Marine027 Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 (edited) vor 1 Stunde schrieb SneakyErvin: Not all frames are suited for every type of enemy or mission. THIS. This sums the game up as it is, same way certain weapons simply not work well against certain enemys. If people want that kind of balance we would onyl have like 10 warframes at most and all of them to simlair to each to work against all factions. Edited March 22, 2019 by Marine027 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
den2k Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, CoreXCZ said: If you want to fare well against infested, take Rhino with his Iron Skin Huge numbers of enemies huddled together, when I use the 1-2 combo I can get insane armor multipliers (100k and more extra HP). Rhino is definitely the best frame against Infested, followed by Nezha (his Warding Halo slices and dices throught the huddling chargers and it can almost stunlock them). Hildryn is just easy beacuse you need exactly 0 abilites to tank like there's no tomorrow, but of course she is no Rhino. 4 minutes ago, Marine027 said: If people want that kind of blance we would onyl have like 10 warframes at msot and al lof them to simlair to each to work agiasnt all facitons. Precisely. For example against Grineer and Corpus Zephyr is mostly invulnerable but only a fool would take her to an Infested mission. Edited March 22, 2019 by den2k 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NEon0218 Posted March 22, 2019 Author Share Posted March 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, den2k said: exactly 0 abilites to tank like there's no tomorrow without her abilities she cant get shields to tank so your wrong Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaStorms Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 23 minutes ago, NEon0218 said: not upset just dont like being unable to prevent the damage done that u can do with every other frame That is the way her weakness is pronounced. Her other weakness is that she *always* has quick thinking. Her shields are her energy bar, hence she's always in a state of 'quick thinking' to anything that doesn't bypass it. It's her weakness, and I think it is intentional. She doesn't have the same benefits as other caster frames due to her casting being intertwined with her survivability. Doing well lets you survive more easily by rewarding you with more health, doing poorly results in you wasting health and dying faster. Flow also doesn't work on Hildyrn. That doesn't matter because that is her drawback. Energy related mechanics do not apply to her as much as other Warframes. Deal with that flaw, and get a Warframe that can handle the problems you have with her. She is not designed to be good against infested because they bypass her 'quick thinking' 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrBorris Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 (edited) I am just going to pretend I did not read the poo show of a discussion and go straight to a proposed solution. Have Shield Pillage be based on enemy count and not enemy resources. And if DE is hell bent on having Shield Pillage "scale", then have it be based on enemy health. Also the LoS restriction feels unnecessary, it makes sense for Haven to be LoS, but Shield Pillage? Nah. Edited March 22, 2019 by DrBorris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeltaStorms Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 4 minutes ago, DrBorris said: I am just going to pretend I did not read the poo show of a discussion and go straight to a proposed solution. Have Shield Pillage be based on enemy count and not enemy resources. And if DE is hell bent on having Shield Pillage "scale", then have it be based on enemy health. Also the LoS restriction feels unnecessary, it makes sense for Haven to be LoS, but Shield Pillage? Nah. A solution to a problem that is an intended weakness? No? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vox_Preliator Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 Er, are you sure you don't mean "Mostly everyone vs toxic ancients"? Because their roar/breath/whatever attack does crazy damage at higher levels, most frames without serious damage reduction or invulnerability will suffer the exact same fate if they get caught by it. Hildryn not being able to twiddle her thumbs around high-priority targets isn't really an issue, maybe there being targets whose heaviest hits have very little telegraphing is an issue, but Hildryn in particular doesn't have an issue with them. 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyErvin Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 2 hours ago, NEon0218 said: not upset just dont like being unable to prevent the damage done that u can do with every other frame All other frames suffer the same as Hildryn though. No frame except a handful can actually ignore that hit from Toxic Ancients without a proper HP pool. