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Nightwave + alerts removal feedback

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5 minutes ago, kuciol said:

You are to fixated on rewards and thats proof enough of your entitlement. Aim is to get to rank 30 nothing more, you get cred past that to not make it pointless and give some sort of rewrd. This is not for veterans. Alerts were also not for veterans. You have everything you shouldnt care about cred shop, the rewards are for people that still care for game itself not shiny cosmetics. Its incentive to diversify gameplay for people that this content is still relevant. I bet my left kidney that you didnt do any alert for a year (not including special ones, and we still can do those) and you are the one to talk how they were better? You either lie to me or yourself. If you dont have a reason to do those super easy things that take 2 hours tops in whole week then you dont have any reason to play the game any longer. You are proving this with every post.

Funny how you don't want to quote me again.

It really does feel like you're just not able to understand my posts because you're repeating the same stuff over and over again while totally missing the points I'm making....again.

Not to mention I've already said that the creds are pointless to me which kind of proves you're not actually reading my posts...

It's also funny how you're trying to make assumptions to back up your post, shame it's the wrong assumption... Actually I did do alerts while they were active if I was online, I never bothered with using the app even early on.  However as I've been playing long enough to accumulate everything I only did the missions I felt like doing rather than doing whatever one was there.... mind you you only need one of the helmets so it basically boiled down to GoL, auras, forma, exilus adapters, nitain and kavat dna (which isn't in the cred store but got a small drop chance buff instead).

And once again you fall back to the don't play it comment... it's almost like you don't actually have anything else to argue with.   You do realise there are other parts to the game other than those such as PoE and nightmare missions etc that we've 'completed'.  We can enjoy the game quite happily in areas where we haven't 'completed' it. 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Funny how you don't want to quote me again.

It really does feel like you're just not able to understand my posts because you're repeating the same stuff over and over again while totally missing the points I'm making....again.

Not to mention I've already said that the creds are pointless to me which kind of proves you're not actually reading my posts...

It's also funny how you're trying to make assumptions to back up your post, shame it's the wrong assumption... Actually I did do alerts while they were active if I was online, I never bothered with using the app even early on.  However as I've been playing long enough to accumulate everything I only did the missions I felt like doing rather than doing whatever one was there.... mind you you only need one of the helmets so it basically boiled down to GoL, auras, forma, exilus adapters, nitain and kavat dna (which isn't in the cred store but got a small drop chance buff instead).

And once again you fall back to the don't play it comment... it's almost like you don't actually have anything else to argue with.   You do realise there are other parts to the game other than those such as PoE and nightmare missions etc that we've 'completed'.  We can enjoy the game quite happily in areas where we haven't 'completed' it. 

I dont care if you specifically used app, the fact there was a need for its existence is proof enough that it was used. Individuals do not matter. I also call bullS#&$ how you did alerts, they had literally nothing of value to you so you had 0 reason to do them, they were less rewarding then nodes they were occupying if you already had mods and weapons that you say you did. Creds are pointless to you because they are supposed to be almost pointless, they are not aimed towards you. You didnt do missions you felt like doing simply because you had to do missions that were available at that time with no way of knowing if or when the alert will come back again. The whole game operates on doing specific content  for specific rewards and you just want to ignore that because its inconvenient truth. You want arcanes > you farm eidolons, you want argon crystals > you go to void, you want cryotic > you do excavations and finally you want cred > you do nightwave. There is no reason to change that just because you cant grasp the fact that you shouldnt be able to get what you want the way you want it. You have no real argument besides what i said multiple times and i will keep repeating it until it sticks. YOU ARE NOT ENTITLED TO REWARDS IF YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO PARTICIPATE IN CONTENT. You operate on false assumption that you should and that comes from someone that doesnt have rewards from 1st season and wont be able to kill PTO because i have currently rank 1 in vox. 

