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Nightwave + alerts removal feedback

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39 minutes ago, Enialyx said:

The great irony here is that this is a feedback thread. Specifically made by DE staff to hear people's opinions. 

And the DE Defense Force thinks they're doing a service to DE by shooting negative opinions down.

frustrated the x files GIF

No the irony is that there are people criticising on rather spurious grounds and trying to get the people responding to the thread to believe that comments critical of their criticism isn't also valid feedback. 

See how that goes? 

 

3 hours ago, NezuHimeSama said:

What question was that?

 

4 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Now since you are claiming that how long it takes us is the issue here, let me ask you a very unpleasant question.... If you were to apply yourself, how long do you think you would take to get the 30k standing for the week using the most efficient tactics available to you? 

Again, that's the least time required for you to get 30k standing? 

☝️

The question you now seem to be trying very hard to avoid answering. Folks might find it a wee bit suspicious soon. 

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I was very optimistic when we first got Nightwave, but as time passed I started to dislike it, and now I'm completely burned out.
 

I just wanna log in and do the things I want to, and have fun. Being told what to do and especially having limited time to do those things every week is the opposite of that. Also the chores I mean challenges itself are asinine, and a complete waste of my time. I especially resent DE trying to ram content the playerbase dislikes and actively avoids due to poor rewards or tedious gameplay down on our throats. The amount of time investment required is way too high too. Like having to complete 10 syndicate missions for merely 3.000 reputation?  YIKES.

Also:
No I don't want any fish from the Plains - definitely not until you fix the Cetus economy, which in its current state I ain't touching with a ten foot long pole

No I don't want to kill the Silver Grove guardians - there's literally no rewards for it.  Also I couldn't come up with a more tedious task in game if I attempted to, like scanning plants

No I don't want to run 10 syndicate missions

No I definitely don't want to find 3 Caches in ALL 3 separate sabotage missions 

No I don't wanna go 3 wagers in the Index without the enemy being able to score.  

And I especially don't want to scan anything for Simaris

Like, did you guys even consider how much time it will take to do all these things? Going for a rough estimate, I'd say it would take literally 3-4 hours to do everything, if we include preparations, looking for groups and such.
If I divide that by 7, it's still half an hour of doing nothing but chores every day. THEN I can have some fun in the game doing the things I actually enjoy.
This is unacceptable.
 

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37 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

No the irony is that there are people criticising on rather spurious grounds and trying to get the people responding to the thread to believe that comments critical of their criticism isn't also valid feedback. 

See how that goes? 

 

 

☝️

The question you now seem to be trying very hard to avoid answering. Folks might find it a wee bit suspicious soon. 

That's not a question. It's an incomplete questioning statement.

Also, minimum time will be above some 5min per chore avg * number of chores, which isn't really the issue like I already said, and like you continue to ignore.

 

4 minutes ago, Ssalem said:

I was very optimistic when we first got Nightwave, but as time passed I started to dislike it, and now I'm completely burned out.
 

I just wanna log in and do the things I want to, and have fun. Being told what to do and especially having limited time to do those things every week is the opposite of that. Also the chores I mean challenges itself are asinine, and a complete waste of my time. I especially resent DE trying to ram content the playerbase dislikes and actively avoids due to poor rewards or tedious gameplay down on our throats. The amount of time investment required is way too high too. Like having to complete 10 syndicate missions for merely 3.000 reputation?  YIKES.

Also:
No I don't want any fish from the Plains - definitely not until you fix the Cetus economy, which in its current state I ain't touching with a ten foot long pole

No I don't want to kill the Silver Grove guardians - there's literally no rewards for it.  Also I couldn't come up with a more tedious task in game if I attempted to, like scanning plants

No I don't want to run 10 syndicate missions

No I definitely don't want to find 3 Caches in ALL 3 separate sabotage missions 

No I don't wanna go 3 wagers in the Index without the enemy being able to score.  

And I especially don't want to scan anything for Simaris

Like, did you guys even consider how much time it will take to do all these things? Going for a rough estimate, I'd say it would take literally 3-4 hours to do everything, if we include preparations, looking for groups and such.
If I divide that by 7, it's still half an hour of doing nothing but chores every day. THEN I can have some fun in the game doing the things I actually enjoy.
This is unacceptable.
 

