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Cpt-Night

Worried about Nightwave Season limit

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My largest concern with nightwave is there is a large departure from other syndicate type ranking, the fact that the threat of the season ending in 10 weeks and the ranks changing, and likely removing your nightwave rep to start from the beginning.  I was pretty excited at first by the whole thing until i learned that we had to reach rank 30 in 10 week.  Then the more i looked at it the more the challenges just seemed like the time gated Bounties from Destiny, where you have to login each day to do you deligence like its a job if you expect to get anywhere.

MY suggestions:

- Make all the item rewards in Night wave an option you purchase, likely with rep directly.    some people may want to buy a bunch of helmets, others might just want a pile of Umbra Forma etc. let them choose what they spend rep for.

- Make the rewards at each tier currency so you can buy the things you want.   many Veteran players will feel they are wasting their time getting the old alert rewards and such, so literally the last few highest tiers are all they care about. 

-Last Do not make tiers and rewards seasonal if it takes constant continuous work to get there.  I think many players tolerate or enjoy the syndicate systems because you are not in a rush to do them to get to the top ranks (fortuna and PoE included)  Right now i feel that if i ever want a chance to get an umbra Forma i have to constantly do these missions for weeks and its all i can do with limited time. and in those 10weeks i have to constantly keep playing warframe even if at that time i dont actually want to.  unlike with Fortuna or PoE I know those rewards are always waiting there at the end for when i choose to try to get there.   

Warframe is one of my favorite games because i can stop, go play something else, and then later come back to play warframe when im in the mood.  Now with Nightwave build around a season i can't afford to stop playing if i ever want to see those rewards at the end and that is the fastests way to get me to simply stop playing, just like I did with Destiny when it felt like working instead of playing.

 

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People who buys it already have thousands of plat, so this makes no direct profit for de. Unless your a content creator buying this weak weapon now is "stupid" anyway. 

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The wolf spawn rate will increase by time, so idc about people buying it right now
I´m having more fun with the new system than with the old alert system.
The prime vault is kinda necessary since we have so much stuff, it would only split the loot table even more. And since prime warframes ain´t mandatory for anything, you can still stick to your normal one, till you can farm the prime version for free.

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50 minutes ago, Dark_Lugia said:

The wolf spawn rate will increase by time, so idc about people buying it right now
I´m having more fun with the new system than with the old alert system.
The prime vault is kinda necessary since we have so much stuff, it would only split the loot table even more. And since prime warframes ain´t mandatory for anything, you can still stick to your normal one, till you can farm the prime version for free.

An Increase of 0.000000000000000000000000001% is an increase. I want them to give some hard numbers on current spawn rate and projected increase over time so i can judge just how long i have to grind to get the wolf sledge, my only current incomplete content in Warframe.

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On 2019-03-03 at 9:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

My largest concern with nightwave is there is a large departure from other syndicate type ranking, the fact that the threat of the season ending in 10 weeks and the ranks changing, and likely removing your nightwave rep to start from the beginning.  I was pretty excited at first by the whole thing until i learned that we had to reach rank 30 in 10 week.  Then the more i looked at it the more the challenges just seemed like the time gated Bounties from Destiny, where you have to login each day to do you deligence like its a job if you expect to get anywhere.

MY suggestions:

- Make all the item rewards in Night wave an option you purchase, likely with rep directly.    some people may want to buy a bunch of helmets, others might just want a pile of Umbra Forma etc. let them choose what they spend rep for.

- Make the rewards at each tier currency so you can buy the things you want.   many Veteran players will feel they are wasting their time getting the old alert rewards and such, so literally the last few highest tiers are all they care about. 

-Last Do not make tiers and rewards seasonal if it takes constant continuous work to get there.  I think many players tolerate or enjoy the syndicate systems because you are not in a rush to do them to get to the top ranks (fortuna and PoE included)  Right now i feel that if i ever want a chance to get an umbra Forma i have to constantly do these missions for weeks and its all i can do with limited time. and in those 10weeks i have to constantly keep playing warframe even if at that time i dont actually want to.  unlike with Fortuna or PoE I know those rewards are always waiting there at the end for when i choose to try to get there.   

 Warframe is one of my favorite games because i can stop, go play something else, and then later come back to play warframe when im in the mood.  Now with Nightwave build around a season i can't afford to stop playing if i ever want to see those rewards at the end and that is the fastests way to get me to simply stop playing, just like I did with Destiny when it felt like working instead of playing.

  

Bolded for my emphasis.  This right here is exactly how I feel, put in a respectful manner, and with added suggestions. Thank you for articulating this.

