are just random bashing on new ideas and I think it´s important to point them out.

Because bashing the bashers makes sense?

As you noted...

17 minutes ago, Arcira said:

we are in a Warframe not Athem forum.

An Anthem love fest doesn't go here...You should expect a defense stance to be adopted on home ground.

When/If Anthem gets a forum (don't hold your breath... Bioware can be fairly thin-skinned) it should probably go there instead.

19 minutes ago, Arcira said:

You are right nothing of this is really a new idea and no one said Anthem is the perfect game. But that doesn´t mean if a game shows how certain things can be done you are not allowed to take inspiration or lern from it.

Also you can´t know for sure whether something is profitable or not if you don´t try it. I´m not saying every single suggestion need to be tested but if a reasonable amount of people are interested it might be worth a try. Some people love to confuse success with knowledge or effort. There are far more factors which affect the end result like lack of competion or even more simple things like luck. It´s arrogant and dangerous to think you are on the top because you are the best.

Actually it doesn't mean any of those things...

DE chose not to continue adding "vinyls" (Immortal Skins) long ago and only chose to add a new, conditional type, recently with Garuda's pack.

Why they chose to stop adding them is anyone's guess...I would imagine it's due to generic options not being possible given the number of unique models and specific not being as profitable personally.

What we do know is that if the original Immortal skins were profitable they would have kept doing them...Because DE likes money.

As to the rest?  I don't know what in the heck you are on about as it's all hyper-assumptive.

...You are literally are making assumptions on assumptions.

It's enough to say that competition is good is good for players... That makes vastly more sense than berating imaginary people and what you've perceived as their opinions.

Kindly take that nonsense to the Anthem forums if you ever get one.

 

 

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

On 2019-02-02 at 10:03 AM, rune_me said:

Anthem has better fashionframe, better movement/traversal (in my opinion), better enemy design, better AI (obviously, but that's hardly an accomplish since any AI is better than Warframe's). There's lots Warframe does better, but there's certainly plenty Warframe could learn from Anthem. 

enjoy the illusion , but wont change my mind

[ChaoticEdge]

9 hours ago, rune_me said:

Ah okay, that's fair. From playing the demo, it doesn't seem you can really ignore combos in Anthem, though. It really is the difference between taking half a minute to bring down a bullet-sponge grunt, or killing a whole flock of them in a couple of seconds. This of course is only based on the demo, so take it with a grain of salt. Things may be very different when we have the full game.

that depends for it work or not.

Edited February 4, 2019 by ChaoticEdge

[OniDax]

To the people in this thread who are bent out of shape because the OP decided to make a thread called "Anthem and what Warframe can learn from it": you guys are way too afraid of Anthem, and way too offended at the notion that Warframe has something to learn from something else. Warframe isn't a perfect game. Anthem isn't a perfect game. No game is perfect, and therefore all games can learn from one another. Most of the toxicity that is out there towards Anthem comes from Warframe players (just go look at Reddit and YouTube comments, and even comments on this thread), toxicity that is not reciprocated towards Warframe (because Warframe is largely irrelevant to non-Warframe players). Half of you are just jealous that it is getting attention that Warframe isn't getting. At the end of the day, it isn't a big deal. You're all bent out of shape for no reason at all. Let Anthem be Anthem and stop getting upset that some people want to see DE learn from things others are doing right.

Yes, there are some things Warframe can learn from Anthem, and yes, you are right, there are things Anthem can learn from Warframe. At the end of the day, it's about Warframe becoming a better game. The people who think Warframe can learn from another game aren't saying that because they hate Warframe. If they did, they'd just rant about how Warframe is awful and they'd walk away. The reason they're suggesting Warframe can learn is because they want Warframe to get better. They actually like the game, to some degree. So there is no need for vitriol, no need for an Us vs. Them mentality, no need to vehemently push back against the notion that Warframe isn't perfect. And guess what? Warframe adopting some things that are currently better in other games only creates more reason to play Warframe and not those other games. And to those on the opposite end of the spectrum, it's ok that people think Warframe has nothing to learn from Anthem.

 

11 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Because bashing the bashers makes sense?

As you noted...

An Anthem love fest doesn't go here...You should expect a defense stance to be adopted on home ground.

