Bring back Alerts

[(PSN)AbioticViper]

No, just no.

New system is way better.

Alerts were pure RGN S#&$show. I can't define how happy I am there gone. 

[xXIcyBladeXx]

I sure do miss those rubedo and credit alerts...Let us remember the old days.

[Chappie]

22 minutes ago, Catastor said:

why not both ? and alert rng was like that by design so its totally DE fault .

nightwave system is was more crappy and force you to do things you never ever wanted to comeback and grind your ass off for a reward you used to get in 5mn in alert even with all the alert system flaws.

alert and nightwave are not the same thing so why should one replace the other, they could coexist in harmony but DE want you to spend more time for less rewards so they took it out.

theres many ways to rework and expand on the alert system but why spend assets and time on that when you can do that on new Syndicate time wall instead .

Wait.  You want the old alert system back but you said the alert system was broken because it is DE's fault?  So you want a broken system?

Nightwave is the new system going forward.  PERIOD.  No amount of complaining or whining is going to change that.   So you have two choices: "help make the new nightwave system" or "post on the internet of how you want the olden better days back through your rose colored glasses".

Change is inevitable...growth is optional.  

Edited March 20, 2019 by Chappie1975

[(PSN)Double991]

If they could have alerts alongside Nightwave then can I have the old void keys alongside relics?

[Shaderox]

Well im fine without the old alerts, BUT having having both and incorporating alerts in nightwave would be my chosen way of doing it.

Having alerts reward standing, wolf creds or one of the rarer resources from the game. (i know id want some oxium or plastids alterts now and then, the problem i had with resource alerts in the old system was that a slow defense alert and a quick capture alert rewarded the same amount).

 

[Pinegulf]

Missing Nightmare alerts... I hope NightWave to incorporate these somehow. (Don't see any easy way)

[Test-995]

1 hour ago, (PS4)Double991 said:

If they could have alerts alongside Nightwave then can I have the old void keys alongside relics?

tbh it would actually be fun, +1 for this.

[Knight_Ex]

No idea what OP is on about, I see alerts every 40 min on my menu, arbitrations are fun 🙂

[Oreades]

6 hours ago, Test-995 said:

 

because both is better.

Technically we kind of have both. Since Invasions still have Forma, Reactors, Catalysts and Exilus in their potential drop pool. 

[(XBOX)Papa Requiem]

6 hours ago, flabyspartan228 said:

can we please bring back more alerts 

No thanks. Nightwave is better.

[Marine027]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb Catastor:

nice logic there .

one of the main reason why people did raids even with all the bugs and connections problems was for the arcanes, so instead of fixing raids or leaving them as is and adding something new to drop from the Eidolon they said fuk it and gone full lazy mode.

and raid didnt even have a gamebreaking bugs, the main problem was connections and scrubs .

 

Can't disagree there sadly, i just say that that was the official reason, they said they bring it back but, i doubt it also, sadly in my eyes Warframe starts to go down a bad path.

Edited March 20, 2019 by Marine027

[Teljaxx]

7 hours ago, Ver1dian said:

I gave you as obvious a reason as any why they cant coexist without changing the entire cred store. It's very one dimensional to think DE can just keep adding whatever they feel like it.

And these forums are general, as mentioned too many times, NOT for feedback.

If nightwave is a problem for anyone, there's a simple solution "git gud".

 

Alerts were nothing more than a noob trap with a horrible timing mechanic, with helmets of debatable quality, Mr fodder swords and a frame, random low amounts of resources and the once in a blue moon potato, the only needed thing were the Auras (all two of them -CP and SC). Oh... and let's not forget the Nitain, which from the community reaction seems to be a requirement for every single item in the game. Honestly, has anyone ever needed more than 15 at any given time?

 

Speaking of one dimensional thinking, it seems like everyone against bringing back alerts is assuming that the only possible way to do so is exactly as they were. Of course there would need to be some modifications for it to work out. Alerts weren't perfect, and could have used some improvements anyway. But I really do not think that they were bad enough to warrant complete removal.

