Extensive thoughts. A need for Exilus slots on weapons? Helpful but unused utility mods?

[Its_Starwing]

Preface

This gets long as feedback, but I feel is worth everyone's attention due to the extent of important changes I feel this could make. Warframes have the option for Exilus mods which can offer small buffs, abilities, or resistances. They can offer some small unique benefits like Mesa's Waltz or Hysterical Assault. Utility uses like Thief's wit, Enemy Sense, Patagium +aim glide and wall latch, even Rush for more sprint speed. These are all mods that are nice to use but not something you would typically want to sacrifice the limited regular mod slots we have. One wouldn't want to exchange an all too necessary Intensify, stretch, streamline, or continuity for a Handspring or Heavy Impact. They all offer their varying degree of somewhat niche usefulness.

 

To use these utility mods over regular damage related mods on weapons requires sacrificing too much performance.

There are many mods that I think would be perfectly suited to being in a theoretical Exilus slot for weapons. The limited mod slots available simply do not allow for these mostly utilitarian niche mods to ever really see use. Especially since it would have significant reduction to damage if it replaced a regular mod. However there are many mods that I believe many would like to use, but can never sacrifice a normal mod to do so. Any regular mod being swapped out would have huge impacts on damage output (ex. Serration, elemental damage and/or status, multi shot, critical chance, and critical damage, etc.)

 

I would like to offer examples of unused mods that could see great usage if offered a specialized utility slot. like maybe an Exilus slot for weapons. There is a long list of specific mods for each weapon type so I will try to cover some more prominent examples.

 

Some key points that could make these great as Exilus mods.

Ammo economy such as Critical Delay  which could offer a small critical chance increase to offset its lower fire speed impact on dps, Maybe alternatives like Vile Precision offers up to -60% weapon recoil and -36% fire rate, which can be used to really reduce screen shake for those averse to it, while also offering more ammo economy. As what could be an Exilus mod for rifles It could offer a small performance change or increase to something that would fit more to a player's preferences, while trying to not gain or sacrifice large amounts of damage. Balancing damage and fire speed for ammo economy is a key for this.

Recoil reducing mods such as Stabilizer or Steady Hands would be amazing on a few weapons like the Pyrana prime which although a great weapon. I personally don't like to use due to how it can just cause dizziness pretty quickly for those averse to such a constant screen shake. Probably shouldn't be allowed to use more than 1 non riven based recoil mod since it might offer up to -120% weapon recoil.

Projectile velocity based mods like Terminal Velocity which would increase rifle projectile velocity up to +60% which could be very helpful for things like a Battacor. A small change that doesn't really increase its damage output outright, but offers making the projectile based guns significantly easier to use in terms of leading targets, especially over a longer distance like in the open world areas.

Mods that offer only punch through like Metal Augur, this one could definitely be a stronger contender in popularity like what handspring is to Warframes, but I feel it would still be reasonable since it just increases a weapon's capability of dealing with groups of enemies in a line, but in my opinion it's not really a mod a person would sacrifice a more regularly used mod for.

Ammo mutation! There are a good number of weapons that could use this. It is a niche role for things with large magazines, reserves, and fire rate such as the Soma Prime, the Supra, Twin Grakatas, or other weapons that can face similar ammo issues with their small magazines and ammo reserves (ex. Prisma Angstrum) But it is something that could be a definite benefit if one might not want to be tied down to the carrier seeming like such an absolute requirement when dealing with such ammo intensive weapons. Ammo maximum (reserve ammo) such as Ammo Drum could also be a candidate for a small quality of life weapon Exilus mod.

Mods that increase or decrease zoom such as Overview, Eagle Eye, Aero Periphery. There are some niche occasions when a person would like less zoom, or more zoom while aiming or aim gliding. The only way to reasonably fit that in is from a riven, but even then such utility does not offer much else. Definitely a strong candidate for a weapon Exilus mod given its niche. Also note Agile Aim in being related to a small movement benefit while aiming.

Status Duration mods such as Continuous Misery, which offers up to +100% status duration. Can be helpful for longer radiation based confusion, puncture based enemy damage reduction, stagger etc. It can however offer some increased damage due to slash procs lasting longer, but overall a niche mod to increase benefits the effects of status infliction on enemies over time.

 

Before moving on to the most unique of mods. I would like to mention silencer mods such as Hush, Suppress, and Silent Battery. Although it could be argued that these would make too sizable an impact in performance if any weapon could be 100% silenced without directly affecting damage output. I feel it does not, since if anyone is not using a silenced weapon, or if you or a companion are successfully spotted and the enemy fire a single shot, or otherwise alert any nearby enemies the stealth of a silenced weapon is already broken, and it would quickly devolve to a brawl anyways. It would just be handier for more easily getting the initial drop on enemies, or possibly offering a wider variety of stealth based weapons and options. Silenced weapons from Exilus slots might be a strong contender for a top Exilus mod so discussion will likely be needed.

 

There is a long list of mods that offer unique effects in a wide range. So I will simply have to list some of the mods and have discussion over them as I do not use many of these to begin with and cannot offer proper feedback on their performance of feasibility as a would be Exilus mod.

