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Melee Revisit: Phase 1 Feedback Megathread

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The multi-tool finisher, suggests they might have ideas brewing that we're not aware of. 

They might separate melee and gunplay again, and use the multi-tool for quick melee/finishers.

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Tennnocon is over.  There really is no excuse to not tell us they have read the Melee concerns that have been present for the last half a year.  That tells me it is not changing because they don't care, and/or they like it how it is.

I saw a Wukong Prime teaser among the Tennocon clips. So all Primes since Hydroid are just being glossed over.  That's what I feel they are doing with Melee.  They don't want to handle it, like they apparently didn't want to make other Prime Trailers (yet somehow found the time to do a Wukong one), so everything before will just get swept under the rug.

I mean, if they can put continual effort in showcasing new and upcoming content, a few words addressing melee is not too much to ask for.

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I don't have anything new to add, just stating my opinion so far:

Instant switching between weapons is awesome! As is targeted slam.

Pretty much everything related to blocking is horrible, while I like the seemless autoparry, we really need the manual block button back, or an insane amount of changes to make everything work again.

The whole problem with people missing certain quickmelees could be easily fixed by introducing a new stance for every melee. (One could also just remove the stance and put 1-2 forma into the weapon to offset the lost points, it's not like melee weapons need a lot of forma right now).

I'm really curious what the next batch of melee changes will entail...

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So, much time has passed. No Melee fixes yet... To the licences owners of this game that we the gamer's have paid, time, money and promotional energy too. I would ask again that the Melee sys is fixed in a way that we can use the old system Melee. I would think that would sever to benefit your franchise greatly. I would like to play the game again like I did months ago.

 

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Feedback : Now that I am used to the new quick switching and it is part of my gameplay, I was very surpsised when I equipped a weapon with an alternative fire to see that the alternative fire key doesn't switch back to my primary weapon. Given that this key doesn't have any use for melee, it feels like switching back to the main weapon would be the expected behaviour.

 

Also as a suggestion : the game currently uses horizontal arcs or discs in front / around the frame for melee attacks which makes it frustrating to hit either flying ennemies or ennemies in stairs / slopes.

Having a directional arc / disc that tilts based on the player's aim would be a good QOL change for me.

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On 2019-07-27 at 5:44 AM, Genitive said:

 

 

On 2019-07-27 at 7:41 AM, Maka.Bones said:

 

 

On 2019-07-27 at 4:10 PM, vaarnaaarne said:

.

 

On 2019-07-28 at 3:20 AM, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

🤙🤙

 

On 2019-07-28 at 4:13 AM, vaarnaaarne said:

 

Please note wukong 4th is currently using melee 3.0

At tenno Remove primary and secondary weapons to fix block and block glide

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Removing primaries and secondaries is no fix at all, it's even less than a fix because all you're doing is removing two thirds of your weaponry just because the RMB button and autoblock are so bad. It is nothing but just pretending the RMB problem isn't there.

Similarly, while Iron Staff does show combo inputs that are more in line with Warframe's actual gameplay than the extant Hold and Delay combo inputs, it will do nothing to solve the RMB problem.

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1 hour ago, vaarnaaarne said:

Similarly, while Iron Staff does show combo inputs that are more in line with Warframe's actual gameplay than the extant Hold and Delay combo inputs, it will do nothing to solve the RMB problem.

If anything it will accentuate it, since it's bizzare to have an input to switch back be so integral to the combo system.

It's like tying a melee attack in DMC to gunslinger.

Once again - Auto-block and the subsequent switch on right-click is the only thing I don't like about the revisit.

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Posted (edited)

You know DE....  

Putting your heads in the sand isn't making this sort of thing go away, and no amount of unfulfilled promises of "we're looking into it" or "we're working on it here or here" or even "we're testing this in a controlled environment..."  is going to stop this thread from continuing to float to the top in the forums to remind you that you should be doing something other than working the Steve Jobs reality distortion field™ in the hopes that people will change their dissatisfaction to "it's-the-next-new-iPhone-cool".  

Wukong/Wukong Prime is not going to be the next meta when a majority of the players would prefer swinging a sword (and not a staff) in their Warframe hands and an ultimate of a Warframe power that has as much appeal as a 30 second flash in the pan before they move back to the frames and weapons they would prefer long before your Wukong rework.  

Now, are we going to see something done?  Or do we need to start shield clattering the media (again) in order for you to stop playing the ignore it, it'll go away dance that you tried to do with Rahetalius and failed?  

Edited by MBaldelli
Missing word
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Posted (edited)
On 2019-08-01 at 7:11 AM, MBaldelli said:

You know DE....  

