[Warframe Rework Suggestion] Vauban: Grenades. Mines, and Forts {Response on Devstream 126 and Update 24.5.0 Patch Note Statement}

[FoxFX]

OVERVIEW

This will be my take on a Vauban rework. After some time looking up his current playstyle, I had to consider a lot of issues that even DE has addressed and problems that could be easily noticed if Vauban is in more late-game content including Sorties/Plains:

• [LINK TO DEVSTREAM 126] From the previous Devstream, [DE] has stated the "Pure CC" style Vauban has had throughout the game has been outdated and overshadowed by Warframes that can do Damage + CC and his utility was focused more on older versions of Warframe.

• Vauban's survivability depends mostly on his Crowd Control alone and he does not fair too well against ranged enemy attacks. His Crowd Control can also risk slowing down certain game modes where killing enemies can be important. Most missions in general do involve defeating enemies at times.

• Vauban's current kit is not so engaging as it potentially just leaves enemy open to attack all the time. For some of the newer and some of the "properly" reworked Warframes that have a certain flow into their kit where each four abilities that have have a purpose to use in combat. With Vauban, most would just spam Bastille or Vortex all over the place which can get rather repetitive.

 

GOAL AND RESTRICTIONS ON THIS REWORK

• [BASED ON DE'S STANCE ON AUTOMATED ABILITIES AND ON PATCH NOTE 24.5.0 Section "Next Step"] I will NOT suggest turrets nor recommend Vauban have turrets in his kit. There is also mentioned issues on AI from Warframe powers which is also why I feel the "Roller Tesla" wouldn't be such an advisable idea. We also have to consider how a turret's damage scaling could be as similar as Chroma's Effigy. DE would prefer Warframe powers consisting of keeping player's engaged in their abilities and in the fight.

• This rework will attempt to give Vauban some extra punching power. His theme involves setting up traps/mines and throwing grenades at enemies so some scaling could be provided.

• Give Vauban a chance to improve his self-defense in tougher missions while remaining true to his playstyle.

• Try to limit the amount of Crowd Control he has so the rest of his kit could also bring in some punch power and some team-based support to the table.

 

THE METHOD I TAKE FOR REWORKING WARFRAMES

When it comes to suggesting reworks, I try to classify all abilities based on one or more roles each ability has. For Vauban, I will try to limit each ability for Vauban to contain at MOST three roles in each ability I then rank each role based on the Energy cost of the ability.

• DAMAGE - ranking the ability's damage dealing

• CROWD CONTROL - how effective the ability can stall enemies

• HEALING - self explanatory, healing

• SELF DEFENSIVE SUPPORT - armor buffing, protective coating

• SELF OFFENSIVE SUPPORT - attack buffing

• TEAM DEFENSIVE SUPPORT

• TEAM OFFENSIVE SUPPORT

• MOBILITY - abilities that allow a Warframe to move around the place

• ENEMY STAT DEBUFF - reduces enemy defenses, offenses, speed, etc.

• RESOURCE SUPPORT - improves drop rates in some way

• WALL - creates structures that can either prevent enemy attacks or themselves from going through

• UTILITY - provides something outside of the norm from the other roles

 

Quote

OPTIONAL PASSIVE CHANGE - REINFORCE OPTION #1

Vauban's knowledge of explosives and grenades prepares himself defensively. Gains 40% Damage Reduction while a grenade erupts or a mine/trap is within 15 meters from Vauban. This works with both enemies and his own grenades and mines/traps as well. This effect lingers on Vauban for 6 seconds.

OPTIONAL PASSIVE CHANGE - REINFORCE OPTION #2

Vauban's knowledge of explosives and grenades prepares himself defensively. Each trap/mine 15 meters from Vauban grants him 20% Damage Reduction (max 80% Damage Reduction).

The idea for this passive is to make Vauban prepare himself for explosions whenever a bomb or mine is nearby Vauban. In terms of enemies, they all have some grenade/trap ability including the Infested (Mutalist MOAs and Crawler variants are prime suspects). But if you feel doing more damage is a more secure passive for Vauban, you can leave this idea out as it is an optional suggestion.

