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Posted (edited)

And by the way, I don't understand why with 5K shields, we have 1200 supershield. Where my 1kkk supershield? 

Edited by zhellon
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Does Hildryn have any lore bits yet? ie a story, in-game codex, ...anything really? Why was she developed? When? Its definitely a modern era warframe, designed by the Tenno? since Orokin wanted all the frames to have void abilities to counter sentients. So... what the deal, DE?  Ever since Garuda, we're definitely lacking a bit of context regarding these frames that come from Vox Solaris...

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Posted (edited)

First impressions...

Considering how useless shields are in general to things like toxic gas I kind of feel she needs either innate resistance to proc damage or for the shields to prevent that when it's not on overshields.   I was kind of expecting 'more' from shield gating in all honesty...

Personally I think she should have more base health, considering how she is powered by shields she should be able to 'survive' without the shields. 

Polarities:

Aura being naramon... um while yes we might want to run corrosive projection on most frames but it's actually detrimental to hildryns abilities, even more so if you run shield disruption.  I could use empowered blades but that would eat into the shields, the rest are rather lacking.  A vazarin would have been a much better choice imo but then I wouldn't have needed to 'waste' a forma changing it....

Exilus slot - only 'worthwhile' mods that fits vazarin are basically (primed) sure footed, aviator (does this even work with her?  It's been hit or miss with other flying frames) and bullet jump mods... I don't run it because handspring is cheaper and just as good in all honesty.

 

Abilities:

1 -  would like a larger splash damage area, it's so tiny I was hitting right next to the target and hardly any damage was done.  Needs to be more like sonicor with less rag doll imo.  Also in all honesty is a little weak when you consider it needs to be used with her 4th ability.  You need to be really accurate when hitting a target, almost like it's got a tiny hit box, smaller than the projectile even.

2 - I think I'd prefer this to be a 'hold to extend range' ability similar to gara's 4th ability. Doesn't seem to charge/restore shields when another ability is active, would be nice if did, even if it's at reduced efficiency, other frames have abilities which can restore while other abilities are active.

3 - It's ok but I kind of think it's a little too expensive to run for what it does. 

4 - Too slow to move around, the 50 for dodge is too high.  I want to be able to use my rifle/secondary, it's not like the hands are actually doing anything.

I think it could have slightly more range as standard, especially vertically before it loses contact with an enemy.  Doesn't always seem to hit flying enemies at 'max range'.  It drops energy orbs occasionally which we have absolutely zero need for....yes, you can argue it's team support but what if we're solo etc.

 

General thoughts: 

I think shields should be able to recharge or stop draining if the abilities aren't actually doing anything, in the same way that ivara's 4th ability doesn't cost anything unless you're actually firing an arrow.

Also maybe any shields taken from enemies off of their numbers before corrosive projection/shield disruption are applied.  We shouldn't be punished for other people using the 'default' aura's.

She doesn't really have an area where you can sacrifice for another area like most frames.  She is also hindered by the 'need' to run more 'necessary' mods compared with a frame that just uses energy. 

Zenurik/Energy doesn't do a thing, I kind of feel that energy should do 'something else' with hildryn, maybe increase overshields or be used as stacks to give resistance against things like gas procs. 

Doesn't work with mods like augur set where you gain shields etc from usage, it really should.

I kind of feel she should have a reduced shield recharge time compared with normal frames...maybe my idea above of stacking energy orbs could be changed to reducing recharge time (or both)...

 

 

Edited by LSG501
added shield to last paragraph for reference
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il y a 16 minutes, LSG501 a dit :

Zenurik/Energy doesn't do a thing, I kind of feel that energy should do 'something else' with hildryn, maybe increase overshields or be used as stacks to give resistance against things like gas procs. 

Just not zenurik. Pls, can players leave from this school. This is already a must for most frames.

