Game is too easy and caters to noobs

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

9 minutes ago, Gabbynaru said:

Gameplay wise, yeah, it is. I came here expecting a power fantasy, I get a power fantasy. I didn't come here expecting Dark Souls, and I ain't getting Dark Souls. So, for all intents and purposes, it's perfectly fine. Sounds to me like you're just looking for a different game. I'm not, I'm just here to enjoy being a god, and that's what the game's providing. Hard concept to grasp, I know, enjoying a game for what it is rather than wishing it was something else.

SOMEONE gets it! Thought I was going crazy for a moment there 😛 lol

[Gamma745]

4 hours ago, DerGreif2 said:

How about... maybe nerfing some Frames? Oh God now I have hit a nerf and right there I see the "deepuip mods" and "use keys" guys. Warframes are to strong and we suffer from powerkreep. I understand power fantasy but if a Saryn or Mesa can nuke the map before you even press a button there is something wrong. DE needs to start balancing things. But I think I ho now because this thread is full of "Its fine you just xxxx" people.

Ah, yes. "I don't want to nerf myself therefore the developer should nerf everyone alongside me".

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

8 minutes ago, Gamma745 said:

Ah, yes. "I don't want to nerf myself therefore the developer should nerf everyone alongside me".

Well, tbh, buffing the enemy is pretty much the same thing as debuffing us.

Either of which is fine, really, if indeed it is for the betterment of the game in the long run.

I believe this is why DE is doing what they're doing with Arbitrations and the like, putting in these deliberate debuffs. It seems like they intend for THOSE missions to be challenges, but they don't want that "difficulty" extending to the star chart / story...probably for a good reason, like not making the new player experience any more difficult than it already is (for various reasons).

[Gamma745]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Well, tbh, buffing the enemy is pretty much the same thing as debuffing us.

Either of which is fine, really, if indeed it is for the betterment of the game in the long run.

I believe this is why DE is doing what they're doing with Arbitrations and the like, putting in these deliberate debuffs. It seems like they intend for THOSE missions to be challenges, but they don't want that "difficulty" extending to the star chart / story...probably for a good reason, like not making the new player experience any more difficult than it already is (for various reasons).

If it's just one gamemode, I guess it shouldn't be much of a problem. But when people asked for it to extend to the entire game...

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

7 minutes ago, Gamma745 said:

If it's just one gamemode, I guess it shouldn't be much of a problem. But when people asked for it to extend to the entire game...

Don't worry about that....  There's  plenty to do at higher levels in the game without interfering with the Starchart nodes directly. At this point, any major changes would fundamentally alter the game, which would be jarring and bad for business.

it's certainly much safer, and smarter, to introduce new modes that use those idea than it is to change the -entire game-.  

Kinda like Coca-Cola...   They had an idea to change up flavors, made New Coke, and it nearly caused them to shut down!  Would have been far better for them to introduce the New Coke flavor as a VARIANT rather than replace the existing base  default, you know what I mean?  Hope that made some sense...it's nearly 7am and I've not  yet slept a wink.

[Anduvriel]

Wishing for more challenge in warframe is more like saying to the waiter "could you bring me some of that spicy sauce, please" in my opinion. Not whining and *@##$ing. Asking for something additional, but important for a group of customers. 

I think no one here really wants to change warframe into dark souls. One or two nodes that you don't have to do, a slider, an option to choose a uber nightmare boss is not gonna change your ability to play the normal version. No one sane asks for that, i dont want that. 

Progression and aspiration is important in games as in many other things. It is not seen at first glance, sometimes those harder missions will be played by just 1% of the community, just streamers or few hardcores, but it changes the perception of the state of the game for the whole community. And has usually positive impact on it (if it is actually based on skill/knowledge/experience, not on wallet or artificial obstacles and is not required to have fun by playing the game casually). 

There is that pyramid of "skill", "hardcoreness", "progression" to climb... even if you don't climb it you will perceive it as a valueable external mirror you can see your progress in. It is a huge added value to basically anything, makes grinds far more justified in your own eyes, makes choices, builds matter, which adds always a lot to a complex game. Thats how human nature works. 

Elite is great to have always, elitist not, of course. Even if its completely optional and doesn't give anything additional to those players and you explicitly dont want to have anything to do with it. 

 

[Medeucea]

This game is NOT too easy. This game is NOT engaging.

