Feedback on future "wolves" (please don't nerf them into the ground)

[AKTKWNG]

Now that Nightwave season 1 is ending and we'll soon see the next version of the Wolf, I thought now would be a good time to give some overall feedback on our current Wolf, which hopefully can be applied to next season's version of the Wolf.

I actually think that after the initial round of nerfs to the Wolf's tankiness, he settled into a very good spot. He was still daunting if you were caught unprepared, but was much more manageable if you had at least one properly modded crit-radiation weapon, and he crumpled like wet tissue if you min-maxed with something like a shattering impact valkyr. He brought with him an ever-present sense of danger, which I feel is sorely lacking in Warframe these days (the origin system became a lot smaller for me the day I could kill the Stalker before he made his first move), forced you to travel prepared (even if said preparation is as simple as reserving one item out of a standard loadout of primary/secondary/melee/warframe, or even your archgun if you have that unlocked), and duly rewarded said preparation. After I learned the Wolf's weaknesses, the only time I felt that he was truly insurmountable was when I was clearly putting myself at a disadvantage, like when I was playing bleeding key ivara for a riven challenge, and I was fairly smacked down for it.

I really like this idea of a looming threat in the background with a specific weakness, kind of like having to venture into the haunted woods with a flashlight. I feel like having to prepare a specific type of weapon against the Wolf is not too much to ask, especially since it can be any one weapon in your entire loadout. In fact, I wish that using the correct damage type would confer even greater benefits to players. Currently, crit-rad melees are still largely superior to other methods of dealing with the Wolf, due to scaling crits and shattering impact. This should be adjusted so that players have more freedom to play melee builds they want while paired up with other wolf-killers. Maybe have it so that radiation damage from guns against the Wolf have a chance to mini-stun him similar to an impact proc, so that squishier frames still have a good chance against him while being able to keep their distance.

Also, there needs to be more in-game information on how to counter the Wolf. Even in week 8 of Nightwave, post-Wolf nerfs, I was still seeing forum posts from frustrated people wondering why their rivened-up weapons can't even scratch the Wolf, and then you read the post and you realise they're using a status Kohm or some other weapon that works great in general but doesn't play towards the Wolf's weaknesses. Maybe Nora can remark on the Wolf's weaknesses when introducing him, or say that he wears alloy armour, or give some indication for people to start wondering if they can better prepare themselves.

Finally, I'd like to express some slight disappointment at the way the Wolf tactical alert was handled. I felt that the tactical alert should have been a chance for players to put into practice all the methods they learned to deal with the Wolf, and maybe a chance for people who didn't quite understand his mechanics to learn that, see, he's not so tough if you're prepared for him. Instead, he was given a bunch of extra weaknesses he never had before. Suddenly, he was susceptible to CC, ability damage and even finisher attacks. It feels really anticlimactic when what was supposed to be a final showdown can be done in less than two minutes, even without the liset air support exploit. Still, it's great that we can end Nightwave by being able to challenge the Wolf on our own terms, and some version of this alert should make its way into every season.

Overall, while complaining about the undying Wolf has become kind of a meme in the community, I actually really like the way he was implemented, and I feel like this is a direction that can be iterated upon in future.

[(PSN)BenHeisennberg]

Honestly, the main issue to me from the start was that he doesn't take status procs.

My complaint has never been "my Paracesis isn't modded well enough."  It's always been "I have a weapon I have killed level 200+ with, why doesn't this kill him well when this other one can?  Why does it have to be rad crit?"  The Wolf is a field boss.  Field bosses, so long as you carry a good, well modded weapon, should die to your strong weapon.

Of course though, rank 0 everything on a higher star chart level defense mission (cough), that's all on the player for not bringing good gear.

Edited May 13, 2019 by (PS4)BenHeisennberg

[AtsiaZ]

See, the issue is that Wolf wasn't ever dangerous in the first place. He was only  looming threat in the sense of the pain in the ass him spawning in caused.  And no, I don't think it's good to be forced to always carry out some minmaxed top tier gun or run a specific frame just to counter one specific enemy that has nothing going for it other than being a ridiculous bullet sponge.

