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Vit0Corleone

So .. convince me to use Ivara ..

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2 hours ago, Keylan118 said:

Afaik, DE has confirmed it to not be a bug

 

Erm, switch teleport works fine through lasers since all you need to do is place a decoy, so I don't see what you mean?
but it is better than Ivara for the express purpose of moving through spy vaults since it's just faster. 
their better invisibility
(and can use that invisibility w/speed outside the vaults to avoid situations where alerted enemies outside the vault activate alarms while you're inside the vault).

so, 1-2 specific Sensor Lasers in the entire game(in specific Tiles, in specific locations), but none of the rest in the entire game, isn't a Bug?
this doesn't sound like a convincing argument that this is a fact.

 

  • if you're trying to get the fastest times, in some Vaults you need to do more than bypass some Laser Fences. which means placing Decoy in places more restrictive than just in the middle of the floor. and as i mentioned already, thesedays if you try to Teleport into a place that isn't large enough for the Player to exist at, instead of just Teleporting you to the nearest valid location, you'll get an error instead.
    which means that you end up wasting time with Abilities not working, if you're trying to get those perfect angles to go as fast as possible.
  • it's only faster in rare cases where you have very long sight lines from multiple positions so that you can take advantage of the Teleporting. otherwise the Animation time basically slows you down to the same speed as everyone else anyways.
    • Infiltrate is a lot faster than you know, apparently.
  • i'm not really sure how this is an argument because Casting Invisibility once or twice per Mission vs every 30 seconds at best is either not a useful comparison for the lack of importance it makes overall for Ash/Loki/Et Cetera that their Durations are lower. since i wouldn't really dock points for them having a Duration limit, it's just not that significant.
    • so better or worse doesn't exist, since it goes against your favor anyways and i'm all for waiving this as point of discussion.
  • Infiltrate can be used throughout the entire Mission if you want. even in not Spy Missions, since it makes you really fast in all situations.
    • Enemies outside of Spy Vaults hitting Alarms is irrelevant for Spy Vaults, they have completely separate Alarms. it doesn't matter what the Alarm Level in the entire Mission is, the Spy Vaults are unaffected by it.
    • and with that being the case, if one was to use Infiltrate incorrectly (i.e. not pay attention to what Mods it scales with), they could just as soon disable Prowl outside of Spy Vaults and use full Parkour speed too, with.... no downsides because again it doesn't matter what you do outside of the Spy Vaults.
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One of the strongest frames in the game IMO.

Near endless invisibility, point-and-click hard CC, good augments, crazy damage with Artemis Bow, and looks freaking amazing.

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I mean, if Loki works for you what's the problem? Loki has long since been one of my favorite frames and he still is. It just so happens that I also play Ivara because her kit is useful in different ways. Her zipline arrows are fun when you find neat places to put them that offer really nice vantage points. I like being able to prowl indefinitely with a Shahasa Kubrow and Rubico prime with hush. 

That said, if I'm not solo, I will usually go Loki if I even decide to go stealth over support.

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Posted (edited)
On 2019-06-05 at 10:14 AM, Keylan118 said:

Afaik, you can't actually ignore the Grineer door scanners (and maybe the new Corpus scanners?)

On 2019-06-05 at 4:03 PM, Keylan118 said:

According to the wiki:

"The Motion Detector in some Grineer vaults will still trigger the alarms if Ivara passes through it. However, it will not damage her."

The augment works for lasers, but not some scanners.

 

On 2019-06-05 at 5:07 PM, (PS4)Ashagin said:

There is one spy console in grineer spy missions that has these 2 scanners that move over the spy console momentarily that will set off the alarm even in prowl if they hit you.  That is the only thing I know of that will set off an alarm when in prowl with infiltrate mod.  All other scanners and lasers will not to my knowledge.

19 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

edit:  I forgot the double lasers on one of the consoles.  For that one you just need to disable one of the lasers and infiltrate will work on the remaining one.   

This information is inaccurate and outdated, the wiki article on 'Infiltrate' needs to be manually updated since it gives a false impression and failed to read past patch notes. it is not "some" grineer motion detector lasers that are bugged, it is just one specific one that is bugged. There is only ONE Grineer motion detector laser that Infiltrate cannot bypass and it is more than likely a bug since the exact same model of motion detector laser is found in other Grineer spy vaults like Sealab and Galleon/Asteroid/Shipyard/Settlement tilesets, of which Infiltrate CAN bypass. The one bugged Grineer laser is found specifically on Earth, Cambria - but only appears on nightmare mode. It may possibly appear on earth spy sortie, but I cannot test that atm. I have patch notes and video proof as evidence to back up what I say below.

Even the "new" Corpus gas city trap lasers were an oversight bug and DE just recently fixed.

