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[DE]Connor

April 2019 Riven Disposition Updates

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I'm not sure what the fuss is about.

DE stated from the start that they introduced rivens to shake up the meta. They see the stats, they know what weapons people use and they can see the meta. They told us directly that riven dispositions are affected by usage stats and that as usage changes they will revise the dispositions.

None of this should be a surprise. I'm not surprised. Many of the other commenters here are not surprised. My question to the OP is: why are you surprised?

The only thing that surprised me was the fact rivens exist at all. They were released within days of Steve saying on a devstream that he doesn't like mods that directly improve a weapon such that they become mandatory, such as Serration / Point  Blank / Hornet Strike / Pressure Point and that he regrets those mods being in the game.

Against this backdrop it's clear to me that top-tier weapons becoming default picks again, despite having the lowest possible riven dispositions, was going to provoke a reaction from DE.

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Not everyone sees a Riven stats going from 150% to 110% as the end of the world. Rivens are still stronger than almost any other mod you could replace them with unless you're intentionally trying to compare the worst roll in the world to prove a useless point.

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11 hours ago, Kaiser_Suoh said:

title

Rivens were meant to make obsolete weapons relevant again by giving them a ludicrous power buff. However that has now devolved into basically any weapon getting a ridiculous power buff. (See: Gram Prime still getting disposition 5 rivens) They have faltered from their original purpose, so a rebalance is in order

Personally, I like these changes. Sure, my ignis riven now sucks enough that I'm seriously considering selling it, but at the same time the Argonak riven I picked up last week is going just that little bit stronger now, and most of my other rivens were either untouched or got improved. Certainly no complaints from me

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18 hours ago, Lokime said:

Nice. Inb4 Rubico fans start raging.

Rubico is still super strong even without a riven so not sure what your talking about....

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3 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

Every time I see these complaints about rivens, it brightens my day just a bit more.

It’s becoming an amusing thing. Gives a bit of a break between the “OMG WOLF” and “BRING BACK ALERTS” threads that pop up. 

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They're guns people use a lot. Usage dictates riven power. More overused weapon, worse rivens

Also, Aklex? Really? You do not need a riven for your Aklex. Maybe a space saver if you want to buff the reload time, but if you can't wipe out the entire room with 16 shots, you're either doing something wrong or the room is big enough that you've got plenty of time to reload

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19 hours ago, [DE]Connor said:

This is our first time determining disposition changes with the help of an internal ranking, to help guide dispositions closer to where we feel they should be, and to offer a solid baseline that is less subject to fluctuating player usage stats.

Thank you, @[DE]Connor and the rest of the Dev Team for this.

This seems like the right kind of solution to bringing rivens back to their original intention, as you discussed in the first workshop and as I asked of you in my post there:

@[DE]Connor My impression of this, taken in context with what's been happening in Warframe over the last couple of years:

- riven values should eventually become less extreme as a result of this ongoing process,

- which fits with there being no really high-level / difficult content in Warframe, so that players don't have to feel that their weapons won't be ineffective.

- The game remains a relatively casual experience,

- although it is arguable that you still have some accessibility issues for new players (i.e. newbies still don't really know what they're meant to do in the game without significant hand-holding from an experienced player), and makes me wonder if you need to address this next?

- Despite new game modes and content being introduced, for me rivens are the most unique aspect of this game and the biggest incentive for playing, alongside exploring build options for warframes,

- but without some kind of mode to really test myself against, a long-term player might feel that there's little point going on (I need more than the Sortie, or sitting in Tavueni for an hour!)

 

0utlier

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Within their weapon classes, those weapons are probably more highly used than say, the Magnus, Kraken, etc. Especially with the Vandal/Prime variants for some of them such as the Lato and Vasto.

If you're comparing it outside of its category, such as comparing the Aklex to the Arca Plasmor, then yes, it may seem weird that the Aklex doesn't have double or triple the disposition of the Plasmor but within the category of Dual Semi-auto Pistols and conventional Secondaries, the ones getting their disposition reduced are still one of the stronger choices. If we're going to ignore categories and match everything to the top meta, a ton of weapons would shoot up to max disposition simply because 8 out of 10 people are holding a Arca Plasmor, Ignis or Amprex.

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12 minutes ago, Mu5tang71 said:

Rubico is still super strong even without a riven so not sure what your talking about....

Agree with this havent been using a riven on mine and can still hold its own in the supposed 'eidolon' Its as if people believe you need a riven for every weapon for it to be viable..

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6 hours ago, Shadow-Spawn said:

Thank you DE for nerfing our hard earned riven mods - why don't you use your time for something more constructive - like bringing back the quick alert system - instead of that god awful nightwave system.

Does the nightwave hate in your post cover "zomg Wolf sucks!" aswell? If so you managed a full house of FOTM complaints in single sentence.

/handsoutacookie

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Posted (edited)

Rivens buffed! Yay!

Edited by uiop2000
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DE has to stop trying to control the meta, they can change the riven disposition as much as they want, it will not make a bad weapon better and it will not make me stop using my favorite weapons. Looking at the list, its all the popular weapons that has gotten a nerf - but come on Amprex and Arca Plasmor for the second time.

What annoys me with these changes are all the time spend (or money used on plat) to getting the rivens and obtaining the kuva and the endo that goes into them.

Looking towards the Melee 3.0 I expect a bloodbath especial on the zaw weapons.

all those hours spend……..

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6 minutes ago, (XB1)Calvindk said:

DE has to stop trying to control the meta, they can change the riven disposition as much as they want, it will not make a bad weapon better and it will not make me stop using my favorite weapons. Looking at the list, its all the popular weapons that has gotten a nerf - but come on Amprex and Arca Plasmor for the second time.

