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DreisterDino

What about weapons that are not supposed to kill anything?

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44 minutes ago, Unimatrix0 said:

Funny, just the other day I was doing a riven challenge with Ivara. While cloaked, a Nox happened to waddle past me and I had a thought. I had a good look at what the Nox was wielding and compared it to the Stug. They're completely different! I know that people make fun of Stug a lot, but I for one find it quite a pain in the asteroids to be on the receiving end of whatever the Nox has. Why can't we just have that? What about it makes it good, and yet the Stug is not?

That is because our health is equivalent to level 5-15 enemies.  Use a stug on low level guys and it’s fine.

 

I like the idea overall.  Would need some adjustments overall to the game, but these need to be made eventually anyway.

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Posted (edited)
vor 24 Minuten schrieb Blitzkriegor:

Part of the issue is the sheer masses of enemies make utility less useful. If I can wipe an enemy permanently with any degree of speed, there's no drawback except in corner cases. I'd like to see the new faction use better tactics with smaller groups that are tougher and more status-capable and dangerous enough (they can impede you and hurt rather than outright one-shot you) that sauntering around with a hand cannon won't work well. So you want cover and multiple angles of fire, etc.

Thats a good point, ill doubt that the new Sentients will be smarter, but they might make CC in general and utility weapons more useful.

Afterall, the enemies play a big role in determining if something is useful or not.

 

Edit: But i think there could be utility weapons that work no matter against what enemies we fight.

Lets imagine we would change the Harpak (the Harpoon-gun) into a utility gun (or create a new weapon with that theme in case someone loves the Harpak 😄)

  • it could have 2 firemodes like the current one
  • the first firemode works like Valkyr's 1st ability, so you can aim somewhere and create a Zipline that will pull you towards the spot
  • the second firemode can still pull enemies like it does now or could be replaced with a mode that allows you to impale any unit (so even Nox for example) and keep them on a wall (just like Bows do, but the enemies dont have to be dead before this can happen)
  • there might even be a third firemode thats lets you create a Zipline and you remain attached to it until you release it

 

Since the upcoming Gas-City-Rework emphasizes on Parcour a lot this could open up some possibilities for our movement and might see some use in that Tileset.

Edited by DreisterDino
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Personally as a devotee to the Church of Our Most Holy Glaxion I feel it needs two things.

  1. A Vandalization. The stats wouldn't be much better but it'd have something like longer range, or ideally a more stable beam.
  2. A mechanical rework. The utility suggestion is on to something, but I'd say that the Glaxion should slow enemies it hits until they freeze solid. Shooting frozen enemies with a Glaxion will prime them to emit a Glaxion chilling field around themselves for the duration of the freeze that can help propagate the freeze. Killing a Glaxioned enemy shatters them dealing a portion of their max health as Cold damage. The portion would be dependent on how much time was left on the freeze duration.

The above wouldn't exactly rack up whole room clears like the Amprex or Ignis currently do, but damn if it doesn't sound fun to turn a whole room into self sustaining self propagating ice sculptures before you fire your Tombfinger into the center and they all go boom in a chain explosion. It's like a bastard mix of Frost's Avalanche, Nova's Molecular Prime, and Saryn's Spore.

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Hell yeah. I'm on board for this.

Would love to use the weapons that use to be mining tools, smelters, & etc to remove enemy armor, disrupt shields, & etc.

I can see weapons like say The Serro, Ripkas, Quanta being useful for destroying enemy armor.

This would also give DE a reason to equip enemies with RNG generated weapons of their faction.

So enemy groups can really change up combat on players.

Glaxion's freezing the floor & walls like the OP mentioned, Quanta's stripping armor, Amprex's disabling shields, & etc.

Such things would make combat seriously chaotic & would force players to ironically change their mindsets & target specific enemies to stop them from buffing enemies/enfeebling the field/players.

Also, this would hopefully make my dream of using the Tranq Rifle come true.

Both to sleep enemies, as well as conserve them to unlock/earn enemy Floofs. (It'd be a challenging but funny side game/quest like the Kuria are.)