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Still farming it, but so far the impression i get is that it is the latest in a batch of experimental frames (that started with Khora and the community rejected IPS change) that DE is using to test out new stuff with varying success. (Khora was an unfocused miss, Revenant is a mess, Garuda is salvageable, Baruuk is good and works!, Hildrin is a mess)

Its kit so far seems unwieldy and selfdefeating as all its abilities eat up survivability, coupled with the various power issues and interest for this frame drops noticeably

The choice of giving it a "flight power" as her 4th is also quite debatable since Zephyr keeps getting screwed over in that department while she was the first/original flying frame (and in "her" tileset she can't even fly due to the stupid low ceiling limit impossed in recent years)

So far Hyldrin's kit seems to infringe heavily on Mag's and her augments, she could have done with something different with only the shield gating experiment kept from this iteration and something more from her weapon's master fluff

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52 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Just not zenurik. Pls, can players leave from this school. This is already a must for most frames.

I run instant revive school (vazarin i think it is) when I run Hildryn. Unairu would be a good fit for her too. 

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53 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Just not zenurik. Pls, can players leave from this school. This is already a must for most frames.

Why not, you can't just make a school not do anything 'just because' it's zenurik and people actually use it... 

You're not forced to use it on most frames, it's just that most of us do because of a) it being a left over due to the old focus schools and it's the most heavily levelled one, b) it's far too much hassle to change focus schools (it should be easier so we'd do it more often) and c) in all likelihood it's the first one people pick and not everyone has multiple focus schools. 

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il y a 1 minute, LSG501 a dit :

Why not, you can't just make a school not do anything 'just because' it's zenurik and people actually use it... 

You're not forced to use it on most frames, it's just that most of us do because of a) it being a left over due to the old focus schools and it's the most heavily levelled one, b) it's far too much hassle to change focus schools (it should be easier so we'd do it more often) and c) in all likelihood it's the first one people pick and not everyone has multiple focus schools. 

So you propose to close the main problem Hildryn the most usable school? You can say whatever you want, but the problem is that on most frames you can't imagine anything without energy. It is on this energize arcane is worth 200 platinum. And it's not that it simplifies the gameplay, you can not physically withstand some situations without energy. Now let's see how many ways we have to restore HP. And how much to restore energy? 

Yes, need more ways to recover ammo! 

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33 minutes ago, zhellon said:

So you propose to close the main problem Hildryn the most usable school? You can say whatever you want, but the problem is that on most frames you can't imagine anything without energy. It is on this energize arcane is worth 200 platinum. And it's not that it simplifies the gameplay, you can not physically withstand some situations without energy. Now let's see how many ways we have to restore HP. And how much to restore energy?  

Yes, need more ways to recover ammo! 

To be fair your first sentence doesn't make any sense so I'm guessing at what you're complaining about now...

I've already figured (and I'm sure others have too) out how to have instantly maxed shields when it does run out, there are builds where you can build hildryn to be immortal...so it's not about 'energy' it's about still being able to use the focus schools we've invested in. 

Restoring health is really easy...there are plenty of easily attained arcanes which can heal you really easily, there are mods for all types of companions, not to mention pizza's and the aura (I'll agree this is lacklustre)

Restoring ammo is really easy, you just need to sacrifice another mod, use carrier or use a pizza..

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il y a 1 minute, LSG501 a dit :

I've already figured (and I'm sure others have too) out how to have instantly maxed shields when it does run out, there are builds where you can build hildryn to be immortal...so it's not about 'energy' it's about still being able to use the focus schools we've invested in. 

Let's just say I don't want zenurik did something more with Hildryn than it is now. Why? Because at this point, I don't see the point of taking this school, but when it gets an advantage, it will be mandatory for Hildryn, and it should be avoided. You offer a powerful tool, namely resistance to the toxin. This must be implemented somehow, but not with the help of zenurik.

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27 minutes ago, zhellon said:

Let's just say I don't want zenurik did something more with Hildryn than it is now. Why? Because at this point, I don't see the point of taking this school, but when it gets an advantage, it will be mandatory for Hildryn, and it should be avoided. You offer a powerful tool, namely resistance to the toxin. This must be implemented somehow, but not with the help of zenurik.

So basically your argument goes back to 'just because it's zenurik' as a reason then...

