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[DE]Danielle

Melee Revisit: Phase 1 Feedback Megathread

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Posted (edited)

For about one glorious day, I could run around with channel toggled on, and would stay in channel mode even when I switched to firearms. Then somebody "fixed" it. If you could please break it back to the way it was I appreciate. The goal of the new update was to make combat between firearms and melee seamless. Sounds good to me. But in my case, the only way to continue my own playstyle is to go into games with only melee equipped.

Edited by Titivilis
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As a melee player the new system just kill my playstyle, because :

  • - autoblock drain my energy
  • - i can't life strike properly. I just can't use the toggle system as easily and reliabily as the very intuitive push system we had before.

In conclusion i die 30 level under what i did before. My build and playstyle were not the best, but they were very fun. Can you give us an option to

  • be lock in melee mode
  • have a double key attribution (standard mode/melee)
  • block as a push
  • chanel attack on push
Thanks
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Is it possible to have an option to switch between classic melee configuration and melee 3.0 ? I understand if right now it's not the case, because we have to beta test the new melee 3.0 system, but later on it would be really nice to be able to choose which melee system to apply in game.

I think it's always a good idea when you can let the players choose.

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Posted (edited)

At first I thought I liked the new melee slam mechanics, but now I don't. Before you had to look strait down to pull off a slam. Which made it very useful when you would be bullet jumping and if you over shot where you were going you could look strait down and hit where you wanted to be. It was very precise and took skill. Now if your mouse is at an angle to the ground it will make you land several meters from where you wanted to be. Making it feel more like you don't have any control. Funny as this sounds but before it was better because if you didn't pull off the melee slam strait down, you didn't deserve to. The game had this special thing before. Warframe doesn't take a lot of skill to play. You can have so much fun with your friends and suck ass at it. But, if you wanted to take it to the next level,  especially the movement system, melee attacks, and master the speed of the game it made you feel good about your self because you knew you had achieved something. It elevated the fun! That my friends is special! Lightning in a bottle! That's rare! Include all the other complexities and nuances of the game and you got something you just don't see every day in interactive entertainment. It is like living in side an action movie and who doesn't want to be a hero. I think change is good but not always. People have referred to it as “dumbing the game down” and on some strange level my intelligence has been insulted by this change. I guess I'm just that crazed fan who just wants my idol to never grow old. Why mess with perfection. I hope I'm not alone in this fight to revert to the old system or at least have an option for it.

Edited by Meatsikle
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10 hours ago, DeltaPangaea said:

I'd agree. One thing I've learned from reading this thread and keeping track of the conversation is that a lot of people have some really unique setups. Like, that one guy used Spacebar for blocking? Madman!

But basically the TL;DR is that you can't ASSUME people are going to be playing this game with the default keys. I mean to be honest the default bindings are garbage. We need greater control over our controls. We need OPTIONS. Do we want quick melee to equip our melee weapon properly? Do we want Weapon Switch to swap back to our last used gun or the other one? Do we want autoblock or manual block?

We need OPTIONS for these things. What we DON'T need to be told is that we're not playing 'the right way'. Because that's what you're doing if you change the controls to the detriment of a great number of people and just tell them to get used to it. You're telling them that they're doing it WRONG, and they have to learn to play the RIGHT WAY.

Give us options. Don't try and pigeonhole everyone into one controlscheme, because it's NOT going to work.

I almost NEVER use default key bindings, for nearly every game. For Warframe i have:

Ability Power 1, 2, 3, & 4 = Mouse Button 5, E, Z, & Left Alt.

Interact/Activate = F (like nearly every other game out there)

Switch weapons = 1, & 2 for equip melee during the old system.

Melee = Mouse Button 4 (how can you even use E for this?? Not enough fingers to freely stafe right [D key] while melee'ing). Before Melee 2.999 i would use Left Mouse Button for equipped melee & Mouse 4 as quick melee, but decided to get used to 1 melee button only in preparation for Melee 3.0.

Many other non default keys too but these are the ones relevant to this topic.

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Hindsight is a *@##$ sometimes. This change comes down for me to the old saying: “You don't know what you got until it is gone.” I just took it for granite. And I took for granite and assumed that DE knew that the 2.0 setup was great. I know you can't please all the people all of the time. The debate will rage on on both sides of the fence. I feel there will be casualties if DE moves ahead with this arbitrary change and I might be one of them. Breaks my heart to think about it.