[Zanchak]

10 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Glad someone understood my ramblings, lol.   Seriously, all I've seen people type is a combination of "Don't take our power away!" and "Give us more challenge!"   Those two don't resolve in any way this community would accept.

 

MR 27, 4 years, 2.5k hours - I'm happy with my frames, my builds, my weapons and (most) missions. I enjoy helping newer players, or playing alone.

I am not happy with people constantly claiming "vets" want everything to be stupidly difficult as some of us couldn't give a toss about that aspect. I personally would prefer more quests and fixes on old bugs, or more immersive story telling. The Second Dream had 100% more impact when it was first released as the ENTIRE community learned it at once. It was a fantastic and enjoyable time in game. More of that, yes please. Time wasted on more and more things like eso and arbitrations that people just whine about anyway? No thanks. There is no pleasing them. Ever.

Edited May 9, 2019 by Zanchak
Can't spell at 2am apparently

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

16 hours ago, Zanchak said:

MR 27, 4 years, 2.5k hours - I'm happy with my frames, my builds, my weapons and (most) missions. I enjoy helping newer players, or playing alone.

I am not happy with people constantly claiming "vets" want everything to be stupidly difficult as some of us couldn't give a toss about that aspect. I personally would prefer more quests and fixes on old bugs, or more immersive story telling. The Second Dream had 100% more impact when it was first released as the ENTIRE community learned it at once. It was a fantastic and enjoyable time in game. More of that, yes please. Time wasted on more and more things like eso and arbitrations that people just whine about anyway? No thanks. There is no pleasing them. Ever.

tbh, I LOVE the story . I play 99% of games for story.  

With regards to Warframe, I also enjoy all the other niche modes, as well.  I don't mind the easy stuff, I find fun in the tougher stuff, as well, though...

What I DON'T care for is the downright RUDENESS here on the forums from so many entitled people using such terms as "vets" to justify being a bunch of ******s.  I don't appreciate that, and I'm sure DE doesn't either...

And honestly, I don't know what ANYONE in their right mind would expect someone to see their "feedback" as credible when it's delivered in such condescending manners.

Like seriously, is a bit of civility and respect too much to ask for?  

Anyways, I know DE is just trying to load the game with a ton of "modes" to provide up-front value when  new players log in so they'll have so much to do they won't burn the game out in a week.  They want there to be more to do than just rush through the starchart and uninstall.  I get it.

 but, that focus means the higher level stuff is really not the focus.  That DOESN'T mean DE isn't considering that for those that want it, but it's not the main priority...and I wish people would get that and appreciate that.

People say they love Warframe, but to me...reading what so many write here.. .it's like seeing that abusive boyfriend who claims he "loves" his gf, but constantly talks down to her, tells her how to dress, how to walk, how to speak, and belittles the crap out of her... But yeah, totally "love" 😛

 

[(PSN)JustJoshinEnt]

1 hour ago, Facadedestroyer said:

what are you doing right now mr veteran ? barbie dressing or wall street trading ? and claiming that eso and arbitration was for veteran is big misinformation, those modes are bugged and fuked from every corner, in ESO instead of battling the enemy you fight the decaying timer, in arbitration you get a reward every freaking 2 waves or 10mn and they're a mod you already have or endo of the lowest value.

and theres no lore, you know that very well, they make sht on the go, and resently they're just releasing primes every 3 months with no trailers and no lore at all, even normal weapons are getting added without any lore, they just add them.

and with 2.5k h played i cant fathom how the hell are you still playing let alone happy with warframe current state, i mean what do you use your builds and maxed out mods and god tier cancer raven for ? theres no gear progression, theres nothing to test you, you've been getting powerful for nothing, i can make a new account and with 2 mods and single frame i can one shot anything in the game that does not have invisible phases, and yes i am talking about ash and the dagger mod and the augment, just to prove to you how broken and unbalanced/no principle/half assed this game is.

Here's a crazy thought:  Some of us just enjoy playing the game, as-is. 

Deal with it.

[Gabbynaru]

17 minutes ago, Facadedestroyer said:

 is the cancer of this community.

Says the one with the "my way or the highway" attitude. If people like Taishin are the cancer of this community, people like you, who can't make a single constructive criticism and instead resort to personal and community attacks whenever their way of thinking is not mirrored/echoed by everyone else, are the death of this community. You complain about circle jerks and echo chambers, but that's exactly what YOU want. You want everyone to just parrot your thoughtless arguments, you want everyone to be in awe of you, and since it ain't happening, you are spitting acid left and right just cause YOU feel like YOU'RE right. You're not. Just cause someone likes the game as is doesn't make them wrong. Just cause you don't like the game as it doesn't make you right. Learn how to respect people's opinions, learn how to have a discussion, and for Clem's sake, learn that the world does NOT revolve around you.

