Anthem and what Warframe can learn from it

[Corvid]

14 minutes ago, brucifer1 said:

Which is why Warframes which were supposedly designed to kill Sentients in the old war require you to exit your warframe and fight as the operator to damage an Eidelon. At least Anthem doesn't require you to jump out of your Javelin to fight or collect Kuva

From what we know, Eidolons weren't a thing back then. They're specifically the result of what Gara and the Unum did to a certain fleet mind.

While Teralyst-based combat forms may have been on the frontlines in the Old War, it's entirely possible that they lacked the shielding of the kind we see today.

[Birkenhoff]

What Anthem might learn from Warframe: Staying in business for that long.

This game hasn't even been released and people compare game mechanics and...stuff.

[Myscho]

27 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said:

Is that the aerial hover portion?..

Yep, because flying with Interceptor is just fuken great, more seamless, feel alive like actually controling suit, not just something oversized to fit into space

[fatpig84]

The Combo systems existed since ME2 and ME3. 
Bioware even use it in Mass Effect: Andromeda, so I am not sure what's so ground breaking about it dating back in 2009 and 2010. 
It has being 10 years and I am not surprised Bioware uses it for Anthem, because it is kinda their schtick.

As for warframe, hahah no. Enemies still die extremely fast even in sortie difficulty.
Combos worked for Mass effect because it is a cover shooter and your TTK (time to kill) is low without it.
Anthem for what it seems you don't need to take cover as much, but people still need to take cover if they play wrongly.

In Warframe, your TTK is measured in 0.X of a second in regular content and single digit in sortie level content as long you are using any weapon with decent loving (IE forma and potato).
So combos will just be inefficient at best. Even the majority of players in Warframe rarely even synchronize their powers.

So combos ? Ain't got time for that mate !

[fatpig84]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Lun-Sei said:

Hey, you know the one and only thing that Warframe can and should learn from Anthem?

The fact that you play as an adult guy INSIDE the exosuit, not as an annoying emo brat sitting safely in the base.

 

 

That sounds ridiculously low tech. Iron man 3 remote controlled suits are the rightful way to go, so you don't put the operator at risk.
Not withstanding that Tony Stark had his Ultron issues which forced him to dial back on AI and remote suit development.

Warframe doesn't have this issue because the frames and operators are linked by Ze Void™ and the powers of empathy™ thus very difficult to remotely hijack.
The only way to hijack frames so far have being physical means like a Collar or Kuva Queen soul punching the kid out.
So Transference is definitely the way to go. You can lose frames, but you don't lose the operator.

It is the same reason why modern warfare are so big on drones and unmanned aircraft because the operator that you spent years training won't die.
You can build something really quick, but to train a new guy to be proficient does take a while.
 

 

[Kaotyke]

10 minutes ago, fatpig84 said:

It is the same reason why modern warfare are so big on drones and unmanned aircraft

Thats the Ace Combat 7 plot in a nutshell.

[(XBOX)SilverSurferGuy]

Warframe and anthem are two different games for different moods. Both may be centered around a movement system but they’re too different to be applied to one another. Btw, how much more customization could you possibly want in warframe? Warframe has the deepest customization of any game in the market. There’s a reason it’s nicknamed fashion frame. Furthermore, there’s nothing wrong with warframes status system. You can easily switch to a secondary or melee to apply status then switch to you primary. Plus there’s really only two status effects people care about: slash and corrosive procs. Bleed damage ignores all defense while corrosion strips armor. If you can strip armor at the very least you can take on the toughest enemies. Your title says what Warframe can learn from anthem. I think it’s the other way around. Not just what anthem can learn from Warframe but what EA, and pretty much the rest of the AAA sphere, can learn from DE. In all honesty, I’m not excited for anthem at all despite how good it looks and plays for the sole reason that it’s EA publishing it. I have next to no good expectations. In fact, I predict it’ll come out with flaws that I’ve come to expect from EA: lack of content, an incomplete state at launch, and an outrageous season pass OR ridiculous micro transactions. 

[Sloan441]

Don't sell the farm to EA. 