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringerLighted Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 hace 3 horas, Vox_Preliator dijo: Er, are you sure you don't mean "Mostly everyone vs toxic ancients"? Because their roar/breath/whatever attack does crazy damage at higher levels, most frames without serious damage reduction or invulnerability will suffer the exact same fate if they get caught by it. Hildryn not being able to twiddle her thumbs around high-priority targets isn't really an issue, maybe there being targets whose heaviest hits have very little telegraphing is an issue, but Hildryn in particular doesn't have an issue with them. Best way to avoid this is pretty simple dont get anywhere near toxic ancients because they will send you into oblivion with pretty much any warframe at higher levels 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)obsidiancurse Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 17 hours ago, Ryusuta said: Hildryn can't use Quick Thinking for the exact same reason Inaros can't used Redirection - because she's not SUPPOSED to. It goes against the design of the character. Yes, getting one-shot by a toxic scream is a bummer. And if you want to make an argument that she should have a higher base health, by all means make THAT argument. But what you're currently asking for is for mods to do something that they're not supposed to do because of a one-shot ability from one unit of one faction. A faction that is otherwise pretty much helpless against her and any other Warframe. Doesn’t she gain shields from blue orbs? If so that’s a non argument, they already have somethings working differently just for her. personally I just wouldn’t take her to infested but I don’t see the harm in having quick thinking working on her either. Shrug Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skaleek Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 (edited) Toxic ancients have a "toxic barf" attack that they sometimes do that actually oneshots most frames because its 175% damage to tenno and it bypasses shields. It's a problem for a lot of frames besides Hildryn, yes the attack exists. No, the OP isnt wrong, hildryn suffers from it, but to be honest so do most frames. All of you people posting about "procs" are missing the entire issue. The toxic ancients have an incredibly overtuned attack that they use rarely. People making the arugment that "if you just stand there you get hit by it" arent totally wrong, the longer you stand still the higher the probability that you're going to get hit by it. But also, when you're fighting incredibly high level infested, its a CC fest, and its pretty easy to get pulled by one ancient, and barfed by a toxic ancient. Toxic ancients that barf will oneshot pretty much any frame at high level though, it's not like its a hildryn only problem. The attack itself is way crazy. All of you claiming to just "ignore the attack" are either running immense amounts of CC (which doesnt work in arbitration due to the drones), or just havent played enough to experience this attack. It's out there, i assure you. *EDIT* some people have already shared my sentiments earlier on this page, i was mostly reading page 1-3 and couldn't believe how many ignorant people were posting as if it were fact (esp the guy claiming to afk a 3 hr arb with infested, definite BS, you cant even do that after 30m sorry dude). Edited March 22, 2019 by Skaleek 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Sin of Ego Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 The way I see it, shield gate should have prevented toxin damage from getting to health while she still have shield left, and in this case it does so that need to be looked at and addressed more clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marine027 Posted March 22, 2019 Share Posted March 22, 2019 vor 3 Minuten schrieb (XB1)Cubic Clem: That's why I use quick thinking on most frames with low/er health v.v saves me every single time from them. And that's why I think it should work on her too. Bc her shields are her energy, which then should be consumed by a direct health attack (that would kill her).. I also think it's bad design to have passives/mods/features just "not work" because she's different.. make it work 🙂 Then shield mods would need ot work on Nidus and Inaros also as exampel, also consider this, if she would sue her shields fulyl for those mods as energy she would also be needed to be affected by leach eximus, which with infected often come in pairs with toxic ones, leading to probably the same quick death aswelleven with her short invulnerability. Fact is, they decided is as a weaknes on Hildryn, simple is not take her on high end infected missions, same reason you not try to kill sortie Lephantis with a a unmodded Lato. It is of course unfair and content here should not be designed for only specific frames, chroma agaisnt eidolons meta as example i not like and wish i coudl take more variety in this fight, but faction wise there are simple limits to how to engage those amount of enemies and enemy types. