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BlachWolf

My take on an Atlas rework

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Posted (edited)

Right now Atlas is an okay frame, not as bad as let say vauban but also not as good as khora. Right now only lands slide, petrify and maybe rumblers are worth using. With this change I want to make him a bit more relewant by changing some of his abilities and removing tectonics, cause its basically useless. 

Passive: Rubble and immobile are good passive, but I think rubble has more potential if it’s used as a resource you can consume with abilities. Because of that I want to increase the cap from 1500 to 2500, which combined with his 450 base armor would give him 90% dmg reduction. In addition to that I would remove the drain, because it will be consumed by his abilities now. 

Note: Before you say it’s to op, remember that armor can be bypassed and a portion negated by certain damage types, making it not nearly as good as let say garas splinter storm. This would also negate the usefulness of certain arcanes like guardian and armor mods, because of the high armor value he would have, basically comparable to chromas situation. 

Landslide (small tweak):

Spoiler

 

This ability is his most used one and also once of the best first abilities ingame, mostly because it can scale from mods and to separate combo multiplier. Though the bad thing about it is that it basically can’t deal status, thus falling off against armor in high level content. 

Ability change: Let landslide use shattering impact, this will let him deal with armor a bit better without having to change his status. 

Note: This change won’t change much in the grand skim of things, but it will allow him to scale better, especially because he deals his damage in an AOE fashion, which would allow him to strip the armor of multiple enemies at the same time. 

 

Petrify (small changes and slot swap):

Spoiler

 

Petrify is atlases second most important ability, it gives him tankiness, CC and more damage on his one. Though it hampers other players in the team, by negating further status application. This can become a big issue against high level enemies, especially when they’re armored. 

Ability change: Half the duration and remove the status negation, This won’t be major buff to atlas himself but to his team capabilities, letting allies deal damage to his petrified units. Reduce energy cost to 50 energy 

Note: The duration reduction was taken in order to balance him around comparable other abilities such as khoras ensnare and harrows condemn, both which fulfill a similar task to petrify. In addition the slot swap / energy reduction is because petrify is an ability you want to always use, in its previous incarnation it was just to energy intensive, this change should mitigate the issue. 

Augment changes: Instead of only per enemy corpes, change it to per enemy stone piece. In addition make it so that it also has 25% of dropping extra rubble. 

Note: Right now this augment is basically useless, it doesn’t contribute to his kit nor is it comparable to other frames, in terms of efficiency. This change will allow ore gaze to become relevant by adding something to the kit and also increasing atlas farming potential. 

 

Tectonics (rework):

Spoiler

 

Tectonics I would say is one of the most useless abilities in the game, with only some niche uses like protecting a console, which other abilities such as frost bobble and garas glass wall fulfill much better. Even if you want to create choke points there are far better abilities then this one. Also even in interception it’s not that useful. 

Ability rework: Instead of summoning a wall, Atlas will actually summon a tectonic plate under him with a base range of 20m an duration of 25s, enemies passing through will have a 50% chance of being staggered every second. Damage done by landslide will be transferred to every enemy on tectonics with 50% efficiency. In addition to that enemies hit by rumblers will have a 50% chance of being petrified for 6s while on tectonics. Casting this ability will cost 150 rubble. 

Tectonic fracture (Augment changes): Basically does the same thing, but with the new implementation and that the area and cost are now halved. 

Note: With this new ability atlas will have a reason to cast his 3. It will brings more synergy and gives a reason to also use rumbles outside of making them a distraction. 

 

Rumblers (small changes):

Spoiler

 

Rumblers are okay as of right now, but they could use some changes. For example higher enemy agro. 

Ability changes: As state earlier rumblers will have higher enemy aggro pull. Also while on tectonics rumblers will accumulate rubble based on enemies killed by atlas on tectonics (20 per enemy killed), which will be dropped by them on death. In addition to that they will prioritize enemies on tectonics. Casting rumblers will cost 300 rubble. 

Note: This will drastically increase the usefulness of rumblers in the battlefield, diverting damage done to atlas to them and feeding him with rubble. 

 

Final Words: 

Some of you might have noticed that I took some aspect of nidus and tried to apply them in a different way to Atlas, for example tectonics. This was because they have a sort of similar play style, though with this changes atlas will still feel a lot different to nidus.  

With this change atlas should become a much better frame, with more flexible CC that doesn’t hamper other players.  

So tenno what do you think? 