[Basalto]

23 minutes ago, AKTKWNG said:

He was still daunting if you were caught unprepared, but was much more manageable if you had at least one properly modded crit-radiation weapon, and he crumpled like wet tissue if you min-maxed with something like a shattering impact valkyr. He brought with him an ever-present sense of danger, which I feel is sorely lacking in Warframe these days (the origin system became a lot smaller for me the day I could kill the Stalker before he made his first move), forced you to travel prepared (even if said preparation is as simple as reserving one item out of a standard loadout of primary/secondary/melee/warframe, or even your archgun if you have that unlocked), and duly rewarded said preparation.

Part of that just treads into obvious territory. Of course the enemy is going to die easily with minmaxed equipment,;that's why people minmax their stuff in the first place. I can haaaaaaardly agree with the danger part, though. He wasn't dangerous, just annoying to fight with his bulletsponge defenses and plot armor terrorists. It could easily be cheesed with Wukong or other immortal frame with a half-decent build. Hell, as long as you have Rage, Wukong can probably do it with the first rank of Defy. It's also worth mentioning that forcing the player to separate one of their three weapon slots for a very specific weapon meant to kill an enemy that is beyond any level in the mission itself, who might or might not show up, is just punishing the player for existing. What if I like alternating between Lenz and a sidearm? What if I like using Vigorous Swap with two similar weapons to use and abuse the extra damage? Restricting part of a player's loadout because RNG might decide to #*!% something up is not the way to make an enemy dangerous. I can see people screaming "Russian roulette" when I say random numbers aren't dangerous, but that'd be more an exception, than an expectation, and at the end, that's what Wolf was: Russian roulette. Except that you had the option to strap bulletproof glass on your head before each shot, which you'd be paying for.

 

32 minutes ago, AKTKWNG said:

I wish that using the correct damage type would confer even greater benefits to players. Currently, crit-rad melees are still largely superior to other methods of dealing with the Wolf, due to scaling crits and shattering impact. This should be adjusted so that players have more freedom to play melee builds they want while paired up with other wolf-killers. Maybe have it so that radiation damage from guns against the Wolf have a chance to mini-stun him similar to an impact proc, so that squishier frames still have a good chance against him while being able to keep their distance.

While I understand and would like to see something like that happen, the issue is that it's too easy to get a weapon that can lock an enemy and just keep mashing the melee button. Make the weapon hit fast enough, and a chance becomes a guarantee. Sure, it would reward players for doing their builds right, but that just brings another problem, which so happened to spark the bulletsponge issue of Wolf in the first place: the game is too dumbed down and easy. Even in Wolf's "dangerous" state, I once again will say that you could just grab an immortal frame and literally have no issue aside from the time you'd be wasting pushing his health bar down. Wukong, press 2, drop a pebble on your E with an AHK script and go make some chocolate milk. It's gonna be 1/4 done by the time you get back.

Unfortunately, Warframe's current state only supports bulletsponge enemies and forced invincibility periods to bring "challenge", and I say that word as lightly as a Kilogram of cotton. Instead of the game being about a powerful war machine fighting powerful armies, it's about a powerful war machine fighting dumb hitscanners with overpowered EHP and damage that fluctuates between tickling and "WHAT THE #*!%, DID HE JUST ONE-HIT MY 9999999999 EHP" reactions, depending on where you are in the game. Until the game is properly balanced, the Wolf syndrome will repeat itself over and over, and I will say that as many times as I should, until DE actually goes through with some serious and much needed overhauls.

[YUNoJump]

I'd agree with any argument that he shouldn't be weaker if it weren't for the fact that he can spawn just about anywhere and it's out of your control. I don't want to have to always bring a meta gun, not when I could be levelling something else or using a non-meta weapon that I actually find fun, and sometimes I'd rather run fast missions without the threat of a 5 minute delay in which you have to fight a wall of meat with no real threatening abilities, backed up by some random ads that have massive damage and invincibility for no reason other than the fact that the Wolf himself isn't very good at killing people.

The Wolf is one of the only enemies in the game that can stay alive for a while without resorting to invulnerability phases, and that's good (outside of the power/status immunity), but DE should use that strength on real bosses, with threatening movesets that you have to play around, not enemies who can randomly show up anywhere and punish you for the crime of not playing a meta gun at all times.

