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[DE]Rebecca

Operation: Hostile Mergers Leaderboard Information

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39 минут назад, --RV--Goddess сказал:

 Also I wonder how many clans used the guide we made? XD - Id like a solid count yakno? 

Where can I haz ze guide? Asking for a friend

On topic:

Bugs happen even to the best of them. Expecting developers to bugfix every possible exploit in a complex game is asking them to not release it ever.

You are expected to have common sense and recognize that switch teleporting Demo along a hallway for 1.5 minutes is clever use of game mechanics, while instakilling it is a clever abuse of game bugs. You know, considering the whole game mode is about trying to stop the Demo train which is supposed to get harder and harder.

I guess WF playerbase is just not used to competitive environment and thus doesn't see anything wrong with abusing clearly unintended mechanics that normally "would not hurt anyone else". Thing is, once you go competitive, it would actually hurt.

Any reasonable PvP-centered game would see (and have seen) the same response from developers in a similar situation. Though in WF case DE should probably cut people some slack for the first time offenders because they probably haven't had a chance to train a proper fair play mindset without an established competitive environment.

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3 minutes ago, TheSimplist said:

I agree with the clearing of the leaderboards and the resetting scores to 0, so on and so forth. All of those are fair and balanced when it comes to something that was not intended.
however the account suspension until the event is over is something that i do not agree with.

If we look at the situation one way, players found out (probably on accident) that Demolysts die if they fall off a cliff.
This probably sparked a debate on the fastest way to push a demolyst off a cliff to kill them.
It was found that switch teleport works on them and the cheese began.
however this is clearly mechanics that were in the game and were not math manipulation or weirdness with rivens. It was simply an oversight by you guys at DE.
it was a clever way to kill the demolysts by using warframe powers, and in a game about freedom of builds and play-styles i would think that you of all people would understand that you should never suspend a player for being clever. removing the score is one thing, but preventing them from enjoying the rest of the game is another story.

now nobody will probably read this and nothing will probably come of this but I at least wanted to try to get a voice out there that you are being a little harsh on the players here.
arguably they will maybe not do it again in the future with other exploits, but they also will stop trying new things, they will stop trying to find new creative ways to defeat enemies, and they will stop enjoying the game as a whole because they feel like they are being punished for being clever.

The problem is if you actually tried to do that on any enemy before this new tileset, it would not work. You would of learned, it doesn't work and that enemies get put back on solid ground, just like players and items. It would be CLEAR what is intended to happen. So if you tried with a demo and it died, it should be obvious it was not working right.

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mJTt4gf.png

It was enjoyable running this event with my clan. 

For the first time, we were able to get our Gold without breaking the core group of players and most of us can still run the mission type without stressing out players.  (stares in Defection event Gold requirements) 

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Posted (edited)

People tend to forget that using abilities for their intended use is different than using the ability in exploiting mechanics, sure that's a smart why of using the ability in a different way but not really meant for it intended use, Loki teleport is not meant for killing targets, but just switching. Yes it doesn't kill target by it's own but using it outside the game intended design is wrong, that what people get confused by "Iam just using my warframe ability"

Edited by Slashz

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Posted (edited)
Quote

intended use is different than using the ability in exploiting mechanics

Please hire a lawyer to write out how each warframe ability, every weapon, every void mechanic and every damage mechanic that is allowed to be used for normal gameplay and leaderboard events please.....lol. Seems like we need a list of allowable abilities for new mob content going forward.

Edited by laserlight2

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8 hours ago, Danans said:

why would anyone want to past over 4000? its even hard for me get into 4000

Inactive clan, we had to do way more between the few of us to get the trophies.

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22 minutes ago, laserlight2 said:

Please hire a lawyer to write out how each warframe ability, every weapon, every void mechanic and every damage mechanic that is allowed to be used for normal gameplay and leaderboard events please.....lol. Seems like we need a list of allowable abilities for new mob content going forward.

