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Chatv71e

Duality Equinox. In deeps review.

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Eyyyy I'm back. Kinda. Maybe. I don't even know.

Anyway the old thread was archived so starting up a new one. Go check out the old one for a big info base on weapons and whatnot.

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/830927-duality-equinox-in-deeps-review/

Floowing the latest post from there let me comment

Azimbee

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Pax Bolt Arcane for kitguns gives you 30% Efficiency and 30% power strength on your next ability cast. Power Strength in particular seems to persist on toggle casts for the full duration of the toggle like Energy Conversion does. Efficiency adjusts drains live and I think it should be buffed to apply for drains as well. Power Strength would apply to your metamorphosis buffs, giving your night equinox valuable armor. You just have to make sure to get a headshot kill before form changing. Things like Provoke into Metamorph Night Form into Pacify are all affected by Pax Bolt, every step of the way, compounding the power each time if you can sneak a headshot kill between the casts. Since Rest doesn't need power strength you can cast Rest to make triggering Pax Bolt easier. I don't have it yet, but the logic should be sound.

That is a neat find, although doesn't particulary fit my personal duality playstyle as I use it as a sniper and go afk. Killing enemies to gain buffs? Too much effort. But people who use it as a battle buddy will surely benefit from this a lot!

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Energy Transfer has Synergy with Duality. This was already stated but I can't stress enough how powerful Energy Transfer is, even on its own, and how insanely busted it is with Duality. You don't need an auto turret clone with long duration feeding your Mend+Maim if your ability to change form doesn't interfere with it. I've worked with shorter duration Duality Clone, even in elite sancturary onslaught.

Energy Transfer is a decent addition to the buld, but once again, I don't like it for it takes a much needed mod slot and provies a very niche utility. Duality build doesn't have much range while specter targets units 300 meters away. On top of that, your 4 will constantly drain your energy making your Quick Thinking worse. I would add this mods in a variation of the build that uses less defensive mods when there is team to protect you. Yes it's good when you are a glass cannon.

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 Quick Thinking and Adaptation affected Duality

 Quick Thinking does affect duality, but clone has it's won energy pool. I assume it's 100 base. It can take few hits at 0 hp and survive. As for Adaptation - it gives full benefit. Not only that, but testing it out in simulacrum to see if clone takes less damage with every shot, showed up that Duality has a higher base armor than player. Presumably Duality armor scales with it's level ( Specter is lvl 30 0 all the time) so....

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I still recommend Arcane Guardian

is a very valid input.

Soulvengeance

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Got me curious what it would do with an OP Ignis Wraith, or if i can die by giving it an ogris.....

It's not OP with Ignis due to the fact that its doesn't run around spraying it and will only attack enemy it sees. It's pretty bad with it.

All weapons duality uses doesn't do self damage, so you are safe with ogris, altho ogris is bugged on her.

(PS4)pol_gomez

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Equilibrium and zenurik for gain as much energy as i can.

Speed holster to prepare the clone with the right weapon.

Some range for the others abilities.

Enemy radar to know when to use maim or sleep.

Natural talent to make the gameplay more agile and quicker.

And, of course, as much duration as I can.

I don't play with flow cause I use all the abilities as much as i can. So 225 of energy is enough almost all the time.

With this build I'm quite comfortable but I can't decide on my weapon loadout.

I have Plasmor Arca, Tigris prime, Hek V and Vectis Prime. But I don't have any riven from these. With rivens I have Lanka, Haprak, Sybaris and Cernos.

Thanks for reading me. 😉

Equilibrium is not all that useful on her, I would swap is for literally anything else.

Speed holster is generaly not neede because you have enough time to swap weapons during the cast animation because...

....Natural talent doesn't affect the speed of you 1. Only the speed of you 4. It makes it more fluid and you can keep it if you feel like it, but just for 1 ability? I'd think about it.

Hek and Vectis Prime are both decent at her. Lanka and Sybaris works too. But there are much better wepons. Check out the weapon list in the original post.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Now when we are done with comments...

