We need to talk, DE.

[ObviousLee]

1 minute ago, (PS4)psycofang said:

No you cant.

Thats not sustained hovering thats called gliding. 

But the added con os that i cant stay up in the air almost perpetually out of harms way whilst i lay waste to everything below me.

A thing aim glide cant do and Hyld hasn't been proven to do.

and with a sustained flight ability, as outlined in my op that literally there is nothing to complain about as it benefits all playstyles, you can have the best of the hover, without the inherent issues of tailwind.

[seprent]

3 minutes ago, ObviousLee said:

This, requires justification for me to be ok with. I'm ok with zephyr never flying so long as DE can give me a good reason why, when all the tools necessary to make whats been asked for a possiblity already exist within tailwinds mechanics as it currently is.

personally looking on how zephyr looks she looks built more for the mode of gliding and floating though the air being made from oxium and if i recall that is a material from the orokin era that is lighter then air thus allowing her passive of hang time in the air to be longer one of her abilities governing the ability to make a large leap into the air or dart forward the rest around the concept of controlling the wind to her advantage reflecting bullets knocking people over tornadoes  

[IgnisDraconis4316]

@ObviousLee I don't see why it even matters dude. They can make a frame the way they want it. We pay for a service we do not have any other rights other than "we get to play said game". If you hate her so much you don't even have to play her. You can call her MASTERY FODDER like many do with weapons that aren't "God Tier". They do not have to answer to you or to me or anyone. We don't know where the inspiration for her came from. 

So stop saying that because you spent money on the game that that gives you any rights to the IP and how the game is to be made. I have given hundreds to DE for their content but never once have I told them that they MUST answer to ME because I pay. If that was the case Chroma Prime would have been reworked before it was primed as was DEMANDED by the playerbase. 

As for Zephyr at the time she was made we had no open worlds. Flight is useless in hallways and in corridors where any amount of flight is going to bump into things. At least with Hildryn's hover ability we can get some use out of it. I'm not sure how much and I doubt it would be useful except in Vallis or Plains. Titania the reason she can fly is she shrinks and therefore you still BUMP into things but your small enough that the cramped corridors don't bother you much. 

Now you can give ideas but that is it. Suggest, inspire, feedback without sounding entitled. But just like I have a computer and may charge people to play on said computer....... like my friends...... just because they use it doesn't mean they can change my mouse settings, my computer, my property. DE owns the WARFRAME IP. I admit that Zephyr doesn't really feel like a bird even though she looks like it. However, if you look at her as an air elementalist (think the Last Airbender) then it makes total sense. Chroma is a dragon...... he is more of a Elementalist from other games. 

I will try Hildryn and see how it is. Everyone I know is looking forward to her. They think she looks awesome. and together we can help DE make Hildryn and Zephyr better........ but remember they still have the final say........ we just have to help them see how they can make their idea better without changing it to something they didn't have in their vision for their IP.

 

Make sense?

[TARINunit9]

1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

Now then, Please help me understand why it is that Hildryn can fly?

Here's a contentious opinion: I am not comfortable calling Hildryn's little jetpack hover "flight"

Yeah she can ascend, and move forward while ascending, but to me that's not enough for true flight. She's stuck using up ALL her limbs to maintain that move. She can't shoot, she can barely accelerate, her movements are MORE sluggish than if she were on the ground, and overall her "flight" begins and ends with "feet not touching the ground". She's not flying, she's SWIMMING. And the final nail in the coffin is that she needs to use a dedicated ability to switch between "grounded" and "airborne".

Zephyr, while not free flight either, is MUCH more along the lines of flying. She uses a series of propelled dashes before falling slowly, during which time she can dash again if needed. Now, technically this is exactly what birds do. But we're not here to talk about the semantics of what birds do, we're here to talk about what the player wants to do. And the player can move fast, zip over a foe's head, fire down upon the unlucky groundlings with all their normal weapon options, switch between air and ground seamlessly by just jumping or choosing to land, basically she treats being airborne much more naturally than Hildryn ever does. Literally the only thing Zephyr can't do is remain airborne indefinitely. But that was never much of a problem for Tails in the Sonic games, people still say he can fly without reservations

[seprent]

4 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

She can't shoot

i think she can use that exalted wrist rocket thing and only that and that cost shields to shoot besides that yeah cant do much besides kinda slowly move around and hold people in the air in her AOE 

Edit: looks it up pulled from wiki "While Aegis Storm is active, a second Balefire firearm will be equipped on Hildryn's left arm when using this ability."