[Steel_Rook]

3 hours ago, AKTKWNG said:

I really like this idea of a looming threat in the background with a specific weakness, kind of like having to venture into the haunted woods with a flashlight. I feel like having to prepare a specific type of weapon against the Wolf is not too much to ask, especially since it can be any one weapon in your entire loadout. In fact, I wish that using the correct damage type would confer even greater benefits to players.

Without wishing to be rude, that is terrible game design. For one, it gets redundant VERY quickly. You can't really have more than one of these, else the player starts having to bring multiple mandatory weapons to ward against multiple threats. For another thing... Yeah, it IS too much to ask. Asking players to dedicate a weapon slot for a boss who's not going to spawn most of the time isn't preparedness. It's just locking down a weapon slot and limiting variety. The hell do I need a Lanka for on a low-level Infested mission? But I have to have one in case the Wolf shows up and I don't feel like spending half an hour mag-dumping into him with my "level-up weapons." And finally, node difficulty exists for a reason. If I'm playing a mission on Mars or Mercury, it's because I'm looking for a low-level, easy experience where I can bring a crap build made up of low-level gear MR fodder. Having to worry about a boss in a low-level mission is not tension, it's irritation.

Wolf's design is the result of game mechanics operating well outside of their intended parameters, producing a binary boss as a result. He's trivial with the right gear and damn near impossible with the wrong gear. Far as I'm concerned, he had no reason to spawn in regular mission as an "assassin" to begin with. He should have had his own node from the start, possibly with some kind of resource cost to attempt him collected from killing his Fugitives. That way, we could go in actually prepared to fight a tanky enemy, rather than having one imposed on us when we were doing something else.

[Aldain]

2 minutes ago, Steel_Rook said:

Having to worry about a boss in a low-level mission is not tension, it's irritation.

Indeed, and more to the point I don't get the people who are complaining about people who just want to affinity farm in peace like they are committing some grand sin for wanting to go to Hydron without getting ganked. Especially when players have been farming like that for longer than the Wolf has even remotely existed.

Similarly I can't fathom how people confuse a bullet sponge as a challenge when the Wolf had trouble killing any players to the point where they had to add the Molotov Mooks to give him some degree of threat.

I'll admit that maybe some people can like it that way, but man no matter how hard I try I can't understand why.

[Teridax68]

4 hours ago, AKTKWNG said:

I actually think that after the initial round of nerfs to the Wolf's tankiness, he settled into a very good spot. He was still daunting if you were caught unprepared, but was much more manageable if you had at least one properly modded crit-radiation weapon, and he crumpled like wet tissue if you min-maxed with something like a shattering impact valkyr.

This is one of the main reasons why I think the Wolf is so unpleasant to fight: how exactly does one "prepare" for the Wolf? Because up until this Tactical Alert, the Wolf was a randomly spawned assassin that could theoretically appear in any mission, bar the Plains and Vallis. The entire point to random assassins is that you can't really prepare for them, because they can strike at any time. Why, then, do we need this assassin to present such large discrepancies in damage received that going in with the "wrong" loadout will literally multiply the time to kill him? Fighting him with the wrong damage type can already multiply the time needed to kill him by three and a half, and this difference is itself multiplied depending on whether you're using a crit or a status weapon. When even the most hyper-optimized setup can still have a four-person squad take thirty full seconds of constant damage to kill the Wolf, how exactly is that fair or fun to the person running the "wrong" setup in a regular mission?

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

I was screwed by the old wolf with his invincible molotov throwing hooligans while stealth farming with equinox and stood no chance. HAving to bring a very specific meta gun to every mission out of fear that you will have a walking bullet sponge that also instagibs you with fire is not something that was fun even for a veteran like me. All it did was make me want to bring my Rhino to every mission and hope he chose to spawn at an opportune time. I do feel for him being nerfed again and again but he shoudl of never came out in such a broken state where most players could not kill him and even a group of 4 veterans (My friends) took like 15-20 minutes to kill him when he spawned on Hydron the first time I saw him with no gear that could dent the nearly invincible bullet sponge. Hopefully DE learns from this and makes the next assassin not such a threat he needs a meta weapon to be killed every single time and spongier then the thing that lives in a pineapple under the sea. Don't get me wrong I am not against them being strong but not as strong as the wolf was on release....

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

8 hours ago, Basalto said:

It's also worth mentioning that forcing the player to separate one of their three weapon slots for a very specific weapon meant to kill an enemy that is beyond any level in the mission itself, who might or might not show up, is just punishing the player for existing. What if I like alternating between Lenz and a sidearm? What if I like using Vigorous Swap with two similar weapons to use and abuse the extra damage?