Edited by kuciol
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6 minutes ago, kuciol said:

I dont care if you specifically used app, the fact there was a need for its existence is proof enough that it was used. Individuals do not matter. I also call bullS#&$ how you did alerts, they had literally nothing of value to you so you had 0 reason to do them, they were less rewarding then nodes they were occupying if you already had mods and weapons that you say you did. Creds are pointless to you because they are supposed to be almost pointless, they are not aimed towards you. You didnt do missions you felt like doing simply because you had to do missions that were available at that time with no way of knowing if or when the alert will come back again. The whole game operates on doing specific content  for specific rewards and you just want to ignore that because its inconvenient truth. You want arcanes > you farm eidolons, you want argon crystals > you go to void, you want cryotic > you do excavations and finally you want cred > you do nightwave. There is no reason to change that just because you cant grasp the fact that you shouldnt be able to get what you want the way you want it. You have no real argument besides what i said multiple times and i will keep repeating it until it sticks. YOU ARE NOT ENTITLED TO REWARDS IF YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO PARTICIPATE IN CONTENT. You operate on false assumption that you should and that comes from someone that doesnt have rewards from 1st season and wont be able to kill PTO because i have currently rank 1 in vox. 

and once again you continue to reply without understanding or fully reading my posts....

The fact that you don't believe my bit about doing alerts just shows that your opinion shouldn't hold any credibility because you're just going to call 'bull' on anything that you can't deal with.. if I wasn't doing alerts how come I have over 100 nitain (think it's actually closer to 150), close to 100 kavat dna (most of which came from alerts)  and multiples of each aura. 

Then to top it off you reply based on incorrect assumptions of my posts which again removes any sense of credibility of your argument. 

You argue about doing excavation for cryotic, void for argon and eidolons for arcanes but you don't realise that you're actually supporting my argument about not doing things that don't give me anything in return for doing them..... everything you listed gives me something I need for doing said missions.  As you've clearly not read my posts you've missed the fact I've said I have all rewards AND max standing on PoE for example so doing those missions give me nothing that I need even if I do them again... it actually states I'm already max standing and awards 0 cetus standing awarded when I finish the mission. 

And once again, your capital letters just shows you can't read..... I am not against participating in challenges, I am against participating in challenges that I have no reason to do other than to gain standing for nightwave.  As you're clearly incapable of understanding this why don't you just do what you said you'd do earlier and not reply to me anymore....

 

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4 hours ago, (PS4)BenHeisennberg said:

If I don't particularly care for excavation, should I demand cryotic be added to exterminate drop tables?

Want the rewards?  Play the missions.  It's how the entire game works.

Well no, but not for nightwave, nightwave standings should be much more generic and reward "just by playing" instead of being yet another hexenon/OW resource/nitain/cryotic or whatever.

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But they do give you something in return! They give you regular mission rewards on top of cred. Again its not aimed toward players like you.  The standing itself is reward for you, players that are not maxed get more. Its not endgame and stop acting like it is. 

11 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

You argue about doing excavation for cryotic, void for argon and eidolons for arcanes but you don't realise that you're actually supporting my argument about not doing things that don't give me anything in return for doing them..... everything you listed gives me something I need for doing said missions.  As you've clearly not read my posts you've missed the fact I've said I have all rewards AND max standing on PoE for example so doing those missions give me nothing that I need even if I do them again... it actually states I'm already max standing and awards 0 cetus standing awarded when I finish 

This proves that you are not willing to accept the fact that it is not endgame. We can agree that you have nothing else to work towards to but it wont change what NW was supposed to be.

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Just now, kuciol said:

But they do give you something in return! They give you regular mission rewards on top of cred. Again its not aimed toward players like you.  The standing itself is reward for you, players that are not maxed get more. Its not endgame and stop acting like it is. 

This proves that you are not willing to accept the fact that it is not endgame. We can agree that you have nothing else to work towards to but it wont change what NW was supposed to be.

And once again you fail to understand my posts... you'd have done much better to just stop replying because you're not helping yourself here. 

I have at no point said nightwave was endgame, nice to see you're still not actually reading my posts.  You've pulled that one out of thin air to try and prove your misunderstanding again. 