Most of my gametime now is -just- nightwave missions, and I don't get to focus on the mission types I enjoy with limited gametime.

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On 2019-03-03 at 7:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

Make all the item rewards in Night wave an option you purchase, likely with rep directly.    some people may want to buy a bunch of helmets, others might just want a pile of Umbra Forma etc. let them choose what they spend rep for.

If people want to buy a bunch of helmets, they can. The Wolf Cred offerings are there so you can pick and choose what you want. You earn Wolf Cred at a steady pace as long as you complete the Acts, and you can spend them on helmets, potatos, nitain, whatever. The other set of rewards are the tier rewards, and it's clear that DE does not want you obtaining multiple ones of those. For the emblems, sigils, emotes, and other cosmetics, that makes sense, because you only need 1 of those. But it's also clear that DE doesn't want you to have a "pile" of Umbral Forma. It's a high-end reward meant for those who dedicate themselves to the Nightwave system for weeks. I don't really see a problem with DE rewarding that kind of investment. And seeing as its only function is to make your endgame gear more endgame-y and doesn't grant MR, I don't see a problem with Umbral Forma being limited.

On 2019-03-03 at 7:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

Make the rewards at each tier currency so you can buy the things you want.

I do think Wolf Cred could be rewarded more frequently, perhaps even at every rank as you suggest. DE said that they're monitoring feedback and taking it into account, and that they're exploring this new territory just as much as we are. I wouldn't be surprised to see the reward distribution changed substantially for Series 2.

On 2019-03-03 at 7:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

many Veteran players will feel they are wasting their time getting the old alert rewards and such, so literally the last few highest tiers are all they care about.

The lower tier rewards aren't "old alert rewards". The old alert rewards are Wolf Cred offerings, and veterans can choose which of those to purchase. The tier rewards follow a progression pathway that clearly has been predetermined by DE. If veterans want the high-tier rewards, then they need to put in the time.

On 2019-03-03 at 7:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

Last Do not make tiers and rewards seasonal if it takes constant continuous work to get there.

Honestly I'm on the fence about this. I think if it's true that you only need 60% Act completion to reach Rank 30, then it's probably fine, but I'm open to other thoughts on this and I'm sure DE is too.

The last thing I'll say is this: there are some challenges that are iffy in terms of how fun or easy they are (fill 5 Ayatan sculptures, play with friends, do 60-minute survivals without life support), but in the end: if you don't have fun playing the game, then why are you here? Nightwave gives you rewards for killing enemies, cracking relics, completing Syndicate missions – all of these core gameplay. If you don't like the core gameplay, then I'm not sure it makes sense to complain about the rewards.

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I mean, you CANT buy a bunch of helmets. You can buy 4 every 10 weeks, 300 Wolf Cred max, and then Im not getting any Nitain. I used to earn that in a week prior. 
Also, obviously, some items would be limited 1 only.

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1 hour ago, simplygnome said:

I mean, you CANT buy a bunch of helmets. You can buy 4 every 10 weeks, 300 Wolf Cred max, and then Im not getting any Nitain. I used to earn that in a week prior. 
Also, obviously, some items would be limited 1 only.

Most of the cosmetics are honestly not that interesting, certain helmets look just bad. You get to buy Nitain in BULK. I have to say that Wolf Creds are scarce for sure and they should be rewarded in higher quantities to GUARANTEE that players who get to let's say Tier 20 will be able to buy everything atleast once.

To those who complain about the price of the Wolf Sledge: When Mesa Prime came out I sold a set for 500 plat, I sold a Gram Prime set for 280 plat, something's new, people buy it and then they might fall face first if that item is not that good, and as I head the Wolf Sledge in fact is not that good. According to two friends who own it it's a Jat Kittag with better supportive stats and no Vulcan Blitz. Give it time, he will spawn more often over time.

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On 2019-03-03 at 7:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

Then the more i looked at it the more the challenges just seemed like the time gated Bounties from Destiny

 

I migrated to WF after Destiny drove me off.

and I agree that the new Nightwave bounty system feels very similar.

And that's not good.

 

That system is part of what made Destiny get old fast for me.

Every day I'd login, blow through the daily bounties, then be bored. Maybe go do some PvP (which WF does Not do as well).

After a while the regularity starts looking more like a chore than fun.

 

The randomness of old Alerts breaks the monotony, gives you a reason to hang out doing other things.

 

Side note, the little mini-challenges in missions, why did DE have to get rid of those?

Sure, they gave insignificant reward, just some xp; but I'd do them anyway just cause its fun!

"20 kills with my pistol"? Okay its a race! lets see if I can do that before Saryn over there steals all the kills!