Then it's up to you to find a way to make it work for you?

I don't think that I ever saw a single Wukong in my time hunting him. And I certainly knew that there was no one specific weapon to kill him with. Some frames were very good for doing the killing, but I didn't need to take one of the best, I just took the frame I like the most. I had a few options for the weapons that would get the job done, and just made sure that I chose wisely. 

The problem is that many people chose to take nothing that would work, and then complained because they made poor choices and faced the consequences of those poor choices. 

Others never had a problem taking him down while simultaneously levelling gear, or doing relics, or whatever. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

22 minutes ago, (XB1)Zweimander said:

I was screwed by the old wolf with his invincible molotov throwing hooligans while stealth farming with equinox and stood no chance. HAving to bring a very specific meta gun to every mission out of fear that you will have a walking bullet sponge that also instagibs you with fire is not something that was fun even for a veteran like me.

In that situation, newbs like me would have just gone around him, the exact same way we did with the Syndicate squads. Why didn't you try that, if you knew that you were poorly set up for taking him down? 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

5 hours ago, Aldain said:

Indeed, and more to the point I don't get the people who are complaining about people who just want to affinity farm in peace like they are committing some grand sin for wanting to go to Hydron without getting ganked. Especially when players have been farming like that for longer than the Wolf has even remotely existed.

Because Hydron is the only place to level up weapons in the whole star chart. 😭 It's not like there's anywhere faster for doing that where he can't spawn at all. 😭 Why should anyone go to a high level node carrying anything other than unranked gear? 😭

 

Meanwhile back in every single relay, Sanctuary exists, and Simaris has no interest in your poor excuses and your crocodile tears. 

[(XBOX)Zweimander]

Just now, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

In that situation, newbs like me would have just gone around him, the exact same way we did with the Syndicate squads. Why didn't you try that, if you knew that you were poorly set up for taking him down? 

I could have but he spawned so rarely I had to at least try to kill him even if I knew it was in vain having only my archgun with limited ammo and a rather high level wolf. if it was up to me I would of been my rhino and killed him easily which is why i usually brought my rhino whenever I played as well as solo from that point on. When even a 5 year veteran is scared into bringing a very specific gear set just incase a field boss spawns that is an issue because how is a newer player supposed to kill him? Immunity to most abilities, two forms of DR and status immunity was going way to far in this case. He should of not come out as stupid as he did period and his invincible goons were just kinda BS as well because you could not always separate the wolf from them and it made the fight even harder on top of the Tankiness.

Perhaps he could of just taken reduced damage from abilities in general and not been immune to status and then people would of been able to fight back more reasonably in general. and vets would of been able to kill him every time regardless without needing specific gear but it wouldn't of been a cake walk still as well. Also his goons should not of been invincible at any point and that was just a stupid design choice on DE's part honestly. My only hope is they take what they did with the wold initially and do not do it again because if we did what OP suggested we would have a bunch of field bosses that all require unique pieces of gear to kill and once that exceeded the number of weapons we can equip what would we do then? I understand the want of a challenging enemy I really do but making a bullet sponge with invincible allies that cant be effected by abilities or status is not the way to go about it period.

[--END--Rikutatis]

Forget about it OP, all the enemies and semblance of difficulty in this game are eventually nerfed into the ground. The best we can hope for is for the devs to implement a difficulty slider to the game like they mentioned earlier this year. But even if they do that, I still have this nagging doubt they'll manage to trivialize it somehow in the name of accessibility. 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

8 minutes ago, (XB1)Zweimander said:

When even a 5 year veteran is scared into bringing a very specific gear set just incase a field boss spawns that is an issue because how is a newer player supposed to kill him?

Oh I used Rhino, because I'm a newb with just one year, but even I know that Valkyr and Chroma always outclassed Rhino when taking on the wolf. Excalibur and Titania would easily have been solid choices as well. Garuda could oneshot him with a omgwtfbbq blast after feeding on his conveniently immortal buddies. 

And as for:

13 minutes ago, (XB1)Zweimander said:

I could have but he spawned so rarely I had to at least try to kill him even if I knew it was in vain having only my archgun with limited ammo and a rather high level wolf.