[taiiat]

7 hours ago, Dhrekr said:

True, Mass Effect input flavour through its powers - such as, say, the biotic effect of Singularity being completely different by the biotic effect of Reave, despite both having the same "element". Still, their elemental system was tremendously simple - 4 elements, 3 procs, 1 combo. Warframe has more elements than that.

(That said, I do not know how Anthem works, I don't know that it works like in ME3, and my answer was explicitly aimed at what OP suggested).

which was the exact point :)
that "Biowares' system" has kept it from getting out of hand in the past(and the results certainly matched the situations you'd want to use them for in the first place), and they'll probably be doing something similar this time as well. so if people want to take notes, i would probably take notes based on that.

- - - - - - - - - - 

4 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

No levels in the traditional sense, but only in difficulty scales.

Same as selecting Easy/Normal/Hard/Very Hard/Dante Must Die in other games: Increased enemy damage output, HP and (if what the devs said is true) better AI tactics.

The last one is particually important, since they dont have levels and seemly static stats on the weapons, the enemies will have time to apply those tactics. Such thing is very rare in Warframe because of its horde genre and the sheer power of the players.

 

2 hours ago, (PS4)Fireworker77 said:

The AI is definitly something special here. Naturally you can't test it that good in a demo but sometimes (especially human enemies) tried to outflank me, get higher grounds or use multiple basic tactics to get me away from cover. (Deploying explosives that bypass my shielding, rush into my shields into close combat, snipers trying to jetpack to higher ground behind me, forming smaller squads and even retreat to better cover.)

The problem here is, you have to let them play that out. If WF really has something to learn it would be better coordinated attacks and squads like the G3 with some sense of "combat movement". And here is also the big problem:

Why use tactics when everything gets shredded in mere seconds. Maybe the WF AI is also very good but we never see that because they never live long enough to actually use tactics. (I have often seen minor Corpus units trying to stay closer to "Ice Eximus" or Nullifier Fields, maybe to be better protected. But in the End it doens't make any difference in WF.

Enemies in Warframe do infact do all of those things, indeed. use Cover, go between Cover, have Units act as a meatshield to get other Units closer, Flanking, surrounding the Target, Et Cetera.

however, in Anthem as well.... you can delete just about anything in a few seconds so the Enemies in Anthem aren't likely to deploy these actions that often either. yes, you can still delete Medium/Heavy Enemies on 'Hard' even in that 'Demo'. Bosses will seemingly get their opportunity to use their tools, but so do most Bosses in most Games, in one way or another.

- - - - - - - - - - 

1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said:

↑ That's why...

For example, I liked the Colossus....

• I did not enjoy trying to keep pace with the faster javelins (which was all of them)
• I did not enjoy the ability to get stunlocked to death because he wasn't quite fast enough to get out of freeze patches under heavy fire.

...Sometimes theme can get in the way if it's not fully accounted for. 

mind, even in that 'Demo', the Colussus could get a Health Bar that basically went off the edge of the screen, so it is definitely getting some positives for the negatives that it has.
ala being able to literally go AFK in front of a Boss while your Team attacks it.

- - - - - - - - - - 

 

 

1 minute ago, (XB1)SilverSurferGuy said:

Btw, how much more customization could you possibly want in warframe? Warframe has the deepest customization of any game in the market. There’s a reason it’s nicknamed fashion frame.

no, people literally give a fashion themed nickname to every single game that has atleast a moderate amount of Cosmetic choices.
Warframe only sets a great example for the Industry in having so many Cosmetics to choose from, but most of them are choices of one or the other (this is applicable to a lot of popular games over the times, Warframe was far from the first game to make Cosmetics a popular method of Monetization).

Warframe was already rather 'so-so' with the customization types that existed in 2013-2014. 4 Tint Masks for an entire Character? you've got to be joking. that's been holding themselves let alone the Community back for years. some little bits that you can stick on here and there is neat, but ultimately everything is limited by having 4 Tink Masks + an Emissive Mask.
if Equipment in Warframe had 8, 12, even 16 Tink Masks (multiple Emissive Masks would even be close to groundbreaking) - then certainly Warframe would be able to chuckle at the customization that some other game has. but this is not the case.