[Anduvriel]

2 hours ago, Facadedestroyer said:

what are you doing right now mr veteran ? barbie dressing or wall street trading ? [..] theres nothing to test you, you've been getting powerful for nothing, 

We can remain civil about this tenno.

Does DE try to make harder content? 

They do try, orbs, arbitrations, thumpers, wolf scaling (stalker does not scale) are recent additions. New harder gamemode is soon to come. So its not that they don't see an issue with challenge in the game or don't work to improve what we have difficulty wise. Or do not create content for more experienced players. They definetely do. 

Are they succesful..?

All things consider its mediocre, not bad, but also not great..  The content has usually too little scaling enabled, usually through a lot of time (which sucks, doing same repeatable thing for 2 hours is not really fun, especially if you start with no difficulty and get to "you need to cheese that" difficulty) and not really "hard" or challenging, as requiring a polished skillset to complete. Its usually a cheese gear/knowledge check which is kinda worst difficulty imo but prevalent through all the looters i know. 

I dont especially care if it can be cheesed or not if the uncheesed way of playing is fun to begin with, because thats why i play warframe..  to have some fun with friends. It is a casual looter and those usually are easy after you aquire highest tiers of kit to work with and deep knowledge of the mechanics. 

Profit-taker is an example of a bad difficulty in my opinion, exploiter of a fun fight but not difficult enough. Thumpers actually dont demand use of a riven, but can definetely challenge your kit damage wise if you want to kill many in a day. So your kit might not be tested, as you need that god riven to complete something, but they sure as hell speed the grind immensly.

What i would love is something similar to raids with roles, party play and boss/es with mechanics similar to exploiter, eidolon, but with clear, zoned, telegraphed abilities that you need to skillfully dodge or prevent, work with others. Adding a nightmare mode with failure conditions on top would be a big plus. From what we know they are working on a "raid". We will see how it pans out.

Saying there is nothing in this game for a veteran is an overstatement, thou it does feel there is a hole after they took the raids out. 

[Numerikuu]

On 2019-05-07 at 10:48 AM, FlusteredFerret said:

The game needs to cater to players of all skill levels...including noobs.

DE are trying to figure out how to provide more challenging content for veterans, without screwing up the game for everyone else.

 

In the meantime, if you're bored - go play another game. Elitist tryhards like you make up a small percentage of the player base, so DE aren't going to jump to your command.

 

 

Vet here. Amen to this.

[DatDarkOne]

Wow.  Just WOW.  

[Zanchak]

5 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

tbh, I LOVE the story . I play 99% of games for story.  

With regards to Warframe, I also enjoy all the other niche modes, as well.  I don't mind the easy stuff, I find fun in the tougher stuff, as well, though...

What I DON'T care for is the downright RUDENESS here on the forums from so many entitled people using such terms as "vets" to justify being a bunch of ******s.  I don't appreciate that, and I'm sure DE doesn't either...

And honestly, I don't know what ANYONE in their right mind would expect someone to see their "feedback" as credible when it's delivered in such condescending manners.

Like seriously, is a bit of civility and respect too much to ask for?  

Anyways, I know DE is just trying to load the game with a ton of "modes" to provide up-front value when  new players log in so they'll have so much to do they won't burn the game out in a week.  They want there to be more to do than just rush through the starchart and uninstall.  I get it.

 but, that focus means the higher level stuff is really not the focus.  That DOESN'T mean DE isn't considering that for those that want it, but it's not the main priority...and I wish people would get that and appreciate that.

People say they love Warframe, but to me...reading what so many write here.. .it's like seeing that abusive boyfriend who claims he "loves" his gf, but constantly talks down to her, tells her how to dress, how to walk, how to speak, and belittles the crap out of her... But yeah, totally "love" 😛

 

I should just respond with "This" to most of your posts, it's easier.