18 hours ago, Chewarette said:

For the double lasers, do you mean the Grineer Galleon vault ? Where there is one central room, and 3 consoles to hack (one for the door, and one for each laser spraying over the console) ? I've done this one quite often and I've always only hacked the door, never been detected here either 

Yes, you are correct. I will present update patch notes and video evidence for support. 

The Sacrifice: Hotfix 23.1.3 update patch notes - " Fixed Ivara's companion setting off spy traps when Ivara herself has Prowl Augment activated." This was the old bug that triggered the grineer motion detector lasers, not the augment itself if you had it equipped.

Link to original hotfix 23.1.3 patch notes (fixed on July 26, 2018 - 315 days ago).

When this bug was still active, if you took off your sentinel companion, but still had Infiltrate equipped then you wouldn't set off the alarms. That's how somebody on the WF reddit was able to test and deduce it was in-fact a bug (that DE fixed in the above patch notes).

Now video evidence to further confirm that Infiltrate does bypass those sweeping Grineer motion detecting lasers. 

Those Grineer use the exact same sweeping motion detectors - and those are lasers. Video showing off Infiltrate bypassing those sweeping motion detecting lasers on Grineer Galleon (Grineer Settlement/Shipyard/Asteroid tilesets all use the same types of Grineer spy vault - so this video covers all spy vaults from Mercury, Mars, Ceres, Saturn and Sedna combined). 

Those exact same sweeping motion grineer detecting lasers are also found in Grineer Sealab (Uranus). Specifically in the video below at

 

This is the only one bugged grineer sweeping motion detecting laser, it only ever appears on the nightmare mode version of Earth, Cambria (and possibly Earth spy sorties, but I cannot test that at the moment, so only view that as a possibility). It's more than likely that DE just simply forgot that this laser exists (because it doesn't actually appear on the normal mode of Earth, Cambria and is very rare to encounter). 

 

Pago, Kuva Fortress spy mission does not have those specific sweeping grineer motion detecting lasers. But it's being presented to further prove that Infiltrate bypasses lasers found in Pago, Kuva Fortress.

 

 

The entirety of the Grineer spy vault laser testing vs Infilitrate can be found here in this playlist I made, and guess what. Infiltrate will bypass every other laser found in all other Grineer spy vaults. It really is only that one bugged laser on nightmare Earth, Cambria that is the one specific outlier.

I don't have video editing software to combine everything into one video, sorry. So I made due with what I can do right now. Playlist below: (youtube stop changing your buttons on me)

@taiiat Sorry for the ping, but I'm only pinging to include you in the conversation and that I have evidence to support you and Chewarette that it's likely a bug and that it's really just one specific bugged grineer motion laser found only on Earth, Cambria (found only on nightmare mode, and possibly also on spy earth sortie). I will file the bug report later, recording and compiling all this took some time out of me. Hopefully the wiki article on infiltrate gets updated out of all this.

 

 

EDIT: Oops, forgot to mention that fix on the new corpus gas city trap laser (it was just a simple oversight bug):

  - The Jovian Concord: Update 25.1.0 - Fixed Ivara’s Infiltrate Augment Mod still triggering alarms from Laser Doors in the Gas City tileset.

This is just to further the point, that there are bugs in Warframe and that DE fixes them, eventually. Of which I appreciate.

I'll make a more appropriate response to OP's thread later. Just this inaccurate information about Infiltrate I needed to investigate into because it was bugging me on how this gets spread around.

Edited by BlindStalker
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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, BlindStalker said:

Sorry for the ping, but I'm only pinging to include you in the conversation and that I have evidence to support you and Chewarette that it's likely a bug and that it's really just one specific bugged grineer motion laser found only on Earth, Cambria (found only on nightmare mode, and possibly also on spy earth sortie). I will file the bug report later, recording and compiling all this took some time out of me.

Hopefully the wiki article on infiltrate gets updated out of all this.

(that's ok, it wasn't a waste of my time, that's only when i get angry at pings)

i'll do that now(or atleast within the hour, w/e). :)

 

ok it took longer than an hour, i was busy

Edited by taiiat
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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, BlindStalker said:

This is the only one bugged grineer sweeping motion detecting laser, it only ever appears on the nightmare mode version of Earth, Cambria (and possibly Earth spy sorties, but I cannot test that at the moment, so only view that as a possibility). It's more than likely that DE just simply forgot that this laser exists (because it doesn't actually appear on the normal mode of Earth, Cambria and is very rare to encounter). 

This one appears so rarely that most forget about it or have just adapted like I did.  In the past year (12 months from starting in May) I think I might have seen it once.  

I've been thinking that by the time I get my PC back all the bugs will be resolved for Infiltrate and the new areas. 