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17 hours ago, IronSteelEX said:

Please enable Primary Weapon Secondary Fire while Melee is Equipped

Many weapons have an important secondary fire/toggle (like Phantasma, Zarr etc.) that i cannot use anymore immediately after melee attacking.

I'm mainly a Corinth secondary Air-burst user who needs to shoot air-bursts all the time, and i'm now frustrated that after doing a quick melee (where melee is brought out & fully equipped now) I cannot immediately shoot off a Corinth secondary air-burst at a crucial time, but have to shoot 1 primary fire shot first before primary weapons is equipped again and i can then blow up the whole group instantly with my secondary fire air-burst. I don't need that button for melee channel, as i don't use it and even if i did i have it mapped to a different key (and as i understand, melee channel will be done away with soon anyway).

Also, i can't press the "switch weapons" button anymore to bring out the primary weapon again after melee is equipped, in order to fire off an air-burst, it changes to secondary weapon...

Forgive me if this was mentioned earlier in this forum, i haven't had time to finish reading every page.

 

Other than that, I like the melee 2.999 improvements and love the direction that you guys are taking this, and i'm sure these kinks would be ironed out eventually as melee 3.0 continues to be worked on 🙂

Just found out today that i could equip Primary Weapon again after melee by right-click aiming, and thus am able to shoot off a secondary fire shot immediately. This is just a stop-gap solution though. Again, please enable instant secondary fire while melee equipped.

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I'm going to take a moment out of my grind to beat a dead horse on this improvements.  I know it's been said before.  I know that it's been +1 upvoted plenty of times too...  I just feel that it requires a revisit and a sort of vent from me...  Because it dawned on me, why I'm finding my dislike building for it.  

Quick Melee is supposed to be the sort of thing that one does in order to hit targets that were otherwise too close/in my personal space that I don't want to deal with either with a primary that can do some incredible one-shot self-death, or a secondary that takes a bit to swap out to because of the keystroke requirement as well as the animation.  After a quick swing or two, I'm back to having my personal space cleared out and I get the opportunity to use weapons of mass destruction without fear of making myself into a piece of charcoal during the mission.

Here's the problem though -- it's the same problem I have when it comes daggers and stance mods.  With the improved systems it completely lacks any economy of movement.  Instead of a quick attack with a CQC weapon on targets I don't want near me, I'm having to deal with the potential of activating the stance mod based on keyboard combinations.  And with some of them -- like the sigma and octantis -- I can end up moving huge amounts of distances which can be a potential problem when playing in the open map of the index.  

DE has been trying to tell me that this is an improvement.  That this makes the flow of battle easier.  It makes for better effects and better...  whatever.  

I call BS.  This is a drastic change that reads too much like Hollywood Producers trying to pitch a new movie with "wouldn't it be cool if..."  Only to have the movie ending up a non-stop cliché of tropes.  

That often frustrates players not only because it's been added in an arbitrary method not in the middle of not every day play, but at least three to four events where players are trying to get rewards as quickly and as efficiently as possible without having to suffer the frustration of learning new muscle memory situations and a new system for the game.  And definitely not by suffering burn out in the process.  

Allow me to hyperbole the point by saying this is like giving an untested weapon to a squad and throwing them into the middle of a live-fire situation.  In a real world situation this would cause death and collateral damage of untold amounts, but in a game...  Yeah, perfectly all right because it's just the average joe playing a game in their spare time.  

As former military I can most certainly tell you -- you're doing something to remove the target in as quick and efficient a manner as possible...  Not dance like in a Kung-Fu movie...  You know, like this:

giphy.gif

Since the recent update, it once again defeats the purpose of gameplay and breaks the very flow it's supposed to be "enhancing" by going into quick melee, dance like one's Jet Li, and then refuses to go back to a non-combative choice from the gear -- you know Fishing Spears or Mining Lasers -- exactly the same bloody way the old system used to be before the enhancement.  The very thing that makes me contemplate whether to make noise about the thought introducing to the Plains of Vallis to fish and farm free of the random mobs spawning and saying, "oh hey Tenno, I hear you like bullets and laser beams?"  

I know it's sort of premature to whinge about the above...  that there's still things in the works to fix this melee system.  As I said though, this a vent.  

TL;DR I'm here to kill, not dance with the enemy.  