This guy gets it. It's TACOs all over again.

I started playing Warframe specifically because I got sick of PSO2's bullS#&$.

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Posted (edited)
13 hours ago, --END--Rikutatis said:

You have absolutely no idea how a Skinner box or behavior analysis work, do you? What you said above is just incorrect in so many ways... If you try to use psychology to defend your arguments, you should at least understand how it works. 

Denial is a coping mechanism and seems to be strong in this one.

Edited by Xenodi
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16 minutes ago, Ssalem said:

I was very optimistic when we first got Nightwave, but as time passed I started to dislike it, and now I'm completely burned out.
 

I just wanna log in and do the things I want to, and have fun. Being told what to do and especially having limited time to do those things every week is the opposite of that. Also the chores I mean challenges itself are asinine, and a complete waste of my time. I especially resent DE trying to ram content the playerbase dislikes and actively avoids due to poor rewards or tedious gameplay down on our throats. The amount of time investment required is way too high too. Like having to complete 10 syndicate missions for merely 3.000 reputation?  YIKES.

Also:
No I don't want any fish from the Plains - definitely not until you fix the Cetus economy, which in its current state I ain't touching with a ten foot long pole

No I don't want to kill the Silver Grove guardians - there's literally no rewards for it.  Also I couldn't come up with a more tedious task in game if I attempted to, like scanning plants

No I don't want to run 10 syndicate missions

No I definitely don't want to find 3 Caches in ALL 3 separate sabotage missions 

No I don't wanna go 3 wagers in the Index without the enemy being able to score.  

And I especially don't want to scan anything for Simaris

Like, did you guys even consider how much time it will take to do all these things? Going for a rough estimate, I'd say it would take literally 3-4 hours to do everything, if we include preparations, looking for groups and such.
If I divide that by 7, it's still half an hour of doing nothing but chores every day. THEN I can have some fun in the game doing the things I actually enjoy.
This is unacceptable.
 

Yet you get up to 7k just signing in and killing stuff...you dont have to look for groups for syndicate the majority of them are pre 20 missions and you get standing toward warframe specific mods...haha finding groups for syndicate missions...sounds like you dont the tier rewards from nightwave either lol.

Caches have their own rewards

Syndicate missions have their own reward

Scanning for simaris has its own reward.

If you dont do any of the elite or non kill weeklies.. Youll earn enough tiers to get your free slots , extra forma, and a bunch of nitain. 

2 hours ago, Enialyx said:

The great irony here is that this is a feedback thread. Specifically made by DE staff to hear people's opinions. 

And the DE Defense Force thinks they're doing a service to DE by shooting negative opinions down.

frustrated the x files GIF

Except your de defense force has been advocating improvements for nightwave improvements.the bring back alerts and scrap nightwave (neither of which is gonna happen is detracting from that feedback ).

@season acts (that themselves dont take all season to do) for resource, faction related, friendship challenges, and build related task

@a credit award at a lower tier rank

Or @ credits each rank

@etc.

Theres three tiers of playerbase here ..the new players who are the least likely to be on the forums, the e long time players who likely only did nitain and rare alerts anyways and the in between players at various advancement.

Do new players need tier 30 from this?no. One or two ranks per week for 10 weeks will net them far more than alerts just signing on and killing stuff.

Elites....they want tier 30 so they can rack up wolf credits . 

The in between players are nightwaves primary focus. They also are the hardest to please because they have diverse daily agendas when they log in

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7 hours ago, NezuHimeSama said:

That's not a question. It's an incomplete questioning statement.

Also, minimum time will be above some 5min per chore avg * number of chores, which isn't really the issue like I already said, and like you continue to ignore.

Wow. You do seem to be pulling out all the stops to avoid answering the simple question of how long you think it would take you to get 30k standing. Why is that? Is it so difficult to just tally it up the way others have done? 

 

And if I look at the numbers 3 elites + 5weeklies = 30k standing. All elites and weeklies become available at the reset. 