Edited by BlachWolf
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I love it! The 90% damage reduction by increasing his armour makes him viable for sortie level content. I personally think he needs more health to utilize this feature but your overall suggestion will boost the frame towards the respectable category. The tectonics replacement is also a good idea. The current variant is indeed useless. And lastly, if somehow DE agrees to let us deal status proc to petrified enemies even if the duration is halved, this will be an incredible form of utility for atlas. Great ideas bro! I would really like to see them in game! 

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I've been wondering how uncapping his passive completely would play out, I think armor increases get diminishing returns and you'd have to keep at it but I'd imagine that'd make his playstyle more active and his tankiness more reliable, plus it'd work better as an ability consumable. 

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24 minutes ago, Smoked_Black said:

I love it! The 90% damage reduction by increasing his armour makes him viable for sortie level content. I personally think he needs more health to utilize this feature but your overall suggestion will boost the frame towards the respectable category. The tectonics replacement is also a good idea. The current variant is indeed useless. And lastly, if somehow DE agrees to let us deal status proc to petrified enemies even if the duration is halved, this will be an incredible form of utility for atlas. Great ideas bro! I would really like to see them in game! 

You must be incredibly new or just inexperienced to believe that Atlas in his current state is not visible for sortie level content. I mean that as no disrespect to you.

The only thing about Atlas that should be worked on is tectonics and perhaps the effectiveness of Rumblers. 

Everything else suggested here are just buffs for the sake of making a strong frame stronger. It's like me saying Atlas needs a Sprint speed buff although by design he was given slow Sprint speed. He doesn't need it to be effective, but it would be welcomed for the sake of.

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8 hours ago, Smoked_Black said:

I love it! The 90% damage reduction by increasing his armour makes him viable for sortie level content. I personally think he needs more health to utilize this feature but your overall suggestion will boost the frame towards the respectable category. The tectonics replacement is also a good idea. The current variant is indeed useless. And lastly, if somehow DE agrees to let us deal status proc to petrified enemies even if the duration is halved, this will be an incredible form of utility for atlas. Great ideas bro! I would really like to see them in game! 

Thank you very much. Atlas was already sortie viable with this change I just wanted to remove the need for armor mods, basically the chroma treatment.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, -Bv-Concarne said:

I've been wondering how uncapping his passive completely would play out, I think armor increases get diminishing returns and you'd have to keep at it but I'd imagine that'd make his playstyle more active and his tankiness more reliable, plus it'd work better as an ability consumable. 

Every 300 armor you gain your modded hp as extra ehp, warframe doesnt have diminishing returns when it comes to armor.

Edited by BlachWolf

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

You must be incredibly new or just inexperienced to believe that Atlas in his current state is not visible for sortie level content. I mean that as no disrespect to you.

The only thing about Atlas that should be worked on is tectonics and perhaps the effectiveness of Rumblers. 

Everything else suggested here are just buffs for the sake of making a strong frame stronger. It's like me saying Atlas needs a Sprint speed buff although by design he was given slow Sprint speed. He doesn't need it to be effective, but it would be welcomed for the sake of.

The buff to his one is to let him have a small chance of dealing with armor, its not a huge buff cause you'll have to sacrifice a mod slot and thus lose on damage. The changes to his two is really more of a team buff, in my experience there is really nothing more annoying then a petrified / frosted / glassed corrupted heavy gunner at lvl 100 and up, with this change it will remove that annoyance and give him some better team synergy, the reduction on the duration is to balance it out. This also means you cant just go low duration, because his abilities will depend on it, thus reducing the power creep. But If I had to chose what needs to get a rework asap is his wall and rumblers as you said. Atlas was already sortie viable, but when compared to someone like khora who basically does the same thing but much better, he's left behind. With this rework I just wanted to bring him a bit higher in terms of power levels but not make him op. 

But none the less your criticism is valid, his one and two already do a good enough job till level 125 - 150.

Edited by BlachWolf

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20 hours ago, BlachWolf said:

The buff to his one is to let him have a small chance of dealing with armor, its not a huge buff cause you'll have to sacrifice a mod slot and thus lose on damage. The changes to his two is really more of a team buff, in my experience there is really nothing more annoying then a petrified / frosted / glassed corrupted heavy gunner at lvl 100 and up, with this change it will remove that annoyance and give him some better team synergy, the reduction on the duration is to balance it out. This also means you cant just go low duration, because his abilities will depend on it, thus reducing the power creep. But If I had to chose what needs to get a rework asap is his wall and rumblers as you said. Atlas was already sortie viable, but when compared to someone like khora who basically does the same thing but much better, he's left behind. With this rework I just wanted to bring him a bit higher in terms of power levels but not make him op. 

But none the less your criticism is valid, his one and two already do a good enough job till level 125 - 150.

