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Why not just fix host migrations? I just lost 4.5k endo and several other rewards because the host decided to go 'oh welp i'm dead not gonna wait for people to revive me' and left.

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4 minutes ago, (PS4)deathstroke_dom said:

Yayyy!! what a smart move ! Now I can play arbitration as a host with my Banshee and I'm sure that the squad mates would risk their life for me 😀😍

Not on the same platform on you to begin with but I woudl literally leave you to die and block you so I could not see any of your complaints about not being revived if you made them XD. Just as I will do to anyone who tries that on me on the Xbox version. That is if I even partake in them with a group and not just go in solo as a tank frame and do it that way because it would be easier and less stressful.

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1 minute ago, (PS4)deathstroke_dom said:

But they included revives for a reason 😢 so that all squishy players with the worst load out can start playing END GAME . Show your love to a fellow tenno

I think I will not do that and let those who die in a place they should not be in the first place so easily to stay dead. the point of the mode was originally for it to not have revives and I will continue to play it as such. Hopefully others do as well!

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Here's what I'd suggest to make arbitration's good:

1. Reduce the length of rotations to be the same as regular missions (5 minutes for defence/survival).
2. To counter the increased amount of endo/essence this will give, half the amount of endo you get per rotation and double the cost of all items in the vitus essence store.
3. Remove the drones, seriously nobody likes them.
4. Increase enemy spawn rate and their starting levels, i'd suggest at least level 80 for rotation A.
5. Make it more obvious that arbitration's exist as there's no mention of them anywhere in the game until you unlock the star chart. A lot of people I've spoken to didn't even know about arbitration's and had no intention of completing the star chart because of crappy defection/archwing missions. Adding a warframe to the vitus essence store would help a lot as people would look up where to farm it.
6. Consider adding rewards that will make people want to come back once they no longer need endo. perhaps add fully built forma or relics to the store as those items are always going to be useful.

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Posted (edited)

TL:DR: Swing & a miss
1. too much grind, RNG and tedium for too little reward vs time spent (changes will make this WORSE).
2. This set of changes is a guarantee me and my mates will never touch the mode again no matter the rewards.
3. Growing concern Warframe has moved into creating tedious grind for the sake of drawing out player play time, as opposed to reasonable grind as a means to an end (Ephemera, Aura forma, Riven rerolling etc).


Issues (2 original mode ones, 3 from these changes):

  1. Reward rotation time: Time is a premium for most older players; add in rewards being mostly Endo A: 90.5% B: 88% & C 81.5%? Other ways of getting it faster PLUS other rewards.
  2. Host migration. I get why (it'd be horrific for DE to host every instance across 4 platforms) but still. Long rewards game mode, risking losing everything if host drops? No ta.
  3. Increased scaling. The draw was repeated rotation C....for a lot of people, the scaling means either toxicity for failure, or not even getting there.
  4. Aura forma - given how much aura choice can be restricted by builds or vice versa, sticking a super low % drop super useful item behind such a time consuming mode? No. Not rewarding that. This seriously isn't cool.
  5. Getting crippled to revive people - combined with the extra scaling this is going to be miserable.


Sorry DE, really enjoy Warframe and appreciate DE's approach as a company (esp given the industry as a whole atm), but as a long time player after slowly hunting down most weapons/frames/pets etc? the majority of things I'm left with are all super low drop %, high plat cost alternative or with no other way of getting them (Hate, normal Detron, new fist weapon - at least Lato Vandal parts etc are tradable if expensive!). Add in the removal of casual alerts (they were useful for quickly hopping on and having a 1 shot random something to hop onto), and gating new frame/weapon build improvements behind ever increasing RNG?

If you keep this route, you're going to bleed all but the most hardcore older players as they feel their time isn't being respected, and new player retention will suck as layered systems are so numerous and convoluted and poorly explained in game without a Veteran to help on top of also feeling their time isn't respected.

