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Alaskan

A Conclave casual's concerns

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This is not a big post about the finer nuances of Conclave and what needs to be changed or tweaked, but a smaller simpler one about what someone who never plays pvp, thinks about the experience.

 

First, is the Conclave station in the orbiter, why doesn't it show current standing, or allow you to purchase the rewards from there without visiting Teshin in a relay? It's just an inconvenience.

Next, why is Quick Steel not always available? When I touched it it felt so much easier to play than all the other modes, no more worrying about optimal weapon and frame choice, or having the right mods, everyone is on an even playing field except skill and experience.

Last, what happened to all the other festive pvp events? Like the snowball fight and the currently seasonal bow only Eros match? A little bit of variety could be nice for what I understand as a very stagnated portion of the game.

 

A lot of my frustrations with actually playing Conclave come from "mad cos bad", but I just don't see why quality of life can't be a thing for everyone.

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Honestly conclave should be Operator V Operator , A lot of my frustrations with actually playing Conclave come from the fact that I go into conclave and suddenly i have to play by a different set of rules. (let be clear i understand why they are needed).

OvO would be easier for them to balance

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31 minutes ago, Alaskan said:

First, is the Conclave station in the orbiter, why doesn't it show current standing, or allow you to purchase the rewards from there without visiting Teshin in a relay? It's just an inconvenience.

This has been requested for a really long time but nothing has been done and no reply from devs has been given on the matter.

34 minutes ago, Alaskan said:

Next, why is Quick Steel not always available? When I touched it it felt so much easier to play than all the other modes, no more worrying about optimal weapon and frame choice, or having the right mods, everyone is on an even playing field except skill and experience.

It was a tactical alert and i'd like to see it back or even added in rotation with other similar modes like opticor variant (instagib with modified opticors) and Hearts&Arrows (instagib with paris). However the hardcore anti pvp side of the community went way too loud hating on it to the point where the devs simply haven't made it return despite the mode being actually fun.

38 minutes ago, Alaskan said:

Last, what happened to all the other festive pvp events? Like the snowball fight and the currently seasonal bow only Eros match? A little bit of variety could be nice for what I understand as a very stagnated portion of the game.

Same as above, let's thank this wonderful community for not allowing the devs give us nice things that they could simply not to play if they don't want to.

18 minutes ago, Dabnician said:

Honestly conclave should be Operator V Operator.

That would only lock PvP behind a lot of PvE walls which doesn't make any sense.

Should players have to wait at least until TSD where operator is unlocked? Would it be a better idea to make them wait until TWW where their operator starts moving on its own? Or perhaps lock it behind Saya's vigil so players can jump in pvp with the mote amp.

18 minutes ago, Dabnician said:

 A lot of my frustrations with actually playing Conclave come from the fact that I go into conclave and suddenly i have to play by a different set of rules. (let be clear i understand why they are needed).

Rules are mostly the same as in PvE: same parkour system (slightly toned down so it's easier to shoot at other players); same modding systems but with different mods; even weapons are balanced mainly by the removal of status and crit chances plus damage and magazine tweaks in order to keep their mechanical feel similar to their PvE counterparts, while making use of the same damage system we all have known from years ago.

The only difference is that you're not playing against AI that walks in conga lines to your bullets, but instead against players who want to win as well and will adapt their loadouts, positioning, energy management, etc. according to your strategies, making you adapt again in an actual learning process much deeper than watching a youtube guide for a meta build and mash 1234 in the right order to beat everything.

18 minutes ago, Dabnician said:

OvO would be easier for them to balance

If we keep in mind stuff such as focus schools, waybound passives, void mode and the evergrowing amount of amp combinations, it would probably end up being way harder to balance than what you think.

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What Conclave REALLY needs => quality of life:

- match browser 

- star chart node

- full new players loadouts (guns and melee not only skanas)

- weapons balance as was up till end of last year

Real fixes that may help Conclave in long run:

- Stalker Mode (was annouced for this year)

- Better rewards, since it is hardest game mode and gives lowest ammonuts of resources, credits and doesn't make players stronger in any way. Basicaly worst investment to reward ratio in game.

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On 2019-02-11 at 5:26 AM, Aramil999 said:

- Stalker Mode (was annouced for this year)

Honestly, I'm kind of worried about this. I'd welcome it, but most PvE players are kind of concerned about the idea. Many of them play the game only for the power fantasy, and they reeeally don't want PvP forced upon them. I just hope this doesn't deepen the rift between PvE and PvP players. I'm in favour of an opt-in or opt-out Stalker mode.

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2 hours ago, Wrikster said:

Honestly, I'm kind of worried about this. I'd welcome it, but most PvE players are kind of concerned about the idea. Many of them play the game only for the power fantasy, and they reeeally don't want PvP forced upon them. I just hope this doesn't deepen the rift between PvE and PvP players. I'm in favour of an opt-in or opt-out Stalker mode.