Btw, I though of an idea to make Rumblers more viable. 

Make Rumblers do "True" damage to petrified targets.

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18 minutes ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

Btw, I though of an idea to make Rumblers more viable. 

Make Rumblers do "True" damage to petrified targets.

That would be a bit to op, Why actually give them a chance to petrify an enemy, this would Synergie well with his whole kit.

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On 2019-04-12 at 3:12 AM, BlachWolf said:

Half the duration and remove the status negation

On the contrary, this by far is the most OP thing in this thread. You're practically creating a second limbo.

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

On the contrary, this by far is the most OP thing in this thread. You're practically creating a second limbo.

Not really, the personification would last only 6s  which is basically as long as a knockback, just that it feeds atlases rubble. Nidus has something like that o with his larvas on his 4 so yeah I would say thats op. I mean even zephyr can do that with her 4.

Edit: It wouldnt scale with duration though, it would be a flat 6s.

Edited by BlachWolf

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1 minute ago, BlachWolf said:

Not really, the personification would last only 6s  which is basically as long as a knockback, just that it feeds atlases rubble. Nidus has something like that o with his larvas on his 4 so yeah I would say thats op. I mean even zephyr can do that with her 4.

Agree to disagree. Good luck on your thread.

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2 minutes ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

Agree to disagree. Good luck on your thread.

Same haha. Thx I just want to inspire DE to make some changes to Atlas before his prime comes out, so we dont have another chroma situation where only 2 of his abilities are good and the others are less then convenient / outright useless. 

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I like everything but the Rumbler cast cost is unjustified unless they triple his passive cap (yes, triple. the current decay is too high for them to cost THAT much).

 

I personally think that the decay should at the very least be halved. It is SUPER annoying to keep recasting petrify in front of a huge enemy crowd just to keep his survivability up. 

 

On a sidenote though, I'd prefer if tectonics would be reworked into a full defensive skill. He is already very offensive, no need for another skill to expand that. 

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4 minutes ago, Karu-QW said:

I like everything but the Rumbler cast cost is unjustified unless they triple his passive cap (yes, triple. the current decay is too high for them to cost THAT much).

In my rework there woundnt be any drain, the passive would be a resource that would be used for casting other abilities and tankiness.

5 minutes ago, Karu-QW said:

On a sidenote though, I'd prefer if tectonics would be reworked into a full defensive skill. He is already very offensive, no need for another skill to expand that. 

Well tectonics will still be a defensive skill because of the knock backs and synergy with his rumblers, it would just also benefit his one.

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On 2019-04-12 at 5:20 AM, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

You must be incredibly new or just inexperienced to believe that Atlas in his current state is not visible for sortie level content. I mean that as no disrespect to you.

The only thing about Atlas that should be worked on is tectonics and perhaps the effectiveness of Rumblers. 

Everything else suggested here are just buffs for the sake of making a strong frame stronger. It's like me saying Atlas needs a Sprint speed buff although by design he was given slow Sprint speed. He doesn't need it to be effective, but it would be welcomed for the sake of.

The thing is my friend, atlas lack a lot in terms of survivability and being an asset to his squad in my opinion. Firstly, his base hp is not enough to utilize his armour. He need more health to cope with that. Second, you spend more time healing him through his rubble rather than stacking up your armour unless an until you have a lot of spawn. In solo situations, the spawn is not enough for atlas to maintain his survivabilty through rubble even with the use of enemy radar. The only place he can potentially keep up to a certain extent is void fissure and he has a hard time in a t4 fissure once the enemy goes up to level 75+ in the void specifically where you have healers countering your landslide damage. The nullifiers create hindrances for his rumblers and petrify. Lastly, using a using a high efficiency build along with high ranges makes you sacrifice either your total ehp or your power strength. In order to quickly kill mobs you need decent power strength in order for the meele mods to benefit landslide. Low base value for power strength does affect his total dps in terms of landslide and rumblers.  

I supported the kit alterations for Atlas suggested by BlachWolf because I saw it generating some breathing room for atlas. You don't necessarily need energy pad or health pads to keep atlas functioning with his take on the buffs. It makes him sortie viable because in his current state this frame is sub par at best for sorties. Enemy modifiers take a toll on his total utility and so does the overall high level enemy damage and armour values. He starts falling of faster than most of our frames in these situations. I want this frame to be a front line tank for his squad and not chicken out when the enemy level starts to increase. His title suggests he the titan lord of stone. This description should not be limited to the title but to his actual performance as well.

I hope this clarifies what I meant. I never considered your comment to be a form of disrespect and I hope my words don't create that notion either. Thank you.