Edited March 7, 2019 by seprent

[Zeclem]

1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

I'm not judging the frame. Did you even read the OP? I'm upset that a frame themed around shileds, has a flight ability when a warframe that is THEMED AROUND FLIGHT has little to no actual flight aside from a janky system that unless one diminishes a stat that benefits the rest of her kit cannot be effectively used in the majority of the game.

shes not designed to be "shield frame". shes designed to be ironman-esque frame. they said so in the devstream. and guess what, iron man flies. 

[(PSN)psycofang]

14 minutes ago, ObviousLee said:

and with a sustained flight ability,

but was she designed with flight in mind or hovering? They couldve slapped on Titanias flight onto Zephyr but they didnt long after Titanias release.

Maybe they dont see her as a full on perpetual flight frame.

Regardless Hilds "flight" ,which is a STRETCH, isnt anywhere near as applicable as Zephyr charged tail wind doesnt function on the same level. 

Its flashy CC at best.

[ObviousLee]

Just now, IgnisDraconis4316 said:

@ObviousLee I don't see why it even matters dude. They can make a frame the way they want it. We pay for a service we do not have any other rights other than "we get to play said game". If you hate her so much you don't even have to play her. You can call her MASTERY FODDER like many do with weapons that aren't "God Tier". They do not have to answer to you or to me or anyone. We don't know where the inspiration for her came from. -1

So stop saying that because you spent money on the game that that gives you any rights to the IP and how the game is to be made. I have given hundreds to DE for their content but never once have I told them that they MUST answer to ME because I pay. If that was the case Chroma Prime would have been reworked before it was primed as was DEMANDED by the playerbase. -2

As for Zephyr at the time she was made we had no open worlds. Flight is useless in hallways and in corridors where any amount of flight is going to bump into things. At least with Hildryn's hover ability we can get some use out of it. I'm not sure how much and I doubt it would be useful except in Vallis or Plains. Titania the reason she can fly is she shrinks and therefore you still BUMP into things but your small enough that the cramped corridors don't bother you much. -3

Now you can give ideas but that is it. Suggest, inspire, feedback without sounding entitled. But just like I have a computer and may charge people to play on said computer....... like my friends...... just because they use it doesn't mean they can change my mouse settings, my computer, my property. DE owns the WARFRAME IP. I admit that Zephyr doesn't really feel like a bird even though she looks like it. However, if you look at her as an air elementalist (think the Last Airbender) then it makes total sense. Chroma is a dragon...... he is more of a Elementalist from other games. -4

I will try Hildryn and see how it is. Everyone I know is looking forward to her. They think she looks awesome. and together we can help DE make Hildryn and Zephyr better........ but remember they still have the final say........ we just have to help them see how they can make their idea better without changing it to something they didn't have in their vision for their IP. -5

 

Make sense?

Gonna address this by the numbers here.

1: we don't pay for any service. It's entirely free. Nor did I state any dislike for any particular frame. So nice strawman.

2: Again, another strawman. Never once did I say, suggest or hint that I am owed an answer. Not once did I declare that my will must be bowed to.

3. Flight is useless in hallways? Have you ever played Titania? Granted her kit differs entirely from Zephyr's however even if you're filling the exact same situation of zipping through hallways to avoid enemies not being on the ground with an entire x y z plane to navigate on increases your movement options.

4. this is exactly why I have the original post in how I feel to best address her issues with tailwind are  included in the original post.

5. Calling out blatant inconsistencies and mistakes is the literal job of everyone. Just as on a range everyone is a safety officer, in an online gaming community everyone is a bug tester, everyone is an observer with something to put forth. And in the instance where things are being put in that are direct requests for a specific warframe, but that specific warframe doesn't get the requested change but a brand new warframe gets it as part of their kit, We players of said frames find it hard to take in.

 

the outrage over zephyr not being able to fly started upon the release of Titania, and now I'm kickstarting it myself with Hyldrin.