Edited by ThrynValravn

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I'm flabbergasted that THIS is what you guys thought was the problem with Arbitrations. It's really hard to believe. But then again, we have two 60 minutes survivals and a 40 wave defense on Nightwave this week. Apparently ridiculously drawn out and tedious tasks == engaged players for some reason.

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I'm going to be frank - I can already tell by these changes that it's going to be tedious, and it's getting me to grind for sake of a unique forma, more Vitus Essense and perhaps other new goods.

I'm not going to enjoy doing Arbitrations solely on the fact that there are unique goods that I want in that gamemode when the slog towards them is uninteresting, boring most likely. Plus the absurdly low rate for that Aura Forma that'll be worthless once everyone has it, assuming in an ideal situation that people will have it all and then look back and realize that was too tedious for something that was asked for long ago.

I'm going to be frank again - make the aura forma MUCH more common, uncommon at least. Make the gameplay of Arbitrations fun to play, and you will have made some improvements with the game mode-- in my opinion.
 

  • Remove the Invulnerability that Arbitration Drones give to their allies and just add huge damage resistance should the drone and any of its allies link up. Keep the mechanic where Arbiter Drones blow up and do huge damage in a wide radius when destroyed.
     
  • Make the aforementioned new Aura forma more common, but don't let that be the sole incentive. bump that 2% up for 10% or 12%.
     
  • Speaking of Forma and other goodies that might be present in the game: don't make changes/additions to the game where the fact there is something the community wants the sole reason to play something that needs improvement.

    Make the progression towards those rewards fun! Have a boss invade the current Arbitration run at certain intervals, allow for Warframes to receive progressive buffs to them depending on their actions in the current session (increases maximum health/shields/energy pool, increase Ability Strength/Range/Efficiency/Duration) that last for the entire arbitration or for a period of time. Temporary Affinity/Credit/Resource boosts, etc!

    Generally, make us want to play not solely because there is something we want in there, but because the game is fun AND the rewards are great too.
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Posted (edited)
В 22.04.2019 в 04:49, PeripheralVisionary сказал:

To be fair, the host dying and leaving is an annoyance in general, though I question the persecution complex people seem to have regarding "If one dies, it is on them". Mistakes do happen, and I rather not be screwed out of my rewards because the host has no more reason to stay. Has Warframe's community always had a team of snobs who thumbs their nose down at those who may have pressed the wrong button at times?

How funny that the only people that dare say it happen to press the wrong button at times ALL OF THE TIME?

Like literally what the ****? I played Arbitration for hours and hours, only died 2 times, once because of my own mistake which I never repeated and second time just a random death out of nowhere with full health and garas 2 active. While people around me died all the freakin gtime, and some of them didnt give any effs, they were those frosts who leave the safety of the bubble and leave excavators to potentially die - and not because they needed power cells but because they needed some "action", so you got that guy with a not that tanky frame standing 10 meters away from lv 100+  grineer bombard shooting those grineer whn he could've shoot them from 30 meters away from the bubble - and it so "happens"  thathe dies. Wow. Shocking.

Fry-Im-Shocked-Futurama.gif?fit=360,210&

Who might have though that would happen?

And now his teammates with iq higher than 20 are burdined to revive him, risking to lose their own rewards. Great. Splendind. Thast what you get for your trouble cause by other people.

Literally makes me not ever want to play pubg or anything other than infested excavation ever.

Цитата

But they included revives for a reason 😢 so that all squishy players with the worst load out can start playing END GAME . Show your love to a fellow tenno

Literally hope no one will ever revive those.

MAYBE ENDGAME ISNT FOR squishy players with the worst load out HAVE THAT THOUGHT NEVER CROSSED YOUR MIND.

Edited by -Temp0-
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Feedback time:

The basic concept is good but feels rushed.

- Revival tokens need to be exempt from Vaccum powers, maybe even made to be picked up intentionally like Ayatans so we dont accidentally debuff ourselves.