[Marvelous_A]

11 hours ago, peterc3 said:

Your example is... a clunky Corrosive. Why bother setting up a combo like that if you could just mod for Corrosive on your secondary or melee?

It's a good example showing how armor is affecting our gameplay in a bad way and subsequently how heavily we rely on armor stripping.

[Marvelous_A]

At least I agree with the Titania part.

>A warframe that can literally fly.

>Walks anyway.

[(PSN)Lun-Sei]

Il y a 1 heure, Gabbynaru a dit :

It makes more freakin' sense to control an exosuit from a distance than it does to control it on site. Exosuits are expandable, troops are not so much. One would rather lose mass produced exosuits rather than lose the exosuits and the soldiers in them. Soldiers don't exactly grow on trees. So I dunno what you're talking about, maybe Anthem should improve their warfare tactics.

 

il y a 29 minutes, fatpig84 a dit :

 

That sounds ridiculously low tech. Iron man 3 remote controlled suits are the rightful way to go, so you don't put the operator at risk.
Not withstanding that Tony Stark had his Ultron issues which forced him to dial back on AI and remote suit development.

Warframe doesn't have this issue because the frames and operators are linked by Ze Void™ and the powers of empathy™ thus very difficult to remotely hijack.
The only way to hijack frames so far have being physical means like a Collar or Kuva Queen soul punching the kid out.
So Transference is definitely the way to go. You can lose frames, but you don't lose the operator.

It is the same reason why modern warfare are so big on drones and unmanned aircraft because the operator that you spent years training won't die.
You can build something really quick, but to train a new guy to be proficient does take a while.
 

 

 

 

So, here are some questions.

 

1) If you think it makes sense to have remote control, tell me, does it also make sense to have a child be the controller instead of an adult? I wonder what logic leaps are required to justify this as well.

2) If remote control exists to make the operator safe, then why is it that Warframe clearly hints that the operator may get damaged if his or her warframe dies? That makes the remote-control safety pointless.

3) If we're playing as a child sitting on a chair, then why did we find this out YEARS after release, when some (many) players were quite convinced they were playing as the warframe? I'd be way more ok with that narrative choice if only I had known it from the beginning, not after years of letting players make their own interpretation.

4) Are we making "realistic" science fiction or are we making a cool videogame that's fun and awesome? Because you know what's awesome - being a guy inside an exosuit. You know what's not awesome - being a creepy emo kid sitting in a chair and not being in the game's actual battles.

Edited January 29, 2019 by (PS4)Lun-Sei

[Autongnosis]

I think the combo system would be nice to use for abilities more than for damage, to give some sense of team coordination to the whole deal. That would be nice. 

Also flight mechanics look better than what warframe has for AW, and cpuld probably be used as inspiration for it. 

Other than that, while having custom dashes would be nice, I'm not sure it would really fit warframes since they all have completely bonkers mobility, so that even Rhino, the "heaviest" frame, can fly at the speed of sound a cpuple of button presses away. And tbh I'd rather have the animation guys rig up a new operator animation setup so they don't behave like graceless monkeys :S

 

The customisation does look juicy asf tho, I'd love to have the option of selecting which material to use for the different colour channels ❤️

Edited January 29, 2019 by Autongnosis

[Gabbynaru]

1 minute ago, (PS4)Lun-Sei said:

So, here are some questions.
1) If you think it makes sense to have remote control, tell me, does it also make sense to have a child be the controller instead of an adult? I wonder what logic leaps are required to justify this as well.

2) If remote control exists to make the operator safe, then why is it that Warframe clearly hints that the operator may get damaged if his or her warframe dies? That makes the remote-control safety pointless.

3) If we're playing as a child sitting in a chair, then why did we find this out YEARS after release, when some (many) players were quite convinced they were playing as the warframe? I'd be ok with that choice if only I had known it from the beginning, not after years of letting players make their own interpretation.

4) Are we making "realistic" science fiction or are we making a cool videogame that's fun and awesome? Because you know what's awesome - being a guy inside an exosuit. You know what's not awesome - being a creepy emo kid sitting in a chair and not being in the game's actual battles.