First: Most of the rare alert rewards are already in Nightwave, so those would be gone from alerts. Second: If the credit and resource rewards were not enough to be worthwhile, why not increase them? Third: Rewards should actually scale properly with the level and mission type of the alert. As for Nitain: I think having a smaller and cheaper bundle, like 5, in the Cred shop, while also having it in alerts would be best. That way, you can get a slow stream of it from alerts, and buy any extra if you need it, instead of just having to choose between it and something more permanent in the shop.

Also, I don't seem to remember ever getting inventory slots from alerts. And the main potato alerts, the Gift From the Lotus ones, are still around, so that apparently isn't an issue. I am also not sure how having an easy way to get early game items and extra resources was a "noob trap". If anything, alerts were far more newbie friendly than Nightwave currently is. Just because you don't like the helmets, and moved beyond low tier weapons doesn't mean that everyone else did.

And I don't thing getting good (sorry, "gud") will help with the fact that Nightwave is about as engaging as watching grass grow. But that is a discussion for another thread.

[Veridian]

1 hour ago, Teljaxx said:

Speaking of one dimensional thinking, it seems like everyone against bringing back alerts is assuming that the only possible way to do so is exactly as they were. Of course there would need to be some modifications for it to work out. Alerts weren't perfect, and could have used some improvements anyway. But I really do not think that they were bad enough to warrant complete removal.

First: Most of the rare alert rewards are already in Nightwave, so those would be gone from alerts. Second: If the credit and resource rewards were not enough to be worthwhile, why not increase them? Third: Rewards should actually scale properly with the level and mission type of the alert. As for Nitain: I think having a smaller and cheaper bundle, like 5, in the Cred shop, while also having it in alerts would be best. That way, you can get a slow stream of it from alerts, and buy any extra if you need it, instead of just having to choose between it and something more permanent in the shop.

Also, I don't seem to remember ever getting inventory slots from alerts. And the main potato alerts, the Gift From the Lotus ones, are still around, so that apparently isn't an issue. I am also not sure how having an easy way to get early game items and extra resources was a "noob trap". If anything, alerts were far more newbie friendly than Nightwave currently is. Just because you don't like the helmets, and moved beyond low tier weapons doesn't mean that everyone else did.

And I don't thing getting good (sorry, "gud") will help with the fact that Nightwave is about as engaging as watching grass grow. But that is a discussion for another thread.

But they were that bad. Up untill Dday any meniton of alerts was just to point out that nobody does them and that they're bad.

You also can't randomly throw numbers all the time. 

Nitain is suposed to be a rare resource. This removes that aspect. For no reason than simpy cuz

I guess I have to explain it letter by letter.

Granting rewards such as guaranteed forma, potatos, slots...etc. is a straight reduction in plat consumption. However you scew it, wether DE can manage it or not is irrelevant. Thus the helmets, auras and nitain are harder to get in order to balance it all. Added that the overall usefulness of rewards has increased it's an adequate trade off.

Alerts were a noob trap, because they gave less that it would apear. There is only one piece of equipment from alerts that any competent players use and that's the jaw sword for a chese Gara/Khora build. The resources were a joke. Credits? Alerts derailed new players from the propper progression path with sub par rewards that at start looked enticing.

 

And don't get started about how engaging nighwave is, because if you're trying to convince anyone that a lvl 5 exterminate or a defection were engaging....

Edited March 20, 2019 by Ver1dian

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

People have already brought up most of the salient points, but just in case there is some misunderstanding that this is all just opinion, here we go:
(my posts generally get buried and ignored in threads)

Is Nightwave all that great?

Supposedly, Nightwave replaced the Alert system to eliminate the "snooze, you lose" problem when alerts would pop up when people were at work or away from the game for any reason. Instead, you get to work toward rewards on your own time. Great in concept!... except, that's not how it was implemented. They added a much larger "snooze, you lose" issue with the entire event due to the time-limited nature, and limited amount of tasks you can do per week, along with the nature of those tasks being out of reach of some people. (arguably losing out on things of much higher rarity than the things offered by Alerts that would eventually pop up again and most had alternate methods of obtaining - unlike the event-exclusive cosmetics and Umbra Forma - even if other methods are introduced in some vague future possibility.)