A new build I'm using looks like this

unknown.png

I fully gave up on range because I was mostly using range to heal myself and team with my 4. Now when I switched frome Zenurik to Vazarin I no longer need healing. I can heal everyone with operator while ALSO making my duality clone fully invulnerable for 5 seconds. That's a lot of seconds.

To compensate for enegry regeneration loss I'm using Energy Siphon aura. It's a bit harder to maintain your energy pool high with Vazarin. Handspring is there just to make sure your clone will not be usless when knoked over, since it's the only thing that will affect it while it's invulnerable.

And now lets check out new guns. It's been a while since I reviwed those so there is a cuple new things that can be used in this build

First of all, we have a new weapon class - Archguns

Archguns can be used in any missions (besides ESO and Index). Archguns will benefit from ALL the mechnics of this build. Such as: No self damage. Infinite ammo. Auto aim. 300% more damage.

Oh yes, unlike you, Duality can't run out of ammo and doesn't need to wait 10 minutes to use gun again.You can just use Duality and never make a single shot, letting her deal with enemies.

There are few good options for arch guns that work well with the clone.

Larkspur - if I wanted to describe this gun in few words, I'd say 'amprex prime'. Everything is good about it. 40m range of a beam, bounces between enemies, hitting multiple at once, fast reload, has a little special effect of beam magnetizing to enemies, making sure that Duality doesn't miss. 100% status chance with right mods. Disadvantages are - limited range. Sometimes Duality will target enemies out of her range and will get stuck.

Grattler - another good gun. Punch through, heavy crits, good status and AOE explosions on top of that makes it a great weapon for duality. And it also does no self damage to a clone. But it also has a limited range that can mess up your clone a bit.

Imperator Vandal - is for the times when you REALLY want to turn your clone into a sentry turret. Its fast, it has a decent accuracy, but with all that fire rate it's doesn't even matter if it misses some shots. It has no range limit and will snipe out enemies on 300m range. I personaly not using it because it lacks AOE, but it's still a great gun.

Thats all for Archguns. Maybe you'll test more and add your comments.

Next post - primaries and kitguns. Spoiler aleart - kitguns are OP. 

 

Also check out the video one of my friends made about duality with AW guns. and dont forget to subsrcibe  to pewdiepie

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Tombfinger, haymaker, splat without a riven, on duality, is god teir.

In the index your equiturret one murders as fast if not much faster than a good mesa.

On open world the shots destroy dropships insanely fast.

I have yet to try a rattleguts but otherwise i have not found a primary as well performing as a good tombfinger on duality. Zarr comes close but the limited range is a huge factor and it usually deals less damage.

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16 hours ago, Chatv71e said:

Arch-guns can be used in any missions (besides ESO and Index). Arch-guns will benefit from ALL the mechanics of this build. Such as: No self damage. Infinite ammo. Auto aim. 300% more damage.

Oh yes, unlike you, Duality can't run out of ammo and doesn't need to wait 10 minutes to use gun again.You can just use Duality and never make a single shot, letting her deal with enemies.

Wow, just wow.

I now have to unlock arch-guns even more.

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Hey guys Equinox Prime is out and you know what that means?

It means that Duality build just got a direct upgrade! For all the increased stats on original frame will be transfered to Specter and will also be increased by Specter scaling.

You can look stats on the wiki page but I will list them anyway to show how they will affect specter

First and most important stats is armor. It might not seems as much 120 vs. 100, but 20 extra base armor is a big deal. 

Specter scaling machanic works just as any enemy scaling machanics. Meaning if specter has 120 armor at lvl 1, they will have 337 armor at lvl 30.

Duality spawns as lvl 30 unit every time.
And compared to non-prime equinox that's 56 more armor.

Extra HP will affect both you and your specter evenly (375vs300) adding up 185 extra HP

Next important stat is Energy Pool. From 150 to 220 at level 30. This will affect both you and specter would you use Quick Thinking.

Specter base energy pool will always be 220, meaning compared to regular equinox Quick thinking will add up 67 extra HP to specter and 162 more HP to you if you are using maxed primed flow.

In conclusion 


Duality prime will have

56 more armor.