So if I do take your 5 minutes figure, this suggests that you are opposed to being asked to play warframe for more than 40 minutes throughout the week, possibly on a single day. 

Is that 40 minutes the maximum amount of of time that someone like you, who has played the game for years is willing to play before attempting to "pay to bypass" the "wait time" (read "participation" ) for their event rewards?

Seems abnormally low, doesn't it? 

Are you just scared to put a number on it because you might have to admit that you just don't want to have to play at all to get the rewards? 

 

The challenges can often be done simultaneously and many people can complete the majority in a single day. Even the scan for Simaris challenge seems to be something that can be done in a day, because for the latest one I had to do 4 Scorch Grineer dudes. I did 3 and have the challenge complete. 

 

I'm at MR 16 right now, should probably be able to jump to 19, but meh. I am super casual, and I am just picking and choosing challenges to do. No fomo. No "omg must grind until burnout". No "gee I really don't enjoy that game mode but I am doing it for the next few hours because Nora is forcing me". 

I'm at about tier 19. The event started just about 5 weeks ago. I've gotten a bunch of free stuff and I'm very happy with the way things are going. 

 

Last night I did the silver grove one with someone from recruiting and took them fishing after because they didn't have the bait. He was having a blast, so we kept doing it until I packed it up and went to bed. He said that he is loving the NW event and was currently on tier 13. He wasn't reeing about being "forced to play" a game that he enjoys either. 

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Posted (edited)

You can spin it how you guys want, the fact is nightwaves are not a good alert replacement.

Both systems should coexist, each for it's own use and purpose.

However, if old alerts are not gonna be returned, the nightwaves system must be tweaked a lot so to be enjoyable by a lot more players and not seem as a forced grindfest ladder of things we have done many times over or do not wanna do in general just because, so to be reaching to rewards.

On my previous post in here, I suggested a few things on how to make nightwaves a bit more tolerable by those you don't like them.

Overall though, old alerts were better and felt alot more on the fly rewarding for running a mission and 5-10 minutes later had the reward collected, done and done.

No ladder, no grindfest, no forced gameplay.

A lot of players think this way, we cannot all be wrong about it.

DE, we love you and all, but do something with the nightwaves, adjust them in a way to be more enjoyable and not feel as a chore.

Or bring back the old alerts too and have both systems up, so players to choose how the wanna be doing things.

Everyone would be happy if this happened.

Thanks for reading.

 

Edited by No1Eye
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48 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Wow. You do seem to be pulling out all the stops to avoid answering the simple question of how long you think it would take you to get 30k standing. Why is that? Is it so difficult to just tally it up the way others have done? 

 

And if I look at the numbers 3 elites + 5weeklies = 30k standing. All elites and weeklies become available at the reset. 

So if I do take your 5 minutes figure, this suggests that you are opposed to being asked to play warframe for more than 40 minutes throughout the week, possibly on a single day. 

Is that 40 minutes the maximum amount of of time that someone like you, who has played the game for years is willing to play before attempting to "pay to bypass" the "wait time" (read "participation" ) for their event rewards?

Seems abnormally low, doesn't it? 

Are you just scared to put a number on it because you might have to admit that you just don't want to have to play at all to get the rewards? 

 

The challenges can often be done simultaneously and many people can complete the majority in a single day. Even the scan for Simaris challenge seems to be something that can be done in a day, because for the latest one I had to do 4 Scorch Grineer dudes. I did 3 and have the challenge complete. 

 

I'm at MR 16 right now, should probably be able to jump to 19, but meh. I am super casual, and I am just picking and choosing challenges to do. No fomo. No "omg must grind until burnout". No "gee I really don't enjoy that game mode but I am doing it for the next few hours because Nora is forcing me". 

I'm at about tier 19. The event started just about 5 weeks ago. I've gotten a bunch of free stuff and I'm very happy with the way things are going. 

 

Last night I did the silver grove one with someone from recruiting and took them fishing after because they didn't have the bait. He was having a blast, so we kept doing it until I packed it up and went to bed. He said that he is loving the NW event and was currently on tier 13. He wasn't reeing about being "forced to play" a game that he enjoys either. 

literally answered the question, but keep ignoring it I guess. It's pretty obvious you're trolling, I'm just here to make sure it's obvious enough for everyone else.