4 hours ago, Facadedestroyer said:

what are you doing right now mr veteran ? barbie dressing or wall street trading ? and claiming that eso and arbitration was for veteran is big misinformation, those modes are bugged and fuked from every corner, in ESO instead of battling the enemy you fight the decaying timer, in arbitration you get a reward every freaking 2 waves or 10mn and they're a mod you already have or endo of the lowest value.

and theres no lore, you know that very well, they make sht on the go, and resently they're just releasing primes every 3 months with no trailers and no lore at all, even normal weapons are getting added without any lore, they just add them.

and with 2.5k h played i cant fathom how the hell are you still playing let alone happy with warframe current state, i mean what do you use your builds and maxed out mods and god tier cancer raven for ? theres no gear progression, theres nothing to test you, you've been getting powerful for nothing, i can make a new account and with 2 mods and single frame i can one shot anything in the game that does not have invisible phases, and yes i am talking about ash and the dagger mod and the augment, just to prove to you how broken and unbalanced/no principle/half assed this game is.

I really love how much you've assumed in this little rude paragraph, but assume does have ass in it, after all.

I didn't actually say anywhere that eso OR arbi was specifically for vets, but you were far too busy being rude and pig-headed to notice that werent you?

There is lore - it is no one elses problem but yours to go learn about it. Does it all make sense? No, but it exists and saying it doesnt is *gasp* "big misinformation". I stole that from you because it was worded so well.

2.5k hours of spending time in something I enjoy while battling something I do not. Can you not fathom enjoyment or are you too bitter at the world for not giving you exactly what you want when you want it? You also assumed I use rivens. There are 3 I use, and very rarely. I play 99% of the game with normal mods.

Cancer is cancer - your annoyance in a pixel world is not. Learn the difference for it is great.

I also never said anywhere that there is nothing wrong with the game. I have made it very clear when there are things I dislike. Not agreeing with whiney tantrums doesn't mean everyone is in some kinda "circle jerk" as you so intelligently put it.

Maybe you should go outside for a while, find a reason not to be so bitter.

 

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

2 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

Wow.  Just WOW.  

I knew this was going to be a good one.  I stole some of Maggie's popcorn for this.

[Gamma745]

27 minutes ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

I stole some of Maggie's popcorn for this.

RIP Thy Divinity. For he is about to experience something no mortal man should experience.

[Ziser]

On 2019-05-08 at 12:55 PM, George_PPS said:

MR27 here with good builds and loadouts for all missions. 

I found current balance of enemies levels proper and enjoyable. If the hardest contents are designed for only top players’ meta gears, 99% won’t be enjoying the game. It actually feels good for me to play with any players and help each others out. And if I want more challenging contents, I stay longer in missions or find less experienced players to do harder missions.

 

MR27 who played since near start of game here and seen how it evolved based on what new type of players joined the game. I also played a large selection of other games in same genre and multiply others. I also explored most of the metas and other builds and gear combos the game has to offer and can safely say that anyone claiming that having to stay for longer periods of time in a mission for it to FINALLY reach a acceptable diffculty loses their credability in the matter.

Quote aside, the game needs clear challanging content that truly tests your skills and give you merit for it, you can argue how much you want against it but looking back at games this is what made a game a Game. Adding content thats only doable using metagear is a bad idea and no real challange seeking player asked for this, you just asumed it like that. Theres a large portion of players who have skills outside that of gear knowledge such as good aim, reflexes, movment interested players, puzzle lovers and more, yet we have little to no challanges adressing these. I aknowledge that any content might not be doable by all players but we are all humans and humans are good at improving when they want.

This game has absolutely NO challanging content whatsoever from the point of view of an experienced player, even less so for one with a lot of skills to back their experience up too. As original post stated (which is also true whatever you like it or not) the game is catering to more casual players and since their mindset is "All content should be playable by everyone" it is KILLING any chances of adding new actuall challanging content simply because casual players wont be able to do that content. They dont want to improve or are too lazy in order to do said content and will even complain about said content. This is harmfull for the games quality growth and will have all your non-casual players eventually leave. However out of a business view this is ideal because these types of casual players loves to pay for shortcuts, EA has been abusing this fact for a while and thus their games lost their quality entirely, that is fact.

Not wanting to improve or even try because it looks too tedious is never an excuse to lower the requirments for something, we call those people bums in the working society.

Shoot for the starts and dont let anyone stop you.

[Ziser]

6 hours ago, Facadedestroyer said:

and theres no lore, you know that very well, they make sht on the go, and resently they're just releasing primes every 3 months with no trailers and no lore at all, even normal weapons are getting added without any lore, they just add them.

Id like to point out that theres lore however its not relevant to gameplay, its there for those that enjoy it and it also requires you to search for it and put pieces together to understand it, it is just not spoonfed to you like usually seen in games.