67 extra HP from Quick Thinking

185 extra HP

With Total of: 337 Armor, 595 HP from Quick Thinking and 925 HP  from Vitality.

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Okay so....

Kitguns.

There are curently 2 kitguns in the game that dualty can use well. That will be Rattleguts and Tombfinger

Catchmoon is also fairly usable but because of the limited range, damage fall off and the way projectiles can dissapear if duality touches the wall with them makes it rather madiocre.

Now some people say there is forth kitgun. Don't trust them. Forth kithun doesn't exist.

Rattleguts being the more poweful of the two provides you with a direct upgrade from Stubba/Arca scisco. If you tired those guns and liked how duality performs with them - take Rattleguts.

High fire rate

100% accuracy

Slash procs with 300% dmg, Radiation damage that goes well both against grineer and corpus.

No downsides.

Tombfinger on other hand has much higher damage values but also has slow traveling projectiles. It is more suited to use in a close combat or tight areas  where its aoe explosion can be beneficial. Although it still performs well in under 100m range.

Area damage

Insanely high damage

Good accuracy

Radiation damage that goes well both against grineer and corpus.

Downides are: Slow projectiles on figh ranges, low accuracy on fast moving targets. 

Mind that area explosion only occurs if shot hits the target. If it misses and hits the ground, there will be no area of effect damage zone.

 

For both kitguns I used Zipneedle, making reload time so fast that even if Specter reloads twice, it still doesn't matter due to how fast reload is. And reducad magazine size also doesn't matter because Duality will reload often anyway.

For Rattleguts I went to Lovetap to make it fire a bit faster. Duality benefits greatly from fast fire rate. Used Haymaker for Tombfinger, to rise up it's damage to the sky and guarantee oneshots.

 

Next post - Synergy with new warframes, tweaks to old ones and maybe couple of weapons.

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Do arcanes like guardian have any effect? I don't want to have to use vazarin to sustain my clone 

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59 minutes ago, Xaxma said:

Do arcanes like guardian have any effect? I don't want to have to use vazarin to sustain my clone 

No arcanes have no effect on the clone. If it diest too much, try placing it in a safe isolated spot to make it shot things from distance.

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On 2019-04-30 at 10:01 PM, Chatv71e said:

No arcanes have no effect on the clone. If it diest too much, try placing it in a safe isolated spot to make it shot things from distance.

What about a hybrid build of range and duration with the augment for both 1 and 4? Equinox with less than like 70 range feels horrible. 

Being able to swap between the two forms and maintain charge feels great, especially since the night form gives shield per kill when mend is channeling. It gives her and her clone/allies some extra sustain. The clone contributes to charge, which is great for maim.

Do you know if adaptation functions with the clone? It could make a shield oriented equinox viable. 

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18 hours ago, Xaxma said:

What about a hybrid build of range and duration with the augment for both 1 and 4? Equinox with less than like 70 range feels horrible. 

Being able to swap between the two forms and maintain charge feels great, especially since the night form gives shield per kill when mend is channeling. It gives her and her clone/allies some extra sustain. The clone contributes to charge, which is great for maim.

Do you know if adaptation functions with the clone? It could make a shield oriented equinox viable. 

Adaptation works on the clone, that's why I'm using it. 

More so, passive shield on killing from your 4 also works on Duality clone. It will get overshield.

Check out the old thread (Link in main post), there is version with more range + Zenurik to sustain energy while using 4. There are also Augment for 4 enthusiats, as well as build for it with duality.

As for me, I'm still sceptical about her 4 augment. It provides a nice utility but takes out a much needed modslot. I don't find myself using 4 at all because duality on the tree shreds everything from 300m away before it even gets to me. On top of that your 4 drains a lot of energy.

 

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18 hours ago, Xaxma said:

What about a hybrid build of range and duration with the augment for both 1 and 4? Equinox with less than like 70 range feels horrible. 

 starting from that post, there is a build that person sugest. And while it does look like something that should work greatly, I could not make it work. Plus it maintains energy by using Rage that has antisynergy with shields, but you can get the ideas from that build.