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7 hours ago, Ssalem said:

I was very optimistic when we first got Nightwave, but as time passed I started to dislike it, and now I'm completely burned out.
 

I just wanna log in and do the things I want to, and have fun. Being told what to do and especially having limited time to do those things every week is the opposite of that. Also the chores I mean challenges itself are asinine, and a complete waste of my time. I especially resent DE trying to ram content the playerbase dislikes and actively avoids due to poor rewards or tedious gameplay down on our throats. The amount of time investment required is way too high too. Like having to complete 10 syndicate missions for merely 3.000 reputation?  YIKES.

Have you tried just not doing the ones you don't want to do? Why do you feel like that's not an option? 

7 hours ago, Ssalem said:

Also:
No I don't want any fish from the Plains - definitely not until you fix the Cetus economy, which in its current state I ain't touching with a ten foot long pole

No I don't want to kill the Silver Grove guardians - there's literally no rewards for it.  Also I couldn't come up with a more tedious task in game if I attempted to, like scanning plants

No I don't want to run 10 syndicate missions

No I definitely don't want to find 3 Caches in ALL 3 separate sabotage missions 

No I don't wanna go 3 wagers in the Index without the enemy being able to score.  

And I especially don't want to scan anything for Simaris

Sounds like what you are trying to say is that you don't want to play the majority of the game. 

The fishing you can get done with the first spear and nothing else. Folks like me have loads of bait, and I'm not affected by you catching fish when I toss the bait. If anything it's easier for both of us because we can find the hotspots faster, and take turns chasing away the Grineer. You don't need to turn the fish in, just keep them on ice until you get bored of waiting for them to change the game to suit your individual whims. 

Silver grove.. Again you don't actually need to do anything. 2 of us teamed up and carried the 3 potions, and did the killing, one random who joined in and didn't rush to extraction got the challenge completed anyway. Doesn't hurt me in any way. Oh and protip, the spectres drop stuff. So that's 2 sets of rewards the random got just for tagging along. 

Syndicate missions are pretty much regular in game missions with the added bonus of extra syndicate points for free, and the chance to find a syndicate chit to turn in for even more. What's that something like 4 sets of rewards for completing regular missions? Yeah I can see why people wouldn't want that. /s

You don't have to find even one hidden cache, so long as anyone in the group finds them. Again this can potentially be done passively, and you are rewarded. 

Index should be more than doable but I'm not going to bother. I don't need the points and don't think I really need credits. Maybe I'll change my mind later in the week. 

I scanned 3 targets (3 scorch out of 4) and got it complete I'll go do the last one at some point, because like the other syndicates, Simaris lets me trade them in for more free stuff. In a given week it's not unusual to get a bunch of simaris targets because someone else was hunting them. 

None of those seems like a loss on the balance sheets. What's the reason for the hate? 

 

7 hours ago, Ssalem said:

Like, did you guys even consider how much time it will take to do all these things? Going for a rough estimate, I'd say it would take literally 3-4 hours to do everything, if we include preparations, looking for groups and such.
If I divide that by 7, it's still half an hour of doing nothing but chores every day. THEN I can have some fun in the game doing the things I actually enjoy.
This is unacceptable.
 

The actual maths is ok, but you made a major mistake. You're assuming that we have to do these things exclusive to playing the game. 

Simaris targets show up in most mission types. You can pick syndicate missions that you enjoy and will benefit from. Apart from the fishing one, and possibly the index one most folks can get the others done while playing the game normally. 

Since you don't need to complete all to hit max tier, what's unacceptable about that? 

 

1 minute ago, NezuHimeSama said:

literally answered the question, but keep ignoring it I guess. It's pretty obvious you're trolling, I'm just here to make sure it's obvious enough for everyone else.

Saying "it won't take me less than 5 minutes each" isn't anywhere near answering "how long do you think it would it take you to get to 30k standing on an average week?". 