- Revival tokens need to vanish when the dead player leaves the session otherwise we have to carry that debuff permanently for the rest of the mission and that's mad.

- Revival Tokens and Revival Stations need new assets. Please don't reuse Index coins and Life Support capsules!

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Have rewards scale based on enemy levels and in turn allow people at the start of arbitration to use a system similar to mutators (increased enemy dmg resistance, etc. this would allow players to scale the difficulty for added challenge.) Remove the debuffs from those tokens, and PLEASE shorten the length of rotations! 

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I have a few suggestions.

1. Add 3 difficulty levels, sorta like we have in the index. 50, 75, 100 starting level maybe. Player choice is always welcome.
2. Increase the rewards quantity AND quality according to difficulty level.
3. Introduce the AI from the Index enemies into Arbitrations. Index enemies seem to try to avoid direct conflict more then normal, choosing to find cover. (maybe this is just my imagination, anyone know for sure the AI is different in Index? sure seems like it to me.)
4. More enemy diversity, include more of the rarer enemy spawns from each faction.
5. Remove the 'rez' your teammate function, just give us a limited amount of rez's, maybe 3 lives total.
6. Remove Endo from the rewards list, replace with Kuva. Endo is not an endgame material/currency, Kuva is.
7. Reduce waves/rounds from 10 to 5.

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Could you please add an option to revive your sentinel somehow? It's not great when you rely on your Carrier for ammo during Arbitrations and it dies and the only way to revive it is for you to also die.

And why is Sharposhooter a reward? It's worth 5 Platinum. Doing a Lith capture is worth more than that.

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Posted (edited)

I played with 3 dead people crying to rev plz for 5 minutes before they left, never had this much fun, gj DE. I'm not going to revive, doesn't matter how much you coerce me into it. You made the game mode worse, you gave green light to really noob people to play the game mode. Before this people considered if they wanted to waste 10 minutes before dying anyways. I mean why should I revive them, 99% of people in pub just going to die in 2 minutes again.

Edited by GoatPimp
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18 minutes ago, GoatPimp said:

I played with 3 dead people crying to rev plz for 5 minutes before they left, never had this much fun, gj DE. I'm not going to revive, doesn't matter how much you coerce me into it. You made the game mode worse, you gave green light to really noob people to play the game mode. Before this people considered if they wanted to waste 10 minutes before dying anyways. I mean why should I revive them, 99% of people in pub just going to die in 2 minutes again.

Savage 😆👍

Can't wait to do same 😈

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24
On 2019-04-22 at 3:23 AM, Maganar said:

This is changing one thing that was in fact not a problem (permadeath) but only became frustrating enough to cause gamer rage from many because of the larger elephant in the room (EXTRAORDINARILY slow reward rotations) while ignoring said elephant crushing us against the walls.

Meanwhile, the lack of permadeath is going to attract players who are not sufficiently well-equipped for Arbitrations and which will demand aid until you use "Ignore" if they are holding you back so much searching for tokens that they are inhibiting your ability to maintain stuff like life support or hostage hp.  Public matchmaking with this influx of people that are unprepared is going to be a death sentence and now you need other friends at endgame more so than ever before.

This is exacerbated by what I already anticipate to be a highly polarizing change: the more rapid increase in enemy levels.  I for one (and I know others) greatly APPRECIATED this about Arbitrations because enemy damage in the game has gotten way too high in stuff like Elemental or Physical Enhancement sorties, where the game pretty much just consigns you to be oneshot even through Quick Thinking unless you bring one of the game's few super-tanks.  A small group of people demanded this, so now we all have to suffer through their request even though this is a divisive topic?  Now we're going to have enemies rapidly scale in excess of Level 120 to fulfill their pleas?  This is madness.  High level gameplay exacerbates all the difficulty factors in this game which are already broken, showing off the weaknesses in balance that usually remain hidden (e.g. armor scaling being exponential and thus making Grineer and Bursas ridiculous to crack; disparities in warframe tankiness causing Rhino to laugh at individual attacks that can squad-wipe other entire parties of squishier warframes, etc.).  And since we still have the halved reward rotation rate... these rapidly  scaling enemies will descend upon us to higher and higher levels for more and more nonsensical oneshotting power than in any other mode that has existed in Warframe to date.  Who cares if I can be revived and a misstep isn't permadeath, when I can't survive without cheese anyway?  I'm still going to be forced to cheese it and to party up with a premade squad of only with other people willing to cheese it as hard as I am.