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Tweaked build a little bit, using rage instead of constitution. Feels a bit smoother. Much more tanky and less energy issues for that vazarin.unknown.png 

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The Jovian Concord: Update 25

This update brought us lot of new stuff to work with. Lets start from bad news.

The indoor index map has been reworked. No more afk index farming for duality users. Sad news. Along with that all jupiter maps were reworked by a maze loving sico that I assume is responsible for making kuva fortress. Thus making Duality mostly unusable in those Jupiter Defence/Interception missons and such.

You still can ue duality, you just can't cover an entire map with it because there are so many damn obstacles. Enemies always will be behind piles of junck or barrels, making duality aim at them and unable to fire.

New weapons that came with this update are pretty good though.

Fulmin performs great in hands of specter, dealing both massive crit damage and having punch trough to hit multiple enemies. It has a pretty long reload time in hand of specter because it uses up all ammo and has to wait till it recharges to full. The down side is limited range of 20m, but in a tight corridors it's pretty damn good.

Cyanex is an interesting one. It seems it has some minor issues with bullets not tracking down enemies all the time but other than that it's pretty strong in hands of duality. The reason is 300% dmg stacking gas clouds that it creates. Mixed up with infinite ammoo and gun's pasive ability to kill enemies hiding behind corners, makes this gun great. But it certainly lacks damage.

--------------------------------------

Literally all new mods are useless to us. Build remains unchanged.

There was an idea to use Amalgam Javlok Magazine Warp for it's "Parrying with a Shield reflects +6000% Damage." But turns out you need to be channeling for it to work. Specters can't do that. 

------------------------------------

Two new missions. 

Lets start with the fact that Duality blows on Ropalolist fight. As expected. Every frame that is not Inaros (or Inaros but with shields instead of HP) blows on that fight. Anyway, Duality can't damage the boss, gets killed fast and overal usless there.

The second misson is Disruption and this is where the fun begins. The goal is to spawn a really beefy enemy and kill it before it reaches the point. 

Duality is one of the most optiomal frames for that mode and here is why:

1) Nullifiers. Nullifiers everywhere. Most frames that would rely on buffs to the damage will get their buffs purged. Duality on other hand not only keeps the 300% dmg buff but also doen't give a crap about bubbles, blowing them up at will. It does takes a bit of damage while in a null field though but it kills nullies in a blink of an eye. It keeps doing and going even when your own abilities are dsabled. 

The demolist itself will cast a bubble ever 5 seconds that will remove every debuffs from demolist and any buffs from nearby warframes. Duality will stay untouched and keeps spraying it with 300% dmg buff.

2) An extra gun = more status procs. As said in a main guide - using duality don't stop you from attacking yourself. And it so happens that one of the best ways to kill the Demolist is Paracesis. But having such a low status, you cant expect it to proc anything. Meanwhile, Duality can do that for you, using a status weapon while you spin to win your way to victory. On top of that Duality will also boosts up the damage done by Condition Overload like this.

3) Magus Lockdown is on of few things that effect Demolists locking them in place for a little bit. But to use it you need to jump into operator and dash. You can't attack during that time, but yoor Duality sure can. Furthermore, imobilizing enemy like this will make it easier for Duality to hit. By the time lockdown duration ends the target should be dead.

 

My setup for killing lvl 160+ Demolists is

Duality spawned with Viral+Electricity Zarr. 300% dmg Zarr is no joke. Viral proc will reduce enemy HP by half, electricity deals bonus damage to Demolists. 

Magnetic Pox (optional). Throwing few of those at Demolist will eat up its shield last till tocic cloud is on them.

Paracesis for huge damage spin attacks

A kavat with Cat's Eye to make those crits flowing or a sentinel with magnetic status gun instead of Pox. 

And mandatory Magus Lockdown with Vazarin to keep Duality/Cat/Sentinel alive.

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On 2019-03-28 at 1:28 AM, Chatv71e said:

-snip-

If I may add some experience I did with Duality.

