[DE response inside] Please revert Emissive Texture changes introduced in U24.7.0

[Kaptrad]

On 2019-04-12 at 4:08 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Important information as a result of this feedback (lots of merged threads):

Right to the meat - we are reverting the Emissive Energy inheriting Secondary energy as of next Hotfix. The reason we added this was because we read player feedback indicating disappointment 'Secondary Energy' did nothing on the Warframe itself, so we tried to give it meaning. And now the meaning has swung too far the other way!

You can expect a way more in-depth colour customization to come soon - at least we're experimenting with something really wild. We will be working on giving you (Forma using players) even more options - 4 energy customization slots total. Primary and Secondary for the Warframe itself. Primary and Secondary for the Warframe's Abilities and Effects. This means your all-Red Ember could have Blue Fire. Your Green Saryn could have Orange Spores, etc. But - it's in the laboratory. Stay tuned for a Dev Workshop as we work on this. And if you don't use Forma, you won't be forced to. Your Secondary slots would just be the same as Primary, so nothing would force a Forma, etc.

i really just wish all these little reversions and changes could all be collected together and thrown into some kinda menu u could access via the arsenal or the esc menu, idk just feel like it would be fun to mess around with em all and would decrease player annoyance to 0% :D

[StylishRex]

I just want to Color Chroma's Energy Color to something thats not white and black and still have Ice Effect same with Chromatic Blade for Excal it was restricting customization so the builds could be more viable for Endgame. Thats all I wanted when this Update came.

Edited April 18, 2019 by StreyishRed

[BladeZerker]

On 2019-04-12 at 10:08 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Important information as a result of this feedback (lots of merged threads):

Right to the meat - we are reverting the Emissive Energy inheriting Secondary energy as of next Hotfix. The reason we added this was because we read player feedback indicating disappointment 'Secondary Energy' did nothing on the Warframe itself, so we tried to give it meaning. And now the meaning has swung too far the other way!

You can expect a way more in-depth colour customization to come soon - at least we're experimenting with something really wild. We will be working on giving you (Forma using players) even more options - 4 energy customization slots total. Primary and Secondary for the Warframe itself. Primary and Secondary for the Warframe's Abilities and Effects. This means your all-Red Ember could have Blue Fire. Your Green Saryn could have Orange Spores, etc. But - it's in the laboratory. Stay tuned for a Dev Workshop as we work on this. And if you don't use Forma, you won't be forced to. Your Secondary slots would just be the same as Primary, so nothing would force a Forma, etc.

It looked way better with the emissive having the secondary energy giving the warframe the look of having one kind of colour and the energy from abilities gaining a blend of both. For example my Atlas would have orange lights while his punches would be blended with streaks of red from the primary, now he is all red. Looks like ass to be honest and not easy on the eyes. I would ask you kindly to please revert this change or give us an option, a button of some sort to "invert" energy hierarchy but to be honest this hotfix improved performance for a lot of things so I wouldn't want you to break anything in the process. In other words I take the performance boost over being a whiner. Good on you though for listening to the vocal community.

[-QUILL_PETER-]

15 hours ago, AXCrusnik said:

many were unhappy about

But most people were. Unhappy people are just louder, a fact DE should understand by now. I really hope it comes back with the suggested 4-way color concept.

[-QUILL_PETER-]

17 hours ago, Stormandreas said:

The 2 colours are so incredibly similar

Can you seriously not tell the difference between orange and yellow?

[SordidDreams]

On 2019-04-12 at 10:08 PM, [DE]Rebecca said:

Primary and Secondary for the Warframe itself. Primary and Secondary for the Warframe's Abilities and Effects.

That's amazing news, however I'd like to point out something I found a bit disappointing about the dual color implementation that this also doesn't address.

See, prior to the dual energy color update, with default energy color, certain frame abilities used to have two different colors very distinctly separated. Like for instance Excal's Exalted Blade used to have yellow energy on the sword, but the projectiles were blue. Trinity's Blessing had a blue pillar of light in the middle of a green energy blast. The dual energy color update changed that, now even these abilities are a single color when a default energy color is selected.