What's rapidly becoming obvious enough for everyone else is that you are trying really hard to not give any answer to the question. That suggests that you have some reason to not answer it,, doesn't it? Is it because the answer will discredit a lot of what you have complained about?

Looked like a straightforward question, the answer to which would easily shed some light on the problem you're having, and your professed feelings about nightwave. Why not just give a simple answer? 

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23 minutes ago, NezuHimeSama said:

literally answered the question, but keep ignoring it I guess. It's pretty obvious you're trolling, I'm just here to make sure it's obvious enough for everyone else.

Very obvious, indeed. He's one of the two people heavily trolling and trying to de-rail this thread. I'm ignoring them, so should everbody else. This thread is for feedback about nightwave, and when those two are so happy with it, they should just say it and leave. When there are enough people stating that they are very unhappy with nightwave, hopefully DE will acknowledge that and act accordingly.

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32 minutes ago, NezuHimeSama said:

It literally is.

Why are you trying to fool?

No, all you did was offer one of the possible amounts of time it won't take you. You didn't even indicate if playing the game for 40 minutes a week is the maximum time you would consider acceptable which is one of the things that I asked in the subsequent post which you then claimed ignored what you had said. 

It seems as though you really want to avoid giving any answer that would show how long it will take you, in your estimation. 

30 minutes ago, TheFBD said:

Very obvious, indeed. He's one of the two people heavily trolling and trying to de-rail this thread. I'm ignoring them, so should everbody else. This thread is for feedback about nightwave, and when those two are so happy with it, they should just say it and leave. When there are enough people stating that they are very unhappy with nightwave, hopefully DE will acknowledge that and act accordingly.

Disagreeing ≠ trolling or derailing

Not bashing the games and DE ≠ trolling or derailing 

Pointing out that what some people are claiming to be objective truth has been shown to be false weeks ago ≠ trolling or derailing 

Trying to find out more about the causes of subjective complaints that may be valid for the person posting it ≠ trolling or derailing 

 

 

And the reason we all know this is that you can report folks for trolling. It also can't be derailing if each post is a response to things that were clearly said by others (usually quoted for clarity) often with simple math included to back up what were saying. 

So far it's mainly been repeating stuff like: nobody is being forced to do anything, we can opt out at any point; if people are unable to complete the tiers this time there are other seasons planned so no need for FOMO; we do have some good reasons for believing that it will be at least 10 weeks, and at this point we should be safe if we guess that it might be 11; you don't need to do all of the challenges to hit the highest tier; newbs who are focusing on the creds can get all that are on offer in the first 30 tiers without doing a single Elite weekly; that 70% estimate is sooo last month, and the dude on reddit failed to take convicts into consideration; yes there are people who seem to be a couple of ranks above where they should be so capturing those convicts does seem to be adding up for some folks; what do you even mean dude, I'm literally quoting what you said and that directly contradicts what you are saying you said, are you even paying attention to the stuff you are making up at this point; and pretty often we have to say "dude, the point of a feedback page isn't that we all need to bash the game, yeah you're allowed to rant but we're also allowed to point out the flaws in your rantings, nobody's told you not to express your opinion, so it's really not cool for you to try to shut us up". 

You're free to check that out if you like, or not. Up to you. Do it if you want to, sort of like the nightwave challenges. 😉

 

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10 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:
10 hours ago, Enialyx said:

The great irony here is that this is a feedback thread. Specifically made by DE staff to hear people's opinions. 

And the DE Defense Force thinks they're doing a service to DE by shooting negative opinions down.

frustrated the x files GIF

No the irony is that there are people criticising on rather spurious grounds and trying to get the people responding to the thread to believe that comments critical of their criticism isn't also valid feedback. 

See how that goes?

 

At what point did DE ask to spam your opinion on other people's opinions? At no point. What you're doing here is picking fights and filling the thread with pointless arguing. This makes it living hell for DE to find the actual feedback.

If I were the customer feedback girl, I'd rather hit myself in the face than sift through a thread like this.

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Just now, Enialyx said:

 

At what point did DE ask to spam your opinion on other people's opinions? At no point. What you're doing here is picking fights and filling the thread with pointless arguing. This makes it living hell for DE to find the actual feedback.