Now, If you don't play enough each week (or you go on vacation, or can't access the game, or you play other games instead, or aren't far enough in Warframe's story), you miss out on the event's important (exclusive) rewards. You could waste 8 weeks of effort, if you didn't do all the "elite challenges", or skipped the tasks you couldn't do or didn't want to bother with (as most people say you can) if you miss the last 2 weeks and your goal was the last 3 tiers of rewards, not caring about anything else offered, for instance... that's a "snooze, you 'megalose'" as I've said in a previous post.

If you start too late (how late is "too late" is still unknown due to not knowing the end date and full potential standing available, or how common fugitives will become as they become "more frequent" as the event progresses), invited to the game by a friend or just starting out on your own, or returning after a break -- you don't stand a chance of benefiting from the event -- in a meaningful way (I know this point will be nit-picked by people whiteknighting the system, but I stand by that assessment of their potential situation, depending on when they join during a given Nightwave's season.)

For those who don't want to lose (missing out on exclusive rewards) but have very limited play time, they have to decide between having fun accomplishing their own goals, or completing the Nightwave todo checklist before considering anything else. This limits many players who have posted on these boards.

The only thing Nightwave did in replacing Alerts, was steal part of the Alert system's reward table, and threw the rest away. There are no more random ninja contracts being offered as situations arise in the living world. You don't get to just complete a contract and get paid anymore. If we weren't around for alerts, similar missions with similar rewards would eventually pop up again later, no pressure - no longer the case. You could leave the game for whatever reason, and come back months later, and jump right back into random alerts... now, no, you have to play every week, every day, and fulfill their sometimes masochistic tasks, to work for your rewards (and you still might have just come back at the wrong time, and can't earn enough in your amount of playtime to even earn the lowest rewards - yes, this will happen to people.)

Now, everyone is given a checklist of tasks to complete (having no relation to the story at hand, given what we know so far), during a limited time, with all your work poofing into thin air if you don't get to certain milestones (for the standing rank rewards that matter to you) or just don't spend the event-exclusive timed currency of Wolf-Creds it in the shop with a rotating stock from the old Alert tables (plus a few new things, they say) that might not contain what you're really after at any given week - when you have wolf-cred to spare - so you could miss out, even if you earn those creds.

You're no longer doing quick missions to get paid; now you're grinding out standing. If you can't complete some tasks because they're locked behind content you don't have access to yet, or simply don't want to participate in the task required, you must randomly stumble into fugitives and capture them for a dribble of standing.

From my experience with the system, its implementation contradicts the stated purpose of the event. Either they lost sight of their initial goal during production, or the goal of the system is not the stated goal they presented. If they wanted to make it easier for people with busy schedules to get the rewards previously offered by random alerts, they failed for many people in many types of circumstances who cannot play regularly every week, every day, and complete most of the Acts. It could just be a ploy to increase player retention over a longer duration than immediately after the launch of new content. Maybe they wanted to get rid of the easy to use alert system and increase the grind for the items they used to provide while also bumping up player numbers each day/week/etc for reports. I can't say. The Optimist in me is assuming they meant what they said, and weren't trying to be malicious/manipulative like that. If they meant what they said, changes need to be made.

The day-to-day impact of this system is detrimental to the "fun" and long-term retention of players, IMO. (Especially if these Nightwave series' will be back to back to back, filling the Alert activity gap) It leads to burnout. Instead of enticing people back to have fun, they're heavy-handedly saying, "play or else." (and it's not play your way or else, it's do these specific things, or else.)

 

Regardless of their intent, these changes need to be made, IMO:

Alerts need to come back, modified, at the very least - Higher credit rewards for credit-only alerts and longer windows of opportunity (at least 3hrs each). I'd bring back their entire loot table, simply letting Nightwave compliment it, giving people who aren't on for alerts a method of progressively working toward certain substantial rewards (Vauban, Nitain, Reactors/Catalysts, Cosmetics). Nightwave simply did not replace the function of Alerts, they only share "loot tables." As a newbie, I relied on Alerts for a ton of resources. I still want them for the rarer resources like Oxium and Tellurium, as well as the missing Kubrow Eggs (much more humane way of getting them, than killing the digital wild animals that are just protecting their dens) and Kavat genetic Codes (that are a pain, even with double scans).

