Jump to content
[DE]Danielle

Melee Revisit: Phase 1 Feedback Megathread

Recommended Posts

I just died... Valkyr's 4th Ability completely overriden by AIM GLIDE, Arbitrations 150+ Levels good bye reward. DEFU.SE---

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looking for a good Warframe EMU Pre-Melee 3.0

Anyone???

  • Like 1
  • Satisfied 1
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just want a an option to change between a toggled channeling and a held channeling. The forced toggle feels clunky when I just want use channeling in short bursts for things like dispatch overdrive or life strike. I end up burning a lot more energy then intended with the toggle due to it being slower.

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I hate this changes for all the reasons previously mentioned by other players.

I will not going into detail because at this point, it seems futile since you DE are not willing to giveus any form of feedback.

Im very disappointed.

Also NERF SCOTT, leave my Itzal alone.

  • Like 3
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, (PS4)hellahym said:

I hate this changes for all the reasons previously mentioned by other players.

I will not going into detail because at this point, it seems futile since you DE are not willing to giveus any form of feedback.

Im very disappointed.

Also NERF SCOTT, leave my Itzal alone.

I agree, Nerf Scott.

Please bring back the ability to select Melee, we can no longer do the following since you've REVERTED BACK to Melee 2.0 by forcing us to use a single button:

1. Can't Channel Attacks, wuts the point of channeling?

2. Can't Charge Attacks, warframe is busy auto-blocking

3. Can't Chose when to block, warframe auto-blocks,and screws up everything else.

4. Can't reliably do combos anymore; since its now a new button to add to already over-taxed fingers with buttons, what magical button did you THINK we were going to bind quick melee to, to melee for OVER AN HOUR pressing 1 button?

5. Please stop smoking cheesy poofs and actually try meleeing for an entire play through and realize how horrible 1 button melee is.

6. The alt-fire for most melee barely functions now, redeemer for example. My guy is too busy swinging the redemeer around to actually fire it; before when I could swimply swap to melee, and use Mouse 1 to attack, Mouse 2 to block / channel, I could simply press Alt-Fire to use Melee Alternate attacks. Now it's a crapshoot if it ever works.

 

Currently Melee is utter trash because its bound to 1 button. I have no idea who thought that was a good idea; it was bad back when it was one button, which was why you guys re-designed it, to give melee more love. Now all we can do is go back to spin to win to do melee, and honestly after 10 minutes everyone's wrist is worn out from spamming the same button outside of all our normal PC wasd buttons.

Edited by Argenex
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@[DE]Danielle: I just found out about this post; I hope to god it's not too late to get some feedback in!

Firstly I just want to briefly point out a lot of my original melee 3.0 suggestions were well received (my post and all its upvotes got borked) and implemented into what we see now. Phase 1 is off to a running start so my suggestions at this juncture are:

  • Aerial Attack Delay Should Be Removed. At the very least no more of a delay than non aerial attacks. Warframe's melee combat is mostly on the ground meanwhile parkour infused space ninja combat is begging to be more aerial. If DE is experimenting with juggling/DMC influence, this suggestion synergizes with that end.
  • Wall Attacks Should All Be 'Tatsued'. The new melee weapon Tatsu is the closest we ever have come to wall attacks being viable for the distance it travels is actually meaningful. However since we can not control when the wall attack (after wall launching) executes and it does a very long post attack roll animation, wall attacks still languish in mediocrity.  Please remove or greatly speed up the end roll animation.
  • Blocking Should Be Its Own Button/Command. If DE is doing away with restrictive melee only/firearms only modes then DE should go all the way in this direction. Allow those who stay on their toes to literally guard themselves if they react in time. Let an iota of skill creep back into the power fantasy. If we have to attack first to utilize blocking it's not completely evolving past the old melee/firearms mode that holds warframe's combat back.
     

And that's it!  I said the bulk of what I had to say in the first link.  After 6k hours into this game I still love it and hope to see great things to come still! 🙂

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have to say that in general the new melee is pretty nice.
It is nice to be able to take a quick shot at a distant enemy.
The aimed groundslam makes for good mobility and extra combat options.
And the sound/visual effects of the weapons is really satisfying.

I have however one major problem.
I am a polearm user and before the rework I was able to walk or run around the battlefield attacking enemies with a nice amount of mobility.
This was possible because of a reduced melee moveset when wielding a gun.
If I wanted to slice up a few enemies that were too close I would just do so without stopping the flow of my movement.
This is however not possible anymore.
With bleeding willow I now come to an almost complete halt to do a swing, and with shimmering blight this happens at the third hit.
Even if I take off the stances, which reduces the maximum amount of power I can put into my weapon, this is still a problem.
The second hit in this case stops my movement completely.

