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I mean woo hoo archgun rivens but why are they just tacked on to arbs? Are archguns that special that their rivens belong outside of sorties? Just move that pesky anasa over to arbs because thats the ayatan gamemode, and stick archgun rivens in sorties.

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The amount of salt in this thread is hilarious. I don't have a problem with permadeaths, makes it more of a challenge and I would prefer fixing host migration issues. Other than that, I'm excited for this 🙂

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Posted (edited)

>be DE

>don't improve hosting

>don't add scaling rewards

>force experienced players carry noobs, cuz host migrations

 

Well I'm not gonna play pub arbi anymore for sure!  I liked getting punished for brain lag, for my own brain lag, not other's... I don't like this 'dumbing down things' trend with the game... Make a new game mode call it 'kumbaya' and leave the challenges alone...

Edited by GoatPimp
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Thank god, arbitrations can be fun now, thank you very much for this.

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I love all of this, I cant count how many times one of my friends get killed by something on accident and we all have to leave super early because we feel bad. Im looking forward to this update.

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Posted (edited)

Any chance the level scaling doesn't get buffed for solo play? Just a straight up difficulty increase in that scenario. Other than that all sounds good, will be nice to not be punished as severely for trying out frames I'm less comfortable on with the strength modifer when in a party. Was worried archwing rivens would dilute the sortie pool for a moment, glad that's not the case.

Edited by Gpof
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Could be interesting, but I want to test it before giving real feedback.

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Posted (edited)

I can't help but read this as "Instead of fixing host migrations, we're going to band-aid arbitrations." I guess there's no hope of host migration ever working properly, which is a big part of why I play solo whenever I'm not with clanmates or friends. Arbitrations will also be harder for solo players with the increased enemy scaling, and they'll still be slow and boring thanks to the halved reward rate.

Edited by vandald
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1 hour ago, [DE]Connor said:

Hail Tenno.

Your path has led here. Prove yourself.

Arbitrations have existed in Warframe for just over 6 months - these endgame mission variations put new twists on our tried-and-true mission formula, offering players a level of challenge they cannot find anywhere else in the game. Now that we have had time to observe how these missions fare in players’ hands, we have prepared some tweaks meant to address common complaints with the mode.

The most polarizing of these issues is Arbitrations’ lack of revives. Adding real consequences to death was somewhat of a new sensation in Warframe, and while we would like to retain some of that tension, the fact of the matter is that being dead is not fun. Permadeath also caused issues with host migration, since a dead host may be inclined to leave early, potentially throwing squadmates into disarray. Therefore, we will be implementing a new system where dead players can be revived - but your squadmates will have to earn it.

When these changes go live next week on PC (and consoles in the near future), the rules of Arbitration death will be a little different: players are still killed with no bleedout timer, but a revive tower will be placed at the player’s spot of death. If any squadmate is awaiting revive, the Arbitration drones will begin dropping unique pickups known as a “Resurgence Burden”. These pickups function similar to Index points (otherwise known as “Financial Stress”), debuffing the players who carry them. 

Warframe0284edit.jpg

In order to revive a player, 5 of these Resurgence Burdens must be taken to their tower simultaneously. These 5 pickups can be delivered by one or multiple squadmates, but cannot be “dropped off” at the tower - it’s all or nothing!


  

We hope that this system bridges the gap between players who crave hardcore consequences, and those who were put off by the prospect of permadeath. Since this shifts the mission balance in favor of players, we plan to compensate by making enemies scale at the rate they do in other mission (instead of the reduced rate of scaling that Arbitrations have now).

Finally, we wanted to give players who have already mastered Arbitrations a reason to come back. Therefore, we will be adding a new reward mentioned long ago - Archgun Rivens will be available for purchase using Vitus Essence! Expect a few new cosmetic rewards as well.

Thanks everyone for reading - we hope you look forward to revamped Arbitrations. 

You are on the verge of a new truth. May this help your journey. 

Okay, so we're getting more rivens...

Could we please get a reasonable increase to the riven limit then?

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Posted (edited)

Literally no one asked for the revives. The whole thing of not having any revives was adding a dose of thrill to a game where mortality in a mission is non-existent basically. 

When I saw "Arbitrations Revisited" I sincerely hoped you would revisit the time needed to get a vitus essence rotation in certain mission types (excavation vs defense), and adding more interesting enemy variations and interactions. Endo rewards are too small. The only mission that is comparable with Vodyanoi is the excavation arbitration if you are doing it perfectly. Get rid of the 10 minutes rotations, they are way too long.