Effectively, you're going to create a game mode that caters even harder than before to the meta-adherent gaming elite and streamers that play Warframe as their careers.  These no-nonsense people may be willing to only play the same handful of warframes exclusively because they are "best" for the mode (and not because they ENJOY playing them) for literally hours on end, spending all their waking hours on Warframe since that's the source of their income (while the rest of us have jobs and only get to do Warframe in our off-time) and with their inner circle of other pro gamer allies to make a squad and set records.  Anyone else is toast.

In summary, the only requests for change you are acquiescing to are the ones that are divisive and polarizing topics that, if put through, will make Arbitrations a point of pride for an ever-shrinking group of the Warframe playerbase and everyone else can ignore the new cosmetics (I've already given up on the Ephemera I was most excited for because it's locked behind 60-minute session grindwalls for 1% drop rate each rotation after putting in the first half-hour just to get TO the rotation I need - these will inevitably be more of the same for me and many others).  At least the archgun rivens can be bought for Vitus essence from doing one-rotation runs.  What about all the following  suggestions that had almost universal approval that are apparently not happening?  Drone removal/reworking (I'm on the fence about this one myself, but I know I am in the minority as the vast majority of players are strongly opposed to them)?  Self-revival only (so the 3, or more with arcanes - a happy medium between threat of permadeath but a single misstep not ending a run)?  And of course...

Faster reward rotations so people with lives outside of Warframe can actually GET the C-only rewards that aren't tradable?  Not a whisper here - even to say why you think you are justified in maintaining the current slow rotations.

After such exasperation, I owe it to you to make my own suggestions in case they are not already explicit from my insinuations.  Here they are, written in a plain list:

  • Faster.  Reward.  Rotations.
  • Allow self-revival only.  This prevents the infinite revives and even worse the impossible-to-mess-up operator reviving nonsense (like you wanted to do with permadeath), but it will discourage people from trying to leech in public missions when they don't have suitable gear by just going "well they can revive me by collecting tokens if they are so good, heh."  This is also prevents a single misstep or stray Bombard rocket from completely ending a very profitable run, which is what was causing people to rage.  It also encourages playing other "endgame" experiences like Eidolons to get Arcanes to have more self-revives!  This solves what everyone wants!  Please!
  • Realize that faster enemy scaling is a polarizing and divisive topic.  There are some proud meta-adherents that love to show off how their most used weapon is Tigris Prime and their most used warframe Rhino Prime that are going to love faster enemy scaling.  Equally many people are NOT going to like that.  Starting enemies at lower sortie levels (and allowing them to scale up to equivalence of the final sortie stage) was the appropriate happy medium between these two opinions.
  • Consider the possibility that you may even be able to implement faster enemy scaling if we just have faster rotations.  If you do that, people who don't want to see Level 150 enemies can duck out but STILL get their C rotation rewards.  People who only have limited time to spend on Warframe can ALSO get to C rotation rewards.  AND the elite players that want to set records can still have their rapid scaling and can just stay for EVEN MORE C rotations (it's not hurting them to start getting their C rotation rewards sooner in the mission!).  Thus, if and only if you give us faster reward rotations, the faster enemy scaling as a divisive topic might sort itself out!
  • Consider downgrading the effects of the drones to a fair balance of preventing nuking strats while keeping offensive abilities relevant.  I saw a comment once with a recommendation that the drones allow enemies to be invulnerable (as is currently true, yes!) but NOT crowd-control-immune (which they currently also are).  This would make people feel the value of casting an ability without allowing them to cheese the whole map by just spamming their ability 4 with 500 energy pads on the gear wheel and a warframe with which that is an unfortunately viable tactic elsewhere (and there are several so let's not start pointing fingers and demanding reworks - instead, let's make a mode where that boring strat isn't viable but that is still fun to play, yes?).