 

NEW ABILITY #1 - FRAG

FRAG - ENERGY 25	EFFECT	AFFECTED BY
Roles: DAMAGE(20) , CROWD CONTROL(5)	Lobs 3/4/4/5 Blast mines . Triggers 1 second after an enemy is within their radius. If Vauban successfully attaches any of the Frags to an enemy, the bomb will deal damage based on a portion of its Health + Armor.	STRENGTH, RANGE, DURATION

Removing the single target likelihood of Vauban's Tesla for a bundle of mines Vauban throws down . Either by setting it up as a group of mines or successfully attaching one or two to an enemy for massive damage. The scaling out of an enemy's Health and other defensive stat has been used before for a first ability (prime example is Oberon's Smite). The main difference with Frag is that it scales off more if the enemy has Armor. Comparing damages if a max rank Frag takes 35% of an enemy's HP/Armor total as an example:

• Level 80 Lancer (HP: 9461, Armor: 1146) = 3712 Blast Damage

• Level 80 Ancient Healer (HP: 37846) = 13246 Blast Damage

• Level 80 Tech Crewman (HP: 45062, Shield: 8171) = 15771 Blast Damage

• Level 80 Heavy Gunner (HP: 23628, Armor: 4949) = 10001 Blast Damage

• Level 80 Bomber (HP: 26292, Armor: 5390) = 110887 Blast Damage

A final version of this ability could replace the enemy stat scaling to have it affected by Secondary Damage Mods (outside of Multishot), and Status/Crit Mods.

 

NEW ABILITY #2 - JAMMER

JAMMER - ENERGY 50	EFFECT	AFFECTED BY
Roles:  CROWD CONTROL(25), RESOURCE SUPPORT(25)	Jams enemy weapons and disabling enemy robots temporarily. Melee enemies are briefly stunned. Each enemy affected have a chance to drop resources (Ammo, Energy Orb, Health Orb).	DURATION, RANGE

A resource support in the form of a strong Crowd Control (Infested have Mutalist MOAs that CAN be disabled through this (tested with Mag's Counter Pulse Augment but this doesn't work on Mutalist Ospreys for some reason). There is a chance for each enemy stunned by Jammer to drop resources to balance out the heavy CC it offers for ranged enemy types. This ability can act as a mine as well.

 

ABILITY #3 - BASTILLE

BASTILLE- ENERGY 75	EFFECT	AFFECTED BY
Roles:  WALL (25), TEAM DEFENSIVE SUPPORT (40), UTILITY (10)	Creates an impassible containment field which can be used to trap enemies or defend objectives. Bastille absorbs enemy projectiles and prevents enemy entry/exit. Allies crossing Bastille's wall get a low duration of invulnerability (with a cooldown). (Only 1 Bastille on the field at a time)	DURATION, RANGE

Trading away the multiple of Bastiles to give the ability away to protect allies from damage more (though in this version,the duration maybe adjusted). Bastille converges bringing enemies together opening opportunity for Frag to land on a few enemies inside. The crossing through Bastille granting invulnerability is a unique team support for allies to take advantage of in case there are more difficult enemies approaching. Bastille's definition means (prison or fort) which I feel this version encompasses both of those definitions while remaining effective. Following all of the current defensive walls in game:

Quote

 

Atlas’ Tectonics - Impassible wall with health, can be recovered with Atlas’ 3rd and make for a stronger rolling projectile

Frost’s Snow Globe - stacking health dome, CC’s enemies inside with slow, pushes away enemies at cast, up to 4 can be placed at a time

Gara’s Mass Vitrify - Impassible Health Dome, sections break off instead of the whole, glasses enemies preventing status but they receive more damage

Khora’s Strangledome - passable no-health dome, grabs enemies nearby, uses enemies as “barrier” while they can receive damage from incoming fire, up to 2 can be placed at a time, enemies hanged receive more damage

Limbo’s Cataclysm -  passable dome, supports allies with energy regeneration, entities cannot be damaged from opposite plains, Stasis makes inside dome a hard CC

Volt’s Electric Shield -  somewhat passable wall if not affected by Shock, up to 6 can be placed at a time, Shock turns the shield into a CC, can be picked up and run with

 

For this Bastille compared to the rest: Impassible Dome with the ability to grant allies and Vauban temporary invulnerability when crossing its borders. Effective prison ability for bomb tactics or locking out CC-immune enemies.