1. If a child is capable of controlling a War Machine and causing the amount of damage we are currently causing, that means the war operation is working at peak efficiency. The war operation is not limited by age, gender or physical condition, as such the amount of soldiers available to the war operation is increased significantly.
2. The technology was created by the Orokin (not Tenno) to aid in war efforts. The Orokin (bar Margulis) saw the Tenno as expandable tools, as such the technology was likely imperfect, and chances are, it's still in that imperfect state.
3. I don't get the feeling that 4 years have passed in-universe. If anything, it's just a few months at best. Between Second Dream and The War Within, we had to wait for 1 year, yet in game, the gap was seemingly one day. That's called story progression, and unless we're able to write (and model and create and unify and bugfix) faster than we think, these discrepancies will always happen.
4. I find it more awesome that they're children rather than gruffly old men. I've seen angry old men in video games since forever, but few storywriters are as ballsy as to explore children as tools of war. Add to that how the youth mind is far more capable of adapting to a psychological control machine than that of an old man, and it's just a great story exploring how powerful the youth can be given the proper tools. It's a new, fresh story, not that filled with cliches and easy ways out, which to me makes it far more awesome than "buff man in iron armor story #7240". Yes, these kids are cool. Far more cool than the "adults" I've seen time and time again in every single video game.

[(PSN)Zero_029]

11 hours ago, _Urakaze_ said:

1. Combo system

I know we have similar things in the form of combined elemental damage types. We can add more depth to it. In addition, this will be a good chance to buff some underperforming status effects/damage types. To illustrate my idea, I will use heat and magnetic as example

fire proc burns enemy and after 3 seconds, soften the armor and enemy armor is reduced by 50% for the duration of the heat proc. If magnetic proc is applied to enemy while the armor is soften, 50% of armor is stripped permanently.

the possibilities are infinite.

I will agree that the Combo system (or Skillchains, or whatever people want to call them) is nice! It definitely gives players a reason to cooperate.

Warframe could indeed benefit from this. However, it would require DE to do an absolute combat overhaul. From Status Effects to damage dealt, to creating brand new status effects that are only formed from a combo and of course animating the effects themselves.

I think it would really add a new layer to combat but much like Melee 3.0

Its SUCH a dramatic change to combat that it would take a very long time to implement, require a rebalance & rework of ALL Warframe abilities (so they can synergize & combo).

I just don't know if DE could spare the time & resources to do so.

[(XBOX)The Neko Otaku]

8 hours ago, (PS4)Lun-Sei said:

4) Are we making "realistic" science fiction or are we making a cool videogame that's fun and awesome? Because you know what's awesome - being a guy inside an exosuit. You know what's not awesome - being a creepy emo kid sitting in a chair and not being in the game's actual battles.

Oh boy another person who uses emo to describe the operators even though they never act that way. Starting to think people don't know what the hell that word means what so ever. 

Having the operators as kids/teens is better for story cause they have alot of growth to go through. In war within we see they act somewhat rebellious towards the lotus and rush into the kuva fortress without any knowledge or preparation and they fall into a trap and tenshin has to teach them to be less reliant on the lotus to get them out of situations and be more independent which we see more of in the sacrifice as we se a tenno acting entirely on there own without anyone to guide them.

I rather have the operators as children than get generic mc dude 547 as my character. Having them as kids provides more interesting stories and reinforces the idea of the orokin empire as pretty messed up to force children tonfight their war, amonst the other horrific things they do.

Edited January 30, 2019 by (XB1)The Neko Otaku

[SneakyErvin]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Fireworker77 said:

Thats what I meant with " Naturally you can't test it that good in a demo".

I hope this game scales "better" than WF because I don't want another mindless powercreep. We have to wait until it's released, I also didn't like the decision to start you at level 10 in the demo, and just throwing you in without any sense of why you are doing anything.

Since I havent tried it and wont I can only speculate about their scaling. I wouldnt be surprised if they go with the illusionairy progression system of games like Diablo 3 and Inquisitor Martyr. Now in D3 it isnt that present because you actually increase the difficulty as you go but gems and paragons pretty much even this out, so you are in a constant loop of feeling progression when you really arent progressing at all.