It doesn't have to be resistance to toxin (but to be fair we already have adaptation and various other abilities which already offer this, not to mention hildryn already does it with her overshields), it could be faster regen of shields or larger shield pool, neither are mandatory reasons to run it, yes they may be seen as beneficial but it's no different to energy regen for other frames.

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I've had a blast playing with hildy today however I do feel like what's truly holding her back kinda comes down to the interaction between her fourth and first.

On paper her 1 is a fine first ability and delivers a rather hefty punch. But in tandom with her 4 it feels like a massive downgrade. Especially against a nox where you're trying to break through it's glass helmet before it can continually hit you with toxin.  It's a slow burst damage weapon, but a burst damage weapon that can't reliably crit so even then it's damage is quite limited. Throw in that it takes your shields for each shot and the time it can take to prepare a shot and it becomes a real ball and chain. There's a fair amount of weapons that can outperform this ability, and making it the only weapon you can use in your fourth with no compensation ultimately drags down an otherwise interesting ult.

 

I feel like the lack of real utility to Balefire pushes me away from wanting to use my fourth as Hildryn. I feel that perhaps when you land a shot it should possibly refund shield to you as you can't use your 2nd ability with your fourth up, meanwhile you may be using your fourth to deal with a lethal enemy and find yourself crossing your fingers that your shields hold out until you can slowly chip away at the glass helmet of an enemy with D.R You're just a slow moving zepelin shooting cannonballs when you need something much faster/ or with more utility. 

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Posted (edited)

So I've been playing Hildryn more or less non-stop since her release, and I have to say I'm definitely having fun. But, as others on this thread have pointed out, she has some problems that could use addressing. I'm not a game designer, so I'll focus more on sharing my (the player's) perspective of how she plays and what is enjoyable/usable and what isn't. 

-Firstly, I love her combat flow. It reminds me a lot of Halo, Borderlands or other shield-based shooters. Take hits till you get low, find some cover or dodge, recharge, get back in the fight. It's a fun way to play: Not fragile enough to bust in a few hits, but not falling into the Rhino/Inaros school of tanking (just soak everything), I feel like this provides a fun middle ground.

- I really like her synergy with her Arcgun. I think that was a fantastic idea, and it really gives me the feel of being a 'heavy weapons' frame. I essentially have 4 weapons at my disposal, counting balefire, and developing loadouts that give me a wide-reaching toolkit has been an absolute blast. I feel more prepared for most situations with her than I have with any other frame I've played thus far, and it's an awesome feeling.

- I think the system of using her shields for abilities is a great idea, and a fun dynamic. You have to think tactically: Defense vs. offense. Risk vs. reward. It's less about energy management than it is pacing and situational awareness, and that's a very fresh and fun way to play Warframe.


That being said, there are some things that seem to take away from the experience and could use a second look. 

She's got Some Very Big Weaknesses:
First off (surprise, surprise) I have to agree with a lot of the "shield-related" problems that have been a big focus of the thread thus far. 

Slash/Toxic procs can and will send you immediately onto the defensive for anything above lvl 40. Toxin's not so bad as it tends to be easily avoidable, but slash will kill you dead fast and comes from projectile attacks. I can use my 2 to clear it, but with such a small health pool it only takes a few at best before I have to back up a bit and do damage control. Disengage, cleanse, heal, repeat as needed. It doesn't sound like much, but it gets very frustrating after a while. It's the gameplay equivalent of having your engine die on you every few miles, and you've gotta shift to neutral and and restart it.

What I think it really comes down to is that it's a sour note in the overall Hildryn experience. Having an Achilles heel that big, with the potential of getting downed almost before you have a chance to respond (it has happened a few times) just feels very out of place and wrong. In all other cases, she has a kind of elastic resilience that makes her unique and extremely fun to play. 

Unfortunately, it's an enormous argument not to bring her along for some of the more endgame content. And that shouldn't be. The overshields thing was a step in the right direction but overshields last about as long as a fart in a hurricane once combat begins, even using your 2 and Adaptation they just drop too fast. Which brings me to point #2...