If it sounds like this is several different ways of saying "faster reward rotations fix everything or at least minimize the downsides of things to the point we can ignore them" then that because, gosh-darnit, that may in fact be the case!  I'm also strongly advocating the self-revival only happy medium between permadeath on one extreme end and infinite, invulnerable operator revival on the other extreme end.  Drones remain a point of pain for many people but that can be silenced with some tweaking to nerf their omni-protective power as suggested above (no need for outright deletion as some people ask - those requests are borne of frustration that we can and should reduce by making them fairer).

As a final note, I may sound angry to some but you have no idea how thankful I am that you folks at DE show us the changes you have in mind for stuff like this and give us the chance to provide feedback before it goes live.  I do not write a response this long to rant, but rather to provide thorough feedback to make these dev workshops worthwhile (if we don't explain what we think would be better, they do little).  I've seen too many devs that try to surprise their fanbase with "look what we did for all of you!  ...Wait, you mean you hate these changes?  But - but I thought this is what you said you wanted.  Oh.  Oh my."  Now please for the love of everything good and true: take the advice I and others are giving to heart and reconsider the way you are going about these changes.  Arbitrations need help, but this isn't the exact type of help they need and I fear if it goes live like this, it will in fact only worsen the existing problems.  Thank you to anyone who does the grueling slog of reading through this long feedback response!

Are you aware that this game mode was intended to be "elite alerts," so endgame? This mode is not for casual players. This is for the tryhards and the meta players, not you. You make some good points, but you fail to realize that making everything easy for you is unfair to the endgame players. For veteran players, they feel like there isn't anything to do, because getting to levels where their builds are actually pushed hard takes hours. These are the players that have played the game for years. They have no challenging gamemodes. Go play a regular level 35 mission for 5 minutes if you want to play something made for casual players. Pretty much the whole game is made for casuals due to powercreeping. What's wrong with having a gamemode devoted to another player base? "Hello I am upset when we aren't about me" is what I'm hearing from you. 

That said, I agree that for elite alerts, the arbitrations do lack team synergy due to the fact that cc frames can't affect enemies under the influence of arbitration drones. CC frames deserve to be a part of arbitrations just as much as tanks and DPS frames do. If anything DPS frames are too OP and need the check, because CC frames tend to be squishy. They rely on their CC to stay alive. DPS and tanks are affected much less by enemies being unaffected by their abilities than CC frames, and it isn't fair to the player base to make CC frames worse for endgame than other frames. 

I also agree that the gamemode needs faster rewards, because it is boring to wait so long for rewards. There is no point to the gamemode of your community finds no joy in playing it.

Scaling needs to increase faster since many players want to play against higher level enemies but don't want to wait long for it. 

There isn't anything wrong with infinite revivals because if your team gets tired of reviving you, your team just won't revive you. There is risk to your teammates and only reward for you, so it's self regulating. 

But again, this gamemode is not for casual players, so you don't get to whine that you die so quickly when you're obviously not good enough at the game with good enough builds to play endgame modes. We have waited years for sustainable endgame. You do not get to take that away from us just because the gamemode advertised as hard was hard.

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What about a new  "Void Key"  system... One that basically boosts drop chances of your relic as the mode scaling climbs --

 

Have an alter you deposit  Radiant Relics  maybe in Arbiters of Hexis hub or something, like an Eidolon shrine... (Wanted something more than a menu like Index, but that could work.)