 

NEW ABILITY #4 - CLUSTER

CLUSTER- ENERGY 100	EFFECT	AFFECTED BY
Roles:DAMAGE(30), UTILITY (30), ENEMY STAT DEBUFF (40)	Vauban spreads around himself a field of floating Tesla Mines. Enemies hit by these mines receive Electric Damage and have their Shield and Armor reduced by XX% temporarily. Tesla Mines last for XX seconds and tend to home in on enemies X meters away. Hold down this ability to increase the amount of mines created and the radius of the field.	DAMAGE, DURATION, RANGE

Vauban's fourth plays out as a more spread-out are denial and has a stronger debuff effect that many liked about Shred but better due to being able to reduce both enemy Shields and Armor. While waiting for enemies to run into mines can be inconvenient for some, I decided that these floating mines can have the perk of seeking enemies nearby.

 

INTENDED PLAYSTYLE

• The main burst damage Vauban has is skillfully landing a Frag on enemies.

  • With effects of Jammer, a tough ranged enemy can be an open opportunity to land a strong AOE damage

  • With Bastille, the prison constricts its size to make it easier to handle multiple enemies at a time.

• Cluster will be the area denial Vauban can display creating trap areas severely debuffing enemies that pass through them.

• Placing Bastille at Vauban's feet creates a quick defensive barrier for him and his allies against ranged attacks. Cross through Bastille's walls tactically to take advantage of the invulnerability against tougher enemies but be wary of the cooldown after the cross over.

 

OPTIONAL AUGMENTS

Quote

 

FRAG {CONCUSSIVE FRAG} : Frag deafens and confuses enemies nearby temporarily.

JAMMER {DUST JAM}: Jammer leaves behind particles reducing enemy accuracy.

BASTILLE {REPELLING BASTILLE}: Bastille will reflect enemy attacks from its walls.

CLUSTER {STIFLING CLUSTER}: Enemies hit by cluster are immobilized and temporarily stuck to the floor

CLUSTER {CLUSTER LINK}: Cluster mines X meters near each other form energy beams dealing damage to enemies crossing them.

CLUSTER {FLASH CLUSTER}: Each exploding Cluster mine temporarily blinds enemies.

 

 

OPTIONAL ABILITIES

Quote

 

[WHITE HOLE/BLACK HOLE GRENADE]: Tap to create a black hole Vortex dragging enemies to its epicenter and absorbing enemy projectiles (no ragdolling). Hold to create a white hole Vortex pushing enemies to its epicenter and reflecting damage.

[TEMPORAL FIELD]: Grenade creates a dome of temporal energy reducing all damage done to allies inside and slowing down projectile speed. Allies inside the field hit by enemies can gain stacking Evasion which lingers for a few seconds outside of the field.

[TETHER MINE]: Prevents up to X enemies from moving a certain radius from the tether mine and lowers their damage output.

[TESLA FIELD]: Mine behaving a similar manner to Sapping Mines, but each pulse improves the damage of the Tesla Field per enemy hit inside.

 

 

FEEDBACK SUGGESTIONS

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• Have Vauban "carry" Bastille for some mobile effect (some restrictions may apply) - @KingOfPredators

 

Edited April 28, 2019 by FoxFX

[FoxFX]

I'd like to explain further on the reasons for these suggestions and the mindset on how this could improve Vauban's speed and his performance as a trapper-themed Warframe.

[FoxFX]

FURTHER REASON ON WHY TURRETS FOR VAUBAN COULD HURT HIM MORE THAN HELP

Much of the suggestions floating around is to give Vauban a turret ability and in my perspective it is rather unclear if this is more of a serious notion or something out of how the gaming world treats "engineers." Although considering how automated abilities have been handled in Warframe, I can consider rejecting the idea that a turret would make him better.

We have to understand that [DE]'s Warframe design as of late desire for Warframes to build themselves up so they can scale in combat. Whether it is through absorbing blood through Garuda's playstyle, gaining Mutations through nidus's playstyle, rewarding Headshot tactics with Harrow, having a near endless energy supply and access to a strong support style from Hildryn, etc. All these above tier Warframes have this sort of "build themselves in combat to excels" essence to them, and I can't see an automated ability to be designed this way.

Turrets could either be as low scaling as Chroma's Effigy.