Inquisitor Martyr took it one step further and put the nail in the coffin when it comes to progression. They use a power level system on missions and gear. So even if you sit with 2500 power rating a mission of power level 3000 is effectivley as easy/hard as a PL 750 mission is when you sit at PL 250, the rewards are also nearly the same. There is absolutely no progression in the game to make it easier beyond getting max level and all slots filled with the highest tier of gear. Just as you cant make it much harder either, except in one single piece of content that, where the scaling isnt much more than bullet sponge math.

So it all just becomes a poor loop with no real carrot or interesting new mechanics as you go. And this seems to be a new popular thing because it keeps some people playing without having to actually release any real new content or items to chase. Like in Martyr, a new set of items to them is releasing the same relics all over again with a slightly higher level and PL tied to it, the stats are still capped close to the exact same, but you need to regrind it all if you wanna do the "new" content they release since it is of a higher PL.

[fatpig84]

53 minutes ago, Gabbynaru said:

4. I find it more awesome that they're children rather than gruffly old men. I've seen angry old men in video games since forever, but few storywriters are as ballsy as to explore children as tools of war. Add to that how the youth mind is far more capable of adapting to a psychological control machine than that of an old man, and it's just a great story exploring how powerful the youth can be given the proper tools. It's a new, fresh story, not that filled with cliches and easy ways out, which to me makes it far more awesome than "buff man in iron armor story #7240". Yes, these kids are cool. Far more cool than the "adults" I've seen time and time again in every single video game.

 

I actually laud DE for daring to play the Child Soldier arch type in WF. Not many companies (except Bungo with Halo) would dare risk it as it is a pretty heavy subject.

Of course we are now digressing, but we can pretty much say, gameplay wise, there is nothing to Warframe wants or needs from Anthem except maybe flying.

In Anthem, their transition to jump jets is nice, but those overheat which is extremely annoying which leads to plenty of forced encounters.
Which imo leads to padding out on content.

In open world WF, you can safely ignore all forms of forced ground combat as long you got energy to spam Itzal / Amesha's 1 or Elytron / Odonata's 2 which means you can avoid most time wasting encounters, thus making Warframe hyper efficient.
 

1 hour ago, (PS4)Lun-Sei said:

So, here are some questions.

1) If you think it makes sense to have remote control, tell me, does it also make sense to have a child be the controller instead of an adult? I wonder what logic leaps are required to justify this as well.

2) If remote control exists to make the operator safe, then why is it that Warframe clearly hints that the operator may get damaged if his or her warframe dies? That makes the remote-control safety pointless.

3) If we're playing as a child sitting on a chair, then why did we find this out YEARS after release, when some (many) players were quite convinced they were playing as the warframe? I'd be way more ok with that narrative choice if only I had known it from the beginning, not after years of letting players make their own interpretation.

4) Are we making "realistic" science fiction or are we making a cool videogame that's fun and awesome? Because you know what's awesome - being a guy inside an exosuit. You know what's not awesome - being a creepy emo kid sitting in a chair and not being in the game's actual battles.

1) Because the Orokin are desperate, they are losing at the Sentient battle. They have frames who are made of infested humans but those won't listen to anyone as they are usually insane. But somehow the Void infected kids can. So why not ?

Remember they are fighting a war of extinction, so who cares about ethics ?

Even the Spartan IIs from Halo are basically kids who are super augmented and thrown to fight rebels (John 117 was only 14 for his first major operation) and aliens while Spartan IIIs are war orphans with a huge chip on their shoulder. So if other fiction can do this, why not warframe ? 
 

2) Because it isn't perfect or the Void isn't exactly benign. But again a little transference issues is probably the last thing on the minds of scientist to stave off extinction. In any case Quills / Vox Solaris have already found ways to negate this completely with the new Arcane.

3) Because when DE first made Warframe, they had no story in mind. They needed a product that runs smooths, lets you shoot things, spam cool abilities, parkour and have fun.  And hope they get enough so they can keep the lights on. 
That is the reason why I bought founders for them, even though when I joined, there was a grand total of 2 maps. 