 

 

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On 2019-03-03 at 9:11 PM, Cpt-Night said:

-Last Do not make tiers and rewards seasonal if it takes constant continuous work to get there. 

I think you missed the point.

The constant work to get there IS THE POINT.

It serves multiple functions.  First, more concurrent players interacting regularly is good for shareholders.  They like that.  It also means you buy more crap the more you play.  

Second, veterans have literally nothing to do.  Even with nightwave, I'm done in under five minutes a day, and when the week switches over I get about 2 hours.  This gives us something to work for as aspirational content.  At least now though, i have a reason to log in at all.

Do I like everything about nightwave?  No, I think the endgame grind is too much for umbral forma at 1 every three months, and that umbral forma shouldn't exist right now because there is no content that requires it (we were already soloing orbs in 2 mins beforehand, umbral forma might shave off another 15 seconds at most for what was supposed to be challenging content, lol).  That and we can't mute the radio queen, and new players don't get alert resource bundles anymore, which sucks for them (although they can earn slots now, so that's a mega plus).

But having nightwave as seasonal and rewards earned over time is precisely the point and intention.  

I've seen a lot of people complain about this because I think they believe and have been trained up to this point to be super entitled because warframe isn't hard at all, and you can get everything, and nobody ever asked you to do anything in the game before that you didn't decide to do for yourself.  Now you're mad because you can't get a cosmetic piece before time is out in three whole months?  Come on now, that's always been the way it is.  First prime vault cosmetics, you either get them in the window or you don't get them (and you have to pay cash for those).  Second, there is nothing anyone "NEEDS" to play warframe in nightwave, so it's entirely opt in/opt out.  If you don't like it, don't do it.  For real.

If you can't do it, then that's a YOU problem, because YOU need to up your arsenal and git gud.  Same as will killing terry.  If you can't do it, go git gud and meet the current bar.  Nightwave is both a time and DPS check.  That's the point.

If you can't manage to do that, well, guess what?  You don't get the shiny reward.  Not that you needed it to begin with, because you don't.  There is nothing mandatory about nightwave at all.  So you either choose to do it, or you don't, or you choose to git gud, or you don't.  

The point of cycling it is to keep it refreshed so there is a reason to keep playing, and as it is, the cycles, if you ask me, are too long, not too short.

If I want to put umbral forma on five frames I use often enough, and 1 weapon, that's going to take about 4 years.  That's insane.  It flat out disincentivises doing it because no grind should take 4 years, period.

Now you want to make it last forever and not be refreshed like literally everything else in the game that gets ignored?

Nah, we have plenty of that already.  

If you're so new to the game that you can't do this stuff, well, maybe you shouldn't, and make doing it one day a goal for yourself rather than demanding the game change to suit your specific notions of what you like so that everyone else is forced to play at your pace, including people with 1000s more hours than you've invested who are already bored.  As it stands it's already too easy for many of us that have been around the block.  

Not every challenge is completable by everyone.  It isn't meant to be.  That's what makes it a CHALLENGE.  I know this will seem weird to all the youngins, but there was a time where you didn't get a save, and you didn't get an xp mitigation for losing.  You got three tries and then you started over from square one.  If you didn't beat the game in three tries, that was too bad for you.  Now I feel like games have been borderline catatonic for years now, starting back with WoW.

Warframe is no exception. I can be half asleep and do a tridolon, it's not a challenge.

I mean, they already are giving you a literal participation trophy (several of them) for nightwave as it is, what more do you want?  You want endgame rewards when you haven't put the time in yet?  That's not even worth considering or discussing.

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Well, your suggestions has pros and cons, but some of them make sense for most people. I like the idea of balancing the challenge for both targets of players. Maybe they hear you for the next nightwave round.

I'm currently at rank 9 in this nightwave. Any can confirm if i can reach lvl 30 in the next weeks completing all the challenges?.

Thanks!.

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On 2019-03-06 at 9:52 AM, Klokwerkaos said:

I think you missed the point.

The constant work to get there IS THE POINT.

It serves multiple functions.  First, more concurrent players interacting regularly is good for shareholders.  They like that.  It also means you buy more crap the more you play.  

Second, veterans have literally nothing to do.  Even with nightwave, I'm done in under five minutes a day, and when the week switches over I get about 2 hours.  This gives us something to work for as aspirational content.  At least now though, i have a reason to log in at all.

Do I like everything about nightwave?  No, I think the endgame grind is too much for umbral forma at 1 every three months, and that umbral forma shouldn't exist right now because there is no content that requires it (we were already soloing orbs in 2 mins beforehand, umbral forma might shave off another 15 seconds at most for what was supposed to be challenging content, lol).  That and we can't mute the radio queen, and new players don't get alert resource bundles anymore, which sucks for them (although they can earn slots now, so that's a mega plus).