I would really like it if there was a to get the simple moveset back.
Either a button to switch between the two modes, a setting to select one of the two, or perhaps a new stance which uses that moveset.
 

  • Applause 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
hace 16 horas, Marian.WolFox dijo:

I just died... Valkyr's 4th Ability completely overriden by AIM GLIDE, Arbitrations 150+ Levels good bye reward. DEFU.SE---

 

I realize today that you cannot use a warcry build at high levels no more.

The thing is, if you use any mod like Life Strike or Healing Return, you need to attack to sustain your HP. Over lv150 enemies, you need to keep yourself attacking consistently in front of a heavy unit or you hp goes down fast.

Problem is, the stupid autoblocking overrides any other input, so no matter how much you tap the melee button, she stops attacking under heavy fire to block... in fact she get locked in autoblock until you loss more HP than the amount you should be recovering.

So much for the new melee flow... autoblock actually kills you.

  • Like 1
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

So today I finished building the brand new sparring weapon, the Koruddo.  I figured levelling it up wouldn't be a big deal and I'd have some fun doing it.  However, I'd forgotten that we now have this new (and terrible) melee system in place which made what should have been a fun and enjoyable experience in to a very time consuming and extremely frustrating chore.  

The reason why is because previously when we had quick melee, you could level sparring weapons by simply spamming E while you had a primary or secondary equipped to swing a 1-2 punch that also allowed you to run around freely.  Our new system however forces the weapon stance on us, so each time I pressed E, i lunged forward 10 metres.  If I continued to press E then I became locked in a very drawn out combat animation that could not be cancelled.  The act of actually levelling the weapon became to Press E, wait for the lunge to finish, possibly panic press jump and aimglide to get myself back on solid ground because the lunge has thrown me clear off the side of a platform, then correct my aim, press E again, rinse and repeat over and over.  It took half an hour to complete an exterminate mission that I should have easily been able to clear in 10 minutes, all because I had to keep stopping and correcting my 'lunge trajectory' after each press of the melee attack button.  On top of that, on numerous occassions during some of these missions I jumped from a platform so i could drop down near an enemy only to find that, because that enemy was shooting at me, I was locked in to an autoblocking aimglide I could not cancel or control, forcing me to either adjust my direction to land significantly further away from the enemy than I should have done, or use ground slam to reach the floor and then put up with all nearby enemies flying through the air and having to chase after each one of them to attack them.

There is simply no control in this new melee system, it does not advance or improve on what we had, it only makes it worse in every regard.

Edited by Konachibi
  • Like 1
  • Applause 3
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Konachibi said:

There is simply no control in this new melee system, it does not advance or improve on what we had, it only makes it worse in every regard.

There's only so many time I will reiterate what I and others have stated OVER. AND OVER. AND OVER.

@[DE]Danielle One of you developers, actually read the blasted thread. What good is asking for "feedback" if you stick your collective fingers in your ears for a month?

  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Auto switch with no option to disable it, auto block with no option to disable it, no option to switch to melee without attacking. this 'flow' patch reduces the actual flow of combat. then throw in valkyr's issue and any other exalted. it's disappointing, frustrating, and disheartening to see that some of it still isn't being addressed.

Give us an option to disable the auto stuff (one for each), and revert the change to the switch weapon keybind. we already HAD a keybind for explicitly switching guns, now they're nearly identical.

Also, why doesn't reactivating the arch-wing launcher get us out of arch-wing yet? I finally found a way out of it without attacking (melee switch and aim glide), then you guys removed even that.

  • Like 1
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 5

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Konachibi said:

So today I finished building the brand new sparring weapon, the Koruddo.  I figured levelling it up wouldn't be a big deal and I'd have some fun doing it.  However, I'd forgotten that we now have this new (and terrible) melee system in place which made what should have been a fun and enjoyable experience in to a very time consuming and extremely frustrating chore.  