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It took a bit of adjusting to get used to and I do like the Melee changes so far. My only issue currently is that aim glide drops objective if primary weapon is equipped. Doing missions like mobile defense or excavations where I have to bring an object to a point means I can't aim glide without dropping said object which is a bit frustrating.

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Ya know, if folks can swap their default combo to another combo at the press of a button(Like Ivara can swap arrows on her 1 ability), this system would be way better. So instead of seeing default combo when tapping melee, you see one of the stance combos you swapped to. 

The timed attacks and whatnot can stay(added damage as a reward for doing these), but they are too hard to pull off in chaotic situations.

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Have you considered widening the auto block arc for sword and shield weapons?  The purpose of a shield is really to defend.  It’s something to hide behind when the going gets tough.  The narrow blocking arc is fine for something narrow like a sword or staff, but I really think it should be a little wider for a shield.

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il y a 1 minute, BghElwood a dit :

Have you considered widening the auto block arc for sword and shield weapons?  The purpose of a shield is really to defend.  It’s something to hide behind when the going gets tough.  The narrow blocking arc is fine for something narrow like a sword or staff, but I really think it should be a little wider for a shield.

I think that's what they changed Reflex Guard to do.

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1 minute ago, xZeromusx said:

I think that's what they changed Reflex Guard to do.

I highly doubt that, even changed as it is, very many people will ever use Reflex Guard.

It's still one of the many junk mods we still have for some reason.

Seriously, why are the single-stat Status Chance mods STILL so goddamn horrible?

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Posted (edited)
il y a 9 minutes, DeltaPangaea a dit :

I highly doubt that, even changed as it is, very many people will ever use Reflex Guard.

It's still one of the many junk mods we still have for some reason.

Seriously, why are the single-stat Status Chance mods STILL so goddamn horrible?

I mean, you're not wrong. I'm just pointing out that subtle change. Honestly, so much broke with this new system that I don't even know where to begin. IMHO, the only thing positive I've taken away from it that I would like to keep is quick melee switching, and even then, I see the nightmare that is the lack of the old quick melee without switching. Just about everything else, I could see so many upsides of rolling back.

If they'd just roll the whole thing back to melee 2.0 until such a time comes when they actually complete 3.0 in its entirety rather than this phase implementation stuff, we could revisit a possible change. But this limbo nightmare (get it?) is just going to bite into their bottom dollar.

Edited by xZeromusx
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1 hour ago, xZeromusx said:

I mean, you're not wrong. I'm just pointing out that subtle change. Honestly, so much broke with this new system that I don't even know where to begin. IMHO, the only thing positive I've taken away from it that I would like to keep is quick melee switching, and even then, I see the nightmare that is the lack of the old quick melee without switching. Just about everything else, I could see so many upsides of rolling back.

If they'd just roll the whole thing back to melee 2.0 until such a time comes when they actually complete 3.0 in its entirety rather than this phase implementation stuff, we could revisit a possible change. But this limbo nightmare (get it?) is just going to bite into their bottom dollar.

Here's what I'd do, were I the unquestioned overlord of this debacle. First step, roll back to melee 2.0. Except the directional slams, they can stay.

Then, we institute Quick Shot. In short, when your melee weapon is equipped pressing Quick Melee will fire your secondary weapon in the same quick draw manner as Quick Melee makes a melee attack.

Next step, is going through ALL OF THE STANCES and standardizing them. Forward/neutral combos don't interfere with movement, and back-combos are where the fancier stuff is. Maybe use block combos for CC combos or otherwise fancy ones. Defensive ones maybe, Iunno.

And then and ONLY then, we make Quick Melee use the equipped stance, after we've resolved how horrible a lot of stances are for doing normal things.

And while we're at it somewhere along the line we increase weapon switch speed across the board. And speed up the knockdown and stagger animations. Because spoiler alert, almost nobody uses Handspring, and I guarantee you that even LESS use Pain Threshold. And cut out stuff like Trencher knockback forcing a heavy landing. It's annoying.

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, DeltaPangaea said:

Here's what I'd do, were I the unquestioned overlord of this debacle. First step, roll back to melee 2.0. Except the directional slams, they can stay.

Then, we institute Quick Shot. In short, when your melee weapon is equipped pressing Quick Melee will fire your secondary weapon in the same quick draw manner as Quick Melee makes a melee attack.