Now the problem I always had with custom energy colors was that these awesome multi-color effects just became all one color. The dual energy color update was a definite improvement for abilities that only had one color, but for these multi-color abilities it was a bit of a sidegrade. I was hoping the two energy colors would allow us to color the two distinct areas of these abilities separately; instead, they make everything the same blend of two colors. Which is nicer than just a single color, not as nice as two separate colors IMO.

Just something I thought worth a mention.

[AXCrusnik]

4 hours ago, -QUILL_PETER- said:

But most people were. Unhappy people are just louder, a fact DE should understand by now. I really hope it comes back with the suggested 4-way color concept.

And imagine how happy they will be when it actually works?

[ChromaUmbra]

Thanks for ruining my fashionframe.  I spent hours coming up with a really cool look and now I need to go back to the same boring old colors I usually have to use.

Edited April 19, 2019 by ChromaUmbra

[shimmer.shine]

On 2019-04-13 at 7:49 PM, NightmareT12 said:

The way I understood it, since they deployed a new set of textures and code to all things, the revert would redeploy the old assets as they were previously to 24.7, so everything should return to normal.

DE didn't fix it after all 😞

[TuxedoCatfish]

So... what does secondary energy actually do now? I set my secondary energy color on Harrow to something different than the primary and it doesn't show up anywhere, both his abilities and the lights on the warframe are all primary.

[KokoroWish]

On 2019-04-18 at 10:28 PM, -QUILL_PETER- said:

But most people were. Unhappy people are just louder, a fact DE should understand by now. I really hope it comes back with the suggested 4-way color concept.

I was happy with the concept, but the execution was not there to match. Given the problems, like Exalted weapons having issues with the colouring and the like, the reversion was warranted. However the reversion still hasn't really fixed many issues.

I am looking forward to them reinstituting the function with better coverage and hopefully no problems.

Edited April 20, 2019 by KokoroWish

[Arc5in]

So I really think DE needs to reconsider how they are implementing these changes to energy colors.

1: Sliders to adjust intensity for each color independently.

2: Options for how the energy colors interact, a couple toggles which give different effects. It would be cool to have the energy colors not simply combine, but a couple other options as well, like dual color, with an inner color and outer color. Some possible options are mix, dual color, and emmisive. Three is probably enough. Additional amount sliders to adjust how this effect applies, for each color. These amount sliders would adjust the mixture for energy color mix, or the mixture for emmisive color, or the sizes (and incidentally the gradation) of dual energy colors, depending on which type was chosen.

3: Elemental procs need a client side option which enables or disables using custom energy colors globally. You want mobs that you light on fire to be green, cool man, but we shouldn't be subjected to other players fashion choices on such a massive scale without opting in to it. Ideally this would have 3 options, enabled, disabled, and only for my procs. Yeah I know, but like, I may really not want to see other players' green fire on everything, but I do want to see my own black ice. Maybe that is asking too much though, in which case simple enabled/diabled options would be acceptable for custom proc colors globally.

4: Elemental weapon effects and elemetal proc effects need to be separate and toggle-able per frame/weapon. They both need separate toggles in the weapon/frame cosmetic options. Then as per point 3 above there needs to be a separate toggle under graphics options to disable custom proc effects. We don't need a local setting to disable the custom elemental weapon effects globally though.

5: Slightly off topic, but while we are here, and since we have added a sub-menu for energy, we might as well fix a long standing issue. For weapons, let's add a sub-menu for elemental effects. Inside, all the elemental effects are listed, with a slider for intensity. By default all would be set to max intensity, which would be what we have now. Effects will only actually appear on a weapon if it actually has that damage type of course. Now we could make the elemental effects on weapons look more subdued or disable them individually by setting to zero intensity. Currently we have an option to show/hide elemental effects on melee weapons, but this setting is global, and it barely even works. Disabling it, disables it everywhere, so just because I don't want my sword to be snowing, I turn off all elemental weapon effects, for everyone. Except, that doesn't even work, because my glaive often has elemental effects, or partial effects, intermittently, even when they are disabled. Sometimes throwing it will make them disappear, inconsistently. This should be a cosmetic option per weapon anyway though. Maybe not right away, but at some point in the future I would love to see a radio button added to each element in this sub-menu to enable alternate, more subtle effects. Like instead of constant electrical arcs, an occasional random arc between long periods of none, or instead of snow, just a frosty coating that forms occasionally and dissipates.