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Off the top of my head, all of the following weapons can be used for something beyond point and click murder:
Mutalist Quanta
Torid
Nullifying Miter
Zakti
Tether Penta
Armour stripping shotguns/beams
Any status gun for CO melee
Any status duration secondary, especially with CCing procs
Zenistar
Debatably: Napalm Ogris, Covert Lethality on daggers, stat sticks for powers/pets

Some of these weapons are more commonly used than others, almost all of them are massively inferior to just killing enemies by shooting them because in Warframe one of the three possible objectives is "kill enemies" (alongside "go here" and "wait here"). While back in LoR there was incentive to leave enemies CCed and not kill them so that your team had a constant flow of energy, pub players in every other mission would rather kill CCed enemies even if they will just respawn elsewhere instantly.You can set up elaborate stunlocking traps or inflict long lasting freeze procs on enemies to lock up all the enemy spawns but all your effort in doing so will be for naught when a spin2win Atterax user twirls by or a Mesa player tries as hard as possible to get orange numbers on the extraction screen. Nevermind that locking up all the enemy spawns invariably gets patched out of the game by DE, look at the old nerfs to Excavation+Xiphos Turret. Any "utility" weapon has to coexist with killing focused design and killing focused players.

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On 2019-05-13 at 4:56 AM, DreisterDino said:

Because of the recent Alerts i had a thought about weapons in Warframe.

I couldnt bother to get the Glaxion-Skin because its arguably one of the worst Beam-Weapons in the game and i know i will never use it.

And nobody can deny that some weapons are even to weak to be used on an average level.

 

I dont want to make every weapon a complete beast, and of course every game has weapons that perform better than others, thats totally fine.

Since there are so many weapons in every weapon-category available in Warframe, usually when a new weapon comes out basically 2 things can happen:

  1. stats are better compared to the existing weapons -> many people will like and use the weapon
  2. stats are worse -> weapon will get ignored by most of the people after getting the MR and only very few fans of the weapon will use it

 

So my idea was to create weapons which sole purpose is utility.

Instead of buffing the stats of a bad weapon so it is on par with the better weapons, create a mechanic that makes the weapon useful even if it cant kill a lvl1 grineer 😀

We have weapons in the game already that could be classified as "utility weapons", but mostly the ones that are being used are still used for their killing potential.

Let's use the Glaxion as an example because i mentioned it at the start:

 

  • the weapon doesnt do any damage anymore (maybe just enough to kill enemies up to level 5 ....... so... everything stays the same 😅)
  • instead of shooting at enemies, you will use the Glaxion to cover the ground with Ice
  • this layer of Ice stays on the ground for a certain amount of time (Status-Duration-Mod gets useful for the 1st time in Warframes history!!!!HYPE!!!)
  • the Ice heavily slows down enemies
  • it might also give buffs to you and allies like Cunning Drift does (+Slide and -Friction)
  • it might even synergize with other weapons - if you use a weapon with Fire, you can force blast-procs when shooting at the ice (or create gas-clouds when using Poison etc)

 

What do you think? And do you have any ideas of weapons you might want to use even if they dont kill anything?

 

I think there are tons of possibilities for weapons that might be useful and fun to use or simply interesting for solo-players.

They could allow us to build traps, buff allies, debuff or cc enemies, set up possible synergies (i didnt play Anthem, but from what i have heard, one thing people liked was setting up combos and "prime" enemies, and this weapons could fulfill this purpose) or simply change the environment like the Glaxion would in my example.

 

One thing sets us apart is those that make the game don't play it on an enjoyment level. They play it on a business provocation level...meaning while u play for fun they will play for enticements towards monetary. There is less creativity in one of those philosophies hence the "touches of love" will  always become secondary to "just enough"!? Sloppily told...

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How about a dead cow launcher? Spreads disease and flatulence where ever the cows land. Enemies die gagging and wretching. 

 

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On 2019-05-13 at 10:56 AM, DreisterDino said:

this layer of Ice stays on the ground for a certain amount of time (Status-Duration-Mod gets useful for the 1st time in Warframes history!!!!HYPE!!!)

 

On 2019-05-13 at 10:56 AM, DreisterDino said:

instead of shooting at enemies, you will use the Glaxion to cover the ground with Ice

i can already see this idea as a good augment for the glaxion.