It's no secret that shields are regarded to be the weakest and worst "health" in the game. Having an enormous shield pool is a good defense up to a point, but past that point enemies will tear through it like paper should you try standing your ground, sending you into a near-constant shield gate scramble. This forces you to play her as if she was a lighter frame (mag/volt etc.) and focus on mobility and dodges, but without as much utility as those frames have to compensate. More on that in a moment.

I'm aware that the potential solution for this is a rework/overhaul of the shield system in general, and I don't expect it will get addressed right away. That's a really big job, after all. Hildryn's still a lot of fun, and I'm willing to hold out. Maybe there's an intermediate measure that can be enacted in the meantime, who knows. Currently however, between that, the unreliability of her 2, and the aforementioned slash/toxin problem I'd be hard pressed to bring her instead of another frame with more tankiness/cc/utility on a Sortie or Arbitration.

Unfocused Abilities:
If I had to say that something needs looking at sooner rather than later, I'd say it's her abilities. Her abilities seem to lack the focused intent of many other frames. They try to do a lot of different things, but don't strike out enough in any one direction to be terribly effective at much of it. Most frames, you can pick one or two abilities and stats and go into those to create a viable build that does something specific, but Hildryn doesn't feel that way. Especially in the case of Haven and Aegis Storm, it's almost like the abilities fight with themselves a little bit. I'll try to explain what I mean down below.


1) Balefire - The raw damage is decent on paper. However with a lack of crit or status, Balefire's usefulness tapers off against higher level enemies. Anything beyond the star map, and you're better off ignoring Balefire entirely and using a Primary. Though you can stack power to get a big enough raw number to counteract enemy DR to a point. As crowd cleaners they fall flat, the AoE on them just isn't enough without some additional range to hit like an actual AoE. 

What you have is something that's not strong enough to take out tough single targets, and not wide enough to take out crowds. It's designed to be both, but ends up in a middle ground that's neither. This can be fixed by modding for power and/or range, but at best you're modding it to be a slower and costlier version of what the Staticor does naturally. It just doesn't have that specific niche where I'd say "This is a situation for Balefire", and sadly I find myself almost never using it. 

2) Shield Pillage - The most useful part of her kit right now, though it has it's problems. It's good against corpus and really high level grineer in theory. But in practice, really only against corpus is it of any use as a shield restore. Grineer armor at levels under 40 isn't enough for any appreciable gain, and against infested it does nothing. Used as a mag-like armor strip, going big into Power mods gets you where you want to go (200% power gets you 50% armor strip) and that's pretty good. The base range actually isn't bad either, but it's limited by line of sight, which cripples it in most areas that aren't outdoors. The status curing and occasional armor strip is really what I use it for outside of Orb Valis.

3)  Haven - It's a great idea, but in practice all it does is burn up your shields. To protect my allies with shield regen and gating, I have to keep it constantly channeled, thus preventing shield regeneration and enduring an enormous drain per enemy for a small, near-useless damage tick that I don't even want when they get close. Having a limited range (this is Warframe, people are constantly parkour-ing everywhere) and the LoS restriction, this is only going to help my team if we somehow manage to all be stuck in the same room. I really, REALLY want this to be even half as useful as Oberon's Renewal, as I like supporting my teammates with extra survivability, but as is it's a big investment for a buff that's rarely able to do it's job.

4) Aegis Storm - With Balefire rockets the way they are, this ability doesn't get much use. The drain is very high, the range is small, and I lose the most effective and versatile elements of my arsenal. If I could use my normal weapons, this would be insanely fun. It would, in fact, be so fun as to be the biggest reason to use Hildryn. Humming "Ride of the Valkyries" to myself while raining Opticor magic from on high. Insofar as I can reason, there's no balance reason that I shouldn't be able to, cc aside it's no more of an advantage than being on an elevated catwalk or tower. As it is, it's the same as Haven: Too much cost for something that's spread too thin. It's neither a big enough CC or strong enough 'offensive mode' to really be worth using.

There's more I can say but I've no doubt already run on long enough, so I'm going to wrap this up here. To date, Hildryn is easily one of my top 3 favorite warframes in the game and all that I've said comes out of a place of love. No doubt wiser minds than mine can suggest how to fix these problems, but as a player to the company that created this wonderful game I can only say keep it up. You guys are doing a great job.