If such a turret could scale, it would eventually lead to a major camping/leaching situation with defensive abilities like Limbo's Cataclysm being used.

There is also a lot of talk on the major downsides of AI-guided abilities or summons (which I would like to talk more on the idea of "Roller Tesla" and why that may not work).

Al in all, I feel that asking for some ability that could potentially "do most of the work for us" isn't something in [DE]'s design vision at this point. We would need to adapt some of our mindset and see how to solve some of the problems the more outdated Warframes have.

[FoxFX]

IN TOPIC OF GIVING VAUBAN AN EXALTED WEAPON

I have started to realize that much of the community's opinion is that there may be too many Exalted-type abilities in the game, and that giving one to Vauban could potentially solve his pacing issues but could also be seen as a lazy suggestion. This does not mean that it is by all means a bad suggestion, but there are other ways this could be done.

With the Frag ability I have suggested, I have shown an ability where skillfully placing a Frag on an enemy causes it to deal more damage. Another could be having it work off of Primary/Secondary Mods like Atlas's Landslide and Khora's Whipclaw does.

But these are all just examples to how some of Vauban's kit can be done.

[FoxFX]

FURTHER NOTES ON THE FIRST ABILITY SUGGESTION - FRAG

 

• Tesla had major problems not just because of its 1 enemy at a time function, but also for the lack of impact it had on the battlefield as well as the speed of Vauban's ability style
• Vauban's style requires him to lob grenades and mines and in most cases it would be fine to do so if the after effects paid off
• Having Frag make Vauban throw down bundles of mines in-front creates a first ability that helps Vauban handle multiple enemies more efficiently even with the slow arc-speed of his grenade tactics
• This ability could scale through the Enemy's stats or by being affected by a Weapon Mod Build starting Vauban's stand to reach to the effectiveness of the newer meta of Warframe
• This could also be described as a Zarr firing attachable mines in this ability

[(PSN)ForNoPurpose]

3/4 abilities totally replaced? 

No matter how you justify or support it i cannot see any of this as a good idea as i cannot see DE going that far EVER.

[LascarCapable]

6 hours ago, (PS4)ForNoPurpose said:

3/4 abilities totally replaced? 

No matter how you justify or support it i cannot see any of this as a good idea as i cannot see DE going that far EVER.

Too bad you don't like it, because his ideas aren't that bad at all. That rework was far from being conservative, but OP tried to adress every single issue the best he could. If his post wasn't useful as a Vauban rework, it could be useful for something else as well.

I mean, it has everything a Vauban rework needs : survivability mechanics, a decent attempt at solving issues with overlapping abilities and more diversity of actions.

[FoxFX]

3 hours ago, (PS4)ForNoPurpose said:

3/4 abilities totally replaced? 

No matter how you justify or support it i cannot see any of this as a good idea as i cannot see DE going that far EVER.

 However, from Devstream #126, [DE] has stated that they are considering going THAT far. The link proving their future intentions with him are in the link provided in the OP. I'd invite you to check out everything they have said.

[FoxFX]

I am currently in the works on a Nyx article, but I will explain the remaining ability suggestions further as time passes on.

[FoxFX]

FURTHER NOTES ON THE SECOND ABILITY SUGGESTION - JAMMER

 

• Vauban's current Minelayer has a lot of problems namely on its effects and of the speed it requires to make an impact on the battlefield. With Ivara, the Quiver ability worked well namely because she has access to self-protection right off the bat with either her first option of Quiver or Prowl. Vauban doesn't have access to any sort of self-protective tech as of now.
• There are practically a few appealing Minelayer options (Shred and Concuss), but even those are hardly used with the way the game is now. You are surrounded by enemies coming at you from all angles and a LOT of times it feels more efficient to just spam Bastille and Vortex all over to handle the situation.
• Jammer contains a hard Crowd Control effect with a Team Resource Support effect which force drops resources to all affected enemies in Jammer's range. Giving Vauban a means to support himself and allies can improve his appeal in many other missions much more.
• Jammer also leaves some interesting options for augments to work into. Currently there are no Augments for Vauban's 2nd, but the possibilities for Jammer's augment is a lot more various than one can perceive (have Jammer create special utility on hacking consoles, or have Jammer drop something no other ability can ever drop, or have Jammer have a chance to instead confuse enemy robotics)

[FoxFX]

