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[DE]Danielle

(The Jovian Concord: Update 25) Wisp Feedback

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vor 1 Stunde schrieb Buttaface:

6. The ult is not good as it stands compared to other ults, true. But cmon, with all the other utility and power of this frame, what did you expect? I put it on par with Oberon's alt as it stands, and the frame is already on the verge of displacing Oberon as it is. It needs to lose the stagger to be useful to apply conditions or CC quickly. But get ready for perma 4 builds that grief low level missions full of low level players just like all the other AOE cheeze... but not as bad as Equinox, Saryn 4 spam, Mesa, Volt, etc. which will remain the tryhard AOE frames of choice.

u might wanna rethink that statement.

considering every synergy its safe to assume that boosted sol gate has ~6k base dmg when an enemy has max vulnerability towards it after i guess 3 seconds...with heat +rad +corr proccs...with 100% chance to cause breach surges sparks...with unlimited enemy punch through and granting wisp cc immunity.

i dare say she's one of few frames where every ability is great considering the synergies. with the recent buffs towards her 4 its lacking in AoE compared to others, still, BUT despite that and the fact that it does drain quite some energy its still very strong. she basically sacrifices AoE and direct impact for synergetic power and more comprimated but higher AoE damage, which is not too bad considering her CC and ability to easily reposition.

 

i have to add that before release i wasnt too sure about her, especially sol gate but now after release and the recent buffs its quite obvious that shes really good, at least in my opinion, which does include sol gate.

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46 minutes ago, Morticoccus said:

I don't think people quite understand the whole point of a cooperative game when they count DPS/kills above all else.

 

Like I say, I don't care if Wisp's 4 gets nerfed or buffed, since the best ability in her kit is her 1, with 3 following right behind.

It would be awesome if we could also teleport to another wisp's reservoirs. I wonder if the devs would consider adding this. 

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30 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

u might wanna rethink that statement.

 

Eh, I believe the ult is subpar compared to lots of other ults in the game, but as stated don't think that's a great big deal. Any of the exalted ults do far more dps, and the radial ults are mostly better. As stated, I put it on par with Oberon's ult, maybe a skosh below due to the CC and armor stripping of Oberon, and above only a few ults like Atlas' Dumblers and overnerfed Bladestorm, But feel free to change my mind. Which Ults is Wisp's objectively better than? List please. I can come up with 4-5 at most on my own. In other words "I would rather have Wisp's ultimate than X's ultimate." Short list. That's pretty subpar in a game with several frames needing reworks.

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I find it pretty hard to know where the Will-o-wisp is on the map when I want to teleport while not having it in my fow, can we have a unique icon, or simply one of the size of a Player frame ?

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Could we get Wisps cloth physics back as to how they were before that one hotfix?

Her alt helmet now clips terribly with her butt when she moves forward.

Also the stiffness does not suit her at all, being a flowy ghost lady thing..

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vor 11 Stunden schrieb Buttaface:

Eh, I believe the ult is subpar compared to lots of other ults in the game, but as stated don't think that's a great big deal. Any of the exalted ults do far more dps, and the radial ults are mostly better. As stated, I put it on par with Oberon's ult, maybe a skosh below due to the CC and armor stripping of Oberon, and above only a few ults like Atlas' Dumblers and overnerfed Bladestorm, But feel free to change my mind. Which Ults is Wisp's objectively better than? List please. I can come up with 4-5 at most on my own. In other words "I would rather have Wisp's ultimate than X's ultimate." Short list. That's pretty subpar in a game with several frames needing reworks.

that short list is ur opinion, which is ofc fine but it highly depends on how good radial AoE u rate. in my opinion radial AoE is totally pointless if it doesnt do a whole lot, like volt's ult is only CC later and doesnt kill anything anymore as soon as enemies are a bit more durable. lets turn the whole question around. which ults are better than hers vs lets say lv100. saryn, excal, garuda, mesa, nova and ash's are better in my opinion. titania sure can hurt a lot in her 4 but imo its too energy hungry and the augment does even worsen that so personally i would rate it worse...but again the opinion-matter.

still a frameis not simply 1 ability. u do not just get wisps 4 but also the rest and considering shes deceptively durable, has good buffs and quite the CC with sol gate on top it is a good damage tool. what does wisp not have ? literal invincibility and scaling damage with enemy level. invisibility is kind of an alternative to invinc and scaling damage is nice and fine but one has to play content where it matters for it to be important so it depends. with all the cc and durability a 4 that can kill lv125s comfortably is fine imo.

i usually dont narrow a frame/player down to just the 4 so i cant answer ur question anyway but i also think genereally only caring about the ult is a bad idea where so many frames have good abilities on 1-3 too, of which Wisp is a good example. actually quite the opposite...i'd rather have a player/frame who knows what he/she does and uses all abilities well on a "non meta" frame than someone who just picks a more popular frame and spams 4.