Next step, is going through ALL OF THE STANCES and standardizing them. Forward/neutral combos don't interfere with movement, and back-combos are where the fancier stuff is. Maybe use block combos for CC combos or otherwise fancy ones. Defensive ones maybe, Iunno.

And then and ONLY then, we make Quick Melee use the equipped stance, after we've resolved how horrible a lot of stances are for doing normal things.

And while we're at it somewhere along the line we increase weapon switch speed across the board. And speed up the knockdown and stagger animations. Because spoiler alert, almost nobody uses Handspring, and I guarantee you that even LESS use Pain Threshold. And cut out stuff like Trencher knockback forcing a heavy landing. It's annoying.

Perfect solution right here. Give melee players the option to have ranged as a side peice just like ranged players having melee as a side peice. Everyone will be happy. Perfect solution. DeltaPangea salute! Let the guns and the blade flow? Let the blades and the guns flow too!

Edited by SilviaS12
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Posted (edited)
il y a 16 minutes, DeltaPangaea a dit :

Here's what I'd do, were I the unquestioned overlord of this debacle. First step, roll back to melee 2.0. Except the directional slams, they can stay.

Then, we institute Quick Shot. In short, when your melee weapon is equipped pressing Quick Melee will fire your secondary weapon in the same quick draw manner as Quick Melee makes a melee attack.

Next step, is going through ALL OF THE STANCES and standardizing them. Forward/neutral combos don't interfere with movement, and back-combos are where the fancier stuff is. Maybe use block combos for CC combos or otherwise fancy ones. Defensive ones maybe, Iunno.

And then and ONLY then, we make Quick Melee use the equipped stance, after we've resolved how horrible a lot of stances are for doing normal things.

And while we're at it somewhere along the line we increase weapon switch speed across the board. And speed up the knockdown and stagger animations. Because spoiler alert, almost nobody uses Handspring, and I guarantee you that even LESS use Pain Threshold. And cut out stuff like Trencher knockback forcing a heavy landing. It's annoying.

Works for me. They tried to marry melee and gun fire into one single mode that shares no keybinds on the mouse when they were two separate modes before that did share keybinds on the mouse, and in the process, lost so much of both that both took a big hit. All that needed addressing was the flow from one mode to the other, not this huge wedding of the two that, as weddings often are, was a disaster. The night of consummation finally came, and the spark just wasn't there.

But we HAVE TO get rid of auto-block. It's the drunkest groom's man at the reception. Honestly... or just put it on a toggle that few people are like to actually ever use.

Edited by xZeromusx
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On 2019-03-07 at 9:03 PM, [DE]Danielle said:

Effects Upgrades

 

We've done a complete overall of all Melee Effects! Hit animations, elemental effects and slam attacks: making melee look as good as it feels!

Please PLEASE give us an option to disable the new effects or make it tied to the "weapon elemental FX" option... absolutely hate how much my melee weapons flash around now.

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2 hours ago, DeltaPangaea said:

Here's what I'd do, were I the unquestioned overlord of this debacle. First step, roll back to melee 2.0. Except the directional slams, they can stay.

Then, we institute Quick Shot. In short, when your melee weapon is equipped pressing Quick Melee will fire your secondary weapon in the same quick draw manner as Quick Melee makes a melee attack.

Next step, is going through ALL OF THE STANCES and standardizing them. Forward/neutral combos don't interfere with movement, and back-combos are where the fancier stuff is. Maybe use block combos for CC combos or otherwise fancy ones. Defensive ones maybe, Iunno.

And then and ONLY then, we make Quick Melee use the equipped stance, after we've resolved how horrible a lot of stances are for doing normal things.

And while we're at it somewhere along the line we increase weapon switch speed across the board. And speed up the knockdown and stagger animations. Because spoiler alert, almost nobody uses Handspring, and I guarantee you that even LESS use Pain Threshold. And cut out stuff like Trencher knockback forcing a heavy landing. It's annoying.

Just... perfect solution.

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Since the update, I've tried these new standards DE has made, but I can't. I want to be able to use melee attack and channel with the mouse, not the keyboard. I'm no longer using melee until this problem is solved. 

Only the effects and some combos have improved melee enjoyment by the look's of it from the community. 

I also don't enjoy playing the game as much as it was.

I hope my years and thousands of dollars haven't gone down the drain to make DE take a step backwards. Maybe phase two, fix the problem?