If point 5 is added, then point 4 could be rolled into that elemental effects sub-menu, which would be awesome, because then you could enable/disable custom energy colors for specific elements. For instance have electric, and/or radiation, use your custom energy colors, but have the other elements use normal elemental colors.

 

So to summarize, a separate sub-menu under appearance for energy colors, there would be radio buttons to select types of color interaction (mix, dual, emmisive), then under each color two sliders, one for intensity, and another labeled amount that would behave differently depending on type selected.

Intensity sliders for each color would adjust intensity of the specific color, then the amount sliders would combine those colors variably depending on type chosen.

If type chosen was mix, then amount would simply adjust the mixture amount taking into account respective intensities in the mixture.

If type was dual, then amount sliders would adjust the size of the inner and outer colors respectively and it would effect the gradation between those colors incidentally. So making both very small (min amount) would cause a softer transition between them, while making both very large (max amount) would cause a very sharp transition between them. Making one small and one large would also cause a hard gradation as either a large inner color would fill the area with a hard gradation to small fringe color, or small inner core with a hard gradation to a large outer halo color. By adjusting each colors amount slider you could get some beautiful gradations and very cool effects, especially when combined with their intensity sliders.

If the type was set to emmisive, then amount would adjust the mixture of color in the emmisive light only. By adjusting this slider in conjuction with the intensity sliders you could get some awesome effects. Here energy color would only be effected by primary color, with emmisive light being a mix of primary and secondary, taking into account respective intensities. You could get some nice effects, like having a very subtle emmisive light that is a different color than the main energy, or having a very subdued energy color but with a really intense emmisive glow.

Then at the bottom, two toggles; one for custom elemental weapon effects, and one for custom elemental proc effects. Turning on custom proc effects may or may not appear to other players depending whether they have disabled it globally or not.

Add an option in setting to disable custom proc effects globaly.

Finally, to put the icing on the cake, make elemental weapon effects customizable cosmetic options per weapon as per point 5 above, and roll the cosmetic custom elemental weapon/proc effect toggles into this system.

Edited April 20, 2019 by Arc5in
typos

[Stormandreas]

On 2019-04-18 at 3:33 PM, -QUILL_PETER- said:

Can you seriously not tell the difference between orange and yellow?

No, I'm saying I can't tell the difference between THAT Orange and Yellow. The dual energy colours thing doesn't really do similar colours very well from my experience, it just kinda..... blends them together, but picking completely different opposing colours lets you really tell the difference (i.e. picking a red with a green for example)

[-QUILL_PETER-]

2 hours ago, Stormandreas said:

No, I'm saying I can't tell the difference between THAT Orange and Yellow. The dual energy colours thing doesn't really do similar colours very well from my experience, it just kinda..... blends them together, but picking completely different opposing colours lets you really tell the difference (i.e. picking a red with a green for example)

I'd wager that varies greatly depending on the frame you're using. I had orange with yellow on my Mirage Prime and it was very easy to distinguish the yellow core from the orange halo. Now it's just solid orange =/ However, it does sound like they'll be returning with the 4-way colors. Why they removed them entirely instead of just tweaking the numbers bit by bit until it looked acceptable is beyond me. DE's reasoning and thought processes often worry me.

[Airwolfen]

On 2019-04-23 at 12:25 AM, -QUILL_PETER- said:

I'd wager that varies greatly depending on the frame you're using. I had orange with yellow on my Mirage Prime and it was very easy to distinguish the yellow core from the orange halo. Now it's just solid orange =/ However, it does sound like they'll be returning with the 4-way colors. Why they removed them entirely instead of just tweaking the numbers bit by bit until it looked acceptable is beyond me. DE's reasoning and thought processes often worry me.

Because on some frames it simply did not work well and they would need to edit it frame by frame with a system not designed to have it in the first place. so they removed it temporarely instead of leaving stuff broken. That was the right decision imo.