 

It's a simple matter of "these have what this should, so why not add it to her too"

 

[seprent]

Just now, Zeclem said:

shes not designed to be "shield frame". shes designed to be ironman-esque frame. they said so in the devstream. and guess what, iron man flies. 

it even explains how she does it  Hildryn activates her jet propulsion system as she lifts off from the ground. Hildryn gains vertical and horizontal flight capabilities While active, her shield matrix drains shield points continuously to generate an energy field; the energy field shrinks as Hildryn gains vertical height and expands as she is closer to the ground. Enemies inside the energy field have fiery pillars of energy erupt from beneath them, forcing the targets to be suspended in midair, receive damage per second, and occasionally drop energy orbs.

[ObviousLee]

1 minute ago, ObviousLee said:

Gonna address this by the numbers here.

1: we don't pay for any service. It's entirely free. Nor did I state any dislike for any particular frame. So nice strawman.

2: Again, another strawman. Never once did I say, suggest or hint that I am owed an answer. Not once did I declare that my will must be bowed to.

3. Flight is useless in hallways? Have you ever played Titania? Granted her kit differs entirely from Zephyr's however even if you're filling the exact same situation of zipping through hallways to avoid enemies not being on the ground with an entire x y z plane to navigate on increases your movement options.

4. this is exactly why I have the original post in how I feel to best address her issues with tailwind are  included in the original post.

5. Calling out blatant inconsistencies and mistakes is the literal job of everyone. Just as on a range everyone is a safety officer, in an online gaming community everyone is a bug tester, everyone is an observer with something to put forth. And in the instance where things are being put in that are direct requests for a specific warframe, but that specific warframe doesn't get the requested change but a brand new warframe gets it as part of their kit, We players of said frames find it hard to take in.

 

the outrage over zephyr not being able to fly started upon the release of Titania, and now I'm kickstarting it myself with Hyldrin.

 

It's a simple matter of "these have what this should, so why not add it to her too"

 

 

Just now, seprent said:

it even explains how she does it  Hildryn activates her jet propulsion system as she lifts off from the ground. Hildryn gains vertical and horizontal flight capabilities While active, her shield matrix drains shield points continuously to generate an energy field; the energy field shrinks as Hildryn gains vertical height and expands as she is closer to the ground. Enemies inside the energy field have fiery pillars of energy erupt from beneath them, forcing the targets to be suspended in midair, receive damage per second, and occasionally drop energy orbs.

Can either one of you kindly show me which ironman movie/cartoon/comic that Tony Stark steals shields from others to bolster her own and allies?

She's not a shield frame but her entire kit functions around shields. Makes suense =/

[seprent]

Just now, ObviousLee said:

 

Can either one of you kindly show me which ironman movie/cartoon/comic that Tony Stark steals shields from others to bolster her own and allies?

She's not a shield frame but her entire kit functions around shields. Makes suense =/

i was just following up evidence on how she flies 

[TARINunit9]

Just now, ObviousLee said:

 

Can either one of you kindly show me which ironman movie/cartoon/comic that Tony Stark steals shields from others to bolster her own and allies?

She's not a shield frame but her entire kit functions around shields. Makes suense =/

A frame can be based on two things at the same time. Valkyr is a kitty viking. Oberon is a druid paladin

[ObviousLee]

Just now, TARINunit9 said:

A frame can be based on two things at the same time. Valkyr is a kitty viking. Oberon is a druid paladin

My overall point is that there are inconsistencies that occur and it bothers me immensely when I'm seeing what I perceive to be blatantly ignoring a frame.

I'm open to the possiblity I'm entirely wrong in DE's motivations, and I'm hoping that I am indeed incorrect.

What I want is their reasoning why they've made a frames number one mobility skill subjectively worse and have given any mechanics that could have gone to fixing this borked system to not one but two separate warframes. I just wanna know why, from their mouths.

[PoisonHD]

5 minutes ago, ObviousLee said:

Can either one of you kindly show me which ironman movie/cartoon/comic that Tony Stark steals shields from others to bolster her own and allies?

She's not a shield frame but her entire kit functions around shields. Makes suense =/

She's a shield frame, that has the design of a space trooper, like I said earlier. She is the shield frame, but she is also designed around ironman/space troopers. The two ideas fit well together, a heavily shielded space trooper. I'm also not against you here, just gonna say, I was saying earlier how Zephyr's design suggests that she should be able to fly, and cut through the air. Her design and theme aren't as well meshed as Hildryn's. Saying that, I mean she is thematically more a wind frame then a flight frame, but her design suggests she should fly.