The reason why is because previously when we had quick melee, you could level sparring weapons by simply spamming E while you had a primary or secondary equipped to swing a 1-2 punch that also allowed you to run around freely.  Our new system however forces the weapon stance on us, so each time I pressed E, i lunged forward 10 metres.  If I continued to press E then I became locked in a very drawn out combat animation that could not be cancelled.  The act of actually levelling the weapon became to Press E, wait for the lunge to finish, possibly panic press jump and aimglide to get myself back on solid ground because the lunge has thrown me clear off the side of a platform, then correct my aim, press E again, rinse and repeat over and over.  It took half an hour to complete an exterminate mission that I should have easily been able to clear in 10 minutes, all because I had to keep stopping and correcting my 'lunge trajectory' after each press of the melee attack button.  On top of that, on numerous occassions during some of these missions I jumped from a platform so i could drop down near an enemy only to find that, because that enemy was shooting at me, I was locked in to an autoblocking aimglide I could not cancel or control, forcing me to either adjust my direction to land significantly further away from the enemy than I should have done, or use ground slam to reach the floor and then put up with all nearby enemies flying through the air and having to chase after each one of them to attack them.

There is simply no control in this new melee system, it does not advance or improve on what we had, it only makes it worse in every regard.

Very much this. I was strictly a quick-melee player prior to the change, becuase it was fast, effectve, and had all the "seamless flow of gun and blade" features that DE's believes they've introduced with melee 2.9907912. Now, I am stuck using the stance attacks, with whatever combo comes up, and it's definitely less good. Attacks now have built in movement stoppage, massive fly-across-the-room lunges (meaning you're spinning around endlessly to lunge back at the enemy), and just tons of animation locks.

If DE won't go back to what we had - and I think they'll refuse to revert the changes; they don't usually go back on things of this level - then I'd like them to give us a set of neutral Non-Stance Stance mods (in every polarity) that we can put in to our weapons, so we can enjoy the additional capacity but have just the basic, free movement quick attacks we used to have - no lunges, no movement halts, no animation locks.  

  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Problem with that one, Ham, is that a lot of weapons have default stances that -are- from among the stance mods available to us. broken war is vengeful revenant, tatsu is wise razor, etc.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Auto-block is really genuinely awful. It truly is. I've literally been interrupted out of combos by auto-block which has actually put me in jeopardy. It's just not a good addition. 

As a whole, I am very much against my games playing themselves for me. I know when I want to block. I know when I want to attack. the game is just terrible at making those decisions.

For similar reasons, I am really against the idea of the upcoming combo simplifications. I honestly don't see why they need to be dumbed down when you can learn their timing with like... 2 minutes in the simulicrum. And those who don't want to spend those two minutes can just as easy button mash their combos already. I worry that these changes are going to kill stances like Cleaving Whirlwind and Bullet Dance.

  • Like 1
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I give up.
I do not know what else to say.
The best part of this game is just dead. And I can't do anything about it.
Now I just have to complete the daily missions and hope that DE will hear us.

Edited by Snoit
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Another problem is the lack of quick melee. 

Quick melee used to allow us to keep our speed when we advanced killing stuff, being  necessary in a fast game like this, where 1 second standing still can be the difference between life or death at high levels.

Now Im forced to use the spin to win -never had to- to keep my momentum... something that DE have clearly stated they are against not so long ago.

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Kherae said:

...no option to switch to melee without attacking.

I agree with everything else you said, but this part isn't correct.  For me, using the T key switched between all my weapons, including melee.  It's just the specific "equip melee" function that they did away with, which I had bound to F.

All the same, though, I definitely want a toggle option so that I can turn auto-parry and auto-weapon swapping off.  I thought I might be able to deal with them when 2.99997 first dropped, but the longer I played, the more annoying they became.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-04-10 at 4:45 PM, Maxim_M_Payne said:

... about how this is "better" and "perfect" because DEVULH MAAAI KRAYE JUST LAIK MA ANIMU LAWL...

 

To be fair, the enemy interactions in this game when being hit don't allow it to come close to being like Devil May Cry, so it's not like they succeeded in that goal either.

What they missed is that when you go into a weapon in Devil May Cry, the switch isn't just instant, it's locked into that form, and many of the buttons on the controller switch their functions around to cater to what that weapon can do.

Which allows you to pull off many more combos and makes it more exciting.

Warframe screws this up by not linking any of its other buttons into Melee mode; melee mode feels transient now, at best, and superficial/not-even-there at worst.

Plus it takes away options [manual blocking/block-gliding, for example], and with so many enemies on screen shooting you while you try to Melee, it would be too dangerous to stand still and combo something like you do in Devil May Cry, especially since there's no dedicated Dodge button to get you out of bad situations. 

Jumping works somewhat, as does going Void mode via Operator, but both break the flow in Melee and can't substitute for a good dedicated dodge or block button.

 but I digress; my point is that saying this is like Devil May Cry is a bit of a falsehood, because this doesn't even come close to reaching that bar.

The original melee system we had was far better; all it needed was better swap times without mods, the directional slam, and some better combos, as well as a way of dodging strikes and bullets when in Melee mode.