 

Either way, great breakdown you've done BlindStalker.  😎 

Edited by DatDarkOne
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On 2019-06-05 at 4:27 AM, Vit0Corleone said:

Thanks so much for the feedback so far, you guys are awesome!

I would just like to clarify what is the point of this thread, as it seams some people are taking it the wrong way.

I am in no way saying that Ivara is useless, or that I don't like her. I like her a lot, in concept she is awesome. Her kit is quite fun, and I absolutely love the huntress theme.

My only issue is that when trying to figure out what is the best frame for a task to do it as efficiently as possible, she is never my pick, because there is always some other frame that can do it better. This can of course be subjective, based on my limited experience and play style etc.

This is why I was looking for ideas on how to use her to her full potential, in ways that she will be performing better than the others.

Here’s the secret to Ivara and a few frames with kits with a learning curve like hers...

You have to “reverse engineer” her kit...basically explore and master ALL her tools (including Augments)...and then you will discover how to situationally use/apply them.

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Posted (edited)

I had a fix to her movement issue a few months back, but It seems they fixed or broke it (not really sure which they intended was the original feature), but she used to be able to bullet jump from a CROUCH, not a slide but specifically a crouch. This meant even while invisible I wasn't completely falling behind my team, and it made stealthy things like spy missions a lot more fluid as well. Although this only worked if you were host or solo, for some reason it never worked when u were connected to someone else.

It does seem like DE either broke it or fixed it though, since now it doesn't work at all, which is really sad because I feel really slow with her now.

Other than the usual "blitz through a mission" style mission, Ivara is super good in endless survival, as enemies can't shoot when they can't detect anything, and her Artemis bow has insane kill power, alongside prowl giving that extra loot and life support, it works best in solo but also works decently in squad.

Edited by birdobash

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Just now, birdobash said:

I had a fix to her movement issue a few months back, but It seems they fixed or broke it (not really sure which they intended was the original feature), but she used to be able to bullet jump from a CROUCH, not a slide but specifically a crouch. This meant even while invisible I wasn't completely falling behind my team, and it made stealthy things like spy missions a lot more fluid as well. Although this only worked if you were host or solo, for some reason it never worked when u were connected to someone else.

It does seem like DE either broke it or fixed it though, since now it doesn't work at all, which is really sad because I feel really slow with her now.

It was technically a glitch that DE let go for too long before fixing it.  

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1 hour ago, DatDarkOne said:

It was technically a glitch that DE let go for too long before fixing it.  

I'm not so sure about that as there was NO mention of that change in the patch that "broke" or "fixed" it.

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I'll make a deal with ya.

I'll convince you to use Ivara if you convince me to use Atlas, Ember, Mag, Octavia, Revenant, Nyx, Inaros, Hydroid or Hildryn.

 

Spoiler

There's a point here. I'm not saying these frames are outright bad or have no purpose but instead the purpose they serve is already taken by another frame and/or their kit doesn't fit my playstyle. You likely cannot convince me to use these frames even if you feel there's nothing wrong with some of them.

 

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Posted (edited)

really? *reading more stuff* O' Really?

You struggled on ivar's slow walking way so what...You didn't use your brain enough about using her right in speed invisible stuff for its call doing "link rolling speed"  which

Spoiler

100.gifyou just constantly rolling as you travel

she is pretty good in some ways it just funny ppl don't realized that they can stay invisible and able move fast enough, it just that you have to do link's barrel rolling style for traveling and that is the truth because rolling beats walking but it will consumed energy faster so keep that in mind to watch your energy bar.

Edited by ChaoticEdge
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12 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

really? *reading more stuff* O' Really?

You struggled on ivar's slow walking way so what...You didn't use your brain enough about using her right in speed invisible stuff for its call doing "link rolling speed"  which

  Reveal hidden contents

100.gifyou just constantly rolling as you travel

she is pretty good in some ways it just funny ppl don't realized that they can stay invisible and able move fast enough, it just that you have to do link's barrel rolling style for traveling and that is the truth because rolling beats walking but it will consumed energy faster so keep that in mind to watch your energy bar.

i mean aimgliding and jumping make for faster travel than rolling tbh. 

...I miss wall running x:

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1 minute ago, (PS4)chibitonka said:

i mean aimgliding and jumping make for faster travel than rolling tbh. 

...I miss wall running x:

that when the hallway is too small then rolling is your option.  aim gliding seems a bit fast but not really unless you do air glide and barrel roll then yes it is faster that way.

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8 minutes ago, ChaoticEdge said:

that when the hallway is too small then rolling is your option.  aim gliding seems a bit fast but not really unless you do air glide and barrel roll then yes it is faster that way.

who doesn't roll/slide while aimgliding anyway? xD

If you got massive range tho you could just plop down some cloak arrows and undo prowl to go as normal 😄

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6 hours ago, Xzorn said:

I'll make a deal with ya.