Edited by Fuhklebark
Edit: Spelling and formatting.
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There are 2 things I'd like changed about her abilities:

The slowdown on using balefire shots should go away. While other frames with powerful first abilities arent movement restricted (Khora) or even get movement out of it (Atlas) the opposite happens with Hildryn.

Let us use her 2 while flying around in Hildryn's 4. The abilities looks really cool but there is not very much reason to use it when you can just use a single balefire and have access to Shield Pillage. While this would allow her to stay inside Aegis Storm for a long period of time, it would also have the player very active with often casting Shield Pillage. 

Other than that i very much enjoy this frame.

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1 hour ago, Fuhklebark said:

Used as a mag-like armor strip, going big into Power mods gets you where you want to go (200% power gets you 50% armor strip) and that's pretty good.

Good feedback overall, but I have a comment on this. Armour works in such a way that if you take a level 100 heavy unit and strip 50% of their armour they still have ~92% damage reduction. You haven't really done much, it's still nerfing (nearly) all damage sources to uselessness.

Try as i might, I can't find any valid reason to use any of Hildryn's abilities or to play her in general, beyond how she looks. She's OK at fighting corpus in open spaces, where her 2 isn't complete garbage, but not great even here by any means.

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Please consider either removing or adjusting the "slow down" animation on her first ability Balefire.

I have to use a macro just for the split-second brief button press, so I fire an 0%-uncharged shot and prevent the "walking" animation afterwards. It slows down Hildryn for no good reason!

Set the trigger for her "I charged something, have to deal with the recoil"-animation to at least 30% or 50% of the charge gauge, and not right after her very first few percentages.

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Ability 1: Unlike most here I really  like this gun. It will kill most anything  and it has high status chance. What I  dont like about it is:

-If you fire from the ground you can't  jump, but if you already  jumped you can fire from the air. That just makes it a bit inconsistent 

-There is a animation when you fire the gun. I have a problem with  it, the part after the shot where animation slows down everything and it feels like more like lag then animation. This is the biggest problem  I  have with it. 

Ability 2.It is ok I  guess but biggest problem it has is that it affects only enemies  in your los making it not practical for any serious usage in indoor maps. I feel it would be great with more range and if los thing was removed. 

Ability 3.Worst ability  of all. Very expensive  to use and doesn't  give you anything  in return.I honestly  don't  see any difference with this ability  on. This should  be only support ability and dmg to enemies  should be removed  because right now it only drains shields fast and does very little  dmg to enemies  not being able to be built for anything  serious dmg past lvl 20.

Ability 4.Maybe the worst ult in this game. CC is bad and indoors it is very inconsistent .This ability  should be maide so it affects  everything, even behind walls in its range in order for it to work properly. Dmg it does is also very low. It feels  like this ability  was created more to look good than actually do anything. 

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So Hildryn is a... weird warframe that sometimes works on late game sometimes not.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Passive - Everything good here

1st Ability/Exalted Wep - Really good dmg, fast charge BUT allow for the full movement while charging. We had the same problem with Chroma's 1st ability, why keep it here...

2nd Ability - Its amazingly strong. And you should be able to use it while 4th is on! Why? Cuz enemies on high lvls drains her Shields instantly so 4 ability is 100% useless when enemies deals actual damage. If you are afraid it may be broken just decrese its range, put on cooldown, decrese shields gained anything you want, just let her use it during 4th ability cuz you cant really use 4th on enemies that actually deals damage without having overextended on you.

3rd Ability - Tbh... i dont feel this ability. In my opinion its weak and just drains your energy for nothing. I may be mistaken on this one but i prefer spending my energy on 1 or 4 than 3

4th Ability - Very good you allowed for more movement in it, the CC is nice but as stated in second point/second ability its useless when enemies deals dmg. Also make it possible to shoot our weapons during it. Cuz in this moment you are making us use 4th which takes energy over time, 1 that takes energy per shot and enemies shooting at us draining our energy basicly.