Putting your heads in the sand isn't making this sort of thing go away, and no amount of unfulfilled promises of "we're looking into it" or "we're working on it here or here" or even "we're testing this in a controlled environment..."  is going to stop this thread from continuing to float to the top in the forums to remind you that you should be doing something other than working the Steve Jobs reality distortion field™ in the hopes that people will change their dissatisfaction to "it's-the-next-new-iPhone-cool".  

Wukong/Wukong Prime is not going to be the next meta when a majority of the players would prefer swinging a sword (and not a staff) in their Warframe hands and an ultimate of a Warframe power that has as much appeal as a 30 second flash in the pan before they move back to the frames and weapons they would prefer long before your Wukong rework.  

Now, are we going to see something done?  Or do we need to start shield clattering the media (again) in order for you to stop playing the ignore it, it'll go away dance that you tried to do with Rahetalius and failed?  

Y I K E S boi... 

 

Edited by Maka.Bones

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Posted (edited)

Would be appreciated if melee 3.0 was also released with other exalted weapons too. Or with other *specific* weapons/stances, so we can test it out while it's still somewhat in a controlled environment. 

It would also be lovely if they give us the option to switch between melee and gun-play. I do appreciate the new flexibility of switching between my melee and my primary. I also appreciate being able to switch weapons, simply by aiming. However there are times when that's also more cumbersome than helpful (and for many players it can just be simply cumbersome at all times, because of their individual play style preference)

So it would be lovely & much appreciated if we're given the ability to customize how our melee-rifle relationship works. So then we can have better control over blocking, and are also able to block while aim-gliding. 

Edited by Maka.Bones

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Already wrote enough about what I think about the "new" melee. I still want a toggle (so everybody can play however they prefer) and there isn't a day where I'm not biting into my desk because of that annoying combat $§#@% !! I hate it.

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Posted (edited)

The new melee system has brought in a lot of bugs and issues and barely a few improvements. This is not just because of this change to what we're used to - as some people like to ignorantly suggest.

- The exalted melee no longer works reliably. As an example, I've had this happen to me yesterday a few times with Excalibur's exalted blade. While it was active I was aiming the rifle and then I tried to deactivate it so it doesn't spend energy while I use my ranged weapons, but then my Excalibur just dropped everything and I couldn't do anything until I jumped down the "pit" to respawn. And from what people have said in other threads, the same goes with Valkyr and Wukong. 

Switching melee and ranged weapons is faster, yes, but seems more clunky and less immersive. Instead of having a dedicated "switch" to melee (basically putting you to a different playstyle), melee now seems like an optional, put-aside thing. More like an ability than a different playstyle... Auto-block guts it even further. I liked having an option to block with melee by myself. As already stated in this thread, some combos have become awkward because blocking has been removed. The same goes for aim-gliding with melee. Now I have to glide with my ranged weapon which puts you in a "zoomed in" perspective even on a sidearm. And If you do have your sidearm equipped for that sole reason, if you need to change to a primary it's a clunky thing to do - because now you have to switch from melee to a sidearm to a primary in this whole process of aim gliding.

I like to use both melee and ranged, but when I do melee I want full melee, the same goes for ranged. For everything else I  have/have had  a quick melee. The only good thing about this so far is the improved effects.

Edited by Xaver0s
typo
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Posted (edited)

Wow page 51? need some melee area 51 meme on this page to top it off.

Edited by SilviaS12
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On 2019-08-01 at 9:11 AM, MBaldelli said:

You know DE....  

Putting your heads in the sand isn't making this sort of thing go away, and no amount of unfulfilled promises of "we're looking into it" or "we're working on it here or here" or even "we're testing this in a controlled environment..."  is going to stop this thread from continuing to float to the top in the forums to remind you that you should be doing something other than working the Steve Jobs reality distortion field™ in the hopes that people will change their dissatisfaction to "it's-the-next-new-iPhone-cool".  

Wukong/Wukong Prime is not going to be the next meta when a majority of the players would prefer swinging a sword (and not a staff) in their Warframe hands and an ultimate of a Warframe power that has as much appeal as a 30 second flash in the pan before they move back to the frames and weapons they would prefer long before your Wukong rework.  

Now, are we going to see something done?  Or do we need to start shield clattering the media (again) in order for you to stop playing the ignore it, it'll go away dance that you tried to do with Rahetalius and failed?  

So far this thread looks like just a place to put all the dirt. This thread is just a "rug". Guess who won't be listening to feedback? At least not listen if it is kept under the rug. GGWP Warframe.