FURTHER NOTES ON THE THIRD ABILITY SUGGESTION - BASTILLE

 

• One of the most consistent abilities in Vauban's arsenal used mostly to stall threats and protect areas, but it does tend to get used a LOT
• The hardest part making this suggestion was to consist essences of both Vortex and Bastille into one.
  • Bastille's large AOE makes it still a viable Crowd Control even up to this point in the game, the only major drawback is the limit of enemies it can contain. Removing the limit of enemies it can control would require a sacrifice or else it would be too powerful of a crowd control ability.
  • Vortex is basically used due to containing all threats in a specific area, the problem right now being that it seems unaffected by range mods
  • Both Vortex and Bastille will always be in competition with each other as to which is the better CC. Combining the two abilities into one was the initial intention for this suggestion
• Having Bastille be a protective wall serves the MAJOR WEAKNESS Vauban currently has: enemy ranged attacks. Vauban does not have a stat viable to take much damage (even his Prime counterpart has stats similar to Equinox), so having it be limited to one Bastille but also making it a very solid and strong impassible wall covers that weakness and gives Vauban a further supportive role in the battlefield.
• This is doubled with the sole reason most players favor "Repelling Bastille" as they rather keep enemies away from areas Bastille covers inside. With this Bastille rework suggestion, you leave the opportunity open for a new Bastille Augment which can be something like a reflective wall or something else entirely.
• The invulnerability after passing through was added to spice up the supportive role Vauban has, and it is one that can play out well for Vauban and his allies asa defensive utility.

[FoxFX]

FURTHER NOTES ON THE FOURTH ABILITY SUGGESTION - CLUSTER

 

• Cluster serves a special purpose for Vauban as a zone debuff ability. Initially, Vauban's playstyle revolves around placing mines all over the map. But as the game progresses, enemies started to appear that were immune to crowd control, heavily armored, enemies that consistently teleport or were to fast to counter in usual ways of old. There was also the problem of mines being relatively ineffective against enemies that could fly.
• Cluster becomes a floating minefield that covers a trap field that both land and flying enemies can trigger and be debuffed with.
• The debuff Cluster inflicts is similar to the powerful debuff of Nyx's 2nd ability only that you have to either wait for enemies to come and it can do minimal damage.
• The possible synergy and other ability interactions Cluster can have can vary to having Bastille push Cluster mines from its epicenter turning them into something of a Radial Javelin-like attack or have Jammer affect the mines in some unique way. 

[FoxFX]

COMMENT ON USING THE "ABILITY ROLE" METHOD OF SUGGESTION ABILITY REWORK

I have found this method to be perhaps the most practical method to looking into how most abilities in Warframe are designed around. An in-depth look into each ability in Warframe arrived in a conclusion that all Warframe Abilities optimally have 3-4 roles in each of their effects and no more. It also helped that I use the Energy required in an ability slot to balance out the effects and duration of each ability.

This method also made me realize about certain abilities in Warframe that are relatively packed with more roles than they are used to when it came to Augments. Ember's Accelerant Augment is a prime example with the following roles in it:

Crowd Control, Enemy Debuff, Team Offensive Support, Self Utility, Self Offensive Support

It also showed me multiple abilities that have the same Ability Roles in them. I restricted that each four Warframe abilities should best not have 3 or more contain the same role or it would result in one of those abilities used more. Ember once again shows this:

Fireball, Fire Blast, World on Fire: Damage

For now, I'd hope to use this method for the following next Rework article, the next being Nyx.

[FoxFX]

THOUGHTS ON A SENTINEL COMPANION PASSIVE FOR VAUBAN

I am not entirely sold on this idea namely due to the reliance of AI which has shown problems in this game even today, and as to them benefiting players more with utility-based effects rather than damaging effects. If they make it too hard-hitting they would need to trade it off for something else. We also need to be cautious on the current issues Khora's Companion passive currently has in the game and how that could be similar to a similar effect o Vauban.

I feel that a Sentinel Companion passive may come with a DIFFERENT Warframe in the near future, but as to which Warframe that maybe is up to DE to decide on.

[FoxFX]

On 2019-04-18 at 4:35 AM, D20 said:

Too bad you don't like it, because his ideas aren't that bad at all. That rework was far from being conservative, but OP tried to adress every single issue the best he could. If his post wasn't useful as a Vauban rework, it could be useful for something else as well.