But having nightwave as seasonal and rewards earned over time is precisely the point and intention.  

I've seen a lot of people complain about this because I think they believe and have been trained up to this point to be super entitled because warframe isn't hard at all, and you can get everything, and nobody ever asked you to do anything in the game before that you didn't decide to do for yourself.  Now you're mad because you can't get a cosmetic piece before time is out in three whole months?  Come on now, that's always been the way it is.  First prime vault cosmetics, you either get them in the window or you don't get them (and you have to pay cash for those).  Second, there is nothing anyone "NEEDS" to play warframe in nightwave, so it's entirely opt in/opt out.  If you don't like it, don't do it.  For real.

If you can't do it, then that's a YOU problem, because YOU need to up your arsenal and git gud.  Same as will killing terry.  If you can't do it, go git gud and meet the current bar.  Nightwave is both a time and DPS check.  That's the point.

If you can't manage to do that, well, guess what?  You don't get the shiny reward.  Not that you needed it to begin with, because you don't.  There is nothing mandatory about nightwave at all.  So you either choose to do it, or you don't, or you choose to git gud, or you don't.  

The point of cycling it is to keep it refreshed so there is a reason to keep playing, and as it is, the cycles, if you ask me, are too long, not too short.

If I want to put umbral forma on five frames I use often enough, and 1 weapon, that's going to take about 4 years.  That's insane.  It flat out disincentivises doing it because no grind should take 4 years, period.

Now you want to make it last forever and not be refreshed like literally everything else in the game that gets ignored?

Nah, we have plenty of that already.  

If you're so new to the game that you can't do this stuff, well, maybe you shouldn't, and make doing it one day a goal for yourself rather than demanding the game change to suit your specific notions of what you like so that everyone else is forced to play at your pace, including people with 1000s more hours than you've invested who are already bored.  As it stands it's already too easy for many of us that have been around the block.  

Not every challenge is completable by everyone.  It isn't meant to be.  That's what makes it a CHALLENGE.  I know this will seem weird to all the youngins, but there was a time where you didn't get a save, and you didn't get an xp mitigation for losing.  You got three tries and then you started over from square one.  If you didn't beat the game in three tries, that was too bad for you.  Now I feel like games have been borderline catatonic for years now, starting back with WoW.

Warframe is no exception. I can be half asleep and do a tridolon, it's not a challenge.

I mean, they already are giving you a literal participation trophy (several of them) for nightwave as it is, what more do you want?  You want endgame rewards when you haven't put the time in yet?  That's not even worth considering or discussing.

Erm Nitian is tied to Nightwave, Nightwave is far from optional it is a must if you want to play this game now unless youve already built everything.

Unless they bring the alerts back and remove the time restriction on Nightwave Im done, Sorry but working a few month towards something just to have it reset if Im not fast enough just doesn't tickle those reward centers for me. Shame I was really enjoying this game up until a couple weeks ago when this crap came out. Good for my wallet though as not another penny will be going to the greedy swine who thought it would be good to seriously limit our progression and fun. Seriously why remove the affinity bonuses as well!

Hope it changes in the next day or two but highly doubt it.

Sea of Thieves anyone?

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Forced gameplay isnt fun, esp in a game that DREW PEOPLE IN by advertising as a play as you want game.

There is nothing GIT GUD about Nightwave. Its boring, forced gameplay, thats easy.
It eats my time and takes away from the type of gameplay Id rather do.
Im currently doing it, I can do it - It just detracts from the fun.

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I'm not a fan of Nightwave either.

 

First of all, the new system gives LESS NITAIN than the old system did, 15 sounds like a huge number, but the old system gave 21 away each week and with phone alerts it wasn't that hard to get it all, or most at least, now you may or may not get 15 on a given week, depends on how the rewards are placed. That's if you only spend credits on nitain of course, don't even try to get mods or helmets.

 

Overall I feel like the game is turning into Destiny 3 as some people pointed out. Log in, do daily crap, log out, and what I liked about WF was that it was not like that normally. You could log in and think "what do I want to do today?" that feeling is gone for me, I log in and the first thing that comes to mind is "I still have nightwave stuff to do..." As I said on another post, it feels like an important alert is active 24/7 but it won't go away and give you the reward after completing it, so you have to complete it over and over again to get said reward, detracting from the game's fun and oepenness.

 

I liked when I was able to chose what to do, instead of the game telling me what to do.

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On 2019-03-05 at 5:54 PM, Morgul said:

People who buys it already have thousands of plat, so this makes no direct profit for de. Unless your a content creator buying this weak weapon now is "stupid" anyway. 