Then when warframe began to thrive, they started worrying about things like lore.
Personally I did not like the idea of kiddies doing war stuff, but eventually I warmed up to their idea.
Child soldiers are still not my favoured form of game media but I still play WF because I like how it plays.
That is the reason why I stayed, because I liked the gameplay enough to shell out dough, Lore (like the story in Doom) is just secondary to me.

4) Your rule of cool doesn't apply to me. If you enjoy playing the arch typical knight / samurai in armor that must dive deep into the action, well go ahead if that is your jam.

But personally I find remotely controlling entire armies a much better preferences and while safely tuck away and twirling my mustache for my next diabolical scheme.

Hey, I grew up addicted to RTS / RPGs / tactical combat after all, action came a distant second. So that is my rule of cool.
And  why I love Nekros to bits. A mini army and more phat loot. That is the life.

Edited January 29, 2019 by fatpig84

[brucifer1]

13 minutes ago, (XB1)The Neko Otaku said:

Oh boy another person who uses emo to describe the operators even though they never act that way. Starting to think people don't know what the hell that word means what so ever. 

Having the operators as kids/teens is better for story cause they have alot of growth to go through. In war within we see they act somewhat rebellious towards the lotus and rush into the kuva fortress without any knowledge or preparation and they fall into a trap and tenshin has to teach them to be less reliant on the lotus to get them out of situations and be more independent which we see more of in the sacrifice as we se a tenno acting entirely on there own without anyone to guide them.

I rather have the operators as children that get generic mc dude 547 as my character. Having them as kids provides more interesting stories and reinforces the idea of the orokin empire as pretty messed up to force children tonfight their war, amonst the other horrific things they do.

This is a matter of taste and you will never get a consensus,nor "win" an argument.  When the operator was first revealed there were some who loved it and some that hated it, (myself included in the later). I tried just keeping him locked in the back of the ship and ignoring him but DE decided they created this so they would force you to play it. Now for those who like the operator story arc I'm sure they find this fine, for those of us who hate it we are loving Anthem's power suit that we the player are inside and piloting. It's a mater of taste and neither side is "right" or "wrong", play what you like. The same goes for Anthem's mobility vice Warframes, challenge level, AI, progression systems, etc. It's a different style and feel, in short a different game; you can like one more than the other, love them both, or hate them both, but there is no real "right" choice as most comes down to individual preference.

Edited January 29, 2019 by brucifer1

[(PSN)tissot555]

9 hours ago, zNightWolfz said:

there is nothing in anthem that WF needs ...

played the demo and to be honest the game is what it is its nothing like WF so no need to compare it

Anthem far to long load times harder to get into a game the game crashes way to often...

its a different game to WF and in no way will it affect players on WF at all....

i play all sorts of online games and single player and still come back to WF in the end daily

 

I disagree. Warframe need real loot drops and better raid/ boss encounters. It looks like anthem will win in both these categories 

[(PSN)Lun-Sei]

Il y a 2 heures, Gabbynaru a dit :

1. If a child is capable of controlling a War Machine and causing the amount of damage we are currently causing, that means the war operation is working at peak efficiency. The war operation is not limited by age, gender or physical condition, as such the amount of soldiers available to the war operation is increased significantly.
2. The technology was created by the Orokin (not Tenno) to aid in war efforts. The Orokin (bar Margulis) saw the Tenno as expandable tools, as such the technology was likely imperfect, and chances are, it's still in that imperfect state.
3. I don't get the feeling that 4 years have passed in-universe. If anything, it's just a few months at best. Between Second Dream and The War Within, we had to wait for 1 year, yet in game, the gap was seemingly one day. That's called story progression, and unless we're able to write (and model and create and unify and bugfix) faster than we think, these discrepancies will always happen.
4. I find it more awesome that they're children rather than gruffly old men. I've seen angry old men in video games since forever, but few storywriters are as ballsy as to explore children as tools of war. Add to that how the youth mind is far more capable of adapting to a psychological control machine than that of an old man, and it's just a great story exploring how powerful the youth can be given the proper tools. It's a new, fresh story, not that filled with cliches and easy ways out, which to me makes it far more awesome than "buff man in iron armor story #7240". Yes, these kids are cool. Far more cool than the "adults" I've seen time and time again in every single video game.