[Chipputer]

5 hours ago, (PS4)Taishin_Ishu said:

Here's a crazy thought:  Some of us just enjoy playing the game, as-is. 

Deal with it.

Here's a crazy thought: Some of us would like to have optional difficulty sliders and challenging content that won't impact the fact that you're enjoying the game as-is.

Deal with it.

[Phatose]

9 minutes ago, Chipputer said:

Here's a crazy thought: Some of us would like to have optional difficulty sliders and challenging content that won't impact the fact that you're enjoying the game as-is.

Deal with it.

OK, so the easiest way to do this with the fewest complications - so that the slider affects your level of challenge without affecting anybody else, nor without further fracturing the playerbase for matchmaking is to make the slider simply make you weaker.  Can probably just make it affect your gear - a simple calculation, multiply the mod capacity of all items.  If it's set to hard, for example, all your items have their mod points reduced by 50%.  Or we could have it affect the effective level of any mods you have equipped, treating rank 10 mods as if they were rank 5.

[Chipputer]

9 minutes ago, Phatose said:

OK, so the easiest way to do this with the fewest complications - so that the slider affects your level of challenge without affecting anybody else, nor without further fracturing the playerbase for matchmaking is to make the slider simply make you weaker.  Can probably just make it affect your gear - a simple calculation, multiply the mod capacity of all items.  If it's set to hard, for example, all your items have their mod points reduced by 50%.  Or we could have it affect the effective level of any mods you have equipped, treating rank 10 mods as if they were rank 5.

The simplest way is to let players start missions at a certain level of their choice (maybe up to level 100) and then work on mechanical difficulty (reworking the enemy AI, adding more enemies with unique mechanics) in the mean time.
EDIT: Yes, I'm aware I said reworking the AI is simple. I'm also aware that it isn't simple.

Instead of reducing player power (which is literally just saying, "hey, progress and then lose that progress because reasons"), giving a higher level to start missions at will allow lower MR players a goal to actually shoot for while giving higher MR players content that doesn't disrespect their time (IE: sitting in a survival for an hour to see high enough leveled enemies). Rewards being increased or changed is entirely optional. It's something I don't care about and have no strong feelings about.

There isn't going to be further fracturing of the player base because the player base has been completely shattered for literal years now. You don't see many, if any, open squads after Jupiter unless content in that area has been updated recently. Higher level players already aren't playing on the currently existing nodes. Leveling nodes, credit farming nodes, and fissures are really the only regularly populated places.

Edited May 10, 2019 by Chipputer

[Phatose]

1 minute ago, Chipputer said:

The simplest way is to let players start missions at a certain level of their choice (maybe up to level 100) and then work on mechanical difficulty (reworking the enemy AI, adding more enemies with unique mechanics) in the mean time.
EDIT: Yes, I'm aware I said reworking the AI is simple. I'm also aware that it isn't simple.

Instead of reducing player power (which is literally just saying, "hey, progress and then lose that progress because reasons"), giving a higher level to start missions at will allow lower MR players a goal to actually shoot for while giving higher MR players content that doesn't disrespect their time (IE: sitting in a survival for an hour to see high enough leveled enemies). Rewards being increased or changed is entirely optional. It's something I don't care about and have no strong feelings about.

There isn't going to be further fracturing of the player base because the player base has been completely shattered for literal years now. You don't see many, if any, open squads after Jupiter unless content in that area has been updated recently. Higher level players already aren't playing on the currently existing nodes. Leveling nodes, credit farming nodes, and fissures are really the only regularly populated places.

Something being already shattered doesn't make it impossible to further break apart.  Those regularly populated nodes would be divided up across different starting levels, and now no longer be populated since they'd be divided across varying starting levels. 

Changing any mechanics would either require DE to deal with the new mechanics and deal with the old mechanics - or it would be impacting  players who did not want it, which you indicated it wouldn't.

And really, it's "progress, be unhappy because things are easy after your progressed, so give up that progress because you'd rather have it hard."  And that lower MR player can shoot to be able to play on hard mode just as easily this way as they can with higher numbers.

[Avarice-Syn]

As someone who trains and assists newcomers, this game is NOT for noobs.

[DatDarkOne]

3 hours ago, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

I knew this was going to be a good one.  I stole some of Maggie's popcorn for this.

Honestly I stopped trying as soon as I saw the name of the obvious troll in the topic.