What annoys me with these changes are all the time spend (or money used on plat) to getting the rivens and obtaining the kuva and the endo that goes into them.

Looking towards the Melee 3.0 I expect a bloodbath especial on the zaw weapons.

all those hours spend……..

 

They could have gone down in one go. But they limited themselves to a max of a .2 change.

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19 hours ago, Poke007 said:

Did Vulkar get nerfed or buffed? Since the color used for it is green but the number went down. XD

the Vulkar is in the Red now. all snipers took a hit cause the Devs. don't want us 1 shotting the Eidolons. We'll still find a way,without exploiting the Game. we'll always find a legal means for a more efficient grind.XD

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19 hours ago, Husla said:

oof, sicarus hit again.. i rarely see the weapon anymore

I still use Sicarus Prime a lot. So to keep a good weapon from getting Nerfed. Stop using them and use the not so good ones? the logic escapes me.

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19 hours ago, Airwolfen said:

Yay. the Kohm is spared a demise once again

Luckily they see that a dispo change would kill it.

IKR, the Kohm and the Opticor. They dropped the Vandal Version so the classic would be spared.

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1 hour ago, RX-3DR said:

Not everyone sees a Riven stats going from 150% to 110% as the end of the world. Rivens are still stronger than almost any other mod you could replace them with unless you're intentionally trying to compare the worst roll in the world to prove a useless point.

Yeah Rivens are more or less Monus mods to add a littler extra kick to your weapons. Not surprised. Just hurt my feelings a littke to see my Axlex get slapped a little bit. It's not the end of the world. But to see my Cc Sc and negative recoil. It was -79% recoil and silky smooth. 

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DE, don't forget to nerf also Warframes like Rhino, Octavia, Volt, Saryn, Nezha, Mesa and other most-used and "overpowered" WF. That'd be consistent with the riven-nerfs.

Best DE (wish)-config for EOS -   Ash, Lex, Paris, Jaw Sword and a Kubrow? ^^

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, CarrotSalad said:

Agree with this havent been using a riven on mine and can still hold its own in the supposed 'eidolon' Its as if people believe you need a riven for every weapon for it to be viable..

 

So why would that riven be introduced in the first place? Now every 3 months SAME weapons rivens are being nerfed down to ground, and only 'players' taking satisfaction from that are the ones, who could never either afford a Rubico/Lanka/Vectis riven, or can't accept the fact that majority like to use them. Simply selfish people.

 

Nerfing those rivens will make them completely useless. Is that what you call balance? Simple dumping a content to junk levels, only because they can't handle things the other way around, and give weapons a rework? It's just lazy.

 

These changes are terrible. All the rivens should have the same disposition and the weapons should be worked on. Overpowered riven mods WON'T make people use a weapon, that using is a pain itself. It's just concealing what's terrible about weapons in this game. And this is what this game is mostly about, weapons that you use to kill enemies.

 

These rivens are popular, because weapons for them are good to use in the game for specific purpose, and in this example it's Eidolon hunting. Make the other weapons as usable, as this. SIMPLE. Don't be lazy and don't cover up what's bad in the game with overpowered rivens.

 

Following by their bad decisions, they're gradually nerfing rivens for something, that they finally managed to make good and usable in the game, so that's obviously why people use it. So that's plainly why majority of people will be displeased about, because majority's favourite weapons, most used in the game, are constantly having rivens for them nerfed by % with every "rework". Big announcement! It's not the riven making them great, it's the weapon itself! So now you make it as useless, as everything else, by nerfing a riven mod for it, that somebody already owns! And won't suddenly desire a Stug or whatever!

Nerfing enemies, so that Stug could deal damage to them, won't help them either.

 

I'd be proud of developers if they announced, that all rivens get a dispo of 1.0 and weapons, that nobody uses, get a rework. But that won't happen. Seems like too much effort for them. Better to nerf something, that's already good, rather than trying to make other weapons better and instead, overpower them with ridiculous stats on rivens.

(That won't help, because the weapon itself will still be terrible).

Nobody:

DE: Let's just nerf rivens on weapons that everybody uses, so these weapons become as bad as everything else, and rivens for them non existent. Smart move.

Edited by Ikedo
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Posted (edited)

IMO Riven "balancing" is a terrible idea. Rivens should be used for QoL not to fix a flawed or weak weapon, rivens being used to balance will only cause an unending fluctuation in usable vs non viable weapons. If certain weapons don't meet a certain power factor fix them, "nerfing" weapons and rivens just abuses the player-bases time and energy farming and working toward something to have it taken away or ruined. Which just results in feelings of anger and resentment toward the people that put a lot of work into the development of warframe.

Personally I feel all rivens should be set to the same riven disposition and the weapons fixed, to produce the same amount of damage or worth the weapon gives. Rivens shouldn't be used to balance weak or poorly implemented weapons, its a lazy way to "fix" the power creep DE, and you know it.

I would love to see weapons I thought were interesting while leveling, but not worth keeping (because they a. don't do enough damage or b. there are better options) become good and worth using. Riven balancing wont make this a reality because the weapon is either too flawed or once it becomes popular again it will be "balanced" resulting in the start of the process all over again. Thank you for your time and consideration. 

Edited by Kyneskir
typo
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They nerfed rivens the first time,they nerfed them again now. I believe they simply do not listen at all at what we all say. They have money because we play their game,yet apparently this does not matter to them. Sad. Really sad.

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Posted (edited)

This is disastrous i spent 156 rolls of kuva on my personal rubico riven just to get some decent stats, and now i am all sad, i think i will take a break from the game  😞

Edited by -x-5P1T.F1R3-x-
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