As per this thread, Stalker mode will be opt-in/opt-out:

 

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On 2019-02-10 at 7:57 PM, Alaskan said:

A lot of my frustrations with actually playing Conclave come from "mad cos bad", but I just don't see why quality of life can't be a thing for everyone.

While this is true for a lot of players it is only to a point. Speaking as a casual player myself I'm not necessarily horrible at it I just don't have bouncing off the walls at 100 miles an hour to no scope someone at the other end of the map (maybe a slight exaggeration) down to a fine art like those who practically live in the conclave. While I don't necessarily object to the mode in and of itself I believe it was included in the game by DE to showcase the 360 movement mechanics which to be fair it does.

The main problem is that Warframe is not a hereditary PvP game and most who play it don't do it for the PvP. As for showing standing and the seasonal changes to the line up I think it's a little to small of a band aid to something that is inherently disliked/ignored by the majority is because of the repetitive nature of Warframes PvP. That being the same small selection of maps and a small segment of the community practically living in there.

One possible fix to this that would at least add some verity would be to cycle through maps that are on the Solar map to simulate "battles" to at least change up the feeling of PvP with a possible addition of a Jeopardy session which can have a bunch of Bursa or Nox Eximus or something randomly spawn to target the top three in the match to create a a sense of verity and strategy to the mode.

Unlikely to happen I know but what we have in conclave seems a little stale, uninteresting and frustrating at times at least to me. 

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I've only played like one PvP Event and I would ask for more PvP Changes but everytime I kill someone they log. Like, is it not PvP? I agree with this topic, there should be more PvP. Aaand less narcissism, but I'm sure thats asking WAAAAAY too much.

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2 hours ago, Cuchullin said:

While I don't necessarily object to the mode in and of itself I believe it was included in the game by DE to showcase the 360 movement mechanics which to be fair it does. 

The old old incarnation of Conclave was a few nodes on the Star Chart and was played with PvE loadouts, restricted by limits (mods had individual values). And there were Solar Rail Conflicts with PvE loadouts, too.

When they introduced the new (now old gameplay wise) Conclave, that was still with the old Parkour system. It was much slower and you'd copter around with your melee. It was Capture the Cephalon (CTC) on new maps. Example of me fooling around with Excal's Super Jump and Angstrum is still there, lol:

Spoiler

 

 

Then parkour 2.0 happened and things started to take off. Example of one of the few rounds where I bothered to record. (Edit: weird speed glitch in the recording when played from gfycat? It was not that fast, in the original footage. Should be 10s long):

Spoiler

 

 

2 hours ago, Cuchullin said:

... because of the repetitive nature of Warframes PvP

That made me chuckle.

 

2 hours ago, Cuchullin said:

I just don't have bouncing off the walls at 100 miles an hour to no scope someone at the other end of the map (maybe a slight exaggeration)

Not even, there are a few people who are downright scary. But if you're good like that, you don't need to be bouncing around, anyway. Example:

Spoiler

 

 

I recently stumbled on this, however. That's what you guys should aim for (don't know any of those, and haven't played it in years, anyway):

Spoiler

 

 

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Just to clarify my statement on the repetitive nature of the PvP maps I meant there is only 3 maps that cycle through and while I do understand that it's to showcase the movement mechanics of the game it can get boring fast especially if your up against people you play Conclave regularly and know the best way to run the map and loadouts. Personally speaking as an average player who only plays a little PvP it can get frustrating when you constantly owned by other players who know the map inside and out and are far more involved in it then I am.

With more map verity to cycle through it can change up the tactics and play-styles. By all means keep the current roster but have more areas form the star-chart with the possibility of those turrets that mare on some maps. It just might make things more interesting to play rather then being limited. As for finding people on my level to play against there aren't many I know that play conclave regularly and whenever I go in public  mode it can take a while for anyone to show up. True most of what I said is me just complaining about it but there is enough truth there I think for it to apply.

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14 hours ago, Cuchullin said:

Just to clarify my statement on the repetitive nature of the PvP maps I meant there is only 3 maps that cycle through and while I do understand that it's to showcase the movement mechanics of the game it can get boring fast especially if your up against people you play Conclave regularly and know the best way to run the map and loadouts. Personally speaking as an average player who only plays a little PvP it can get frustrating when you constantly owned by other players who know the map inside and out and are far more involved in it then I am.

Ah, I didn't want oppose your opinion on that, just, you know, when we talk about Warframe and repetitiveness, the following comes to mind:

Spoiler

 

... but sure, I guess I can see what you meant.

 

The other things were meant to give a bit of background info on the Conclave. Maybe you should just watch the one I linked at the bottom; that's what you should try: get a few people together that are about on your level and have a go at it.

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