Also cost some  Vitus Essence,  but this mode pays a bit more of it.

 

Each time you deposit the relic you get sent to a random mission for a predetermined time before extraction, 2 to 10 waves/min for example; A Crucible, kind of like  Elite Sanctuary Onslaught.

[Before going... Will it display next objective type and faction? Maybe that information becomes unavailable later as difficulty rises?] 

 

Each Crucible is more difficult than last due to scaling and perhaps other elements, with scaling rewards and you cash out when you're done. (Similar to Payday 2 Crime Spree mode)

When you fail...you go back a level and wasted 2x resources as a result; from the mission prior and the one failed.

 

You can match-make or premade; When match-making it bases it on the difficulty you are credited as achieving, allowing people to cash out when they feel done and not screw over people, or as bad at least.

 

And no Arbitration drones, no revives; The difficulty comes from scaling and maybe other factors.

 

Call that Elite Arbitrations or The Crucible...

 

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Posted (edited)

I feel this revive method based on Financial Stress is too punishing for the individual on a game mode that emphasizes team play.

I'd suggest modelling it after Thermia Fractures instead. Example, you need 5 cans to revive a person (maybe scale up as the player keeps dying repeatedly). Then each can automatically triggers a random burp. This way, a squad working together can reduce the drawback by gathering cans faster, or else they contend with the squad-wide dilemma of the burps. Also the randomness provides a non-standard difficulty curve as befitting an end-game mode

Edited by zelasgoto

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I'd like to update my experience having run arbitrations all day yesterday (was very fortunate to have the time to play)

Something that was not obvious to me:

All team members are forced to pick up debuffs - as long as there are five TOTAL debuffs collected by the entire team - players can all run to the revive tower together to revive a downed ally - this was not clear to myself and team so we were waiting until one player had 5 debuffs before reviving. While this is a better system than I had initially thought it still is forcing support frames to pick up items which can break their play-style.

Something that was obvious:

Too often what I was witnessing was players with good intentions dying trying to assist players that were downed - teams trying to save players dying until one person remained alive - this dropped the average run to rotation "B". None of my runs lasted more that 40 minutes. the day prior my average run was at least 2 rotation "C"s (40 minutes for survival). From my limited experience the new system increases the difficulty by putting stress on the weaker support frames changing the whole point of arbitrations from a challenge and fun event for endgame users to a system of helping newer players. Nothing wrong with the change, just not as enjoyable to end game players that liked to play with other endgame players.

 

technical issues:

- multiple instances of corpus survival where the debuff bots took more than 4 minutes to simply appear after a player was downed, Had one player leave after no one could find a bot spawning

- Survival missions - even with a nekros on the team the rate of decay of the system is significantly faster than anything else in the game forcing teams to move from resource tower to resource tower - with the new higher level spawn rate and debuff system it is significantly decreasing the time that players are staying in arbitrations.

last comments:

- if you find that the average time that players are in arbitrations has been reduced significantly potentially allow them to be available more than once per hour.

- Arbitrations no longer feel like an endgame activity.

I am all for making the game fun for everyone and really appreciate how quickly the response from DE has been, mentioning it during primetime last night just continues to show how much people care about the game - both the developers and players. While I admit I've used the arbitrations as almost a sanctuary - an area to play with other endgame users for large periods of time - things change - if the goal is to make this activity faster and harder I'm all for it, I'm just a bit concerned that the forced stress of carrying players in public groups is changing what made arbitrations special to my playstyle.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, and I continue to appreciate how receptive the entire warframe community is as the game changes over time.