 

Il y a 2 heures, fatpig84 a dit :

 

I actually laud DE for daring to play the Child Soldier arch type in WF. Not many companies (except Bungo with Halo) would dare risk it as it is a pretty heavy subject.

Of course we are now digressing, but we can pretty much say, gameplay wise, there is nothing to Warframe wants or needs from Anthem except maybe flying.

In Anthem, their transition to jump jets is nice, but those overheat which is extremely annoying which leads to plenty of forced encounters.
Which imo leads to padding out on content.

In open world WF, you can safely ignore all forms of forced ground combat as long you got energy to spam Itzal / Amesha's 1 or Elytron / Odonata's 2 which means you can avoid most time wasting encounters, thus making Warframe hyper efficient.
 

1) Because the Orokin are desperate, they are losing at the Sentient battle. They have frames who are made of infested humans but those won't listen to anyone as they are usually insane. But somehow the Void infected kids can. So why not ?

Remember they are fighting a war of extinction, so who cares about ethics ?

Even the Spartan IIs from Halo are basically kids who are super augmented and thrown to fight rebels (John 117 was only 14 for his first major operation) and aliens while Spartan IIIs are war orphans with a huge chip on their shoulder. So if other fiction can do this, why not warframe ? 
 

2) Because it isn't perfect or the Void isn't exactly benign. But again a little transference issues is probably the last thing on the minds of scientist to stave off extinction. In any case Quills / Vox Solaris have already found ways to negate this completely with the new Arcane.

3) Because when DE first made Warframe, they had no story in mind. They needed a product that runs smooths, lets you shoot things, spam cool abilities, parkour and have fun.  And hope they get enough so they can keep the lights on. 
That is the reason why I bought founders for them, even though when I joined, there was a grand total of 2 maps. 


Then when warframe began to thrive, they started worrying about things like lore.
Personally I did not like the idea of kiddies doing war stuff, but eventually I warmed up to their idea.
Child soldiers are still not my favoured form of game media but I still play WF because I like how it plays.
That is the reason why I stayed, because I liked the gameplay enough to shell out dough, Lore (like the story in Doom) is just secondary to me.

4) Your rule of cool doesn't apply to me. If you enjoy playing the arch typical knight / samurai in armor that must dive deep into the action, well go ahead if that is your jam.

But personally I find remotely controlling entire armies a much better preferences and while safely tuck away and twirling my mustache for my next diabolical scheme.

Hey, I grew up addicted to RTS / RPGs / tactical combat after all, action came a distant second. So that is my rule of cool.
And  why I love Nekros to bits. A mini army and more phat loot. That is the life.

 

 

Again, we can see the logic leaps required to find a justification for the way the Tenno was presented.

 

"Oh, a child soldier is so original!". Yeah, and then comes the next guy describing the Tenno as the opposite of a child soldier: a controlling mastermind of a child.

 

Another logic leap: "it's more original than the overused soldier trope!". Except that if the Tenno was really inside the warframe, he wouldn't be your average soldier trope at all. So... is the "overused trope" being an adult and being in battle? Because that's what I like in my videogames.

 

Much more importantly, I never forgave the devs for doing this emo kid plot twist YEARS AFTER THE GAME WAS RELEASED. It erased years of me playing with a specific idea of what the game's story and atmosphere was like, and if they didn't want players to do that, they shouldn't have encouraged it for so long.

 

Oh, and you know why Master Chef was supposedly 14 years old? Because that's the age of the target audience. So, is Warframe telling me this game is for preteens?

 

Leaving all this aside, now finally we have Anthem doing the exosuit right: my character is an adult and they're inside the actual suit.

[Corvid]

3 hours ago, fatpig84 said:

That sounds ridiculously low tech. Iron man 3 remote controlled suits are the rightful way to go, so you don't put the operator at risk.

In fairness, Anthem is a setting where humanity's technological development was rather strange. They don't have TVs or microchips, for instance, and the Javelins are all hand-crafted because they haven't figured out industrialisation.