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Managed to easily farm and build her.

She works just fine. As amazing as this may sound: I have no complaints about her kit.

Only thing that still eludes me is the themeing. I have no idea what a Will-o-wisp has to do with the Sun and tiny, electric plant pods.

Don't change her any more. This is perfectly balanced. 

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I really like Wisp.  All her abilities are unique and fun.  Of course she sitting in my inventory atm cause I have to wait a week for the cyst to go away, but other than that.

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4 hours ago, Xydeth said:

that short list is ur opinion, which is ofc fine but it highly depends on how good radial AoE u rate. in my opinion radial AoE is totally pointless if it doesnt do a whole lot, like volt's ult is only CC later and doesnt kill anything anymore as soon as enemies are a bit more durable. lets turn the whole question around. which ults are better than hers vs lets say lv100. saryn, excal, garuda, mesa, nova and ash's are better in my opinion. titania sure can hurt a lot in her 4 but imo its too energy hungry and the augment does even worsen that so personally i would rate it worse...but again the opinion-matter.

still a frameis not simply 1 ability. u do not just get wisps 4 but also the rest and considering shes deceptively durable, has good buffs and quite the CC with sol gate on top it is a good damage tool. what does wisp not have ? literal invincibility and scaling damage with enemy level. invisibility is kind of an alternative to invinc and scaling damage is nice and fine but one has to play content where it matters for it to be important so it depends. with all the cc and durability a 4 that can kill lv125s comfortably is fine imo.

i usually dont narrow a frame/player down to just the 4 so i cant answer ur question anyway but i also think genereally only caring about the ult is a bad idea where so many frames have good abilities on 1-3 too, of which Wisp is a good example. actually quite the opposite...i'd rather have a player/frame who knows what he/she does and uses all abilities well on a "non meta" frame than someone who just picks a more popular frame and spams 4.

Lots of words for a dodge of a very simple question. Which frames' ults would you replace with Wisp's ult? It's that simple. Will you dodge again? No one asked you to "narrow down a frame down to just the 4." No one said a "frame is one ability." Those things aren't stated or implied in the simple question.

You have made the claim that Wisp's ult is very powerful, but 1. it isn't and 2. it's in the bottom tier of ults in the game.

Just looked through the entire list. The only ult demonstratively worse than Wisp's is Atlas', and of course that's an opinion (one I'm not all that solid on either due to Dumblers' attracting aggro and not having energy drain once cast. Wisp's ult may well be the very worst ultimate in the game as it stands). This is a game forum full of opinions, but that doesn't mean all opinions are equally grounded or persuasive.

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vor 34 Minuten schrieb Buttaface:

Lots of words for a dodge of a very simple question. Which frames' ults would you replace with Wisp's ult? It's that simple. Will you dodge again? No one asked you to "narrow down a frame down to just the 4." No one said a "frame is one ability." Those things aren't stated or implied in the simple question.

You have made the claim that Wisp's ult is very powerful, but 1. it isn't and 2. it's in the bottom tier of ults in the game.

i dont care what u "ask" of me, im free to have and state my opinion, thank u very much. ur passive aggressiveness doesnt really change anything about that.

also, u mention dodging and then all there is to ur comment is this ? talk about dodging since i explained why her ult is quite good. u on the contrary just complain about it without any real explanation or suggestion to improve it outside of the stagger....really ? u can even skip it...like, try it out.

that aside...read my comment properly and u have the answer.

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3 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

i dont care what u "ask" of me.

also, u mention dodging and then all there is to ur comment is this ? talk about dodging since i explained why her ult is quite good. u on the contrary just complain about it without any real explanation or suggestion to improve it outside of the stagger....really ? u can even skip it...like, try it out.

that aside...read my comment properly and u have the answer.

Her ult really needs to go it is completely useless for wisp because it will only get her killed. A debuff Ability to increase damage dealt to enemies would be so much better or even a grouping ability too.