Oh he would have happily tried to follow you, separating him from his entourage. So you wouldn't need to deal with, or even worry about his, 'invincible molotov throwing hooligans'. 

Just you, and the lamb you were leading to the slaughter. 

[AKTKWNG]

Yeah, I expected my opinion to be rather unpopular, but please don't misconstrue my intent as some kind of vets vs noobs kind of deal, I'm a relative newcomer to the game myself. I guess why I personally like the wolf so much is because I like the idea of things not going according to plan. I like the idea of emergent gameplay, and I find fixing a bad situation on the fly to be more fun than playing out a good situation smoothly. I like having the wolf pop in during a survival mission and suddenly having to juggle between focus-firing him and killing enough ads to maintain life support. I prefer doing pug tricaps over premade groups. That's just me. I get that.

But also, I like the idea that the wolf is something you have to specifically build against. I feel that Warframe is a game of massive buildcraft possibilities smothered by a few overwhelmingly good options. The game was clearly designed for you to look up the elemental strengths and weaknesses of your enemies and prepare accordingly, but in reality there's the corrosive build and the viral-slash build and everything else is for screwing-around purposes only. I specifically like the fact that a generically good build doesn't work on the wolf, because I don't want a generically good build to exist at all.

[Basalto]

13 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Then it's up to you to find a way to make it work for you?

I don't think that I ever saw a single Wukong in my time hunting him. And I certainly knew that there was no one specific weapon to kill him with. Some frames were very good for doing the killing, but I didn't need to take one of the best, I just took the frame I like the most. I had a few options for the weapons that would get the job done, and just made sure that I chose wisely. 

The problem is that many people chose to take nothing that would work, and then complained because they made poor choices and faced the consequences of those poor choices. 

Others never had a problem taking him down while simultaneously levelling gear, or doing relics, or whatever. 

I mean, yeah, I could just cripple one of my slots to prepare for the inevitable case of RNG #*!%ing me, but is that even remotely close to good design? Players could beat the Wolf without grabbing some Wolf-killer weapon, but that just made the fight less boring. It was a case of "do you want to spend 15 minutes shooting or 5?", and that's just obnoxious for no real reason. Why should I "take something that would work" when the point of doing missions is to do the mission, not to farm an assassin spawn that never really got unmarked from the player? DE added assassin beacons for a reason, y'know? Either way, you seem to be under the assumption that people are claiming it's some kind of impossible problem to take down Wolf without extreme preparation, but the preparation just shortens an already easy process (with the exception of the molotov ragheads, which were added because Wolf by himself was just too #*!%ing easy to fight, just lenghty, and any idiot knows that length is not difficulty).

While not being prepared should have its consequences, players should prepare for something they are going to do, not RNG. Preparing for RNG is bullS#&$ design, while preparing for a tough boss fight that you are willingly going to do is a natural process. I theoretically "take nothing that would work", because my objective is doing the mission I am playing the game to do, not lose 15 minutes of my life fighting a random bulletsponge with EHP on the group of the millions. At least the other assassins are not annoying to kill, and might even present a threat to people who get too cocky, like people who insist on not dodging Shadow Stalker's telegraphed attacks with Ember.

A wise man once said: just because you don't have a problem, it doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist. "I don't have a problem" or "other people don't have a problem" is a half-assed way to dismiss something that could otherwise be a genuine subject of discussion.

To summarize: Wolf is not challenging, his "difficulty" comes from his invicible allies with skyrocketed damage, preparing for RNG is the stupidest thing people can support and his nerfs were deserved. I'll also refer to the last paragraph of my previous comment.

[DrivaMain]

13 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

The problem is that many people chose to take nothing that would work, and then complained because they made poor choices and faced the consequences of those poor choices. 

Others never had a problem taking him down while simultaneously levelling gear, or doing relics, or whatever. 

A bullet sponge field boss that’s fully immune to status that has a chance to spawn randomly no matter the level or your gear so you are forced to bring a rad crit weapon every time is not a good boss design.

He spawns randomly so you can’t expect him to show up. At least give him status resistance not full immunity so status weapons can deal some reasonable damage to him or he cannot spawn unless you have a rank 20 loadout or higher (this should apply to all assassin)

Using poor choices as a counter argument are lame. What if people forgot to bring their rad crit weapon and the wolf shows up with no way of damaging him thus failing the mission?  Or what if those people wants to fast level their gear in Hydron and the wolf shows up failing the mission thus wasting 5-20 minutes of their time?