  • Like 1
  • Applause 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I liked to play my melee armored valkyr with life strike, it was not the best melee build of the game, but it was fun, my fun. The knew melee system is cool for gun goons, but when you like to melee it's a step back. I tried to live with it, to adapt, i tried new frames, new weapons, my MR has increaded, but i can't not have the feeling i had before. I can't customise my melee control as before, the capacity to use lifestrike is not as intuitive as before and i die 30 level under what i did before melee 3.0. I lost all sensation of progression.

After a period of intens activity to overcome the problem i play less and less and don't feel the envy anymore, I suppose i'm saying goodbye to the game. I regret it, because it was very unique, good and fun. So thank you to the dev for that fun, and for the future and those who stay i wish a little more care for the dedicated melee players.

 

 

Edited by Syrug
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, (PS4)hellahym said:

Another problem is the lack of quick melee. 

Quick melee used to allow us to keep our speed when we advanced killing stuff, being  necessary in a fast game like this, where 1 second standing still can be the difference between life or death at high levels.

Now Im forced to use the spin to win -never had to- to keep my momentum... something that DE have clearly stated they are against not so long ago.

What DE say and what they actually mean have long since ceased to have any kind of correlation. They mentioned something a long time ago about "looking for ways to reduce the grind"... then they made the Hema. They say that they don't like spin attacks, and then they nerf any form of melee that's not a spin attack.

  • Like 3
  • Applause 2
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have anyone tried to play Duality Equinox now? Don't you hate to have to shoot or reload your guns to make sure your specter wouldn't be walking  like a dork with your melee equiped just because you hit a guy with it just a second before casting your 1st?


FLOW(tm)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Most of this rework so far is good but it highlights two problems:

1) the RMB combos feel a bit more forced to perform now, having to mash the E button or else you'll swap back to your weapon.

2) Sparring weapons have superior quick attacks; removing them just highlights the slightly more inconvenient Grim Fury, and the outright annoying Brutal Tide. Because hurling myself 2 meters past the enemy I wanted to punch with the first press of E was totally something I wanted to do 😕

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So after extensive testing i have come to the conclusion that DE (yes you) has done keffufeld things that need not be.
the auto switch to your active primary/secundary weapon is all nice and well, buut why does primary fire and zoom drag your jolly ars from your melee to your gun?
and spreading salt on the wound they allow a toggle in the options to lock the fire button to be the quick melee when the melee is out

why not just make it so that the zoom button is the toggle for block? heck why not bouth?

if we are going to have the "fluid moation" well then make it fluid
it is jank as faq to use the block combo
it is silly as fudge that i start drifting in air cause i steped of a ledge, i wanted to drop down not fly away
so i might be the only one useing *guardian derision* but right now it is nudderd!
the only way i can "trigger" it is by jumping in the line of fire (great! much cinimatic! such hollywood")

but this game lacs a agro mechanic that i can reliable manipulate towards me!

and becouse we no longer can block manualy with melee so can we no longer drift fly with melee... UNLESS SOMEONE IS SHOOTING AT US, but if we are drifting, we dont have our melee out, so we dont get the block we would need/want, and if we try to whip out the melee to get that block so do we fly straight down to the ground or fly straight over them, cause we have NO MANUAL SWITCH TO MELEE ONLY A QUICK MELEE STRIKE

vaugly flawed.

and this can very much be placebo effect but it feels sometimes as if the auto block overrides the quick melee, much like reflex guard used to do.
look into it cause if that is a yes that it does that, change the prioritaions so quick melee over rules guard or just give bouth, no weapon has 100% damage block

as for the rest, yes it is nice that we can smoothely switch to melee and then wham back to gun, just increas the weapon switch speed cause that is a primary reason to why nobody switch guns, it takes way to long time
(yes we have mods for that, but that takes up valuble mods slots, mod slots most can not or will not give up and thus "main" a singel weapon)
the visuals looks nice and all.
the slam attack is just superb, well done, give whoever came up with that a pat on the head.

____________________________________________

what is the reason that we can not keep the ability to switch to a melee weapon? consols? wabbajack? elon musk? 

 

  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, (PS4)hellahym said:

Have anyone tried to play Duality Equinox now? Don't you hate to have to shoot or reload your guns to make sure your specter wouldn't be walking  like a dork with your melee equiped just because you hit a guy with it just a second before casting your 1st?


FLOW(tm)

fun fact, you can cast your nr 1, and slam that Quick melee juuuust Before the casting is compleat and your clone has switched to melee despite you had your gun out when you pressed 1

  • Haha 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...