Weird... they didn't seem to ask us not to. Can you point that part out for me? Showing simple math, that explains why we don't need to complete all of the challenges, or pointing out where the facts presented by others are flawed, or that the opinions being offered, seem to be based on things that generally aren't true (especially stuff like "omg please stop forcing us to do these challenges" when nobody is being forced and opting out of nightwave if you aren't enjoying it is a perfectly valid option) isn't "picking fights".

People have said stuff to the effect of "I am not enjoying nightwave so I am not going to be doing this" and I have praised them wholeheartedly for exercising their agency. I have no problem whatsoever with people who want to skip it for whatever reason. I support them for making the choices they believe are the best for them. 

Oddly, that doesn't seem to be the way that most of the vocal minority is headed. 

17 minutes ago, Enialyx said:

If I were the customer feedback girl, I'd rather hit myself in the face than sift through a thread like this.

Tendencies toward and advocating o self harm are usually not a good sign, Tenno. You might want to talk to someone about it. 

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It was stated that after each story progression, the spawn rate of the Wolf would increase by a degree that, by the end of it, would be hard NOT to encounter him, but after three episodes, this rate has yet to noticeably increased. I've been testing this since the start of this Nightwave season, and the Wolf has remained consistently rare, with around a 1/80 to 1/100 rate. Worse yet, with Episode 3 his mechanics have apparently changed a bit, but his rate remains the same low chance. We are edging past the apparent halfway point of this Season, with little idea how many episodes remain.

It seems like escalation should start being felt at this point.

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Posted (edited)
20 hours ago, NezuHimeSama said:

A minimum amount of time can be inferred, and a login pattern requirement is stated by the participation requirement, which is what makes Nightwave so awful. If it was a new grindy content dump every 10 weeks, I don't think many people would would much mind. As it is now, it's pretty awful.

Saying power creep isn't necessary is like saying playing the game in the first place isn't necessary. Why even play a progression based game that's introducing newer S#&$ all the time?

 

Umbra Forma shouldn't even be in the game, but now it is.

So your point is really moot because anything past being nigh invulnerable and one shot insta killing all content in visible range (including through walls) is absolutely unnecessary for any game mechanic, moving beyond that is pointless power creep and the answer needs to be an increase in challenge, which devs are allergic to.  right now nobody has any umbral forma and we can sleepwalk through all the content as is.  Adding more power creep to that is just simply irresponsible game development.  Additionally, making the grind for it to reasonably affect your most used gear over 4 years of grind is also absolutely unreasonable and irresponsible levels of grind.  It suffers on both ends.

That said, it's entirely unnecessary to achieve literally all of the game's content while blind folded and half asleep.

Arguing that you "NEED TO" get it is simply a BS argument.

Really what you "need" is rhino (not prime), a decent amp and a pretty good zaw riven, I'd argue an amesha and/or itzal and a couple forma on your fav arch weapon might be useful too.  After that the game challenge is pointless and all other content is entirely optional, though certain frames and weapons are good to have for efficiency and that can reasonably be an argument.  Adding umbral forma doesn't make the game more efficient, it just makes it so that you go from 99.9999999998% unkillable to 99.9999999999% unkillable.  Arguing that it's necessary on any level is absurdist rhetoric.  The ONLY and I mean ONLY players that should aspire to achieve umbral forma are collectors, who will have no problem achieving this because they have no problem with any content, or endurance runners that do mot past 5 hours, who also will have no problem with this.  All other arguments for "needing" umbral forma as "necessary" are absurd nonsense.

Trying to dismantle my point in this way is like me saying "ice cream is good" and you saying "yeah, but what if ice cream had bones in it?!?!" to which I'd respond "but it doesn't" and you reply "but what if it did?!?!"... it's not a valid argument to consider.

Edited by Klokwerkaos
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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, Klokwerkaos said:

So your point is really moot because anything past being nigh invulnerable and one shot insta killing all content in visible range (including through walls) is absolutely unnecessary for any game mechanic, moving beyond that is pointless power creep and the answer needs to be an increase in challenge, which devs are allergic to.  right now nobody has any umbral forma and we can sleepwalk through all the content as is.  Adding more power creep to that is just simply irresponsible game development.  Additionally, making the grind for it to reasonably affect your most used gear over 4 years of grind is also absolutely unreasonable and irresponsible levels of grind.  It suffers on both ends.