[AshenHaze]

THey  don't need to be nerfed.

They just need to have FUN mechanics instead of being -99% damage reduction sponges. Sadly, once again, the insane levels of power bloat  won't let that happen. Worst of all, DE probably won't fix it because the whales like their power bloat.

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

8 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

A bullet sponge field boss that’s fully immune to status that has a chance to spawn randomly no matter the level or your gear so you are forced to bring a rad crit weapon every time is not a good boss design.

He spawns randomly so you can’t expect him to show up. At least give him status resistance not full immunity so status weapons can deal some reasonable damage to him or he cannot spawn unless you have a rank 20 loadout or higher (this should apply to all assassin)

Using poor choices as a counter argument are lame. What if people forgot to bring their rad crit weapon and the wolf shows up with no way of damaging him thus failing the mission?  Or what if those people wants to fast level their gear in Hydron and the wolf shows up failing the mission thus wasting 5-20 minutes of their time?

He spawns randomly with a fixed RNG spawn rate. This means that I have every reason to expect him to show up. 

Ignoring status and powers isn't unique to him. Being tanky isn't unique, and having a single health and armour type is actually a weakness because it means that only a single weapon that can deal a damage type that gets a bonus, is going to be needed. 

People who know that there's a significant chance to encounter the enemy, who refuse to do anything to help themselves deal with the enemy when it spawns, can't blame their ridiculous state of unpreparedness on anyone else. 

The wolf was a wake up call. He reminded people that they aren't the untouchable gods that they paint themselves to be in their own fantasies. They resent him for that. 

For many people, the wolf was never the "impossible to beat in a reasonable amount of time" bogeyman that people are making him out to be. Many of the people claiming that he was, consistently chose to take no gear capable of helping them to take him out. That's called "making bad choices". 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

8 hours ago, Basalto said:

I mean, yeah, I could just cripple one of my slots to prepare for the inevitable case of RNG #*!%ing me, but is that even remotely close to good design? Players could beat the Wolf without grabbing some Wolf-killer weapon, but that just made the fight less boring. It was a case of "do you want to spend 15 minutes shooting or 5?", and that's just obnoxious for no real reason. Why should I "take something that would work" when the point of doing missions is to do the mission, not to farm an assassin spawn that never really got unmarked from the player? DE added assassin beacons for a reason, y'know? Either way, you seem to be under the assumption that people are claiming it's some kind of impossible problem to take down Wolf without extreme preparation, but the preparation just shortens an already easy process (with the exception of the molotov ragheads, which were added because Wolf by himself was just too #*!%ing easy to fight, just lenghty, and any idiot knows that length is not difficulty).

While not being prepared should have its consequences, players should prepare for something they are going to do, not RNG. Preparing for RNG is bullS#&$ design, while preparing for a tough boss fight that you are willingly going to do is a natural process. I theoretically "take nothing that would work", because my objective is doing the mission I am playing the game to do, not lose 15 minutes of my life fighting a random bulletsponge with EHP on the group of the millions. At least the other assassins are not annoying to kill, and might even present a threat to people who get too cocky, like people who insist on not dodging Shadow Stalker's telegraphed attacks with Ember.

A wise man once said: just because you don't have a problem, it doesn't mean the problem doesn't exist. "I don't have a problem" or "other people don't have a problem" is a half-assed way to dismiss something that could otherwise be a genuine subject of discussion.

How is taking a single option to deal with this enemy "crippling" yourself?

You refuse to take any one of a wide range of weapons, that would help you, and would also allow you to deal with other enemies? No problem, that's on you. 

But the instant he shows up and you find yourself up a creek with no paddle, you turn around and cry about how bad the situation is? Yeah no, that's on you. 

Remember saying 'I have a problem with this' doesn't mean that there's actually a problem, especially when the context of your post makes it clear that what you're actually saying is 'I have created a problem for myself, fix it'. 

8 hours ago, Basalto said:

To summarize: Wolf is not challenging, his "difficulty" comes from his invicible allies with skyrocketed damage, preparing for RNG is the stupidest thing people can support and his nerfs were deserved. I'll also refer to the last paragraph of my previous comment.