All the plat in trade was paid for by someone at some point, so it does make a significant profit indirectly (it's also the entire reason Riven mods even exist).

I absolutely agree on your second point though.

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2 minutes ago, marelooke said:

All the plat in trade was paid for by someone at some point, so it does make a significant profit indirectly (it's also the entire reason Riven mods even exist).

I absolutely agree on your second point though.

The more plat they can remove from the "economy" the better it is for them, they like trade because most people selling parts and blueprints go straight onto the market after to buy slots and potatoes.

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On 2019-03-11 at 8:36 AM, TheSkunkyMonk said:

Erm Nitian is tied to Nightwave, Nightwave is far from optional it is a must if you want to play this game now unless youve already built everything.

Unless they bring the alerts back and remove the time restriction on Nightwave Im done, Sorry but working a few month towards something just to have it reset if Im not fast enough just doesn't tickle those reward centers for me. Shame I was really enjoying this game up until a couple weeks ago when this crap came out. Good for my wallet though as not another penny will be going to the greedy swine who thought it would be good to seriously limit our progression and fun. Seriously why remove the affinity bonuses as well!

Hope it changes in the next day or two but highly doubt it.

Sea of Thieves anyone?

nitain is not.  look it up.  

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21 minutes ago, Klokwerkaos said:

nitain is not.  look it up.  

Nitain is indeed tied to nightwave, unles you are counting ghouls as a reliable source.

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17 minutes ago, Kuldor said:

Nitain is indeed tied to nightwave, unles you are counting ghouls as a reliable source.

You are wrong.  I said look it up didn't I?  

No problem, let me do it for you to prove you wrong.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Nitain_Extract

  • A bundle of 5 Nitain can be bought from Nightwave's offerings with 15 Wolf Cred.
  • It has a small chance to drop from a cache when all three are found — Orokin or Reactor Sabotage and Lua or Kuva Fortress Exterminate.
  • Part of Cetus Bounty's reward pool during a Ghoul Purge.

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1 hour ago, Klokwerkaos said:

nitain is not.  look it up.  

Level 15 - 25 Ghoul Bounty

Stage 4 of 5 Nitain Extract Rare (4.12%)

Final Stage  Nitain Extract Rare (5.95%)

Level 40 - 50 Ghoul Bounty

Stage 4 of 5  Nitain Extract  Rare (4.12%)

Final Stage  Nitain Extract  Rare (5.95%)

Awesome odds! Just do the high level ghoul mission about 12 times to get a 50% chance of 1 nitain to drop. 90% after 44 missions! Just imagine the odds! After all, how much nitain would a new player need? 20 for Vauban Prime, true, but it's vaulted anyway, right? So no need to worry!

Oh and there is even better choice.

Sabotage caches that go from an awe inspiring 0.5% (about 150missions for half the population) to a phenomenal 2% (only about 36 missions for the lucky half of the population).

The Wolf himself could drop it at 2.58% as well. All you need to do is find him and kill him... and if you are in the lucky half - you need to do it about 27 times to get at least one nitain extract!

So sure, Nitain is not a gated resource now. Not at all! Everything is fine.

this-is-fine-meme-625x350.jpg

 

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look, im sorry, but i must say it, "MUST". "NEED" to, honestly, D.E. is turning this game into #*!%ING "FORTNITE"

im sorry, but it had to be done... HAD to...

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THIS NEEDED TO BE SAID. I CANNOT EXPRESS HOW THIS FEELS LIKE OTHER THEN FORTNITES SEASONAL 1-TIME "ONLY" ITEMS, eccept for the fact that nightwaves seasonal rewards are "FREE"(yeskindanotreallynoabsolutelynot)

 

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On 2019-03-05 at 8:54 AM, Morgul said:

People who buys it already have thousands of plat, so this makes no direct profit for de. Unless your a content creator buying this weak weapon now is "stupid" anyway. 

No matter who spends the plat, or on what, it has to come from somewhere. There's an amount of circulating platinum for sure, but it still had to come from somewhere.

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18 hours ago, Klokwerkaos said:

You are wrong.  I said look it up didn't I?  

No problem, let me do it for you to prove you wrong.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Nitain_Extract

  • A bundle of 5 Nitain can be bought from Nightwave's offerings with 15 Wolf Cred.
  • It has a small chance to drop from a cache when all three are found — Orokin or Reactor Sabotage and Lua or Kuva Fortress Exterminate.
  • Part of Cetus Bounty's reward pool during a Ghoul Purge.

Hey, getting money is not tied to work, you can win the lottery too!

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