 

Overall... Idea is cool... but it needs more work.

 

Additional feedback:

If you have big syandana and use 4... you cant see anything. Camera behind hildryn makes it really hard to aim or see anything. I rely on sentinel mods to see enemies on the mini map cuz otherwise i cant see a thing.

 

Thanks for reading ❤️

 

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Balefire...

Spoiler

xJjK2Vk.jpg

Why can't we have two? Like Staticor? She only got one on her hand in game so why she have two in her profile? It would be much better with two, plus similar mechanic to Staticor.

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1 hour ago, THeMooN85 said:

Balefire...

  Hide contents

xJjK2Vk.jpg

Why can't we have two? Like Staticor? She only got one on her hand in game so why she have two in her profile? It would be much better with two, plus similar mechanic to Staticor.

Because she gets 2 while in her 4, but it’s only cosmetic.

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Posted (edited)

Please please please let Haven affect objectives. It's not like it's really a strong ability, anyways. I've been playing Hildryn almost exclusively since she's released. I agree with a lot of feedback here! She's just a few tweaks away from being amazing, much like Garuda was on release. Aside from fixing bugs (such as not being able to dodge roll after jumping for the rest of the mission after using her 4), being able to affect objectives with Haven would be so nice and give that ability a nice use. 

 

Edit: I don't mean to imply that Haven is completely useless. It just isn't great, and even more so when playing solo. Affecting objectives would be a nice bonus. I guess it could get out of hand if DE decides to rebalance Haven's numbers, though! 

 

Edit2: AND! While I don't really agree with the ability to use other weapons while in Aegis Storm (not really against the idea either), I do think she should be able to use archguns while in Aegis Storm. At least make Balefire auto activate on Aegis Storm since even if you don't want to spend the shield on using them, there's pretty much no reason to not have them out since it's all you can do. 

Edited by SkyCakeLight

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I think her 2 should always do something, even on enemies that don't have any shields/armor left. Weaving it in more frequently to restore shields might make her kit feel like it flows more consistently. It may also let her do more heavy casting even without max efficiency without being dependent on arcanes half the playerbase probably doesn't have (and half the people who don't have it probably don't want to plan their game time around the cetus clock to farm them). 

I also think her passive should simply make all damage unable to bypass shields. She already has to balance using her shields as an energy source (sans Trinity), having to worry about dying to procs that bypass her shields on top of it doesn't seem necessary.

If EV shield restoring/blessing reset the passive invulnerability proc, it also seems like a Trinity + large range Haven Hildryn combo could make your entire group nearly invincible, but I haven't tested that. In most cases it probably wouldn't be worth giving up a frame that has a more useful spammable ability or an offensive buff of some kind? I'm not sure if the vampire leech augment restores shields for Hildryn, but if it doesn't, occasional blessings (which an EV trinity can cast as much as she'd like) do restore the shields. 

 

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Il y a 13 heures, Fuhklebark a dit :

So I've been playing Hildryn more or less non-stop since her release, and I have to say I'm definitely having fun. But, as others on this thread have pointed out, she has some problems that could use addressing. I'm not a game designer, so I'll focus more on sharing my (the player's) perspective of how she plays and what is enjoyable/usable and what isn't. 

-Firstly, I love her combat flow. It reminds me a lot of Halo, Borderlands or other shield-based shooters. Take hits till you get low, find some cover or dodge, recharge, get back in the fight. It's a fun way to play: Not fragile enough to bust in a few hits, but not falling into the Rhino/Inaros school of tanking (just soak everything), I feel like this provides a fun middle ground.

- I really like her synergy with her Arcgun. I think that was a fantastic idea, and it really gives me the feel of being a 'heavy weapons' frame. I essentially have 4 weapons at my disposal, counting balefire, and developing loadouts that give me a wide-reaching toolkit has been an absolute blast. I feel more prepared for most situations with her than I have with any other frame I've played thus far, and it's an awesome feeling.

- I think the system of using her shields for abilities is a great idea, and a fun dynamic. You have to think tactically: Defense vs. offense. Risk vs. reward. It's less about energy management than it is pacing and situational awareness, and that's a very fresh and fun way to play Warframe.