 

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7 hours ago, SilviaS12 said:

So far this thread looks like just a place to put all the dirt. This thread is just a "rug". Guess who won't be listening to feedback? At least not listen if it is kept under the rug. GGWP Warframe.

Oh, I know at this point....  But I also know that keeping this at the top of their forums is going to be an eye sore too.  A black-eye level eye sore.  

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Yea, if we just keep it up and keep the feedback message to core three points we can keep up the not-yet-fight:

1) RMB switch is disruptive to melee and Exalted weapons, and actively interferes with combo inputs past, present and future.

2) Autoblock is more of a hindrance than benefit, as it removes control, is less effective overall, can disrupt your combos or charge attacks, and turns melee glide into a completely negative state.

3) Therefore, we need manual block back.

Or if we want to be more concise with them:

1) RMB switch is bad for combos and Exalted Weapons.

2) Autoblock is bad for defence, control, and platforming.

3) Bring back RMB manual block to improve melee.

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10 hours ago, vaarnaaarne said:

Yea, if we just keep it up and keep the feedback message to core three points we can keep up the not-yet-fight:

1) RMB switch is disruptive to melee and Exalted weapons, and actively interferes with combo inputs past, present and future.

2) Autoblock is more of a hindrance than benefit, as it removes control, is less effective overall, can disrupt your combos or charge attacks, and turns melee glide into a completely negative state.

3) Therefore, we need manual block back.

Or if we want to be more concise with them:

1) RMB switch is bad for combos and Exalted Weapons.

2) Autoblock is bad for defence, control, and platforming.

3) Bring back RMB manual block to improve melee.

please don't forget to put back the animation of Tenno grabbing the weapons themselves. This teleporting weapon thing is cheesy and cheap looking lazy programming.

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11 hours ago, vaarnaaarne said:

Yea, if we just keep it up and keep the feedback message to core three points we can keep up the not-yet-fight:

1) RMB switch is disruptive to melee and Exalted weapons, and actively interferes with combo inputs past, present and future.

2) Autoblock is more of a hindrance than benefit, as it removes control, is less effective overall, can disrupt your combos or charge attacks, and turns melee glide into a completely negative state.

3) Therefore, we need manual block back.

Or if we want to be more concise with them:

1) RMB switch is bad for combos and Exalted Weapons.

2) Autoblock is bad for defence, control, and platforming.

3) Bring back RMB manual block to improve melee.

Agreed. In so far as I can tell, this is the part that both detractors and proponents of the new system like me agree on, for the most. Autoblock and the associated lack of control is the worst.

1 hour ago, SilviaS12 said:

please don't forget to put back the animation of Tenno grabbing the weapons themselves. This teleporting weapon thing is cheesy and cheap looking lazy programming.

Have you heard of the phrase 'necessary evil'? I don't think any dev that uses the teleport or similar thinks it's artistically superior to drawing the weapons manually, but these choices are always done for gameplay reasons. Adding more animations takes more time which discourages mid-combat switching, which is antithetical to the intent of 3.0.

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Posted (edited)

51 pages and we still have to deal with the auto block annoyance.... I tend to use mostly Wukong and his exalted weapon and it's really annoying to have auto-block triggering every single time when meleeing, especially with a bunch of mobs, auto-block gets in the way blocking any user input, can't even jump most of the times and when I finally regain control over the character I'm pretty much with low hp, less 1 revive or dead. Quite honestly this has been one of my main gripes with melee lately and I'd love this to be reverted.

Edited by ZarTham
Corrections.
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Bring back being able to equip melee! having both quick swap to full melee and hold weapon swap to melee is not problematic! Block combos, aim gliding, and manual block are (near) impossible now!

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some enemy attacks and bullets should slowdown melee progress such as those cannister bullets and lasers from the missions to be fair the turrets that enemies use and artillery is ignored often can be balanced with more types of rewards and navs, keycards, scan + codex loot different values added so robotics doesnt become the top priority and players have reason to pull out their scanners other than starring into a blue orb, it can be adsorbed and transported to safety through the mission, healing players shields and or otherwise with some safety reward to reach extraction should allow of crafting and acomplishing of goals, mount servant guard and hire of armada , soloing gets better, and exploring can be accounted for wanting to explore and schoop the moon orbs for something else rather than their intended darkpurpose , moon cones, do they even have a purpose? also each segment in the ship can have their various cosmetic and augments added to them later for players who use captura, at least replace the loading screen and music during upgrades, etc. 

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Posted (edited)
On 2019-08-04 at 12:01 AM, SilviaS12 said:

Wow page 51? need some melee area 51 meme on this page to top it off.