  • In my opinion this excessive duration is unnecessary, because in low lvl clon will run like headless chicken, while in higher missions he is killed rather fast. In the end I was recasting my clone more often to reposition or resummon it, and it hardly run out of time. Range loss due to Narrow Minded is actually substential, since even if you switch forms often both versions of Equinox' #2 are useable, so that you are not reduced to 1 ability.
  • Clon seems to profit from https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Vigorous_Swap for the entire duration, so I would suggest to add it into your build for even more power. Especailly with melee 2.99999 it is easy to activate.

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3 hours ago, ShortCat said:

If I may add some experience I did with Duality.

Everyone is welcome to add new intel into the indeeps guide.

3 hours ago, ShortCat said:
  • In my opinion this excessive duration is unnecessary, because in low lvl clon will run like headless chicken, while in higher missions he is killed rather fast. In the end I was recasting my clone more often to reposition or resummon it, and it hardly run out of time. Range loss due to Narrow Minded is actually substential, since even if you switch forms often both versions of Equinox' #2 are useable, so that you are not reduced to 1 ability.

That's how most people feel about duality, yet this is possible to play around it weaknesess.

Clone scales with your HP, things like adaptation and quick thinking affects it making it survive even against lvl 100+ enemies. Vazarin makes it invulnerable and heals it back up at any time.

Ai performs best when isolated on a high ground, making it snipe enemies up to 300m away. In a close fight its best to give it a weapon that will have big impact even in hands of dumb AI. Zarr, Amprex, Atomos, Archwing weapons are bets examples.

3 hours ago, ShortCat said:

That's something new. Need to test it out. That would be insanely good if that works.

--------------------------

In conclusiong. I presonally play full on duality. Every mission I run, I let clone do all the work and have no need to use other abilities. But how to play it, is up to individual. Look previous thread there are lot of coments of different playstyles. There are more range oriented build.

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Hey like the article.. in regards to Demolysts.  Why arent  you using Kitguns. didnt you mentioned they were stronger.  Or you using hte Zarr since there is soo many enemies.    Im lookin for somthing just ot kill the demo myself.

 

Side question why the Paracesis

 

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3 hours ago, YxPhoenixY said:

Hey like the article.. in regards to Demolysts.  Why arent  you using Kitguns. didnt you mentioned they were stronger.  Or you using hte Zarr since there is soo many enemies.    Im lookin for somthing just ot kill the demo myself.

Kitguns are good, but in terms of damage output Zarr is possibly the highest in the game. And we need as much damage as we can get due to how tanky Demolists are. Plus Zarr's bomblets gives a good status proc chances.

3 hours ago, YxPhoenixY said:

Side question why the Paracesis

 Aperrantly Demolists are still counted as sentients even though being corpus, thus passive bonus damage agains senstients form Paracesis apply to them. A good red crit with a spin attack can remove 1/4 of their hp bar at level 165, 1/2 if your Duality will proc Viral.

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hey OP a bit of a fun fact, due to inheriting weapon mods, high crit weapons with hunter munitions on them become monsters on the duality clone.  also stradivar prime is amazing on the clone

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On 2019-06-03 at 9:39 AM, (XB1)Neon Lights9212 said:

hey OP a bit of a fun fact, due to inheriting weapon mods, high crit weapons with hunter munitions on them become monsters on the duality clone.  also stradivar prime is amazing on the clone

This is also true for high status gas/toxin weapons, making clone stack those DoT with 300% dmg boost

The problem with that is clone doesn't know that target is already dead and will continue to shot target that would already bleed out, wasting time. 

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5 hours ago, Chatv71e said:

This is also true for high status gas/toxin weapons, making clone stack those DoT with 300% dmg boost

The problem with that is clone doesn't know that target is already dead and will continue to shot target that would already bleed out, wasting time. 

hasnt done that for me, than again, my builds on all my weapons are designed for lvl 125 corrupt gunners and corrupt bombards. making them melt the hp of anything from the average star chart missions.

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I ran an Arbitration today with +300 Equinox Str, Infested Defense. I had another guy join with me and we duo’d it. Ran Sobek (Acid Shells), Twin Kohmak, Paracesis. We went for 50 minutes and the result was 86% Damage dealt and right under 1800 kills. My teammate had right under 700 kills and was pretty pleased with our run. I need to update my build though. Sobek Duality is so ridiculously strong against Infested.

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