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vor 4 Minuten schrieb CodeUltimate:

Her ult really needs to go it is completely useless for wisp because it will only get her killed. A debuff Ability to increase damage dealt to enemies would be so much better or even a grouping ability too.

how does it get u killed ? usually u use her 3 before and then ult since it buffs dmg so much. they also have heat and rad proccs on them so enemies around aggro them and the hit enemies themselves are cced anyway, aside of the blind AoE. she also has her 2 which makes her invisible...how do u manage to die ? o.O

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11 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

how does it get u killed ? usually u use her 3 before and then ult since it buffs dmg so much. they also have heat and rad proccs on them so enemies around aggro them and the hit enemies themselves are cced anyway, aside of the blind AoE. she also has her 2 which makes her invisible...how do u manage to die ? o.O

I mean it is such a waste of energy since your 3 already procs radiation and there are better weapons to strip armor faster than your ult. If you consider the amount of energy you Will use on her ult and then on her 2 to not get killed while ulting, then you can conclude it requieres too much energy for what you actually did.

In other words her ult is not efficient and you would rather use energy in any other skill and use your weapons. Her ult breaks her flow in battle for me.

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22 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

i dont care what u "ask" of me, im free to have and state my opinion, thank u very much. ur passive aggressiveness doesnt really change anything about that.

Yet you made a long-winded post, dodging in print for all to see (and now dodging even more), while attempting to explain (with flawed reasoning) why you refused to answer the simple question. You claimed the ult was powerful, yet apparently can't make a comparative case to other ults that it is indeed powerful.

Now personal attacks with the "passive aggressive" nonsense, jargon you very clearly do not understand. Seen enough. Stopped reading there.

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ult is gud

better than some other's ults

it's just your attitude to "ults" - 4 must be WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY better than 1-3 taken together

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2 minutes ago, LameoveR said:

it's just your attitude to "ults" - 4 must be WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY better than 1-3 taken together

Honestly true

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vor 39 Minuten schrieb Buttaface:

Yet you made a long-winded post, dodging in print for all to see (and now dodging even more), while attempting to explain (with flawed reasoning) why you refused to answer the simple question. You claimed the ult was powerful, yet apparently can't make a comparative case to other ults that it is indeed powerful.

Now personal attacks with the "passive aggressive" nonsense, jargon you very clearly do not understand. Seen enough. Stopped reading there.

aaaaand again talking about dodging only. u might wanna pick up a mirror and take a good look since dodging is actually all u urself do to avoid taking my comments into account. well, i guess ur right on one end - im done wasting time.

vor 31 Minuten schrieb LameoveR:

ult is gud

better than some other's ults

it's just your attitude to "ults" - 4 must be WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY-WAY better than 1-3 taken together

bit overexaggerated, but agree. thats one part i was talking about concerning wisp: her ult alone is not too impressive, sure, but the ult doesnt come alone and there is synergy to buff it quite well into a very good state, on top of the other abilities themselves.

vor 40 Minuten schrieb CodeUltimate:

I mean it is such a waste of energy since your 3 already procs radiation and there are better weapons to strip armor faster than your ult. If you consider the amount of energy you Will use on her ult and then on her 2 to not get killed while ulting, then you can conclude it requieres too much energy for what you actually did.

In other words her ult is not efficient and you would rather use energy in any other skill and use your weapons. Her ult breaks her flow in battle for me.

it takes me roughly 130 energy total to kill 8 lv 130 bombards without me taking any damage at all. her 3 also doesnt directly procc rad but the sparks do, true, BUT they have a damage multiplier and when u use her 4 on a blinded enemy from her 3 u have 100% chance for sparks which deal increased rad damage. against heavy bombards rad damage is quite good and sol gate itself removes the armor so in the end its a very considerable damage increase at least. the rad proccs from her 4 are also more consistent due to it being a beam. sparks dont have a 100% chance unless its a rly high power strenght build so ets say ~40% spark chance and maybe around 35% procc chance each spark. sol gate will apply rad more reliably on average so its not totally pointless.