 

Bow: Thunderbolt 30%  chance to explode

Sniper: Target Acquired, Sharpshooter, Harkonar Scope

Melee: Healing return, Guardian Derision, Energy Channel, FInishing Touch, Gladiator Rush, Quick Return

 

What probably shouldn't be an option for a weapon Exilus mod.

There are a few things such as mods that directly affect reload speed and magazine capacity like Primed Quickdraw offering up to +88% reload speed and Primed Slip Magazine offering up to +55% magazine size that should not get the option to be an Exilus mod. They would have too large of an impact directly on sustained DPS, if anyone feels otherwise for these or similar mods do mention them and explain why you feel they should be a potential weapon Exilus Mod.

 

If you have any thoughts, interest, feedback, or discussion on this topic please leave your comments below.

[Krion112]

I disagree, on the premise that the Exilus concept is a bandaid to an overarching problem: certain game mechanics are way more rewarding across more content than others, so therefore we always build our equipment to amplify those game mechanics. Saying we need more mod slots to make up for the imbalance of mechanical reward completely fails to address the issue, and is borderline power creep, which is already bad enough in Warframe.

Instead of adding Exilus Slots, I think DE should add more content and rework existing content to reward those mechanics over the ones that are currently always used. IE, Adding endless stealth mission types, where being undetected is apart of the reward and difficulty structure, improving the rewards and challenge of mission types that are easier to accomplish because of these mechanics, implementing combat system reworks that make underused mechanics more feasible and/or necessary/efficient, with some buffs and nerfs to both sides, etc.

In summary, I think it's a more proper solution for DE to make these mechanics necessary and wanted than it would be to just tack on Exilus slots. But, that would just be my opinion and solution by comparison.

Edited June 7, 2019 by Krion112

[(PSN)chibitonka]

56 minutes ago, Krion112 said:

I disagree, on the premise that the Exilus concept is a bandaid to an overarching problem: certain game mechanics are way more rewarding across more content than others, so therefore we always build our equipment to amplify those game mechanics. Saying we need more mod slots to make up for the imbalance of mechanical reward completely fails to address the issue, and is borderline power creep, which is already bad enough in Warframe.

Instead of adding Exilus Slots, I think DE should add more content and rework existing content to reward those mechanics over the ones that are currently always used. IE, Adding endless stealth mission types, where being undetected is apart of the reward and difficulty structure, improving the rewards and challenge of mission types that are easier to accomplish because of these mechanics, implementing combat system reworks that make underused mechanics more feasible and/or necessary/efficient, with some buffs and nerfs to both sides, etc.

In summary, I think it's a more proper solution for DE to make these mechanics necessary and wanted than it would be to just tack on Exilus slots. But, that would just be my opinion and solution by comparison.

more designed difficulty instead of just we made the numbers bigger xD

[Teliko_Freedman]

if there was an exilus slot added, I'd be more encouraged to forma a weapon more, and make use of different mods rather than the usual mandatory(serration,hornet strike,etc) mods.

[ShortCat]

6 hours ago, Silvarz said:

These are all mods that are nice to use but not something you would typically want to sacrifice the limited regular mod slots we have.

• Modding in general is all about making sacrifices, you are not supposed to equip every single mod
• Denial of the above mentioned point, led us to massive power creep we have right now
• Exilus did not inspire new builds, it introduced more power creep and created a separate mod pool with "best to use"/"not to use" mods. Exilus actually failed to achieve it stated goal, namely make utility mods more relevant. The issue is not the number of slots, but mods themselves or how necessary they are for the game. (Arcanes are actually second tier mods and suffer the same fate)
• Especially for weapons, which sole purpose is to make damage, will lead to more power. Do we need this additional power in the first place?
• In worst case scenario. How would you acquire this new slot?
• In worst case scenario. How will you mange additional drain?

Firm "no" to Exilus.

[Lone_Dude]

When is DPS increase "too large?". People above stated why adding exilus slots to weapons is a bad idea in the first place. This comment of mine should clarify why it's a bad idea even if it's not discarded outright.

7 hours ago, Silvarz said:

They would have too large of an impact directly on sustained DPS, if anyone feels otherwise for these or similar mods do mention them and explain why you feel they should be a potential weapon Exilus Mod.

• Less recoil = easier to land shots = higher DPS. Slap -recoil on Pandero and it's alt-fire will suddenly be super easy to use and allow you to land 8 shots easily.
• Same applies to Punch Through. You can hit more enemies with it per shot, so it effectively doubles or tripples the damage you deal in general, since Warframe is not about fighting 1 enemy in an open field. It's about fighting 10 dudes at the same time, sometimes in an open field, but more often in some corridor.
• Projectile Velocity can be a great increase in damage for weapons like Zarr and Plasmor - projectiles travel further, can hit more enemies on a longer distance.
• Status duration can increase duration of Slash and Viral procs, these are already meta damage types/status procs. Why would you want to buff weapons that can utilize them even further?
• As for silencers - Ivara exists. Other invi frames will benefit from it greatly, when it comes to their survivability. It would replace one of Lokis augments for example.
• Target acquired is +60% headshot multiplier. Exilus mod? Whot. Maybe we should make Serration an exilus mod as well, lmao?