IF they want to merge the alert system with the Nightwave system, they could reward 1 wolf-cred (or current series equivalent) per alert, and some standing (along with the random alert reward table.) Alerts could always involve fugitives or the Wolf himself (or the current series' themed encounters). This way, we're given a "heads up" that the Wolf and his lackeys are doing something that we need to stop (exterminate, sabotage), or find info to track them down (spy), etc. They fully integrate with the story, and thus, have meaning to accomplish them. Successful completion of an alert could spawn another alert, in chains that lead to a fight with the Wolf, after like, maybe 3 in a row - like Invasions. Completely skippable, always there from the first alert you do. No pressure.

(BTW, I want to know why we're hunting down Grineer Fugitives... I'd expect them to be people we'd want to HELP, not hunt down like we're parole officers. Anything that hurts the Grineer hierarchy sounds like a good plan to me. Grineer "Criminals" sound like our allies... that's all I'm saying.)

If they don't want people to fall into a 'snooze, you lose' trap in Nightwave, like they did in Alerts, they need to modify the event: Eliminate Nightwave's "Snooze, you lose"
* No time limit on progress
Keep standing and wolf-cred after current series ends, similar to the Operation standing for Plaguestar: hold over until the series returns (will they "return?") AND/OR convert the Nightwave series' into the quest system, allowing you to set your active series, along with its themed encounters. The current week's tasks would be the same regardless of series currently selected, to keep all players "on the same page" regarding tasks and coordinating to complete them.

* Increase pool of available tasks each week, at least double, if not triple, with a wide variety (I don't know the entire selection of tasks that can show up, but I'd limit the number of "friends" tasks, "endgame" tasks, etc, available at any one time) while keeping the limit you can complete (even this point could be debated, letting people earn more standing when they have time, like weekend warriors, or before/after a vacation.) I figure the fear here is that people won't team up for the harder tasks, just skipping them all, and nobody will be able to find help for them. To that, I say, Why do these have to be masochistic "challenges" like cracking rivens? It's supposed to be replacing Alerts! My imagination doesn't stretch far enough to see how those two things fit together.

Honestly, it feels like the Acts are just Playstation Trophy challenges that change every week... and I don't go for those on purpose, for a reason. It's not fun.

With this change, even problematic tasks like "1 hour kuva survival (with a friend)" could remain for people who like that, as long as solo players who don't like survival missions can choose to do something else. Even tasks that are "Inventory checks", like filling Ayatan statues with stars, or using forma (I plan, using these carefully, not just throwing 3 around randomly to fulfill a task), or gilding stuff (what about people that already built all the ones they want, now they have to waste precious, not-easily-come-by materials for a task?), could remain, if players can choose to do them or not, if it fits how they're playing at the time and their goals. (Inventory Checks actively discourage interacting with those objectives until they are Nightwave tasks, otherwise, you're wasting time and resources until you do it when you'll be rewarded for it. They even become Plat-checks if you don't have the slot to build a new weapon/robotic/amp to gild. I know I've stopped filling statues, and I'm not making any more modular items unless it's a Nightwave task)* (and/or) Weekly tasks could appear weekly, but remain for the duration of the event, daily tasks would appear daily, and remain longer than 3 days...), to better match a player's goals and what they find fun, and function as a catch-up feature.

If the Acts were categorized, like Nora already did prior to the launch: Defiance, Generosity, Sacrifice, it might give more flavor and reason to the actions we're doing. (If the Alert Chains are grouped like this, even better.) These could be unrelated to the current Nightwave series theme, as the overall concept of doing good for the Origin System and being rewarded (no good deed will go unrewarded.) and they'd still fit lore-wise, since it's under the Nightwave umbrella.

 

* Cred Shop - no rotation. Rotation in this shop also created "snooze, you lose" if you don't have the cred during the week when the item you want appears.

* I'd also front-load Nightwave's rank up rewards with Wolf-Creds, and/or reward creds for Acts and fugitive captures so the system benefits newbies who need the wolf-cred store offerings more than anything else (newbies don't really need glyphs and sigils, for instance). I'd also offer a single Nitain for creds, and some chunks of Credits for 1-5 Wolf-creds, (so people can spend all their creds, and not be left with "extra" that aren't enough for a single purchase at the end of the event) - also replacing one of the Alert rewards that this event replaced without replacing.