Again, it's not that using the ability is wrong. Plenty have said this. It was using the ability to move an enemy to a place over a pit where it would fall and effectively die. Which doesn't happen if you do it on other tilesets, it just teleports the enemy back on to solid ground. You can still use Switch Teleport to stall the Demos all you want.

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Posted (edited)

I will probably be the most hated person here after saying this but well. Here is my take. 

The thing is majority of the people who are complaining about this were those who cannot be named that starts with "C".
The top clans are actually having fun competing with each other. even now after the score wipe majority of the top 5 clans in their respective category are still in the top 10.
DE did those bans because of the "C" outcry, Yet lets be real here. Those people who are complaining aren't even capable to duke it out on the Leader-boars even with a level playing field, So it should not affect them except for damaging their egos knowing they are kinda Meh.

There was a reason why DE made the trophy acquisition to "You can get Gold/Silver/Bronze for X amount of points" instead of "The statue will be awarded to the to top X amount of clans".
No one was loosing out here. You can get everything from the event by being a non competitive clan. 
The Leaderboards was there for the dedicated and skilled players who has knowledge to fight it out. Yet they got punished for it, which is unfair. They did practice runs for days and spent 6 Hours on a mission to get there yet this is what they get? sure wipe their scores, but banning them from the event is a bit too much. A lot of people knew about the Loki teleport but why aren't they on the Leaderboards? punishing the people who were skilled to pull it off and had the dedication to finish the run 🤨..

Edited by --Q--Cumber
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I can see both sides on the leaderboards front.

On the one-hand, leaderboards give people a reason to go back and do the new event again for a better score, which can potentially allow people who didn't do the event Day 1 a chance to get a group together. Plus when it comes to free-to-play games, it never hurts to have goals to set for oneself to mitigate burnout.

On the other though... the spirit of competition is only fostered when people are encouraged to be good sports and can't afford to be caught cheating, neither of which is particularly helped by the anonymity of the internet and low stakes of a video game; it just encourages people to find the cheesiest way to the highest score. I remember the days when Warbros would exploit to win events on the final day, then flood the forums with their toxicity and bragging before they could have their scores revoked.

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2 minutes ago, IspanoLFW said:

Again, it's not that using the ability is wrong. Plenty have said this. It was using the ability to move an enemy to a place over a pit where it would fall and effectively die. Which doesn't happen if you do it on other tilesets, it just teleports the enemy back on to solid ground. You can still use Switch Teleport to stall the Demos all you want.

From what I have read and I talked to my clan mates after being busy the last couple days, I agree. I'm just cautious after hearing about some of the Staff statements and their views on dps and ability metas. And I don't agree, if you can keep chaining infinite delays on a Demolyst, that you won't wake up to a zero score one morning. :nerd:

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3 hours ago, --Q--Krakov said:

Well the only blame I put on DE is not seeing the benefits of allowing exploiting. 

I think I will print out your response and hang it on my wall. And people still ask why do we love Q? Stay classy, Q, stay classy. 🤣

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8 hours ago, Deltablood said:

My concerns:

1. It seems kind of harsh to suspend or ban players who put, if nothing else, a lot of time into the event. I think it would be better to just reset their scores so that they can try to participate in the event legitimately.
2. I don't think it's proper to punish them to that extent when they didn't really have anything indicating that the strategy they used was not allowed. Killing enemies via Switch Teleport is unconventional, but unconventional targets call for unconventional measures. You could call it a cheese strat or whatever and that's fine, but ultimately I don't think the information the players had access to beforehand demonstrated clearly enough that such a strategy would not be tolerated.

I haven't been affected by this personally, nor do I know anybody who has been. Maybe I'm just giving too much credit, but I still find it a bit concerning that these players got suspended or banned for a strategy that wasn't explicitly stated to be illicit beforehand.

Want to know how I know you and others who posted like you didnt read Rebbs post 😉

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4 minutes ago, laserlight2 said:

From what I have read and I talked to my clan mates after being busy the last couple days, I agree. I'm just cautious after hearing about some of the Staff statements and their views on dps and ability metas. And I don't agree, if you can keep chaining infinite delays on a Demolyst, that you won't wake up to a zero score one morning. :nerd:

While defending a panel, if the timer reaches 0, ie you delayed the Demo so it never got there... you get no points.