That said, it's entirely unnecessary to achieve literally all of the game's content while blind folded and half asleep.

Arguing that you "NEED TO" get it is simply a BS argument.

Really what you "need" is rhino (not prime), a decent amp and a pretty good zaw riven, I'd argue an amesha and/or itzal and a couple forma on your fav arch weapon might be useful too.  After that the game challenge is pointless and all other content is entirely optional, though certain frames and weapons are good to have for efficiency and that can reasonably be an argument.  Adding umbral forma doesn't make the game more efficient, it just makes it so that you go from 99.9999999998% unkillable to 99.9999999999% unkillable.  Arguing that it's necessary on any level is absurdist rhetoric.  The ONLY and I mean ONLY players that should aspire to achieve umbral forma are collectors, who will have no problem achieving this because they have no problem with any content, or endurance runners that do mot past 5 hours, who also will have no problem with this.  All other arguments for "needing" umbral forma as "necessary" are absurd nonsense.

Trying to dismantle my point in this way is like me saying "ice cream is good" and you saying "yeah, but what if ice cream had bones in it?!?!" to which I'd respond "but it doesn't" and you reply "but what if it did?!?!"... it's not a valid argument to consider.

What do you do in WF if not accumulate power?

I'm not saying they should keep introducing more power creep, but when they do, the entire goal of the game is to get that thing.

Edited by NezuHimeSama
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1 hour ago, NezuHimeSama said:

What do you do in WF if not accumulate power?

I'm not saying they should keep introducing more power creep, but when they do, the entire goal of the game is to get that thing.

I figure that most people just try to have fun playing the game. Because if that's not the goal of the game, something is probably going wrong. 

If getting one specific thing is the entire goal you set for yourself, then you will probably end up just burning yourself out for no good reason, spending real money to get a single thing, and hating the game because of stuff you irrationally made yourself do...... Hmmm that would explain so much about the stuff some folks are posting on this thread. 

I've chatted with players in game who did the challenges with me, and most seem to be having a blast with the whole nightwave thing. 

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3 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

I figure that most people just try to have fun playing the game. Because if that's not the goal of the game, something is probably going wrong. 

If getting one specific thing is the entire goal you set for yourself, then you will probably end up just burning yourself out for no good reason, spending real money to get a single thing, and hating the game because of stuff you irrationally made yourself do...... Hmmm that would explain so much about the stuff some folks are posting on this thread. 

 I've chatted with players in game who did the challenges with me, and most seem to be having a blast with the whole nightwave thing. 

Anecdotally, most people Ive talked to, while we were grinding out game modes wed rather be playing, hated it.

I am here to play a grindfest game to get loot, and yes to collect a ton of stuff. Nightwave offers things I cant get otherwise, and I cant get by playing game modes I enjoy, selling the rewards for plat, and then purchasing the rewards, so yes, it does -make- me do it, if I want to participate in literally the point of the game.

Unfortunately, NW pushes a time limit that I dont want to adhere to, with tasks that arent actually a challenge, nor are many of them fun.

Its not wrong that you enjoy it, but it absolutely turns people off. So far I have witheld about $100ish in purchases since NW was released, and have stopped playing for the moment. Playing the way I liked to has not burned me out. Nightwave did by week 2.

I hope the weekly chore system/battle pass is changed, because its a flip from what WF has always been, which is a grindfest you could do at your own time.

Edited by simplygnome
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4 hours ago, simplygnome said:

Anecdotally, most people Ive talked to, while we were grinding out game modes wed rather be playing, hated it.

I am here to play a grindfest game to get loot, and yes to collect a ton of stuff. Nightwave offers things I cant get otherwise, and I cant get by playing game modes I enjoy, selling the rewards for plat, and then purchasing the rewards, so yes, it does -make- me do it, if I want to participate in literally the point of the game.