I'll convince you to use Ivara if you convince me to use Atlas, Ember, Mag, Octavia, Revenant, Nyx, Inaros, Hydroid or Hildryn.

 

  Hide contents

There's a point here. I'm not saying these frames are outright bad or have no purpose but instead the purpose they serve is already taken by another frame and/or their kit doesn't fit my playstyle. You likely cannot convince me to use these frames even if you feel there's nothing wrong with some of them.

 

Can't speak for the others, as I don't have them yet, but Revenant is the ideal choice for Index as far as I can tell.

I understand your point, and I agree of course. Thing is, I love Ivara, and I have her - which is why I was asking for ideas/feedback ( and got a ton! Thanks again, you guys are awesome! ). If I didn't care about Ivara, I wouldn't be asking.

Those other frames you listed ( except for Revenant that I do have ), aren't on my radar yet. Maybe I will open a similar thread for them when that time comes. If it gets anywhere close to this feedback, may actually be useful and informative for the community in general.

Stay classy Tenno!

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Posted (edited)

Excluding his OP perma invisibility, Ivara is the best designed frame in this game,  her abilities(even the passive) are all useful and most of his augmented mods are useful as well.

She can make trivial spy missions,solo  survivals, interceptions and Eidolon.

Edited by bibmobello

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16 hours ago, BlindStalker said:

-snip-

Oh okay. Thanks for the effort.

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Posted (edited)
56 minutes ago, bibmobello said:

She can make trivial spy missions,solo  survivals, interceptions and Eidolon

You left out, Assassinations, Capture, Sabotage, Hive and Exterminate.  😁 

edit: As well as all of the Junctions.  

Edited by DatDarkOne
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Posted (edited)
On 2019-06-05 at 2:31 AM, Vit0Corleone said:

Took me quite a while to get Ivara. I was really excited to get her, as I really like her theme, design and abilities. But .. I see myself very rarely using her, outside of just sight seeing ( I used her to explore the new Jupiter tile set ), or if I feel like playing sneaky ninja style and take 20 minutes to finish an extermination mission .. 

The thing is, game is so fast paced, that it's hard to even justify using Ivara because of how slow she moves while in Prowl. And because she is so squishy, that all it takes is a higher level enemy to sneeze at her and she's dead.

Her survivability pretty much relies on staying invisible all the time, but of course doing so means slooooww movement, which, is sort of miss placed considering how fast paced the game is.

It's like when I'm using Ivara, I'm not really playing Warframe as it is, but sort of a different game.

Even for spy missions, where she's supposed to excel at, I end up almost always using Loki, simply because he does it well and way faster. As long as you know the vaults, there's really no reason to use Ivara. Which is funny in itself, because I farmed Loki before Ivara, precisely to make farming Ivara easier. Ended up knowing vaults pretty well, and now I don't really see why use Ivara for Spy missions at all LOL!

I would like to use her more. Really like her theme, design and abilities, but it's hard to justify to myself using her when there isn't really any activity that I can think of where I could say "Ivara is the right choice for this task".

So, I'm curious, players that use Ivara frequently, how do you do it, and why?

Do you go to pub groups and slowly roll your way to extraction while everyone waits? Or do you just play solo?

Is there any situation where Ivara is the right pick that you could share?

I guess what I'm asking for is ideas that convince me to use her more, because as of currently, I have a hard time justifying picking her over other frames.

Also, out of curiosity, was her movement always like this while on Prowl, or was this a nerf that happened some time ago?

 


 

You can move pretty fast with the augment AND doing the following, jump and then roll in the air, jump, roll in the air and jump again in the air, or double jump and then roll in the air, you can even gain some momentum and aim glide, well, now that I said it DE will proceed to nerf it.

Edited by VanFanel1980mx

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46 minutes ago, VanFanel1980mx said:

You can move pretty fast with the augment AND doing the following, jump and then roll in the air, jump, roll in the air and jump again in the air, or double jump and then roll in the air, you can even gain some momentum and aim glide, well, now that I said it DE will proceed to nerf it.

I highly doubt that DE will change it as it involves some level of skill or multiple button presses to do without exiting Prowl.  Basically, you can't just press one button and do it.  So, I think we're safe on this one.  :D

 

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6 hours ago, DatDarkOne said:

I highly doubt that DE will change it as it involves some level of skill or multiple button presses to do without exiting Prowl.  Basically, you can't just press one button and do it.  So, I think we're safe on this one.  😄

 

You would be surprised.

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would just saying please try ivara be sufficient? 

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