Also, if we are getting more rivens, can we at least get an increase to the riven limit?

Edited by Haelbrecht
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Posted (edited)

Permadeaths were fine. Its the perpetually terrible host migration which also plagues the rest of the game that needs to be fixed. Maybe use some of those massive year over year record breaking profits on some dedicated servers? But I guess it's just easier to implement a bandaid for a singular game mode.

All this is going to do is make tank frames even more mandatory since they can actually live long enough to revive teammates. Also there is a big problem with index credits. You cant get rid of them if you accidentally pick them up unless you cash in. That's not a big deal since you revive infinitely in index but an HP malus you cant get rid of unless you cash in with multiple other people or collect enough for a res is a huge #*!%ing deal in a game mode where you instantly die if your HP hits 0. 

Oh also. Survival, defense, and interception are so much less rewarding than excavation. As long as you get a semi-competent frost you can progress multiple excavators at once whereas on the other modes you're locked behind a hard timer.

I suggest:

Bring the kuva harvester mechanic to survival mode except instead of spitting out kuva, finishing the defense rolls a reward

Shorten defense to 7 waves a rotation.

Interception add 2 optional towers. Enemies will not touch them as long as they are neutral but if the players activate them then enemies can go after them as well.

Until then, I'm going to keep ignoring the single tile snorefests that are these game modes.

 

Regarding rewards. The blood ephemera is horrible. Visually. It looks like you are leaking globs of cu goo... Either make the particle effects to look more like blood or replace it completely. I'd personally love an ephemera where you shed leaves or petals. I know the effect is in game. It's a dojo decoration. I do however like that it is locked behind a fixed amount of Vitus. I dont care that it's a lot of Vitus but the fact that I can tangibly progress towards the reward is far, far better than any of the other RNG ephemera.

Edited by ADirtyMonk
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I thought DE lost the proper means to adjust and improve decent game mode after they remove raids, i was wrong

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i think they have lost their minds

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58 minutes ago, Gabbynaru said:

Yeah, 5 minute loops. Game works like that everywhere else. A 10 minute investment is not "difficult", "challenging" or "fun", it's just a rip-off. Making the loops be 5 minutes would make it good for both short term investment (hey, I need a statue, I'll do 5 minutes of Arbies) and long term investment (hey, I did 60 minutes, came out with a crapton of Endo, as well as these other rewards). They want to draw more eyes onto this mode, just make it work like normal ones, instead of being stingy with it.

Should there be some kind of difficulty spike to compensate for the reduced time? I honestly feel like 5 minute waves of enemies that are just a little above Sedna difficulty wouldn't feel like much of a challenge for guaranteed Endo or statues. If the enemy levels were adjusted much higher to compensate, would that be enough to make it work a bunch of endo and statues without just making it feel like every other endless mission in the game? 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Ely.I said:

Personally this wouldn't make me revive any other player that dies, if they die it's on them. I Don't like that you pick the burdens automatically if you walk over them accidentally, this happens often in Index and the enemy concentration is very low there. So basically this makes me less likely to want to play with anyone else I don't know.

Also rivens are a mistake that you keep making and getting deeper into it, seriously what's next? warframe rivens?

XD I agree the riven thing is kinda an endless crater. If they would flat stat them and make them alterable with our kuva it would free up space on their servers b/c we know what people would do with their soma rivens. Crit Chance, Crit Dmg, and Multi/Dmg. I do like your Hunk-like/Mercenary type attitude. However, you are a real downer dude. Try to make it more cheery Goth :P. JK of course, I understand the pain in the butt this games changes can be once we are used to something and now playing with pugs will be even worse. I keep it on friend's only 99% of the time already.

Edited by Akula_Rose

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Still too long a mission for what you get out of it. Why would I spend 10 minutes for a chance to get 2000 endo (at the 30 minute mark) when i can just do a vault run, sell a mod, and have enough plat for 3 anasa sculptures. You guys have still missed the mark advertising this as endgame when the rewards aren't worth the time and the difficulty is skewed by numerous factors.    

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2 hours ago, [DE]Connor said:

We hope that this system bridges the gap between players who crave hardcore consequences, and those who were put off by the prospect of permadeath. Since this shifts the mission balance in favor of players, we plan to compensate by making enemies scale at the rate they do in other mission (instead of the reduced rate of scaling that Arbitrations have now).

Finally, we wanted to give players who have already mastered Arbitrations a reason to come back. Therefore, we will be adding a new reward mentioned long ago - Archgun Rivens will be available for purchase using Vitus Essence! Expect a few new cosmetic rewards as well.

