Getting Knocked out of Archwing in Free Roam

[KynaTiona]

It seems like a pretty unnecessary nerf. Compared to doing the same content on foot, Archwing abilities seem largely underpowered compared to a lot of Warframe abilities, enemies retain a pretty decent amount of accuracy even when I'm 400m+ above them, enemy drops (including ammo!) are prohibitively time-consuming to pick up, and most primaries that work well with Archwing aren't as ideal on foot. (The Opticor is the only weapon I've found that's viable in both cases, and even it's pretty tricky to use while airborne.)

Nothing about this screams "exploit waiting to happen", so I'm kind of confused why there's any need for the anti-air missiles. Not only does getting knocked out of Archwing repeatedly get really tedious, the anti-air missiles themselves tend to deal large amounts of damage, which most Archwings really aren't equipped to deal with. Amesha seems to be the only one, and I believe it's gated behind 3300 oxium, in addition to the 1200 oxium needed to get the archwing launcher in the first place. Anyone who can afford these costs can probably afford any of the substantially more viable non-Archwing alternatives.

Please let me use my Archwing, DE. Making it impossible for people who actually do like Archwing to use them isn't helping the community acclimate to Archwings being a thing.

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

But... But K-Drive must be as good so AW must stay toned down... And have most abilities from every AW besides Itzal not even work or just tickle the enemy, so that they can ground us with ease. Because making everything viable and have different yet useful strenghts is a wee too much to ask for.

But still, I hope DE has listened to the huge amount of good feedback given recently. 

[KynaTiona]

Don't get me wrong, I feel really bad for K-Drives, but their inherent fun has little to do with practicality anyway~

[5p33dy_01]

1 hour ago, CaraiseLink said:

It seems like a pretty unnecessary nerf. Compared to doing the same content on foot, Archwing abilities seem largely underpowered compared to a lot of Warframe abilities, enemies retain a pretty decent amount of accuracy even when I'm 400m+ above them, enemy drops (including ammo!) are prohibitively time-consuming to pick up, and most primaries that work well with Archwing aren't as ideal on foot. (The Opticor is the only weapon I've found that's viable in both cases, and even it's pretty tricky to use while airborne.)

Nothing about this screams "exploit waiting to happen", so I'm kind of confused why there's any need for the anti-air missiles. Not only does getting knocked out of Archwing repeatedly get really tedious, the anti-air missiles themselves tend to deal large amounts of damage, which most Archwings really aren't equipped to deal with. Amesha seems to be the only one, and I believe it's gated behind 3300 oxium, in addition to the 1200 oxium needed to get the archwing launcher in the first place. Anyone who can afford these costs can probably afford any of the substantially more viable non-Archwing alternatives.

Please let me use my Archwing, DE. Making it impossible for people who actually do like Archwing to use them isn't helping the community acclimate to Archwings being a thing.

its not gated behind 3300 oxium.. unless you need the research too.. but that is high because its intended to be a clan effort to contribute.

Manufacturing Requirements
25,000	1	1	1	4	Time: 12 hrs
					Rush: 50
Market Price: 275			Blueprint Price: 15,000
Harness
15,000	2	900	3,600	5,500	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25
Wings
15,000	5,600	5	4,200	2	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25
Systems
15,000	1	2	6,700	2,800	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Amesha

run corpus missions and you will get some oxium if you are in need.

the first archwing you get (Odonata), is a decent one. just read what the skills are.
use 1 for shield and 2 when you see the incoming missile warning...
also keep an eye out for torrents that shoot those homing missiles. if you take them all out, you almost never get shot down.

if you were never knocked out of the sky, it would be too easy, as enemy accuracy is not very good and there is also a lot of melee only enemies.

Edited May 30, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[KynaTiona]

1 hour ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

its not gated behind 3300 oxium.. unless you need the research too.. but that is high because its intended to be a clan effort to contribute.

Manufacturing Requirements
25,000	1	1	1	4	Time: 12 hrs
					Rush: 50
Market Price: 275			Blueprint Price: 15,000
Harness
15,000	2	900	3,600	5,500	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25
Wings
15,000	5,600	5	4,200	2	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25
Systems
15,000	1	2	6,700	2,800	Time: 6 hrs
					Rush: 25

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Amesha

run corpus missions and you will get some oxium if you are in need.

I'll run along the assumption you're right about the oxium being a research-only cost, since I'm between clans at the moment and can't check. That said, I really doubt unstable clan-ness is an uncommon situation to be in, so I would say that the Amesha is fairly well gated regardless. Also, don't get me started on farming oxium. = /

 

1 hour ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

the first archwing you get (Odonata), is a decent one. just read what the skills are.
use 1 for shield and 2 when you see the incoming missile warning...
also keep an eye out for torrents that shoot those homing missiles. if you take them all out, you almost never get shot down.

See, your immediate assumption is that I don't know how to play the game, and it's a faulty one. I'm well aware what my abilities do: 1 never works, 2 sometimes works, 3 is useless, and 4 is useless. See, I'm in the know~

But more seriously, Odonata's Disarray only lasts for 8 seconds at best, and becomes less effective the farther I am from the original cast position. This means I have to pretty much sit completely still if I want to protected from the anti-air fire, so I'm incredibly vulnerable to small arms fire. Plus I'm not completely certain how Archwing energy regeneration works, but I'm pretty sure it's not 6 energy a second. At some point I'm going to run out of Disarray, and then I'm stuck in the same situation no matter what I'm doing.