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And y'know what else, now I'm thinking on it? If you don't have a melee equipped, then you always use Quick Shot instead of Quick Melee. So you can walk around as Mesa with a scanner equipped so your hands are empty, and then just quickdraw on people like you're Clint Eastwood.

Or hell, even put a thing in the options which 'Quick' you want to take priority. Or have an option for each to have separate keys! The critical factor here is CHOICE. Give people as many tools as you can for them to choose how they want to play. If they just want to only use full-switch equipping? Fine. If they want to use Quick Melee and Quick Shot? Fine. if they want to use this hybrid 2.9 system? That's fine too, but you need to give people choices.

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On 2019-03-15 at 5:08 AM, AminusTek said:

This ^^. Same exact feelings and opinion.

Yup. Totally with ya on that. 

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Posted (edited)

After having spent a decent amount of time on this new melee switch system, I have to say... IT STILL FEELS REALLY BAD. It feels offensive to call this "Melee 2.9" because it isn't a melee fighting system anymore. It's a gun shooting system with melee rotting on the side.

The new particle effects are neat.
The targeted slam is great.
The weapon swapping controls feel bad and unintuitive.

The reason the controls feel bad is because the majority of controls that involve meleeing stuff are now Contextual buttons running on illogical "If Then" statement, and they also feel bad because I have minimal control over how I want to tell my character to hit stuff that makes logical sense. These new controls feel like they were designed by someone who's inspiration was "the game is working well here, lets shake it up for literally no reason".

I typically run around with a Zarr, a Sonicor, and a Paracesis. I typically run around stabbing things if they survive more than 1 zarr shot while I'm closing in. My play style could be summarized as "A dinner plate of sword with a hint of gun". After this table flip of a melee update my playstyle has now pretty much become "That was meant to be a ground slam, why is my gun shooting?"

Just like many other players I will Bullet-jump around the map. Just like many other players I will aim glide. Just like many other players I will slam my sword into the ground to annihilate a group of Corpus because there's a nullifier stopping my abilities killing them before I get there.
I will be running around with a sword in hand. This is the weapon I have equipped. The button I press to attack with the weapon I have equipped is Left Mouse Button. This is a standard fact of basically every game that's been released since Doom, if not earlier.
Right Mouse Button has been the aiming button on a great many First Person & Third Person Shooter games. This is a core feature of games where you run and gun. In warframe it is the aiming button for the weapon you have equipped. When you are in the air it was the aiming button for the weapon you have equipped, while also allowing you to glide. Hence the popular name "Aim-glide".

This update has broken that logical process of "right click aims with the weapon you have equipped". Instead it has become "change weapon to the last gun you were holding and aim with that one instead".
Why? I want to aim with my sword so I can slam my sword into the ground.
I know plenty of you may be thinking "Oh IceFire, just click the melee button". Funnily enough It is quite difficult to naturally just do that having accrued 1354 hours in Warframe over 7,228 missions. Turns out when I want to attack I click Left Mouse Button, because that is the attack button, so instead I'll glide over fire a Zarr and 50/50 kill myself since I usually glide close to the floor and Zarr explodes a lot.

Then there's the issue of blocking. In the previous Melee version you gave us a mod that performed auto-blocking. It felt horrible to use. The Warframe would just randomly stop everything to block a bullet. It interfered with animations. I don't know if anyone actually used it, but to me it felt horrible and I promptly took it off my sword.
Now we've permanently got auto-block, but it still interrupts animations when it triggers.

This new "fast switch" melee system also isn't fast/instant if a gun has an animation still playing, because the sword waits politely for that to finish before changing. I've used an Arca Plasmor, fired the shot then immediately went to swing the sword. The sword did not come out instantly. It waited for the Arca Plasmor to finish its end-of-firing animation before coming out. Which also breaks the flow you supposedly added in.

I did ask to have Quick Melee deleted. Quick Melee was more effective in most cases than stance fighting. Your new system tries to dump stance fighting into Quick Melee, and fails at that. I should be allowed to give a quick sword swing in a fast paced looter shooter game like Warframe. In Call of Duty when you click the melee button you don't holster the gun to raise your fists and perform kung-fu moves. You'd give a quick knife swipe, a quick smack with your gun and then you go back to gunning. You don't keep those fists raised or that knife out. That was Quick Melee. Fast is smooth, and smooth is fast.