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1 minute ago, LSG501 said:

And once again you fail to understand my posts... you'd have done much better to just stop replying because you're not helping yourself here. 

I have at no point said nightwave was endgame, nice to see you're still not actually reading my posts.  You've pulled that one out of thin air to try and prove your misunderstanding again. 

But you act like it is! NW is additional reward not singular, the fact that you dont need anything else doesnt make that point valid simply because its not content meant for you. Stop trying to push everything towards my missundersting  when You are the one who doesnt get it. You try to make it more appropriete for vets when it was never meant for them.

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1 minute ago, kuciol said:

But you act like it is! NW is additional reward not singular, the fact that you dont need anything else doesnt make that point valid simply because its not content meant for you. Stop trying to push everything towards my missundersting  when You are the one who doesnt get it. You try to make it more appropriete for vets when it was never meant for them.

It is better if it was meant for both vet and casuals.

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2 minutes ago, Test-995 said:

It is better if it was meant for both vet and casuals.

It would but such approach always fails. Its better to sepparate those, always.

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3 minutes ago, kuciol said:

It would but such approach always fails. Its better to sepparate those, always.

Well indeed, nightwave is pretty much doing such approach by adding some exclusive (but not that exclusive) reward, yet most of the acts are not meant for vets, how strange and faulty it is.

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5 minutes ago, Test-995 said:

Well indeed, nightwave is pretty much doing such approach by adding some exclusive (but not that exclusive) reward, yet most of the acts are not meant for vets, how strange and faulty it is.

Not really. Those rewards are just cosmetic and dont impact gameplay, the players greed is not indication at who the content was aimed towards. Im all in for something like this aimed towards vets in addition not instead of NW. Just upping the rewards on the content you are asked to do would solve a lot of problems but thats problem with content itself not NW.

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Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, kuciol said:

Not really. Those rewards are just cosmetic and dont impact gameplay, the players greed is not indication at who the content was aimed towards. Im all in for something like this aimed towards vets in addition not instead of NW. Just upping the rewards on the content you are asked to do would solve a lot of problems but thats problem with content itself not NW.

If wanting the things that DE thought worth the chasing, and hoping for better/fun way to achieve it is greed, i have nothing to say, really.

In that logic low drop rate ephemera is only meant for people who can grind that ridiculous chance and afford stupid crafting cost, well that could be true since they didn't really changed it yet.

Also asking us to do problematic content is kinda strange.

Edited by Test-995

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1 hour ago, kuciol said:

You are to fixated on rewards and thats proof enough of your entitlement. Aim is to get to rank 30 nothing more, you get cred past that to not make it pointless and give some sort of rewrd. This is not for veterans. Alerts were also not for veterans. You have everything you shouldnt care about cred shop, the rewards are for people that still care for game itself not shiny cosmetics. Its incentive to diversify gameplay for people that this content is still relevant. I bet my left kidney that you didnt do any alert for a year (not including special ones, and we still can do those) and you are the one to talk how they were better? You either lie to me or yourself. If you dont have a reason to do those super easy things that take 2 hours tops in whole week then you dont have any reason to play the game any longer. You are proving this with every post.

1. Merriam-Webster defines entitlement as "belief that one is deserving of or entitled to certain privileges", which, in this situation, couldn't be further from the truth. I am not "entitled" to cosmetics, I don't think anyone here really believes they are, maintaining a focus on the rewards does not equate entitlement. Especially since the rewards are supposed to give you an incentive to even play Nightwave. It seems LSG501's primary issue with Nightwave, is that it makes him do tasks for almost nothing to reward his efforts; and it makes perfect sense. I'm not an endgame player, or a vet, and even I have no reason to play Bounties, Invasions, or Clem's weeklies.

2. "The rewards are for people that still care for the game itself not shiny cosmetics". Then why make the tier 29-30 rewards "shiny cosmetics"? Because DE knows shiny cosmetics will drag any player back to their system. Unless of course, you like going through the game as basic Excalibur. Alerts may not have been for veterans, but then again, they weren't aimed at anyone else, really.
 