Oh you mean the invincible allies that you can bypass, lead him away from, and simply ignore much of the time? Or the invincible allies that you can totally cc because they're affected by our warframe abilities? 

It's high time that people start learning to use the considerable resources the game gives us to adapt to the challenges they face, instead of demanding that they be allowed to win at all times. 

[DrivaMain]

30 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

He spawns randomly with a fixed RNG spawn rate. This means that I have every reason to expect him to show up. 

Ignoring status and powers isn't unique to him. Being tanky isn't unique, and having a single health and armour type is actually a weakness because it means that only a single weapon that can deal a damage type that gets a bonus, is going to be needed. 

People who know that there's a significant chance to encounter the enemy, who refuse to do anything to help themselves deal with the enemy when it spawns, can't blame their ridiculous state of unpreparedness on anyone else. 

The wolf was a wake up call. He reminded people that they aren't the untouchable gods that they paint themselves to be in their own fantasies. They resent him for that. 

For many people, the wolf was never the "impossible to beat in a reasonable amount of time" bogeyman that people are making him out to be. Many of the people claiming that he was, consistently chose to take no gear capable of helping them to take him out. That's called "making bad choices". 

With my current gear setup, I could melt the wolf in seconds. But I can’t expect him to suddenly shows up every time when I bring or not bring an anti wolf setup due to RNG and that is the problem.

Making the wolf fully immune to status effects makes status weapons more obsolete due to the fact that people are forced to bring pure critical weapons to have a chance against the wolf in normal missions.

The biggest wolf problem is him showing up in a defense or interception mission. The mission will not end until the wolf either killed or all players are dead, making him despawn. Due to the nature of pub games I can’t expect other players to listen me after I say “Don’t fight him let him despawn” thus wasting our time and that is another huge problem.

A wake up call? More like an annoyance to me. I am fine with the wolf has an assasinate mission node but as a bullet sponge assassin that can ruin your missions or force you to abort thus wasting your time if he suddenly shows up while the squad didn’t bring an anti wolf setup? That’s not challenge, that’s just an annoyance.

My solution to this is to prevent the wolf from spawning if a player has a frame or weapon that has a rank below 20. Thus players are more prepared if the wolf decided to shows up (Stalker doesn’t spawn if a player is using rank 10 warframe or below)

 

 

[Rogunz]

42 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Ignoring status and powers isn't unique to him. Being tanky isn't unique, and having a single health and armour type is actually a weakness because it means that only a single weapon that can deal a damage type that gets a bonus, is going to be needed.

Taking barely any damage from everything but one damage type isn't a weakness.

19 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Oh you mean the invincible allies that you can bypass, lead him away from, and simply ignore much of the time? Or the invincible allies that you can totally cc because they're affected by our warframe abilities?

So since you can ignore the only dangerous part of the fight what exactly is the point of having him be a massive bullet sponge?

[Aldain]

1 hour ago, DrivaMain said:

A wake up call? More like an annoyance to me. I am fine with the wolf has an assasinate mission node but as a bullet sponge assassin that can ruin your missions or force you to abort thus wasting your time if he suddenly shows up while the squad didn’t bring an anti wolf setup? That’s not challenge, that’s just an annoyance.

I'd recommend not bothering with guz when it comes to the Wolf, in their mind it is ALWAYS the player's fault no matter how stupidly designed the Wolf is and people are just wrong for not bringing a Catchmoon or Rubico Prime on every mission in case he shows up.

Despite the fact that people have been affinity farming in relative peace until now but all of the sudden in guz's mind DE is taking a stand against people powerleveling their weapons in an efficient manner on Hydron because "that's not how the game should be played" or whatever the reason is.

Its absolutely useless to argue about the Wolf with them.

[Chipputer]

I would simply make the boss susceptible to status effects but not allow him to be directly CC'd. He can have damage reduction on those statuses all he wants, I don't care. Just allow me to hit him with status effects.

I don't want them to make him into a complete joke like the Wolf was in his own tactical alert mission but I want them to put it within that middle ground. Allow all weapons to be effective in some manner as long as they benefit from either crit or status (or both) but maybe reduce the amount the statuses affect him in both duration and effect (so corrosive would be half as effective and slash would last half as long while dealing half as much damage, for example).