 

Hildryn on the other hand, looks like a space trooper, has abilities of shield frame, but the abilities could also be that of a space trooper.

Edited March 7, 2019 by PoisonHD

[Legion-Shields]

1 hour ago, ObviousLee said:

Before I begin, allow me to clarify some things.

 

• I am very angry about Hildryn.
• I constantly hear about not wanting fames to step on one another, and yet I see the exact opposite happening.
• Favoritism is not good for anyone when it comes from the creators side.

Now then, Please help me understand why it is that Hildryn can fly?

 

I understand why Titania can fly, she's a fairy. Makes sense. So please help me understand why a frame that has zero avionic thematics can ALSO fly, but zephyr still cannot fly.

It's honestly at this point starting to feel like there is some personal grudge against a fan created frame that Y'all took into the game and made a part of it.

I want to hear some actual justification from you, Digital Extremes, Why you've decided to either neglect or outright spurn Zephyr. I need to understand why it is you took the first warframe capable of something resembling flight, and turned her into a hovering turkey that has to min/max build around a 1 skill as to avoid the animation locks that you yourselves put into her tailwind skill.

 

"But Lee! She's super good on the plains and orb valis!" Yea, I get that. That's not the overwhelming majority of content though is it? If you want to use tailwind in the majority of the game, you need to diminish your duration to avoid being stuck headfirst into walls or enemies. Max duration in anywhere but massive open world playspaces, thanks specifically to the animation lock of tailwind, means absolutely no chance to alter ones direction of travel. So, you're stuck if you panick or misjudge your angles. This wasn't an issue before her "rework" as one could manually tap out of the animation via sprint key. This is no longer the case.

 

So, again, to anyone at Digital Extremes, please help me understand why it is you have left an aviation/wind themed warframe in a borderline decrepit state which is entirely dependent upon the area she's fighting in for her mobility "flight" skill to work, but you've not only made that same mechanic better on Titania, but you've also given a flight mode similar to what several have asked tailwind to be, but on a shield themed warframe.

 

Not saying it is what it is, but it sure as hell feels like a slap in the face due to a frame not being liked by the developers.

 

I truly hope that I am incorrect, but the inconsistency in this particular matter bothers me immensely. Hope to hear back from you.

-Lee

 

Edit: Below is a copy of my suggestions on how to rework tailwind into a more useful and cohesive skill that everyone can enjoy.

 

Posted March 20, 2018

Yes folks, it's me again. It's been a minute but I'm back again to throw my two cents into the frame I love and adore to try to get her to where I feel she should be thematically and mechanically.

 

So, that said let's just jump right on in.

We're going to review her current kit's strengths and weaknesses in detail, and in doing so I'll make my suggestions on where she can be fixed in such a way that can accommodate as many desired play-styles as possible.

So lets start with the bane of all that is joy and happiness for me in regards to her kit: Tailwind. Tailwind as most of you reading this will likely know, is a dual function skill that works one of two ways: press 1 for instant cast to rocket at relatively high speeds in the direction of the cursor, or hold 1 to charge up for a hover that has you sitting in the air for roughly ten seconds.

Strengths: High mobility beyond parkour systems that allows for large distance of travel, as well as the ability to hold a particular altitude for a duration .

Weaknesses: High duration builds which positively effect the better part of her kit(Turbiulence and Tornado) gimp the usefulness of Tailwind in the overwhelming majority of the games content(sans Plains). Hover offers zero mobility without the use of another action, being melee attacking to get out of the hover or casting tailwind again. I've been told rolling out of hover works as well but I've had mixed results, not sure if bug or not but I digress. High duration Tailwind works well on the plains, I'll admit that much outright as the play space is large and open enough to really house the ability effectively. The same cannot be said about the rest of the games content. High duration builds in tile sets will see you grinding your face into walls till the animation lock expires and the ability finishes its cast or worse, have you diving beak first into the chest of an enemy only to be melee hit and take substantial (if not lethal) damage that you have zero ability to defend against. The augment)Target Fixation) is genuinely impossible to capitalize on even with a max strength build, due to the nature of how tailwind currently functions as it requires you to pass by enemies and thus hit them with the ability to gain the effect which resets upon touching the ground. Meaning essentially it's a waste of a slot to use as you're never able to effectively even build around it.