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38 minutes ago, Smoked_Black said:

The thing is my friend, atlas lack a lot in terms of survivability and being an asset to his squad in my opinion. Firstly, his base hp is not enough to utilize his armour. He need more health to cope with that. Second, you spend more time healing him through his rubble rather than stacking up your armour unless an until you have a lot of spawn. In solo situations, the spawn is not enough for atlas to maintain his survivabilty through rubble even with the use of enemy radar. The only place he can potentially keep up to a certain extent is void fissure and he has a hard time in a t4 fissure once the enemy goes up to level 75+ in the void specifically where you have healers countering your landslide damage. The nullifiers create hindrances for his rumblers and petrify. Lastly, using a using a high efficiency build along with high ranges makes you sacrifice either your total ehp or your power strength. In order to quickly kill mobs you need decent power strength in order for the meele mods to benefit landslide. Low base value for power strength does affect his total dps in terms of landslide and rumblers.  

I supported the kit alterations for Atlas suggested by BlachWolf because I saw it generating some breathing room for atlas. You don't necessarily need energy pad or health pads to keep atlas functioning with his take on the buffs. It makes him sortie viable because in his current state this frame is sub par at best for sorties. Enemy modifiers take a toll on his total utility and so does the overall high level enemy damage and armour values. He starts falling of faster than most of our frames in these situations. I want this frame to be a front line tank for his squad and not chicken out when the enemy level starts to increase. His title suggests he the titan lord of stone. This description should not be limited to the title but to his actual performance as well.

I hope this clarifies what I meant. I never considered your comment to be a form of disrespect and I hope my words don't create that notion either. Thank you.

Couldnt have put it better myself. Atlas self sustain is bad, his ehp is to low (adaptation helps a lot though) and his to restrictive to his team. With this rework I was aiming to remove those uneeded limitations and give his kit a bit more flair.

Edit: Without making him overpowered.

Edited by BlachWolf

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2 hours ago, Smoked_Black said:

hope this clarifies what I meant

My effectiveness with a Warframe isn't determined by their skills alone but by the synergies created to compliment their ability.

This is what has always separated the less experienced, from the vets. 

When a Warframe has a weakness (which is not a bad thing) I don't use to the forums to complain, I look for clever ways to mitigate the issue. 

With an issue as simplistic as healing, there are several avenues to take for Atlas. However, it's quite evident that if it's not in a YouTube video, there are no solutions.

Sorry if the post sounds arrogant, but the difference in experience makes all of the difference here. I understood your positioning from your initial post and I just disagree. Where you struggle to keep Atlas active in sorties, I complete them effortlessly.

 

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You sir are my saving grace! been playing atlas since mr 3(bought him btw) way back, for atleast 500hrs, he used to be my main, but as i have done all of star charts, i stopped playing him, because i realized that his kit is only good with the star charts. For playing hundreds of hours on atlas, i already knew his strength and also his weakness. Sad to say his strength is mediocre but his weakness is huge. Been shouting a buff for is 1 and 3 for over a year now. And then here comes his rework where he gave him survivability and healing where he doesnt need it. Been shouting for his 1 to be able to use shattering impact and his 2 to let status apply even months vefore his rework. Why cant atlas have a good skill without obvious limitations, why cant atlas have chromas awesome damage,  octavias scaling damage, revenants scaling drain damage, ivaras permanent invinsibility, etc.

I knnow what people are going to say in squidward's voice: "his 1 deals a ton of damage", his tectonics block enemy fires or objectives from damage", "his petrify is good cc tho". Shut the b*llsh*t mate. I can assure you that theres a f*ck ton of primaries,secondaries and melee,  that can hard out damage, and out value his 1. His 3? A cc that the negative outweighs the positive. Try using atlas in high level armored grineer with a squad, 100% they will tell you to stop using petrify. Now you cant say that to octavia stop using mallet, you cant say that to harrow to stop using covenant, you cant say that to frost to stop using snow globe, only atlas can make you the S#&$tiest proud warframe tenno in the game.

What im trying to say is that the kit that they made for atlas has obviously big potential to be at same level with those frames i just mentioned, but yet they chose to put very narrow limitations to his skill set. Why wouldnt you allow status on a cc'd body while other warframes easily have better versions of this very limited skill? Why would you not let shattering impact to work on atlas while other frames can easily, very easily strip armor from 100 to 0 regardless of enemy level(like nyx, ash, etc.). Why? And they buffed him on places where he doesnt really needed a buff on. Like WTF. 

Basically, i stopped playing him the moment im really sure that DE hate this frame. When they put limitations on Atlas where they didnt put on other warframes.

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