 

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19 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

aaaaand again talking about dodging only. u might wanna pick up a mirror and take a good look since dodging is actually all u urself do to avoid taking my comments into account. well, i guess ur right on one end - im done wasting time.

bit overexaggerated, but agree. thats one part i was talking about concerning wisp: her ult alone is not too impressive, sure, but the ult doesnt come alone and there is synergy to buff it quite well into a very good state, on top of the other abilities themselves.

it takes me roughly 130 energy total to kill 8 lv 130 bombards without me taking any damage at all. her 3 also doesnt directly procc rad but the sparks do, true, BUT they have a damage multiplier and when u use her 4 on a blinded enemy from her 3 u have 100% chance for sparks which deal increased rad damage. against heavy bombards rad damage is quite good and sol gate itself removes the armor so in the end its a very considerable damage increase at least. the rad proccs from her 4 are also more consistent due to it being a beam. sparks dont have a 100% chance unless its a rly high power strenght build so ets say ~40% spark chance and maybe around 35% procc chance each spark. sol gate will apply rad more reliably on average so its not totally pointless.

 

If you use gas damage on an enemy affected by her 3 you can proc the bolts like there is no tomorrow. :B

you know at least I would like an augment that let's you place her ult like a mini sun that procs corrosive and strips armor from enemies in a large area.

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vor 4 Minuten schrieb CodeUltimate:

If you use gas damage on an enemy affected by her 3 you can proc the bolts like there is no tomorrow. :B

yea dot works well, sadly it converts the damage and doesnt transfer proccs, otherwise slash would also be really really good. from what i can tell so far beam weapons are a good way to kind of circumvent the spark chance on builds which dont just go ham and cheese on power strenght. rad as a damage ignoring the procc is okayish on average but it would be much better if that was changed into 2 elements, like rad +heat like sol gate is with no procc chance itself but transfering the procc that caused it. might make slash proccs a bit silly on her but hey...garuda still giggles~

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6 minutes ago, Xydeth said:

yea dot works well, sadly it converts the damage and doesnt transfer proccs, otherwise slash would also be really really good. from what i can tell so far beam weapons are a good way to kind of circumvent the spark chance on builds which dont just go ham and cheese on power strenght. rad as a damage ignoring the procc is okayish on average but it would be much better if that was changed into 2 elements, like rad +heat like sol gate is with no procc chance itself but transfering the procc that caused it. might make slash proccs a bit silly on her but hey...garuda still giggles~

I love wisp but I just want her to be a proc goddess and use her ulti without restricting her actions.

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Wisp must be "balanced". But as you know, you can abuse any frame's ability if you would like.

I can't say she's WOW, cause she needs 1 to buff herself to just stay alive.

She needs to jump to be stealthed.

She needs 3 to proc sparkles to make mos use of  Sol Gate.

But you can test how much time\energy doest  Saryn  take to kill 8 150lvl bombardiers with her 1 and 4.

Or any other frame with "better" Ult.

 

 

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vor einer Stunde schrieb CodeUltimate:

I love wisp but I just want her to be a proc goddess and use her ulti without restricting her actions.

i think that would be too underwhelming. some proccs are strong on their own but technically u need damage to support it. slash proccs of 100 base dmg...weak, viral on its own ? weak. corrosive on its own ? same story and so on.

i agree on the ult part to a certain degree. it should allow casting her 3 but maybe not around wisp herself or her willo-o but rather have half its cost and cause her beam to apply the blind for maybe 3 seconds, moddable ofc.

it needs to restrict to a certain degree, at least animation wise. how would she look channeling sol gate whilst bulletjumping ? i couldnt imagine something thats not totally awkward 😛

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For the little ive played her the ult feels really rather lacking, but my biggest issue is with her 3. Its really not flashy enough. I cant really tell too well with all the other frame abilities effecting enemies which ones ive actually hit, even if i have blinding white energy on and when i shoot them the particle shooting off to hit other enemies really doesnt look that fancy. Please flash her up some? Girls gotta have some flair 

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27 minutes ago, LuckyCharm said:

For the little ive played her the ult feels really rather lacking, but my biggest issue is with her 3. Its really not flashy enough. I cant really tell too well with all the other frame abilities effecting enemies which ones ive actually hit, even if i have blinding white energy on and when i shoot them the particle shooting off to hit other enemies really doesnt look that fancy. Please flash her up some? Girls gotta have some flair 

Try a brighter energy color that will show the blind effect on the mobs' faces and the sparks. If not using the inferior ult (and probably should not be wasting energy and time that way instead of killing mobs much faster with deliciously speeded up weapons) you can go wild with an energy color. If using the frame's objectively weak ult, for S&G, then tone down the energy color unless the intent is to grief the team.

Infested or Halloween bright green makes the 3 plenty noticeable.

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