This, is a mechanical failure in design. The current state of tailwind, whether one likes it above its former incarnation or not, leaves you slamming into walls, doesn't work very well with the vast majority of the game, defenseless against enemies until the duration ends and is only genuinely applicable in 1% of the game(The plains). Don't get me wrong here, the ability isn't trash, but it's a far cry from what it has the potential to be. So, How do we fix this? Simple: we re-arrange the existing mechanics of the current rendition of Tailwind for more cohesion and versatility. Here's what I have in mind.

Remove the animation lock on tailwind. This in of itself would at least give more control to the player in regards to when they want the ability to end for the instant cast and prevent players from being at the mercy of corridors and enemies.No more three seconds of high-intensity wall inspections or getting brained by butchers/chargers who aren't here just lookin for a "good time".

Tie the distance and rate of travel to power strength instead of duration. This allows for max duration builds that aren't gimping any of her skills. Tying Tailwind to strength also bolsters the effectiveness of Target fixation, when coupled with what else I have in mind.

Take the charge mechanic for the hover, and revamp it to a persistent flight mode. The mechanics already exist in no less than three incarnations(Tailwind itself, razorwing, and archwing) so it's not that much of a switch as is. Limit the initial "flight speed" to a happy medium between the jog speed(moving forward without pressing sprint) and sprint speed. This allows for full control of flight without running the risk of slamming into things in narrow hallways. so for arguments sake a stock non thrust flight speed of say 1.05, and pressing sprint will give you the same speed as if you used the ability for its instant cast.

Holding aim engages the hover mode. This allows for controller users to not be kicked to the metaphorical curb in terms of mapping. It also offers point break control for when you want to go from breakneck speeds to stopping on a dime for whatever reason. Pressing jump disengages the flight mode and normal warframe travel can be resumed.

Make Divebomb be triggered on collision of enemy contact or hard collision. What I mean by this is if you're for example flying down a hallway with zero obstructions, and you glance off a wall divebomb is not triggered and you just kinda skitter alongside the wall until you rectify your vector(direction of flight). If you fly straight at the wall however, the AoE of divebomb is then triggered. Collision with enemies would also trigger the effect, however not impede the flight. This would essentially make Tailwind a highly mobile form of cc as well as allow for rapid tactical positioning.

Edit: Instead of using aim to initiate glide, tapping s should engage hover and tapping s again should resume flight courtesy of @Azamagon

In summary: This rendition of Tailwind offers greater cohesion, control, mobility and crowd control without gimping the remainder of your kit in relation to the majority of the games content. It also allows for one to now effectively build around the augment while simultaneously turning Zephyr into an airborne bulldozer without taking an arm and leg to conjure up new systems to make it possible. It's mechanics that already exist in the kit as it currently is, just needs to be re-aligned.

Air burst: Second ability of the kit that centers around strong cc for cheap casts that allow for Zephyr to remove enemies from her faze to avoid melee damage.

Strengths: Instant cast, wide AoE cc that forces knockdown of enemies that comes cheap and even cheaper in the air. It's great as a preemptive or reactive skill for halting enemy advancement or attacks.

Weaknesses: lack of outright damage, sometimes triggers prematurely due to surface clipping or (rarely) goes straight through surfaces and fails to trigger at all.

Honestly not much to say about this ability from my end as it functions (fairly) well for what a cc frame should be should be using. Personally I feel it could do a bit more to possibly force a slash proc, but I'm honestly not sure and it's up for debate.

Turbulence: The "I don't care about guns shooting at me but plz dun hit meh wit yo melee" ability. Zephyrs immensely enjoyable defensive ability with a run speed increasing augment to boot.

Strengths: Do you find yourself being shot in the face? Detron crewman got'cha down? Is that corrupted heavy gunner laying down a literal wall of bullets preventing you from safely murdering the ever living hell out of her? WELL LOOK NO FURTHER! What you need is TURBULENCE: THE GUN DENIER! Turbulence is effectively perfect in that it redirects projectiles away from Zephyr and has a very strong augment to accompany it(Jet Stream) for the purposes of evasion and/or jumping into the thick of the fight.

Weaknesses: Melee and lor range builds. Yup, that's it. oh and AoE from enemies but that's player positioning more so than a fault on the ability itself in my opinion.