 

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Posted (edited)
18 hours ago, (PS4)Kaneki9597 said:

Are you aware that this game mode was intended to be "elite alerts," so endgame? This mode is not for casual players. This is for the tryhards and the meta players, not you. You make some good points, but you fail to realize that making everything easy for you is unfair to the endgame players. For veteran players, they feel like there isn't anything to do, because getting to levels where their builds are actually pushed hard takes hours. These are the players that have played the game for years. They have no challenging gamemodes. Go play a regular level 35 mission for 5 minutes if you want to play something made for casual players. Pretty much the whole game is made for casuals due to powercreeping. What's wrong with having a gamemode devoted to another player base? "Hello I am upset when we aren't about me" is what I'm hearing from you. 

That said, I agree that for elite alerts, the arbitrations do lack team synergy due to the fact that cc frames can't affect enemies under the influence of arbitration drones. CC frames deserve to be a part of arbitrations just as much as tanks and DPS frames do. If anything DPS frames are too OP and need the check, because CC frames tend to be squishy. They rely on their CC to stay alive. DPS and tanks are affected much less by enemies being unaffected by their abilities than CC frames, and it isn't fair to the player base to make CC frames worse for endgame than other frames. 

I also agree that the gamemode needs faster rewards, because it is boring to wait so long for rewards. There is no point to the gamemode of your community finds no joy in playing it.

Scaling needs to increase faster since many players want to play against higher level enemies but don't want to wait long for it. 

There isn't anything wrong with infinite revivals because if your team gets tired of reviving you, your team just won't revive you. There is risk to your teammates and only reward for you, so it's self regulating. 

But again, this gamemode is not for casual players, so you don't get to whine that you die so quickly when you're obviously not good enough at the game with good enough builds to play endgame modes. We have waited years for sustainable endgame. You do not get to take that away from us just because the gamemode advertised as hard was hard.

Sounds like you agree with me on all my points, but still want to belittle me for having not reached endgame.  That's interesting since I'm at MR27 (only item I don't have mastery on outside of founder items is Korrudo), have all mods except 6 (which all have 1.25% drop rates from Profit Taker heist), and have almost fifty 10-rank mods fully ranked and I have run out of things to spend Endo on.  I've gotten to the point where I am literally maxing 10-rank mods that I do not have equipped on a single piece of gear.

I'm at endgame, buddy, and I would like a challenge too.  But Warframe isn't well-designed to provide endgame since it's virtually given us godlike power at this point, and every time DE tries to take away that power (which is strictly necessary to provide any form of challenge whatsoever), they do so in asymmetrical ways that just skew the game into wildly biased metas.  Self-buffers and super-tanks suffer literally no inhibitions by going into Arbitrations - only buffs if they get a boon or a boon on the equipped weapon.  That just makes things easier than ever for these powerhouses (most of which are already meta elsewhere in the game) while leaving everyone else out in the dirt.  I do not think Arbitrations are hard and I have never found them challenging.  They are just boring and unrewarding - more so than the rest of the game, which I say as a veteran.

What we need is 1) the power taken away to by symmetrical 2) faster rotations and overall reduced tedium.  That's all I'm asking for at the end of the day but DE clearly needs us to spell out exactly what that entails because they aren't getting the message on how to do that right now.

"Hello I am upset when we aren't about me."  Very funny.  Arbitrations were specifically designed for people like me and I'm clearly not happy with them.  I was watching on the very devstream these "elite alerts" as they were called at the time (as you point out) first got revealed.  I had high hopes for this mode and it delivered on none of them, creating nothing more than a massive time-sink tedium for rewards spaced too far apart to ever feel meaningful, and which is only getting more tedious with these changes.

Edited by Maganar
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I think they should just scrap the whole system and do complete rework.

Just make missions with different modifiers every every round/5waves. Some challeging, some fun. 

To give an example: The floor is lava/ Kill the matching color/ Immunity to ranged weapons but melee is insta-kill etc.

 

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I'm actually prepared for this I have my immortal adaptation hildryn for arbitration and I'm 9 vitus essence away from 50 so when it comes on console I can get 2 arch gun rivens 

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