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epacsten Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 They could also just add a contingency to her passive, where if you take fatal damage while you still have shields and her passive is up, the passive activates and your shields are depleted. You'd still have to fully restore shields before you'd be protected again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zoffmode Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 (edited) I think it's a fair trade off. Frames have weaknesses and strengths. Hildryn doesn't really suffer from Magnetic procs, trade off she can't use quick thinking to save herself from poison. Why would you even take Hildryn vs Infested anyway. Her by far best ability Shield Pillage does nothing there. And if you're vs Corrupted or some mix and match factions, you'll have plenty of overshields anyway. edit: also you can always use Taxon with Molecular Conversion and Shield Charger... but why bother honestly Edited March 23, 2019 by zoffmode forgot taxon existed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benour Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 16 hours ago, Skaleek said: Toxic ancients have a "toxic barf" attack that they sometimes do that actually oneshots most frames because its 175% damage to tenno and it bypasses shields. It's a problem for a lot of frames besides Hildryn, yes the attack exists. No, the OP isnt wrong, hildryn suffers from it, but to be honest so do most frames. All of you people posting about "procs" are missing the entire issue. The toxic ancients have an incredibly overtuned attack that they use rarely. People making the arugment that "if you just stand there you get hit by it" arent totally wrong, the longer you stand still the higher the probability that you're going to get hit by it. But also, when you're fighting incredibly high level infested, its a CC fest, and its pretty easy to get pulled by one ancient, and barfed by a toxic ancient. Toxic ancients that barf will oneshot pretty much any frame at high level though, it's not like its a hildryn only problem. The attack itself is way crazy. All of you claiming to just "ignore the attack" are either running immense amounts of CC (which doesnt work in arbitration due to the drones), or just havent played enough to experience this attack. It's out there, i assure you. *EDIT* some people have already shared my sentiments earlier on this page, i was mostly reading page 1-3 and couldn't believe how many ignorant people were posting as if it were fact (esp the guy claiming to afk a 3 hr arb with infested, definite BS, you cant even do that after 30m sorry dude). Yes 3h arbitration and didnt die, never claimed it was afk. If you failing after 30 mins survival you are just pathetic. :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyErvin Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 This whole thing also boils down to one single thing. Refusing to cut back a few percent of strength in order to boost HP by several hundred percent in return. If you run a decently high strength build it isnt exactly hard to give up secrets for umbral vit, since you only lose 13% strength on it. It is far worth it in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skaleek Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 2 hours ago, Benour said: Yes 3h arbitration and didnt die, never claimed it was afk. If you failing after 30 mins survival you are just pathetic. :-) To be honest, survival is kind of the easy, inefficient way to do arbitration. Kinda like training wheels. But you do you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benour Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 1 hour ago, Skaleek said: To be honest, survival is kind of the easy, inefficient way to do arbitration. Kinda like training wheels. But you do you. Who cares about efficiency when you have everything and enough plat for rest of your life. Training wheels thats what you forum warriors need in actual gameplay haha. Im not the one crying/complaining about hildryn vs infested. 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skaleek Posted March 23, 2019 Share Posted March 23, 2019 1 minute ago, Benour said: Who cares about efficiency when you have everything and enough plat for rest of your life. Training wheels thats what you forum warriors need in actual gameplay haha. Im not the one crying/complaining about hildryn vs infested. 👍 Enough plat for the rest of your life eh? Wanna put a wager down and see who can last longer on hildryn? We can 2 man an arb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)thefallenloser Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 On 2019-03-22 at 9:50 AM, den2k said: Hildryn is just easy beacuse you need exactly 0 abilites to tank like there's no tomorrow, but of course she is no Rhino. On 2019-03-22 at 9:46 AM, Marine027 said: *laughs in 8000 health Inaros (Prime WHEN?)* On 2019-03-22 at 9:40 AM, CoreXCZ said: She can take advantage of Aviator (which Titania can't) She can now lul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoreXCZ Posted March 26, 2019 Share Posted March 26, 2019 2 hours ago, (PS4)ArtPrince17 said: She can now lul. Congrats, you found out later than others. We're so pround of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MawJigglePhysics Posted March 27, 2019 Share Posted March 27, 2019 On 2019-03-21 at 7:57 PM, NEon0218 said: go stand next to a toxin ancient that is a fairly high level with max shields , if it gasses you you die pretty much instantly. That goes for practically any frame. They are dangerous in that specific way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)Evilpricetag Posted March 27, 2019 Share Posted March 27, 2019 Wyrm's Samaris mod clearing one status and preventing it temporarily? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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