I mean, it has everything a Vauban rework needs : survivability mechanics, a decent attempt at solving issues with overlapping abilities and more diversity of actions.

Thanks again for the consideration. I am glad we both managed to work together and think through on this. Here is to hoping on Vauban's future.

[KingOfPredators]

This rework would not address elephant in the room. Surviving between point A and point B.

For better or worse, I played Vauban outside of raids only because vortex provides insane amount of damage.

 

I stopped playing Vauban because I got tired of dying from enemies by just looking in my direction, especially after passive got changed.

[Teridax68]

I very much like this proposal. Beyond the specifics of each ability, I'm also personally a big fan of getting rid of Minelayer, as I think quiver-type abilities in general tend to offer far fewer useful options than they promise, and Vauban's in particular is full of crap right now. Onto the specifics:

• Damage reduction doesn't really excite me as a mechanic, but in this context it would be much more solid than Vauban's piddly armor passive.
• I think Frag mines would be much more impactful and fun to deploy than Teslas, as one of the problems with the ability right now is that they have their damage spread out over too long a duration.
• Jammer makes decent sense for a tech frame, and gives some unique crowd control that isn't as readily available on other frames. 
• Bastille would be much more interactive as an impassible wall, rather than a mass stun, so that works for me.
• Cluster by itself I think is a fine ability, but I feel it overlaps in function a little with Frag. I think there's some interesting gameplay that could had with Vortex if it were made better at pulling enemies over larger areas, particularly since warping enemies into a specific area would synergize particularly well with the above kit.

[FoxFX]

19 hours ago, KingOfPredators said:

This rework would not address elephant in the room. Surviving between point A and point B.

 

Perhaps you can elaborate on what you mean by this. I believe the suggestions I did for Bastille and Vauban's optional passive replacement assists in a situation you mention here.

[KingOfPredators]

Vauban's old passive (which was more useful then current one) had issue of not giving you armor while on the move, which resulted in more energy drain or going down faster. Once you set up your CCs, you will be fine, but because of the delays for activation, vauban does not have any protection while moving around. For example, Mag can use pull, banshee have silence, some frames are just tanky, some have stealth...

Currently, both vortex and bastille have delay, so by the time it activates you already passed the point of activation. Passive you suggested suffers from same issue as the old one. Jammer for example looks like strong CC, so I don't see it as fast cast or instant effect.

Traps/deployables only did not worked well so far. I think it is safe to say that vauban should stop being one trick pony.

This suggestion would make him stronger because abilities are generally stronger (-removal of vortex since melee is strong with it). Question is, would these changes make him more appealing for playing? Playstyle would be identical which is static. Turret idea is popular but turret supports playstyle that made me stop playing vauban...

Additionally, as Teridax already said, frag+vortex could make nice combo since frag itself would be scalable..

Just a thought while I was writing this, ability/augment to pick up suggested bastille at the cost off CC, radius and maybe one hand could make Vauban a decent tank and more dynamic playstyle.

[FoxFX]

14 hours ago, KingOfPredators said:

Vauban's old passive (which was more useful then current one) had issue of not giving you armor while on the move, which resulted in more energy drain or going down faster. Once you set up your CCs, you will be fine, but because of the delays for activation, vauban does not have any protection while moving around. For example, Mag can use pull, banshee have silence, some frames are just tanky, some have stealth... 

Currently, both vortex and bastille have delay, so by the time it activates you already passed the point of activation. Passive you suggested suffers from same issue as the old one. Jammer for example looks like strong CC, so I don't see it as fast cast or instant effect.

Traps/deployables only did not worked well so far. I think it is safe to say that vauban should stop being one trick pony.

This suggestion would make him stronger because abilities are generally stronger (-removal of vortex since melee is strong with it). Question is, would these changes make him more appealing for playing? Playstyle would be identical which is static. Turret idea is popular but turret supports playstyle that made me stop playing vauban... 

Additionally, as Teridax already said, frag+vortex could make nice combo since frag itself would be scalable..

Just a thought while I was writing this, ability/augment to pick up suggested bastille at the cost off CC, radius and maybe one hand could make Vauban a decent tank and more dynamic playstyle.