 

With these changes, "Snooze, you lose" is eliminated, and the new issues dividing the community (casuals vs hardcore, group vs solo, endurance vs bite-sized) are addressed as well, as far as this concept is concerned. There's no removal here, just addition of options.

 

(I also posted a similar concept as far back as page 19 of the official feedback thread, on March 8th, if curious, link here.)

[(NSW)Agent-10]

Nightwave-based alerts, where it includes the previous alert system, but ran by Nora would be pretty great.

The only real problem with the former system was that it had unrewarding popups that didn't scale real well. The 300 oxium drops were pretty cool though. Would be nice to spend wolf credits on resource bundles like that eventually.

Speaking of wolf credits, I think it would be good for newer players if these credits dropped more frequently via these old alerts and when leveling up. A single weapon blueprint costs 50 wolf creds alone which is ridiculously expensive. That's a whole cred drop! With the old system, I was at least able to get seven BP's a week.

[Highlord83]

11 hours ago, Shalath said:

Why? Nightwave is superior to RNG deciding you can't have that reward because you are at work or sleeping.

Instead it locks things people might actually find useful behind a massive grind wall, puts it all on some stupid timer, and completely skews what otherwise might have been something interesting into nothing but a giant appeasement engine for the all-day grinders and basement dwellers.

[Teljaxx]

14 minutes ago, Ver1dian said:

But they were that bad. Up untill Dday any meniton of alerts was just to point out that nobody does them and that they're bad.

You also can't randomly throw numbers all the time. 

Nitain is suposed to be a rare resource. This removes that aspect. For no reason than simpy cuz

I guess I have to explain it letter by letter.

Granting rewards such as guaranteed forma, potatos, slots...etc. is a straight reduction in plat consumption. However you scew it, wether DE can manage it or not is irrelevant. Thus the helmets, auras and nitain are harder to get in order to balance it all. Added that the overall usefulness of rewards has increased it's an adequate trade off.

Alerts were a noob trap, because they gave less that it would apear. There is only one piece of equipment from alerts that any competent players use and that's the jaw sword for a chese Gara/Khora build. The resources were a joke. Credits? Alerts derailed new players from the propper progression path with sub par rewards that at start looked enticing.

 

And don't get started about how engaging nighwave is, because if you're trying to convince anyone that a lvl 5 exterminate or a defection were engaging....

Most of the players that did not play alerts did not think the rewards were worthwhile. I have explained how to fix that, even though you seem to be ignoring it. You are also still only looking at this from your point of view. If its not a problem for you, then it can't possibly be a problem for anyone else, can it?

Also, I am not throwing around random numbers, I have done math. Like this:

According to the Wiki, you currently need over 160 Nitain to obtain everything that requires it. That means, at 5 nitain for 15 Creds, you need to spend at least 480 Wolf Creds to get that much from the shop. So unless you can get quite a ways past rank 30, it is impossible to get enough nitain in a single season to build everything. This does not seem fair. At all. If nitain was the only thing to spend Creds on, then maybe it would be okay. But it also means that you would have to skip out on everything else. Alerts never forced you sacrifice one reward for another, the way the Cred shop does. This number is also guaranteed to increase over time, since DE is always adding new things that need nitain.

For some reason you are still assuming that potatoes and forma would still be part of the regular alert rotation. You are apparently arguing against yourself here, because I specifically said that all the rare alert rewards have been moved to Nightwave, so they wouldn't show up in regular alerts anymore.

Doing any mission, even a super low level one, is certainly more engaging than bullet jumping 150 times, or using an emote. Because then you are actually playing the game, not doing some little chore. Plus, once you are done with the mission, you get your reward, guaranteed. But how many challenges do you have to do to get the next rank in Nightwave? What if the next reward you actually want is several ranks away? With alerts, you could safely skip any of them you didn't care about, and lose nothing while waiting for one that you did want. But with Nightwave, you can't skip anything without skipping everything.

Derailing new players? If anything, alerts helped guide new players through the star chart. When you saw an alert with something that you wanted that was only two nodes away, it gave great incentive to do those nodes and get to the alert.