3. If any content in this game is irrelevant, it's because of the game-mode itself, not the players. How many actually enjoy playing Archwing pursuit? Or Defection? Granted Nightwave hasn't made you play those modes, yet; but how many people will say "Oh yeah, I love ESO, it's so fun and challenging!"?
 
4. "If you dont have a reason to do those super easy things that take 2 hours tops in whole then you dont have any reason to play the game any longer. You are proving this with every post." This contradicts your previous statement about "people that still care for the game itself not shiny cosmetics"; Maybe LSG501 still cares about the game itself? I still love this game, and I haven't played for weeks. One of the things I loved doing during my free time, was exploring every inch of the plains and Orb Vallis, I didn't get any cosmetics or special standing for doing that. Nightwave puts a big emphasis on "playing the game" in a way some people really don't play Warframe for.
 
There's more to this game than survival or defense missions. Before Nightwave was even implemented, I took a step back from the game and wonder why I even played it, it's so repetitive and inane, it really wasn't the sort of game I'd find myself playing. I realised that I loved this game because of the random encounters with people, the sandbox aspect of dojos, the aesthetic, and the story it told. All the smaller things it presents, not shiny cosmetics, not epic game modes.
 
On another note, why are the pro-Nightwave people so adamant on having a single system? I would like Nightwave stay, only for the short stories it puts out, but I'd prefer it if they simply reworked the alert system and ran it alongside Nightwave. Win-win for both sides, really.
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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, kuciol said:

But you act like it is! NW is additional reward not singular, the fact that you dont need anything else doesnt make that point valid simply because its not content meant for you. Stop trying to push everything towards my missundersting  when You are the one who doesnt get it. You try to make it more appropriete for vets when it was never meant for them.

Um... no I haven't ever said it was end game... I disagreed with YOUR assertation that nightwave is not for long term players.   See this is what happens when you don't actually read the posts you're replying to....

edit: The1stAzrael above understood more in one post than you did in all the replies you've made...because they actually read my post properly...

Edited by LSG501
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1 hour ago, LSG501 said:

You argue about doing excavation for cryotic, void for argon and eidolons for arcanes but you don't realise that you're actually supporting my argument about not doing things that don't give me anything in return for doing them..... everything you listed gives me something I need for doing said missions.  As you've clearly not read my posts you've missed the fact I've said I have all rewards AND max standing on PoE for example so doing those missions give me nothing that I need even if I do them again... it actually states I'm already max standing and awards 0 cetus standing awarded when I finish the mission. 

"I should be rewarded for doing a mission."

"I've gotten everything I want from PoE."

"Therefore, I get no rewards for doing PoE."

"Nightwave should give me an alternative for earning rewards because PoE won't give me rewards if I do PoE for these rewards."

Class, raise your hand if you can find the problem with this argument.

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, (PS4)BenHeisennberg said:

"I should be rewarded for doing a mission."

"I've gotten everything I want from PoE."

"Therefore, I get no rewards for doing PoE."

"Nightwave should give me an alternative for earning rewards because PoE won't give me rewards if I do PoE for these rewards."

Class, raise your hand if you can find the problem with this argument.

Oh do please explain.... baring in mind you've come in at about mid way through that conversation and ignored a majority of the context. 

Oh and you can't just say getting nightwave rewards is the 'reward' for doing the mission, they're a reward on top of the reward for the mission required for the challenge.  If you do a capture challenge you get the reward for that mission AND the nightwave standing for example.

Edited by LSG501

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32 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

Oh do please explain.... baring in mind you've come in at about mid way through that conversation and ignored a majority of the context. 

Oh and you can't just say getting nightwave rewards is the 'reward' for doing the mission, they're a reward on top of the reward for the mission required for the challenge.  If you do a capture challenge you get the reward for that mission AND the nightwave standing for example.

Looks like you explained already lol, and your issue is you feel done with the game.

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, (PS4)BenHeisennberg said:

Looks like you explained already lol, and your issue is you feel done with the game.

And as I suspected you jumped in half way through the conversation and missed out on a fair bit of the context....