That being said, there are some things that seem to take away from the experience and could use a second look. 

She's got Some Very Big Weaknesses:
First off (surprise, surprise) I have to agree with a lot of the "shield-related" problems that have been a big focus of the thread thus far. 

Slash/Toxic procs can and will send you immediately onto the defensive for anything above lvl 40. Toxin's not so bad as it tends to be easily avoidable, but slash will kill you dead fast and comes from projectile attacks. I can use my 2 to clear it, but with such a small health pool it only takes a few at best before I have to back up a bit and do damage control. Disengage, cleanse, heal, repeat as needed. It doesn't sound like much, but it gets very frustrating after a while. It's the gameplay equivalent of having your engine die on you every few miles, and you've gotta shift to neutral and and restart it.

What I think it really comes down to is that it's a sour note in the overall Hildryn experience. Having an Achilles heel that big, with the potential of getting downed almost before you have a chance to respond (it has happened a few times) just feels very out of place and wrong. In all other cases, she has a kind of elastic resilience that makes her unique and extremely fun to play. 

Unfortunately, it's an enormous argument not to bring her along for some of the more endgame content. And that shouldn't be. The overshields thing was a step in the right direction but overshields last about as long as a fart in a hurricane once combat begins, even using your 2 and Adaptation they just drop too fast. Which brings me to point #2...

It's no secret that shields are regarded to be the weakest and worst "health" in the game. Having an enormous shield pool is a good defense up to a point, but past that point enemies will tear through it like paper should you try standing your ground, sending you into a near-constant shield gate scramble. This forces you to play her as if she was a lighter frame (mag/volt etc.) and focus on mobility and dodges, but without as much utility as those frames have to compensate. More on that in a moment.

I'm aware that the potential solution for this is a rework/overhaul of the shield system in general, and I don't expect it will get addressed right away. That's a really big job, after all. Hildryn's still a lot of fun, and I'm willing to hold out. Maybe there's an intermediate measure that can be enacted in the meantime, who knows. Currently however, between that, the unreliability of her 2, and the aforementioned slash/toxin problem I'd be hard pressed to bring her instead of another frame with more tankiness/cc/utility on a Sortie or Arbitration.

Unfocused Abilities:
If I had to say that something needs looking at sooner rather than later, I'd say it's her abilities. Her abilities seem to lack the focused intent of many other frames. They try to do a lot of different things, but don't strike out enough in any one direction to be terribly effective at much of it. Most frames, you can pick one or two abilities and stats and go into those to create a viable build that does something specific, but Hildryn doesn't feel that way. Especially in the case of Haven and Aegis Storm, it's almost like the abilities fight with themselves a little bit. I'll try to explain what I mean down below.


1) Balefire - The raw damage is decent on paper. However with a lack of crit or status, Balefire's usefulness tapers off against higher level enemies. Anything beyond the star map, and you're better off ignoring Balefire entirely and using a Primary. Though you can stack power to get a big enough raw number to counteract enemy DR to a point. As crowd cleaners they fall flat, the AoE on them just isn't enough without some additional range to hit like an actual AoE. 

What you have is something that's not strong enough to take out tough single targets, and not wide enough to take out crowds. It's designed to be both, but ends up in a middle ground that's neither. This can be fixed by modding for power and/or range, but at best you're modding it to be a slower and costlier version of what the Staticor does naturally. It just doesn't have that specific niche where I'd say "This is a situation for Balefire", and sadly I find myself almost never using it. 

2) Shield Pillage - The most useful part of her kit right now, though it has it's problems. It's good against corpus and really high level grineer in theory. But in practice, really only against corpus is it of any use as a shield restore. Grineer armor at levels under 40 isn't enough for any appreciable gain, and against infested it does nothing. Used as a mag-like armor strip, going big into Power mods gets you where you want to go (200% power gets you 50% armor strip) and that's pretty good. The base range actually isn't bad either, but it's limited by line of sight, which cripples it in most areas that aren't outdoors. The status curing and occasional armor strip is really what I use it for outside of Orb Valis.