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Posted (edited)
On 2019-05-13 at 4:56 AM, DreisterDino said:

Because of the recent Alerts i had a thought about weapons in Warframe.

I couldnt bother to get the Glaxion-Skin because its arguably one of the worst Beam-Weapons in the game and i know i will never use it.

And nobody can deny that some weapons are even to weak to be used on an average level.

 

I dont want to make every weapon a complete beast, and of course every game has weapons that perform better than others, thats totally fine.

Since there are so many weapons in every weapon-category available in Warframe, usually when a new weapon comes out basically 2 things can happen:

  1. stats are better compared to the existing weapons -> many people will like and use the weapon
  2. stats are worse -> weapon will get ignored by most of the people after getting the MR and only very few fans of the weapon will use it

 

So my idea was to create weapons which sole purpose is utility.

Instead of buffing the stats of a bad weapon so it is on par with the better weapons, create a mechanic that makes the weapon useful even if it cant kill a lvl1 grineer 😀

We have weapons in the game already that could be classified as "utility weapons", but mostly the ones that are being used are still used for their killing potential.

Let's use the Glaxion as an example because i mentioned it at the start:

 

  • the weapon doesnt do any damage anymore (maybe just enough to kill enemies up to level 5 ....... so... everything stays the same 😅)
  • instead of shooting at enemies, you will use the Glaxion to cover the ground with Ice
  • this layer of Ice stays on the ground for a certain amount of time (Status-Duration-Mod gets useful for the 1st time in Warframes history!!!!HYPE!!!)
  • the Ice heavily slows down enemies
  • it might also give buffs to you and allies like Cunning Drift does (+Slide and -Friction)
  • it might even synergize with other weapons - if you use a weapon with Fire, you can force blast-procs when shooting at the ice (or create gas-clouds when using Poison etc)

 

What do you think? And do you have any ideas of weapons you might want to use even if they dont kill anything?

 

I think there are tons of possibilities for weapons that might be useful and fun to use or simply interesting for solo-players.

They could allow us to build traps, buff allies, debuff or cc enemies, set up possible synergies (i didnt play Anthem, but from what i have heard, one thing people liked was setting up combos and "prime" enemies, and this weapons could fulfill this purpose) or simply change the environment like the Glaxion would in my example.

 

feww weapons have offhand utility like syndicate weapons (magistar, Sydon, etc...).

Edited by Midas

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Give glaxion a crit build and come back and tell me it can only kill up to level 5

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video proof of killing level 100 gunner ;D

https://imgur.com/a/YVhriyK

with this build no riven added

pe7JdCA.jpg?1

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Posted (edited)
vor 9 Stunden schrieb Midas:

feww weapons have offhand utility like syndicate weapons (magistar, Sydon, etc...).

Thats true, but they basically all do the same (discharge a different damagetype and give random buffs to your Warframe).

Not saying its bad, but i think it would be interesting if we would get more Augments like for the Grakata/Quanta that really change the behaviour of a weapon.

Although i want to change the weapons a lot more, thats a start already, and those 2 mods have been the rewards i have been most curious about in Nightwave.

vor 5 Stunden schrieb .Fire_Fly.:

Give glaxion a crit build and come back and tell me it can only kill up to level 5 

Obviously i wasnt 100% serious with that 😛

Anyway, relying on ArgonScope which brings the Glaxion to a blasting 20,25% CritChance doesnt change my mind about the weapon.

The situation outside of the Simularum with frozen AI (haha, frozen AI -> Glaxion -> funny! 🙄 *facepalm*) would be different i guess.

vor 9 Stunden schrieb TheKurtiStryke:

i can already see this idea as a good augment for the glaxion. 

Augments might be the only way these ideas might get implemented anyway.

And i still think it would be cool to get alot more Augments which drastically change the behaviour of a weapon.

Doesnt really matter if the Glaxion can kill 100's in the Simularum because it wont change the fact that so many weapons in Warframe are considered Mastery Fodder.

Edited by DreisterDino
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Posted (edited)

I just want a box opener. Give us the old Telos Boltace slide effect but it only breaks every box in 3 room radius when you do it. No actual damage on it of course.

Edited by ChaosSabre

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