First the positive: I'm extremely happy about enemies finally scaling normally. Very happy. It'll be much easier to do endurance and test our builds in a more rewarding and challenging mission type than the regular Starchart. Thanks a lot for this!

Also very hyped for archgun rivens, I definitely want one for my larkspur. 

Now for the negatives: Permadeath was honestly not the major complaint folks had about Arbitrations, at least not the more veteran players this game mode was aimed at (you did call it endgame in your announcement post). And it was the most interesting feature about Arbitrations, in fact the only real challenge added to it, since drones can be dealt with easily. I think many players would much rather keep the perma death, but increase the rewards to every 5 minutes/waves/etc., to have a better sense of progression through the mission. Heck, maybe even raise the starting level to 80. It's supposed to be endgame after all, let's already start at endgame levels. 

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Posted (edited)

So your solution for having crappy team or a crappy host is to place an even bigger burden on the good players? Seems like you didn't think that through.

Edited by (XB1)WhiteAngelWingz
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1 minute ago, AnActualFrog said:

Should there be some kind of difficulty spike to compensate for the reduced time? I honestly feel like 5 minute waves of enemies that are just a little above Sedna difficulty wouldn't feel like much of a challenge for guaranteed Endo or statues. If the enemy levels were adjusted much higher to compensate, would that be enough to make it work a bunch of endo and statues without just making it feel like every other endless mission in the game? 

Well, this post already says the difficulty scaling will change to work like it does in normal missions, which, if I'm not mistaken, means the enemies will get to higher and higher levels a lot faster. I've not played a lot of Arbies, but I sort of remember the enemies barely going up in level even after 30 minutes, so that's already a push for more difficulty. Statues themselves are not exactly that valuable, I mean, the statues from rotations A and B are barely worth upwards of 400 endo naked (and for some people like myself, amber stars are way too rare for them to be an instant and/or constant endo source), which frankly, I can get in 2 minutes by doing Pavlov, and the actual endo rewards could be tied to rotation C, by which point, with the increased difficulty scaling, should make a lot more sense. Or they could increase the starting level of enemies to 80 or 100, I dunno.

Or they could leave it as is, cause frankly, Endo ain't THAT valuable, and no one, not even DE will feel any negative drawbacks from introducing more endo into the player economy. If anything, they could feel a boost to the bank account, cause people would then maybe feel more comfortable with trading ranked up mods, since they wouldn't be such a pain to level up. Like, I genuinely see no drawbacks to more Endo, since the platinum economy doesn't rely on it. Maybe Anasa will lose some value in the plat market, but considering how much hatred Anasa gets, I can only see that as a positive, since it's diminished value could push DE towards removing it from the Sortie table and making it more readily available (or moving it to Arbies).

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Posted (edited)

Still a massive lack of interesting rewards in there.

Endo, endo, endo and then some endo topped of with more endo in the endo.

I think you guys at DE kinda missread the word endgame, there is no O in it, it isnt called endogame. Give us better rewards from the rotations if you wanna call it endgame. Currently it is middleofprogressiongame. The mods barely fit endgame loot either, actual proper loot would be arcanes, possibly kuva (although kinda lore breaking) and other things that let us progress when we're reached the endgame point. 

I dont see why arcanes are placed behind eidolons, they arent exactly endgame material either. Time to place those things in arbitrations too, since those are about as difficult with slightly more risks involved than eidolon hunts. On that subject, there is a massive inconsistancy between eidolon rewards and orb rewards aswell, but that belong in a different topic.

Get some consistancy into the game rewards please, otherwise you wont have any real endgame, just different modes, with different difficulties and poorly balanced rewards.

edit: And the roations are too long. The regular setup would work far better, especially if you are hunting for mods.

Edited by SneakyErvin
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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Haelbrecht said:

Literally no one asked for the revives

i did, many did, not having revives was the worst because it stopped us from playing non-tank frames and made it hard to reach the fun part, as it was before we would die from a small mistake before we could get to the fun part.
this changes were the best news i got this week.

Edited by JeyciKon

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Really ? 
the main point people where complaining about was the death ?
I find that  hard to believe.


The duration of the reward cycle is too long. That is what keeps me and other people away.
Make it harder (not everybody has to play every mode) and give us a reward every 5 minutes please.
30 Minutes for one C-Rotation reward is not ok, or fun.....

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Im put off by the fact that its so tediously long to get anything worthwhile in this mode.

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