I suppose if I knew what was firing anti-air missiles, I could use Odonata's Energy Shell and hope it works as intended for once. Problem is, that would only work if I was looking at the one firing anti-air, which isn't really viable since atmospheric Archwing loses normal Archwing's innate enemy detection. I would have to locate them from 300m+ away on the ground they blend in with in the 2-4 seconds before I get shot down. And that's assuming their anti-air missiles don't have a blast radius, because if so it would pierce Energy Shell anyway.

The Archwing abilities just weren't designed for atmospheric combat, making them at an inherent disadvantage.

 

1 hour ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

if you were never knocked out of the sky, it would be too easy, as enemy accuracy is not very good and there is also a lot of melee only enemies.

I mean, no? Like I said in my original post, I find that enemies still hit fairly often even a few hundred meters away. It's particularly bad with Grineer, since their weapons are hitscan and will hit me just fine no matter how quickly I'm moving. The damage is undoubtedly reduced from what a Warframe would be taking up close, but it's still more than enough to tear through flimsy Archwing HP.

[5p33dy_01]

1 hour ago, CaraiseLink said:

I'll run along the assumption you're right about the oxium being a research-only cost, since I'm between clans at the moment and can't check. That said, I really doubt unstable clan-ness is an uncommon situation to be in, so I would say that the Amesha is fairly well gated regardless. Also, don't get me started on farming oxium. = /

i checked to make sure before my post.
if you have problems farming oxium, just wait until you realize it takes 10 nitain extract for the components and BP to build... which is not exactly easy to come by.

2 hours ago, CaraiseLink said:

See, your immediate assumption is that I don't know how to play the game, and it's a faulty one. I'm well aware what my abilities do: 1 never works, 2 sometimes works, 3 is useless, and 4 is useless. See, I'm in the know~

it may have looked that way. but that is the one i use and dont really have any problems.
so i was just saying the things that i do, rather than telling you how to play the game.

2 hours ago, CaraiseLink said:

But more seriously, Odonata's Disarray only lasts for 8 seconds at best, and becomes less effective the farther I am from the original cast position. This means I have to pretty much sit completely still if I want to protected from the anti-air fire, so I'm incredibly vulnerable to small arms fire. Plus I'm not completely certain how Archwing energy regeneration works, but I'm pretty sure it's not 6 energy a second. At some point I'm going to run out of Disarray, and then I'm stuck in the same situation no matter what I'm doing.

I suppose if I knew what was firing anti-air missiles, I could use Odonata's Energy Shell and hope it works as intended for once. Problem is, that would only work if I was looking at the one firing anti-air, which isn't really viable since atmospheric Archwing loses normal Archwing's innate enemy detection. I would have to locate them from 300m+ away on the ground they blend in with in the 2-4 seconds before I get shot down. And that's assuming their anti-air missiles don't have a blast radius, because if so it would pierce Energy Shell anyway.

it doesnt state a duration.

another thing you could do, is drop out and reactivate. sometimes the missiles explode when their target appears to be destroyed.

like i said, once take out all the torrents, you shouldnt have too much of a problem

you have or can get mods for enemy detection. though, i dont think it applies to torrents.
but, if you need radar because you cant see where your enemies are, from 300m+, you shouldnt be that far in the first place.

2 hours ago, CaraiseLink said:

The Archwing abilities just weren't designed for atmospheric combat, making them at an inherent disadvantage.

exactly. its mainly intended for the speed travel.

in archwing missions, i would prefer to be on the ground, but thats not possible.. does this mean i must complain about that, and the game must account for how i want to play?
in archwing, i have 1200 shields.. on the ground i have 4000 shields... you see why i prefer being on the ground.

2 hours ago, CaraiseLink said:

I mean, no? Like I said in my original post, I find that enemies still hit fairly often even a few hundred meters away. It's particularly bad with Grineer, since their weapons are hitscan and will hit me just fine no matter how quickly I'm moving. The damage is undoubtedly reduced from what a Warframe would be taking up close, but it's still more than enough to tear through flimsy Archwing HP.

im not sure how the archwing mode interacts with your warframe. i know some mods work, but others dont.
armor is something else, it isnt very high, but its to be expected, since it works fine for the most part.

hitscan or not, if you are moving around (like you should be), they dont hit you as often, because its still harder to hit a moving target.
i can even evade most missiles by moving around.

i only start having problems if i stay in 1 place for too long... you shouldnt be doing this in the first place, otherwise it would be way too easy to play in archwing.
=================
it all boils down to traps, they are there for a reason, it is your job to take them out.
running through missions there is all kinds of traps that i dont like... e.g energy drain, alarm scanners and lockdown (so i cant go through doors).

must i complain that there is traps that make the game more difficult to play?
when there is ways to avoid these problems for the most part, like destroy the traps and kill all the enemies that would activate the lockdown.