 

I'll do a very quick summary as you didn't read everything and it answers the second part at the same time....No I'm not done with the game, I actually still enjoy the game in fact but I do have an issue with needing to do parts of the game that I have 'finished' and as such no reason to do them just to fulfil nightwave challenges. 

 

Edited by LSG501

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20 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

No I'm not done with the game, I actually still enjoy the game in fact but I do have an issue with needing to do parts of the game that I have 'finished' and as such no reason to do them just to fulfil nightwave challenges. 

Eventually, if you play long enough, you finish everything available.  That isn't what the challenges should be balanced around. 

Yeah I have everything from PoE too, but I run it for Nightwave, as I don't have that.

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1 minute ago, (PS4)BenHeisennberg said:

Eventually, if you play long enough, you finish everything available.  That isn't what the challenges should be balanced around. 

Yeah I have everything from PoE too, but I run it for Nightwave, as I don't have that.

But the point is (and I've raised this earlier) is that it doesn't 'need' to be like it is.  DE could easily have done a system that doesn't 'force' players to repeat content or parts of the game that they've 'finished' by just having more options of what we can do to get our weekly standing and adding in a cap (which we technically have with nightwave 2 due to no 'wolf' this time).   The system is 'ok' for newer players but when something is supposed to include everyone it should also take into account what the 'higher level' players have done too and in essence it doesn't.

What is happening is nightwave is in a way being used to increase player participation on dead nodes, which is not the way to make players go back to them.  They're dead for a reason and the reason is there is no reason to go back there.  Give the dead nodes a reason for us to constantly go there and we'll go there.

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On 2019-07-23 at 3:23 AM, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

If you really think that playing a video game, doing a few missions of your choosing per day, lasting a cumulative 2-3 hours per week, at any point in time that you choose, is anything close to having "a job", you're in for a very rude awakening. If you are just using hyperbole, because you have been watching too much youtu.be and figure that being over dramatic is a good idea, you should maybe consider not doing that. 

 

Good luck, Tenno. 

fry.PNG?1307468855

 

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1 hour ago, LSG501 said:

The system is 'ok' for newer players but when something is supposed to include everyone it should also take into account what the 'higher level' players have done too and in essence it doesn't.

What would you recommend it add?  Where in the game would you go?  Everything in the game can be completed.

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4 minutes ago, (PS4)BenHeisennberg said:

What would you recommend it add?  Where in the game would you go?  Everything in the game can be completed. 

I did actually put some 'alternative' approaches for nightwave earlier on in the thread so go back a few pages they'll be in there somewhere.

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3 minutes ago, LSG501 said:

I did actually put some 'alternative' approaches for nightwave earlier on in the thread so go back a few pages they'll be in there somewhere.

If they involve completable content, someone, somewhere will have your gripe.

I have serious questions when someone refuses to do parts of the game once they complete the rewards.  Do you enjoy Warframe?  A break might be in order if you straight up won't touch things you completed because you "don't have to anymore," in a game.

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, LSG501 said:

Um... no I haven't ever said it was end game... I disagreed with YOUR assertation that nightwave is not for long term players.   See this is what happens when you don't actually read the posts you're replying to....

edit: The1stAzrael above understood more in one post than you did in all the replies you've made...because they actually read my post properly...

Ive never said You did just  that you act like it is. You as veteran have wrong approach from get go thats the problem im pointing out. The NW is not meant to be reward alone its meant to be additional reward for diversification of your time.  It doesnt say "do invasions right now!" it says "hey you still need stuff from invasions, do them now for additional gooddies." The fact that you have nothing else to do is not NW fault. Giving you options is just wrong because

1. Players will just do the easy things

2. One they give in that train will never stop

3. It will turn them into participation rewards, abomination that undermines the whole concept of reward 

You want to change NW into something it was never meant to be just because you are content starved. Thats problem with veterans in every game.  NW is meant to slow down burn out by encouraging doing different content, it was never meant as something you just get passively or by doing whatever you want. 

Edited by kuciol
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