And once again, this is not just about "competent" players, or what you think is worthwhile. This is not a competitive game. Not everyone uses nothing but meta builds. Not everyone simply makes a beeline dash for the very best gear ASAP. There are many weapons in this game that are far from the best, but still worth getting. Besides, these items are mostly intended for new players that cannot even use the high MR weapons yet. You are acting like DE was trying to trick new players into thinking that the Plasma Sword was the best weapon in the game or something. If anything, having these weapons as Cred options is more of a trick, Because you only get so many Creds per season, o if you waste some of them on a sword you end up simply leveling and tossing, you cannot get as much other stuff that would have been more useful. Like that all important nitain.

[Creegz]

11 hours ago, Shalath said:

Why? Nightwave is superior to RNG deciding you can't have that reward because you are at work or sleeping.

This. So much this.

[(PSN)AyinDygra]

 

5 hours ago, Creegz said:

17 hours ago, Shalath said:

Why? Nightwave is superior to RNG deciding you can't have that reward because you are at work or sleeping.

This. So much this. 

Except Nightwave expects some of the people with busy schedules who would have benefited from progressively working toward a goal over time, on their own schedules, to devote all their time to Nightwave now, instead of catching that rare alert, playing it quickly and getting that reward. Some people can't play Warframe for fun anymore, just having enough time to work at their new Warframe job/task list/chores.

It might not be that extreme for most people, but it adds that same feeling that the tasks are chores to do, rather than having fun doing their own thing.

Nightwave goes a step further, though, and actively discourages engaging in some content, in the fear that in future weeks, it will be a required task, so don't dare go wasting resources on something you want to do now, no, wait for Nightwave to require it of you. (socketing Ayatan statues, Gilding Modular weapons, using Forma)

 

Nightwave is not a good replacement for Alerts OR superior to Alerts - It's a good supplement to Alerts.

With my suggestions above:
If you're online when an alert pops up, good for you! BONUS. If you don't catch any of the alerts, earn wolf-creds and buy the stuff from the cred shop in Nightwave.

Now, we'd have both an active star chart with Alerts, and progressive goals over time when RNG does not favor us.

It's that simple.

[Creegz]

I see your point, and I definitely agree that having both wouldn't be terrible, and not doing things because you think they might be a requirement for the coming weeks. I can understand that. I did a forma on something a week before Nightwave required it. That said I also don't mind spending a few standing to burn forma. The nice thing is that it sorta leads you to seeing more content. I would never have spent the time I did fishing and creating a Zaw at this time, same for capturing animals on Orb Vallis. I would not have bothered with syndicates or been as adamant about playing sorties. While I feel some challenges get locked out by content, one of my friends could only do half of last weeks because of how far he had progressed to this point which was unfortunate, and this week I legitimately cannot complete because I cannot access Profit Taker at this time. If I was aware of the profit taker challenge last week I would have easily been able to get into it. With that I still feel this is better than alerts for me since for the most part these have been very easy to complete in about 3 hours total. Only thing you must do is do the "dailies" every couple days before they expire. I logged in and did 2 of 3 I had backlogged AND some weeklies.

The thing I feel Nightwave tackles is the lack of direction for newer users. I've learned more about what combinations make what types of damage, what they do, and what different types of things are available to do for me at this time. I've figured out mission types and how to get into them/handle them whereas before I just followed my high level friends into whatever they were doing and still had fun.

Edited March 21, 2019 by Creegz

[Shadow-Spawn]

DE should bring back the quick alert system that was successful for 6 years in combination with the nightwave system.

Nightwave is not newbie friendly at all - its acts are no fun to do - there is no button to turn off all the pop-up's and rambling by nightwave Nora.

[Teljaxx]

2 hours ago, Shadow-Spawn said:

DE should bring back the quick alert system that was successful for 6 years in combination with the nightwave system.

Nightwave is not newbie friendly at all - its acts are no fun to do - there is no button to turn off all the pop-up's and rambling by nightwave Nora.

This is why I really just cannot understand why alerts were removed. They were fine for six years, but then suddenly they were such a horrible problem that the only solution was to remove them? Why didn't they even try to fix them at all?