Make a melee weapon called Page51, which uses a wheel which can stuns and roll, reloaded the secondary with a special bullet and ocasional  user explosives and diamonds, it can be a combination cesti Zaw Fist combined with a Kitgun, nickname Z-51 and its sister from Loafy Cetus, Girlbeer, and Teddybears which can magnetically reassemble after being destroyed, i think simaris can have this chibi kitrobo.

Edited by (PS4)santospizarro

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Nekros Soulpunch, technically a melee attack, should have a set of combos and enhancements when reusing the technique under energy deficits, and while under surplus, which could cultivate ores and also be used to defend with energy or attack switftly with E" rather otherwise its very broken and powerful, i think it matters to also make the soul punch and a future scythe or pet addition for Nekros to have his/her own unique weapon to want to replay or encourage upgrading or using of forma, and its various rivens and augments to unlock fom replayable missions, since relics only focus on dropping orbital gear, and nothing but blueprints data can be aquisitive that a point system is added to the melee system which does recharge the capacitors of some weapons to enhance secondary fire, and features of single blades, popcrystals, such as the LEX school, its strickly awful without a good stance or augment/riven which to a begginer player might seem like a dead end reason to move on to another weapon's purchase without considering mastery reasons, the added rewards would stop players from simply discarding and trading them right away, say that the factions took notice and allocated towards a syndana, and potions for accelerating robotics segments, relics can gain new stance and larger enemies such as the titanoids and dune creatures of the inaros quest, to make melee somewhat feel lik eMMORPG boss fights elements added to regular mission, blocky large enemies who dont die in two hits are good reasons to guarantee hitting instead of missing with an attack,because most enemies in the game are small ,and without AIM ASSiST its really easy to just sliparound the areas, i usually play with the autofolllow tracer off usually, because i wanna be able to do a 180 to an attacker behind me, volt also has some uggly attacks and his magic fails to deliver anything other than the AOE shock, especially mid=air, unless he is using the really expensive shield (it has really low durability and costs is really high) but if you can learn its really good to play volt forever, however his gimmick seems somewhat outdated compared to gauss honestly worth reworking volt, wukongs only problem is that you always end up doing a choke or grapple and slams are not always pretty after and during the cloud, so animation lock is abit unrewarding. Mainly looking for alittle more than just charge attacks on my melee weapon, charge attacks could be transposed into guarding and defending for the time being until you come up with other passive traits that each weapon should have, i came up with a few for the singel daggers to wield elegant traits and i know bungie's destiny2 has some RNG on their weapons but out foundry and items found dont have much unique features so they are either sold or dismantle and tradded for plat, quickly instead of having uses or purpose to dedicate to a new school or aughmented, say a corporate man of cetus will instruct the baton users to wield a a melee weapon as primary and also stance switching is interweaved with falling and jumping to create interesting attacks, can you make a fists stance work with a sword stance? yes. There can be some passive traits and additions to the melee update which can make the mods and tradechat more productive again, essentially added to formating and enhancing weapons, combining, and the k.o revive features which are missing they can be equiped on guns for different firing modes, say a tigershot changes the sound of a lex pistol, or adds a silencer or causes bleeding, the reaload and crouching or rolling can be used to enhance some attacks regardless of the mods but energy wouldn; be required to perform special things for the lex's flashlight maybe, and the future additions of shield combat, you also want to upgrade framefighter and conclave with these melee updates

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On 2019-07-28 at 12:13 PM, Maka.Bones said:

The multi-tool finisher, suggests they might have ideas brewing that we're not aware of. 

They might separate melee and gunplay again, and use the multi-tool for quick melee/finishers.

yes, they said each warframe will get some new feature or subweapon with the new finisher systems, i am really happy with wukong so far because its really diverse, hyldren fixes are a higher priority to me right now because she is stuck with only like 10 sound effects and ways to accelerate and fire feel really limited to play her without the heavy weapon or upgrades to her bow/cannon feels hopeless and i haven't unlocked any special aughments for suit or cards. Using daggers  is just like being on a soapy floor, while the AK Lex recoil helps pause time like rhino, but there are no benefits or exhaustion, i recomend some smoke and additional secondray weapon effects for the pistols and single handed swords to appeal or function better, because all players don't know where to go to augment them or unlock their maximum potential, also used those new plix but felt really stuck with a lack of charging or guidance system, secondary fire or reload features to weave in, its really funny that its like starwars however the damage is impresive, i havent found a good melee partner for this weapon yet or reason to use it mid air, since it i dont use gas damage for spread, so at melee range it should call for an upgrade or two.

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