There really isn't much to change or suggest changing here without risking a lynch mob, so I'll refrain from what amounts to a useless movement and just agree that the ability is fine as is.

 

Tornado: Summoning a maelstrom of nasty is great as an "oh snap" button, and even more so now that it can be recast on demand alongside the damage mechanic that has been incorporated. Tornado, out of all the abilities in the kit that could use some tweaking needs the least amount I believe, but tweaking it needs none the less.

Strengths: Hilarious crowd control, recastable, and monster levels of damage potential.

Weaknesses: The ability has to be babysat in order to make the most out of it as it tracks to your cursor, the tornadoes hold enemies only so/so, and the wandering is still problematic to a slight degree in relation to terrain that isn't the plains.

How we fix: We make Tornado exactly as its name says: A tornado.Singular. One very large, stationary tornado with a massive draw radius that houses enemies within the funnel instead of casting them aloft on the outer rim of the ability to be dumped unceremoniously onto the dirt. This removes the need to monitor the ability, as well as having roving twisters going all over hell and high water looking for a baddy to blow around. Funnel clouds can be retrofitted to function as the tornado ability currently functions, with the ability to utilize air burst in tandem with tornado as it also currently does. What this means is that without funnel clouds on your loadout casting tornado will give you a massive singular tornado that holds enemies inside it, but with funnel clouds you get the ability as it currently functions with the option to spam air burst into it to merge them into the one gigantic tornado. Alternatively, it could be made so it's the other way around and the singular massive tornado be an augment? Either or in all honesty.

 

So, in closing what we have presented before you is a more solid, cohesive skill set that fits the theme with mechanics that match. You get a wind themed frame that's covered in flight surfaces(even has an empennage for a cod piece) able to actually dominate the skies and fulfill her role better than ever before. She becomes more versatile, and allows for multiple styles of play that doesn't remove anything from anyone, but instead gives to all.

Lol u mad bro

[StinkyPygmy]

Full disclosure: didn't read all of that, but Hildrens flying is 10,000% different to any other frame in the game. its way more restrictive and locked down. Think you're overthinking it. Fames having some overlap isn't an issue.

[TARINunit9]

1 minute ago, ObviousLee said:

My overall point is that there are inconsistencies that occur and it bothers me immensely when I'm seeing what I perceive to be blatantly ignoring a frame.

A sentiment I continue to disagree with, but my apologies for continuing a derail you are dissatisfied with

[ObviousLee]

Just now, PoisonHD said:

She's a shield frame, that has the design of a space trooper, like I said earlier. She is the shield frame, but she is also designed around ironman/space troopers. The two ideas fit well together, a heavily shielded space trooper. I'm also not against you here, just gonna say, I was saying earlier how Zephyr's design suggests that she should be able to fly, and cut through the air. Her design and theme aren't as well meshed as Hildryn's. Saying that, I mean she is thematically more a wind frame then a flight frame, but her design suggests she should fly.

 

Hildryn on the other hand, looks like a space trooper, has abilities like a shield frame, but the abilities could also be that of a space trooper.

Oh I feel ya here. I think one of the big issues with text format is that its entirely too easy to misunderstand someones words or intent due to the lack of any kind of emotional context. I'm angry that hyldrin is going to get a flight mode, but I'm not angry with anyone here.

 

Just now, Legion-Shields said:

Lol u mad bro

What a wonderful bout of input.

[seprent]

1 minute ago, ObviousLee said:

I'm angry that hyldrin is going to get a flight mode

what should she get instead then? 

[BemoGuinness]

......Remember the days when they would release a new frame and people were happy to play it and if they liked it good  and if not then they would find another?

......Remember when DE would release a frame and there weren't a thousand #*!%ing thread of people wanting reworks and *@##$ing before it was even released?

 

 

 

........ good old time it was........

[InDueTime-EN-]

28 minutes ago, ObviousLee said:

blatantly missed the part about how the physical representation of the warframe also is indicative and ties into the thematic. So again, does nidus's infested parts not factor into his theme? How about Embers flames? Frosts ice vents? Yup nothing is indicative of what the frame is about, so obviously flight surfaces on a warframe would definitely indicate that it's themed around necromancy.

You missed these : 

43 minutes ago, InDueTime-EN- said:

Emphasis on Terms. These names came after creating the abilities, same as most warframes. 