When/If Anthem gets a forum (don't hold your breath... Bioware can be fairly thin-skinned) it should probably go there instead.

Actually it doesn't mean any of those things...

DE chose not to continue adding "vinyls" (Immortal Skins) long ago and only chose to add a new, conditional type, recently with Garuda's pack.

Why they chose to stop adding them is anyone's guess...I would imagine it's due to generic options not being possible given the number of unique models and specific not being as profitable personally.

What we do know is that if the original Immortal skins were profitable they would have kept doing them...Because DE likes money.

As to the rest?  I don't know what in the heck you are on about as it's all hyper-assumptive.

...You are literally are making assumptions on assumptions.

It's enough to say that competition is good is good for players... That makes vastly more sense than berating imaginary people and what you've perceived as their opinions.

Kindly take that nonsense to the Anthem forums if you ever get one.

 

 

It's probably because of Tennogen. It is, in all respects (imo), better than immortal skins, and certainly more profitable.

[DeMonkey]

31 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

When/If Anthem gets a forum (don't hold your breath... Bioware can be fairly thin-skinned) it should probably go there instead.

"Anthem and what Warframe can learn from it" would be better suited to the Anthem forum? I know GD isn't the right place to be putting feedback for DE, but there's absolutely no chance of them reading it on an entirely separate forum.

28 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

What we do know is that if the original Immortal skins were profitable they would have kept doing them...Because DE likes money.

Not so sure about that, they have kept doing them, but the occasional one has been released via Baro instead of platinum. In fact, there's absolutely no platinum purchase for them at all, which I heavily disagree with.

So profit aside, DE have still found the time to make them, but haven't attempted to monetise them. I'd have bought them, I'm sure many others would have bought them.

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, (PS4)Boardtodeath_TV said:

Do you have ANY Idea on how much Anthem can learn from Warframe? lol 😉 

-snip-

Please stop with these clickbaity, zero-effort comparison videos. We already had enough of those with Destiny 2.

Edited February 4, 2019 by Guest

[Arcira]

19 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Because bashing the bashers makes sense?

Maybe, maybe not. I´m trying to expose hate and fake arguments. This will probably not change the behaviour of those people because I think they are quite aware of what they are doing and why. But it might help others who are a little bit more open minded.

19 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

As you noted...

An Anthem love fest doesn't go here...You should expect a defense stance to be adopted on home ground.

When/If Anthem gets a forum (don't hold your breath... Bioware can be fairly thin-skinned) it should probably go there instead.

I don´t care about Anthem yet nor did I play it thus I have no real opinion on the game so far. And it doesn´t matter because what I said is true for other games likewise.

In addition you didn´t even reply to the context of the sentence. Those and other similar comments make me feel people are on a personal crusade against anything that isn´t warframe. I like warframe but I can accept if another game do something good or even better.

19 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Actually it doesn't mean any of those things...

DE chose not to continue adding "vinyls" (Immortal Skins) long ago and only chose to add a new, conditional type, recently with Garuda's pack.

Why they chose to stop adding them is anyone's guess...I would imagine it's due to generic options not being possible given the number of unique models and specific not being as profitable personally.

What we do know is that if the original Immortal skins were profitable they would have kept doing them...Because DE likes money.

Not sure what you want to tell me here.

20 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

As to the rest?  I don't know what in the heck you are on about as it's all hyper-assumptive.

...You are literally are making assumptions on assumptions.

It's enough to say that competition is good is good for players... That makes vastly more sense than berating imaginary people and what you've perceived as their opinions.

Kindly take that nonsense to the Anthem forums if you ever get one.

Essentially anything I say or write is an assumption and I´m willing to lern where my logic is flawed. What exactly do you disagree with and why?

- you need to test something to be sure it doesn´t work

- if people are interested it can be worth a try

- you shouldn´t assume you are the best only based on your success

 

[Zeclem]

3 hours ago, SneakyErvin said:

(though WF is a power fantasy in that regard)

exactly my point. things in wf doesnt change either. only thing that changes are, just like anthem, numbers. enemies hit harder and so will you. only difference is in anthem you get progression from doing that, in warframe de actively avoids that to keep content "bite sized" for some reason.