3)  Haven - It's a great idea, but in practice all it does is burn up your shields. To protect my allies with shield regen and gating, I have to keep it constantly channeled, thus preventing shield regeneration and enduring an enormous drain per enemy for a small, near-useless damage tick that I don't even want when they get close. Having a limited range (this is Warframe, people are constantly parkour-ing everywhere) and the LoS restriction, this is only going to help my team if we somehow manage to all be stuck in the same room. I really, REALLY want this to be even half as useful as Oberon's Renewal, as I like supporting my teammates with extra survivability, but as is it's a big investment for a buff that's rarely able to do it's job.

4) Aegis Storm - With Balefire rockets the way they are, this ability doesn't get much use. The drain is very high, the range is small, and I lose the most effective and versatile elements of my arsenal. If I could use my normal weapons, this would be insanely fun. It would, in fact, be so fun as to be the biggest reason to use Hildryn. Humming "Ride of the Valkyries" to myself while raining Opticor magic from on high. Insofar as I can reason, there's no balance reason that I shouldn't be able to, cc aside it's no more of an advantage than being on an elevated catwalk or tower. As it is, it's the same as Haven: Too much cost for something that's spread too thin. It's neither a big enough CC or strong enough 'offensive mode' to really be worth using.

There's more I can say but I've no doubt already run on long enough, so I'm going to wrap this up here. To date, Hildryn is easily one of my top 3 favorite warframes in the game and all that I've said comes out of a place of love. No doubt wiser minds than mine can suggest how to fix these problems, but as a player to the company that created this wonderful game I can only say keep it up. You guys are doing a great job.

Read it all and REALLY enjoyed it.

You list exactly all the points that she URGENTLY needs. I'd just add that, on top of ALL THAT, she also really needs a way to deal with hp-direct attacks like toxin, gas and bleed damage/DoTs. Either with a buff to her passive that makes procs and damage types that would normally go directly to your hp only affect her shields instead (until they are depleted) or by making her Haven similar to oberon's Hallowed Ground which would make her and affected allies immune to elemental statuses/procs. The issue with her tiny hp pool is that at high enough lvls, DoTs will kill you, unless your eyes are glued to your hp bar (ready to press "2"), and toxin based attacks (such as the toxic ancients) will outright oneshot you (it's pure toxin damage and not a DoT so it cannot be erased/removed and it just one-shots your hp even with a umbral vitality + umbral intensify so she had around 600hp - tested it myself) even if you pay attention to your debuffs. Because of that, she needs a way to deal with those otherwise she's no tank at all.

 

Hell, to even be called "tanky" in endgame she needs to have adaptation and at least a maxed arcane aegis/barrier if not 2 of each or both... oh and to never be against infesteds...oh and with no squadmates using corrosive projection. On the other hand you can be even tankier (WITHOUT THE NEED TO GET ARCANES worth at least 400p each and without any other conditions) with any frame that is either inaros or has a form of damage reduction/mitigation as a passive or ability eventho they are supposed to be "damage dealing" frames which can nuke WAY more than hildryn could ever hope to achieve (ie: baruuk, gara, mesa, nidus, revenant, valkyr, etc.).  Also, for fun's sake, if you compare both "secondary exalted weapons" in the game, aka Balefire vs Peacemakers, I'm pretty sure there's NO contest as to who's the winner. Peacemakers deal more DPS, have better range and AoE clearing and is a lot more energy efficient than balefire which stops your shield regen on top of draining with every shot. 

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Posted (edited)

Is it just me, or does her dodge/roll feel really, really clunky while in midair? I've gotten used to the bulletjump->roll->slide->bulletjump movement loop, but half the time it feels like Hildryn's just doesn't come out, no matter how many times I press shift. 

And yeah, something needs to be done about the interaction between her 2 and toxin/slash damage. I know she doesn't take HP damage from those statuses if she has overshields, but her 2 is the only way to reliably get said overshields, and it just doesn't work against anything that isn't Corpus. On top of that, it needs LoS, meaning that it's basically useless in indoor maps. 

Edited by Portalboat
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