 

When it comes to Vauban having self-protection on the move, I have considered many angles which he could get that from. While the passive I presented is optional and work alongside both his own and enemy mines/grenades/traps, it is not as situational as some of the other passives the older Warframes currently have for example the wall latching of Loki.

There was an idea I had which was called "explosive fragments" which allowed Vauban's grenade explosions on enemies with armor/shield drop pickups for himself and allies where they gain armor/shield respectively depending on the enemy's protection type. I held back on that idea to keep the theme approach I was going for this rework and also due to some discussions I had online about the idea.

The other was to have bomb explosions provide "Iron Skin" like protection coating as pickups from Vauban's 4th ability (though there would be a limit to this protection).

I understand fully the sentiment on keeping Vauban a "one-trick pony" and how it can be a bland playstyle, but I wish to remain with this until more information comes in on what [DE] has intended for Vauban's rework.

That being said, due to [DE]'s stance on AI-guided abilities and the reported issues of friendly AI's, I will not support the idea of turrets with this. While there is a way to do a scalable one which [DE] might allow, but with a MAJOR limit and drawback.

The carrying Bastille idea I will update on the OP as a possible augment. I'm not too sure how some of the readers here would react to the idea of it though.

[FoxFX]

Updated OP with a feedback suggestion section.

[FoxFX]

I am now in the process of working a new thread on either Nyx or a new content concept. I will soon discuss which should be posted first before the end of the day, but please feel free to talk more about your experience with Vauban here more if you can.

[FoxFX]

I'll soon make some points addressing Mirage's 2nd ability and how its execution and effect in relation to the current status of Vauban.

[K_Shiro]

I don't think a radical overhaul is needed or even reasonable for Vauban. Switching out an ability for a completely different one already happened in the past (i think) but I doubt they would do it.

Personally I would like him to at least warrant the hardship you need to normally go through to get him. As in getting him from alerts back then made him a treasure, and even now it's quiet a bit of a task. And costly in nw creds. And he is not really that useful.

Ability1: Mine - Does the tesla effect, deals electric dmg, and slows the enemy.

Ability2: Distort - Throws an energy ball to target area that explodes, dealing minor electric dmg and causing enemies to take increased dmg from all sources for a time.

Ability3: Bastille - Unchanged except the removal of the limit on the number of affected enemies.

Ability4: Vortex - Unchanged.

I can think of a number of spec mods too that could twist his abilities a tad, like making bastille also lower enemy resistances but for now I would be happy with just this and since most of it is not really that different from what we have now I don't think it would be a problem to actually implement these changes.

 

Yea, it's just a nerd wishing aloud. Sort of.

[FoxFX]

On 2019-05-01 at 1:39 PM, K_Shiro said:

I don't think a radical overhaul is needed or even reasonable for Vauban. Switching out an ability for a completely different one already happened in the past (i think) but I doubt they would do it.

Personally I would like him to at least warrant the hardship you need to normally go through to get him. As in getting him from alerts back then made him a treasure, and even now it's quiet a bit of a task. And costly in nw creds. And he is not really that useful.

Ability1: Mine - Does the tesla effect, deals electric dmg, and slows the enemy.

Ability2: Distort - Throws an energy ball to target area that explodes, dealing minor electric dmg and causing enemies to take increased dmg from all sources for a time.

Ability3: Bastille - Unchanged except the removal of the limit on the number of affected enemies.

Ability4: Vortex - Unchanged.

I can think of a number of spec mods too that could twist his abilities a tad, like making bastille also lower enemy resistances but for now I would be happy with just this and since most of it is not really that different from what we have now I don't think it would be a problem to actually implement these changes.

 

Yea, it's just a nerd wishing aloud. Sort of.

 

Any insight is good. It just brings us closer to realizing what we have currently seen from Vauban and what we can expect out of him.

Radical changes has happened mostly to the Warframes of the older generation (Excalibur -> Super Jump, Ember -> her Damage Reduction Ability, Zephyr -> the removal of Divebomb integrating it into Tailwind, LIMBO -> the removal of Rift Walk and integrating it into his dodge roll). The current popular consensus is that Vauban's kit was the most effective BEFORE the release of Parkour 2.0 game and since then, there are other newer Warframes and reworked Warframes that are performing much better than Vauban in whatever role he has now.