Oberon "Paladin Themed Skills" "Druid Themed Aesthetics"

Revenant "Vampire Themed Skills" "Sentient Themed Aesthetics"

Additionally : 
Zephyr "Wind Themed Skills" "Birb Themed Aesthetics" "Aviation Skill Names" 
 

28 minutes ago, InDueTime-EN- said:

Your Logic : Her Ability names are Aviation Themed = She must be based on Aviation.

 

My suggestion : Don't use the names of the Abilities. Look what each ability does and decide on the theme on that.

 

1st ability = warframe jumps in a the direction that your facing at great speeds and deals damage to enemies. Secondary : Allows warframe to hover.

2nd ability = creates a burst of wind in front of you that damages enemies.

3rd ability = creates a wind shield that deflects bullets

4th ability = creates tornadoes.

None of her ability mechanics, mention anything about being a bird or aviation themed. 

Lost Zephyr Concept Art : 

Quote

 

If you remove Hyldrin or Titania from this argument and just focus on the main complaint :

Why doesn't Zephyr fly?

Answer : Her abilities are wind based. Controlling wind. Birbs and Planes, don't control wind to fly. They use their wings. Zephyr doesn't have wings, she has a design that makes her lighter than other frames. 

[ObviousLee]

Just now, seprent said:

what should she get instead then? 

A siege mode would be interesting, but I've no experience with hyldrin yet. I've a mountain of experience with Zephyr though. I only offer gripes about things I can honestly say I grasp firmly. It's why when someone asks me about how I would balance another warframe I usually have no input to offer as I've not spend a great amount of time with them. With zephyr, I have.

[seprent]

3 minutes ago, ObviousLee said:

A siege mode would be interesting, but I've no experience with hyldrin yet. I've a mountain of experience with Zephyr though. I only offer gripes about things I can honestly say I grasp firmly. It's why when someone asks me about how I would balance another warframe I usually have no input to offer as I've not spend a great amount of time with them. With zephyr, I have.

wouldnt that be already covered by her bale fire cannons and archwing gun thing also from what we been show her flight is very restrictive like trying to get a couple ton iron block to take off the ground via just strapping thrusts to it that overpower the weight while zephyr can and probably will fly circles around her mobility wise 

Edited March 7, 2019 by seprent
autocorrect messing up words

[ObviousLee]

5 minutes ago, InDueTime-EN- said:

If you remove Hyldrin or Titania from this argument and just focus on the main complaint :

Why doesn't Zephyr fly?

Answer : Her abilities are wind based. Controlling wind. Birbs and Planes, don't control wind to fly. They use their wings. Zephyr doesn't have wings, she has a design that makes her lighter than other frames. 

Do you know how flight surfaces work? I'm guessing not. It takes air a shorter time to pass over the top of a flight surface, than it does the bottom side of it.

This is what generates lift.

Here's the excerpt: Bernoulli's principle: Bernoulli's principle helps explain that an aircraft can achieve lift because of the shape of its wings. They are shaped so that that air flows faster over the top of the wing and slower underneath. Fast moving air equals low air pressure while slow moving air equals high air pressure.

 

What is zephyr's body covered with? Flight surfaces. What does she control? Wind. What is necessary for flight? Wind.  Controls wind.....has flight surfaces....nope can't see her flying makes no sense.

 

Yes, this is sarcasm. Not mean sarcasm mind you, but sarcasm nonetheless. Something that can cntrol wind can easily manipulate said wind over the flight surfaces to generate lift, just like it does with tailwind.

 

Edit: Wings are flight surfaces.

Edited March 7, 2019 by ObviousLee

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

12 minutes ago, InDueTime-EN- said:

You missed these : 

Additionally : 
Zephyr "Wind Themed Skills" "Birb Themed Aesthetics" "Aviation Skill Names" 
 

None of her ability mechanics, mention anything about being a bird or aviation themed. 

Lost Zephyr Concept Art : 

 

If you remove Hyldrin or Titania from this argument and just focus on the main complaint :

Why doesn't Zephyr fly?

Answer : Her abilities are wind based. Controlling wind. Birbs and Planes, don't control wind to fly. They use their wings. Zephyr doesn't have wings, she has a design that makes her lighter than other frames. 

:15-:30 sure sounds like flight to me, even the Lotus says she's supposed to fly... Yet :

 

Edited March 7, 2019 by (XB1)RDeschain82