I did not ask for auto-block. It's the reason I never used Reflex Guard. It felt bad to use. Why is it now forced on me?
The previous weapon system felt satisfying to use. I had control of which weapon I would have equipped, and I had control over which weapon I was attacking with. The current system just doesn't make sense for Warframe. With this new system and the toggle enabled, if I'm running on the ground with a sword out I can click Left Mouse Button to swing the sword but if I'm in the air and aim-glide I pull out my gun?
Aim-glide is not "change weapon". Change weapon is change weapon and aim-glide is aim-glide. Having aim-glide as aim-glide-change-weapon feels bad. The game shouldn't be changing the weapon on me. I should be changing my weapon.

On 2019-03-08 at 10:03 AM, [DE]Danielle said:

This thread will be used to house your feedback on Phase 1 of the Melee Revisit from Buried Debts: Update 24.4.0! No one knows the power of their Arsenal better than the Tenno - your adaptability and skill with the blade will be tested, and as we continue these changes, we rely on your feedback! 

You say that we know our own arsenal the best. So stop trying to tell us how to properly use it. The current system is just you telling us "thats not how I do it. Stop trying to play the game how you want to."? 

Give us our control back. If you want this new contextual melee control scheme in then at least give us a Legacy Melee toggle, if you want you could even call it "Advanced Melee", so those of us who prefer that can use it, while those who like the new system can use the new one. Or better yet, give us a whole bunch of toggle options to cherry pick the best features of Weapons 2.9 (the current system) and Weapons 2.0 (the previous system)
Stop making the game tell me what weapon I want to have equipped and attacking with. Let me decide that. I'm the player and I'm a big enough boy I can decide when I want to have my sword equipped, and when I want to pull my gun out.
Weapon Control 2.9 should be smooth and fast. Because as I said before, Fast is smooth, and smooth is fast.

This isn't Devil May Cry. This is Warframe.

Edited by IceFire909
added in the arsenal quote
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I know this is a small point compared to the other major issues you guys have brought up, but I'm not sure I've seen it said, so.

Another issue with this (at least for my controller using arse, because I mainly play on Switch) is that it's really hard to use the right stick to look around AND tap the melee button to strike on the fly. Like... trying to tap any of the face buttons is an exercise in futility while using the right stick, and the button bindings are packed as is, so rebinding feels out of the question.

(Unless there's some solution other controller users have came up with and I've totally missed.)

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My opinions on the melee changes so far:

Slams:  I feel like I have more control over where I am landing with slams now.  Good job DE.

Swapping weapons / melee:  It is smoother to do so now and I have more control over it.  I can go from primary to melee instantly and then switch back to primary or hit my swap gun button to switch from melee to secondary.  This is great DE.

Quick Melee:  The animations don't exist anymore and I don't like it.  Sometimes I would rather just swing my polearm or sword in an X for less damage and keep moving rather then using a combo which causes me to stop and go.  Please bring back quick melee animations DE.

Stance and Combos: I can go straight into the default melee combo, which is great.  If I want to use the alternate combo animations I have to aim down the sights of my gun and then start swinging my melee weapon.  This feels horrible.  I want the alternate animations back.  Please fix DE.

Blocking:  Pull out the melee weapon, the warframe starts blocking shots and doesn't stand there getting shot.  Feels great.  Making the angle of parry a thing with mods is great.  The problem though is I have lost all control over when I am or am not blocking.  It causes the blocking to feel broken.  Sometimes after being shot my warframe goes into the "Active blocking" animation and then gets stuck in it until I shoot my gun.  Because of this sometimes my warframe goes into bullet jump mode when I am mid-jump and I fly into a wall.  Feels bad.  It feels like weapons that have mechanics built around active blocking are broken now.  I can't figure out how to make my Vaykor Sydon blind people now.  Half the time I can't get my Avenging Truth to proc the extra damage.  Please bring back active blocking DE.

Overall I feel like streamlining the fluid weapon switching has cost me control over how I attack.  Due to this, I am currently not in favor of the new melee changes.  Most of this stems from me not being able to choose when I am blocking and when I am not.  Before I get bombarded with the classic "Git Gud" I see a lot on the forums, I tried to look this stuff up online and have asked in game.  The only stuff I find is prepatch videos on the melee.  If there is a place to look up what I am having trouble with, I can't find it.

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