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22 minutes ago, IspanoLFW said:

While defending a panel, if the timer reaches 0, ie you delayed the Demo so it never got there... you get no points.

I'm not sure if I understand your example correctly or not. If the Demolyst isn't dead before 0 seconds left on defense timer you get 0 points for it? Death to CC and more DPS building (switch teleport *cough cough*) :crylaugh: If I understand correctly then it seems like the game mode design encouraged the need for abusing damage mechanics for those that wanted to grind really high scores.

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4 minutes ago, laserlight2 said:

I'm not sure if I understand your example correctly or not. If the Demolyst isn't dead before 0 seconds left on defense timer you get 0 points for it? Death to CC and more DPS building (switch teleport *cough cough*) :crylaugh: If I understand correctly then it seems like the game mode design encouraged the need for abusing damage mechanics for those that wanted to grind really high scores.

You do get the rotation rewards though, so the regular game mode is not like that (too bad those rotation rewards are no that great), it's just the endurance mode where you need to kill the demolyst ASAP for high score.

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47 minutes ago, --Q--Cumber said:

I will probably be the most hated person here after saying this but well. Here is my take. 

The thing is majority of the people who are complaining about this were those who cannot be named that starts with "C".
The top clans are actually having fun competing with each other. even now after the score wipe majority of the top 5 clans in their respective category are still in the top 10.
DE did those bans because of the "C" outcry, Yet lets be real here. Those people who are complaining aren't even capable to duke it out on the Leader-boars even with a level playing field, So it should not affect them except for damaging their egos knowing they are kinda Meh.

There was a reason why DE made the trophy acquisition to "You can get Gold/Silver/Bronze for X amount of points" instead of "The statue will be awarded to the to top X amount of clans".
No one was loosing out here. You can get everything from the event by being a non competitive clan. 
The Leaderboards was there for the dedicated and skilled players who has knowledge to fight it out. Yet they got punished for it, which is unfair. They did practice runs for days and spent 6 Hours on a mission to get there yet this is what they get? sure wipe their scores, but banning them from the event is a bit too much. A lot of people knew about the Loki teleport but why aren't they on the Leaderboards? punishing the people who were skilled to pull it off and had the dedication to finish the run 🤨..

You mean the "Thank you DE, We love you DE" kind of people ? Yeah i can see that.

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The table is set, bonne appétit. 🥂 Looking forward to the second course.

Operation: Illicit Conversion, perhaps.

As for the current dish, I thought it was a bit salty until the spice kicked in.

Spoiler

23099260_1988103784807211_74910113747435

[DE]Rebecca in a nutshell.

 

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1 minute ago, --N-- said:

You do get the rotation rewards though, so the regular game mode is not like that (too bad those rotation rewards are no that great), it's just the endurance mode where you need to kill the demolyst ASAP for high score.

Ahhhh, okay. That's cool and lame at the same time, lol.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Gabbynaru said:

Stop doing leaderboards and competitive stuff. Competition always brings the worst in people and they'll always try to cheat to get ahead. Always. This is supposed to be a co-op game, so why not encourage more cooperative gameplay rather than competitive?

You're speaking as if cooperation and competition are mutually exclusive.

Newsflash: Most cooperative effort are competitive. In fact, the competitiveness is what drives cooperation in the first place. Heck, the very people on the leaderboard, cheating or not, shows incredible cooperative spirit, for organising a full group of 4 people to follow a certain strategy for 10 hours+.

The majority of the playerbase can't even stay in the same mission for more than 30 minutes. And a significant portion of them play solo only. Yeah so much for a coop game. WIthout a competitive incentive, there's little need to be cooperative.

Edited by HolyDemon00
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Banning people because your game is broken is... not cool.

Fix your game maybe?

I dunno, just saying.

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