The only thing that I can think of is something I have noticed lately. DE seems to be spending more time going back and messing with things that do not need messing with. There have been many little changes here and there, and even more that they discussed, but never seemed to happen. And they all "improve" things that were in no way in need of improvement. It makes me think that since the devs are intimately familiar with the game, the have gotten bored with it always being the same, and assume the players are too. And a lot of the time, they don't actually improve anything, they just make it different. Because then it is new, and they are no longer bored.

So they tossed alerts and brought in Nightwave, just because it is something completely new. And new is always better, no matter what.

I  am probably getting a bit too conspiracy theorist here. But I have seen this happen before, and it can be really bad for the game if it goes too far. This is a big part of what killed my previous favorite F2P game, Hawken.

[Shalath]

11 hours ago, Highlord83 said:

Instead it locks things people might actually find useful behind a massive grind wall, puts it all on some stupid timer, and completely skews what otherwise might have been something interesting into nothing but a giant appeasement engine for the all-day grinders and basement dwellers.

You do know that you don't have to complete every challenge right? I play solo so I'm mostly locked out of the friend/clan challenges and I hate spy/rescue missions so I ignore those too along with sorties and Tridolons for the most part. I'm currently rank 8 or 9 and I have achieved that by mostly ignoring Nightwave. I'll generally have a look to see if there is a challenge I fancy but other than that I mostly just play the way I always have. I will usually do the daily but mostly because I just have to take a different weapon for a mission or two so I have the correct damage type.

Steve said that you would only need to complete about 60% of the challenges to hit top rank (not sure if that counts the free points from the guys that show up in missions) and so far about half of those challenges have been things you would have been doing in-game anyway. Given that I'm about a third of the way up the tiers after 2 weeks having paid very little attention to NW (and I only play about an hour on week days so hardly an all day grinder or basement dweller) I would actually be surprised if you didn't hit top rank within 10 weeks if you pretended NW didn't exist.

Another example I posted in another NW thread: I spent literally months tying to get the Vauban Neuroptics as the alert only showed up when I was at work or asleep (yes, I was using the app for the alert notifications). I got sick of waiting and dropped some plat on a Vauban Prime set and actually collected the Nitain/Cryotic/Oxium (after the capture nerf killed Galatea) needed to build it before I finally got the vanilla neuroptics. With NW I would probably have had the full vanilla set in 2 weeks.

I don't think NW is perfect and think DE need to adjust how quickly you get the wolf creds as I think they are too spaced out in the tiers. They definitely need to roll the resources and credit rewards in as NW doesn't have a replacement for those alerts but it is definitely an improvement to the old system that was pure RNG. I see so many threads complaining about things locked behind pure RNG and yet when DE removes one of the biggest offenders people complain? I don't get it...

[PaseLeo]

Nigthwave cant give resource like Oxium, we have to go farm ourself.

Unless they put resource can be trade using Wolf Cred also, else please added back Alert for Resource back.

[Nyx219]

Listen people.

If we can have:

 

Invasions

Syndicates

Relics

Sorties

Arbitrations

as reward systems that shell out rewards alongside NW, then we can have Old Alerts along side NW living Happily Ever After, too. Invasions in particular could be considered double-dipping the NW catalysts and reactors, so the half-baked "risk of double-dipping" argument is already invalid.

 

Why are you people taking the notion so personally? Bringing Old Alerts back isn't demanding killing off NW, it's demanding bringing back a system that worked for a bleep of a lot of people, as evidenced by the colossal amount of feedback saying as much all over the forum. So you didn't like Old Alerts. Big dang deal. I'm going to say what you say, reworded : Then don't play them, nobody's holding a weapon to your temple making you. Are they?

 

And you say people advocating for the return of a long-standing working system are the crybabies? Nobody's even ASKING to take NW away from you, you're having tantrums because not enough people are groveling to DE for your liking. Suck it up, buttercups. We can be happy with a variety of reward systems to please everyone, we've already got several doing exactly that. I don't do Arbitrations, and I really dislike invasions being done in triplicate, so I don't do them. I do like my Syndicate & Relic runs and the occasional Sortie if it's interesting enough, those I do just fine. What I don't do is sit there and ask for a reward system other people like be removed just because I think it sucks. That's what you've done and the ensuing fear of it being done to you is all in YOUR heads, not ours.