[Gabbynaru]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Lun-Sei said:

Again, we can see the logic leaps required to find a justification for the way the Tenno was presented.

"Oh, a child soldier is so original!". Yeah, and then comes the next guy describing the Tenno as the opposite of a child soldier: a controlling mastermind of a child.

Another logic leap: "it's more original than the overused soldier trope!". Except that if the Tenno was really inside the warframe, he wouldn't be your average soldier trope at all. So... is the "overused trope" being an adult and being in battle? Because that's what I like in my videogames.

Much more importantly, I never forgave the devs for doing this emo kid plot twist YEARS AFTER THE GAME WAS RELEASED. It erased years of me playing with a specific idea of what the game's story and atmosphere was like, and if they didn't want players to do that, they shouldn't have encouraged it for so long.

Oh, and you know why Master Chef was supposedly 14 years old? Because that's the age of the target audience. So, is Warframe telling me this game is for preteens?

Leaving all this aside, now finally we have Anthem doing the exosuit right: my character is an adult and they're inside the actual suit.

Tacticians and masterminds also count as soldiers. So he basically said the same thing I did, but worded it better.

HAVE YOU NOT PLAYED ANY VIDEO GAMES BEFORE? SOLDIER IN ARMOR/EXOSUIT IS THE DEFAULT SETTING FOR MOST COMPANIES!

That's your own fault! You made yourself believe a lie that NO ONE hinted at. You are to blame for your overblown expectations not being met, because no one can think the way you do, and expecting them to do so, then getting mad at them for not delivering is absolutely insane. Blame yourself, not the devs!

Won't comment on Halo, cause I  don't have much experience with it.

Right, go play Anthem then! You do know games can tell more than one story, right? No need for them to retell the same story with prettier graphics.

[(PSN)Lun-Sei]

il y a 12 minutes, Gabbynaru a dit :

Tacticians and masterminds also count as soldiers. So he basically said the same thing I did, but worded it better.

HAVE YOU NOT PLAYED ANY VIDEO GAMES BEFORE? SOLDIER IN ARMOR/EXOSUIT IS THE DEFAULT SETTING FOR MOST COMPANIES!

That's your own fault! You made yourself believe a lie that NO ONE hinted at. You are to blame for your overblown expectations not being met, because no one can think the way you do, and expecting them to do so, then getting mad at them for not delivering is absolutely insane. Blame yourself, not the devs!

Won't comment on Halo, cause I  don't have much experience with it.

Right, go play Anthem then! You do know games can tell more than one story, right? No need for them to retell the same story with prettier graphics.

 

 

No, they didn't say the same thing. One claimed they played on the child soldier story, the other claimed they played on the distant mastermind.

 

I don't know what videogames you played, but I really haven't played many videogames in which you're a soldier in a exosuit. Hey, my favorite game of 2018 was Detroit: Become Human, which I have finished no less than THREE times. Maybe we have different tastes. Maybe you're the one who should find out videogames can tell different stories.

I find it curious however that you think exosuit = armor. The two things are certainly not the same.

 

And don't tell me I came up imagining that I was playing as a guy inside the warframe. I was there since Warframe's beta launch, you know? And everyone playing that game - everyone - would have assumed you play as that guy you're seeing. Heck, probably back then the developers themselves thought the tenno was inside the warframe.

 

It's like playing Uncharted 5 and at the end of the game you discover that Nathan Drake was an android remote-controlled by an alien. And you say that's an absurd plot development, and someone comes to you and replies that hey, there was nothing in the previous four Uncharted games that said Nathan Drake is NOT a remote-controlled android, right?

 

And then we have Anthem. Right from the first trailer we see a badass exosuit that doesn't have stupid things like boobplates.... then it opens and there's a woman inside. Right up my alley.

Edited January 29, 2019 by (PS4)Lun-Sei

[Ikyr0]

you didn't mention: actual endgame. this is why i'll likely be playing Division 2 and Anthem instead of WF when they launch. WF has nothing even resembling an endgame (challenging content with scaling rewards). 

this is really too bad, because I much prefer WF's lore and feel of combat. but without scaling difficulty and rewards, I have no reason to log in.