Unfortunately, NW pushes a time limit that I dont want to adhere to, with tasks that arent actually a challenge, nor are many of them fun.

Its not wrong that you enjoy it, but it absolutely turns people off. So far I have witheld about $100ish in purchases since NW was released, and have stopped playing for the moment. Playing the way I liked to has not burned me out. Nightwave did by week 2.

I hope the weekly chore system/battle pass is changed, because its a flip from what WF has always been, which is a grindfest you could do at your own time.

I really think it's more of a split. In Mogamu's latest interview with the devs, they said that they do see both sides. People who love the system and people who think it's a chore. Me personally, I love this system and I really don't think the answer would be to change the system entirely because I believe they have something special here. They just have to tweak some missions and get rid of the rather silly challenges like inventory checks and friend-gating.

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I guess you would call me an 'endurance player', but I mainly keep trying new things and testing them out. Anyway, I have to say I dislike the daily and weekly challenge aspects of Nightwave the most. I don't want to feel like I need to log on, the best thing about this game was that I wanted to log on, unlike all the other games that try to force your participation by putting out a ton of time limited stuff. I would highly suggest getting rid of this aspect of Nightwave. I enjoy the story, Lady Lips, the random encounters in missions, I just hate the constant rotation of challenges. The best thing about alerts in hindsight was that they could happen any time, and thus removed that feeling of having to grind away for things that are probably rarer than they need to be, like catalysts and reactors. On the positive side, I do like doing the elite challenges, but like i said, this enjoyment is somewhat lessened due to the time constraints. A more permanent longer list of challenges might make this better, something that doesn't roll out every week and you can get to when you have time to play/ want to play.

 

Now let's talk about rewards. I miss alerts because they were random, which prevented me from feeling compelled to grab everything possible. I just went for what was up while I was on, and I was happy enough. They also created this fun team aspect where clans would look out for one another and post about good alerts. There was definitely an issue with things only showing up in the middle of the night and so on, but it prevented obsessive gamer behaviors Nightwave reinforces. The cred store is kinda bad the way it is right now in Nightwave. If the challenge stays the same, players should be earning a reliable amount of nitain extract and choose between either a catalyst or reactor, without having to spend creds. The creds would be fine for extra nitain, reactors, catalysts, exilus adapters, but primarily a small amount of those things should be given for doing all the weekly challenges, and then allow players to shop with their creds for cosmetics, more potatoes, or whatever they are seeking personally. Bottom line, it's not rewarding enough and people like me are just interested in the unique items at the end of rainbow like the armor set and umbra forma for the most part.  

 

I hope someone at DE reads this and it is helpful. I have noticed I want to play less since Nightwave dropped, because I don't like the feeling of the game now when I get in. It's not about what I want to do anymore, it's sortie, then check nightwave, help clan members with nightwave, maybe do one mission I actually wanted to do, sign off.

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I don't like Nora herself.  She's pretentious and with a certain political slant that the game is getting a little heavy with.   Her existence is fine,  it's just a little objectionable to have it mandatory and integrated into the core framework. 

 

It would be nice if Nightwave presentation / narrator / voices were handled by Syndicates.   The syndicate you have the most standing with voices your nightwave, or you just choose one in settings.   Nora can still do the episodes.   Each syndicate having their own flair.    The objectives don't have to change at all, just the presenter changes.

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11 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

I figure that most people just try to have fun playing the game. Because if that's not the goal of the game, something is probably going wrong. 

If getting one specific thing is the entire goal you set for yourself, then you will probably end up just burning yourself out for no good reason, spending real money to get a single thing, and hating the game because of stuff you irrationally made yourself do...... Hmmm that would explain so much about the stuff some folks are posting on this thread. 

I've chatted with players in game who did the challenges with me, and most seem to be having a blast with the whole nightwave thing. 

And I haven't met a single person in-game who actually liked it.

Grinding in a lootgrind game should be the fun. Usually, it is. Nightwave, though, is just TACOs all over again; something that could be fun if taken at your own pace, turned into a job just to get you to keep logging in so someone in marketing can go "look, we increased this number that correlates somewhat with that number so we're doing the good!"

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