All of that stuff affects DPS, some of it directly.

[(PSN)chibitonka]

Crazy idea but why don't we just make it so craftable skins provide utility buffs instead?

Manticore scindo and fragor brokk skins were a fun idea tbh.

Shame it stopped at those two when it wasn't a bad idea. Would have to lock it to craftable cosmetics only tho and not ones you can just buy from shop already built.

[ShortCat]

20 hours ago, (PS4)chibitonka said:

Crazy idea but why don't we just make it so craftable skins provide utility buffs instead?

We had this in the game at some point, it was called Arcane Helmets. And it was bad, because you tie stats to fashion frame.

[(PSN)chibitonka]

2 minutes ago, ShortCat said:

We had this in the game at some point, it was called Arcane Helmets. And it was bad, because you tie stats to fashion frame.

They are great tbh. Only reason they stopped making em was the introduction of the arcane system. Otherwise we'd still have them being made. 

Hence why not on stuff you can't craft. So it would discourage the pay to win mindset a bit. Even Arcane helms you had to craft them. 

Fragor Brokk skin, Scindo Manticore skins are things too... They did provide buffs to those weapons when on.

Also what sane person doesn't want fashionable and functional? O.O

[ShortCat]

23 hours ago, (PS4)chibitonka said:

Only reason they stopped making em was the introduction of the arcane system. Otherwise we'd still have them being made. 

This is factually wrong. People complained that they had to choose "worse" looking gear for a minor stat increase. Then DE removed arcane effects from Alt-Helmets, but did not change already obtained ones, because those are payed items. It all happened long before first arcanes were introduced with LoR. This was a good development. No to gear with stats.

 

[(PSN)chibitonka]

1 minute ago, ShortCat said:

This is factually wrong. People complained that they had to choose "worse" looking gear for a minor stat increase. Then DE removed arcane effects from Alt-Helmets, but did not change already obtained ones, because those are payed items. It all happened long before first arcanes were introduced with LoR. This was a good development. No to gear with stats.

 

seems i have an info source to beat later x:

Wonder if they would've kept it if the helms were better looking o.o.

Considering the effects aren't replicable outside mods. 

[Its_Starwing]

On 2019-06-07 at 12:38 AM, Krion112 said:

I disagree, on the premise that the Exilus concept is a bandaid to an overarching problem: certain game mechanics are way more rewarding across more content than others, so therefore we always build our equipment to amplify those game mechanics. Saying we need more mod slots to make up for the imbalance of mechanical reward completely fails to address the issue, and is borderline power creep, which is already bad enough in Warframe.

Instead of adding Exilus Slots, I think DE should add more content and rework existing content to reward those mechanics over the ones that are currently always used. IE, Adding endless stealth mission types, where being undetected is apart of the reward and difficulty structure, improving the rewards and challenge of mission types that are easier to accomplish because of these mechanics, implementing combat system reworks that make underused mechanics more feasible and/or necessary/efficient, with some buffs and nerfs to both sides, etc.

In summary, I think it's a more proper solution for DE to make these mechanics necessary and wanted than it would be to just tack on Exilus slots. But, that would just be my opinion and solution by comparison.

I agree with your assessment that it is essentially a band aid. However unfortunately anything much larger is seriously outside my capabilities to offer feedback, and would just leave the utility mods left forgotten as is and unused. A large rework would have a very large amount of related issues, complications, and scenarios that is far outside what I can offer any real helpful feedback on without something to first base off of. So I just offered something that could work hopefully work well to some degree with what we have to work with. Even this seemingly smaller addition has wide reaching complex issues that crop up in many different areas. I recommend reading my responses to the other quotes below for some of them.

 

Your idea of an endless stealth mission is interesting, personally I dislike stealth missions but I am sure some may find it fun, however I feel Warframe would need a better enemy alert and stealth system. I can't offer a good system but as an example consider the gap in good stealth game between what we currently have in Warframe, and what Metal Gear Solid offers. Not saying it should be like metal gear solid, but that it has things thought out, work, even designed around it. If you think you can come up with a good way of fitting that in I recommend making a feedback post to try to make it happen, it is likely a large undertaking of a project, but even a small step toward something great, is a form of progress.

On 2019-06-07 at 5:14 AM, ShortCat said:

• Modding in general is all about making sacrifices, you are not supposed to equip every single mod
• Denial of the above mentioned point, led us to massive power creep we have right now
• Exilus did not inspire new builds, it introduced more power creep and created a separate mod pool with "best to use"/"not to use" mods. Exilus actually failed to achieve it stated goal, namely make utility mods more relevant. The issue is not the number of slots, but mods themselves or how necessary they are for the game. (Arcanes are actually second tier mods and suffer the same fate)
• Especially for weapons, which sole purpose is to make damage, will lead to more power. Do we need this additional power in the first place?
• In worst case scenario. How would you acquire this new slot?
• In worst case scenario. How will you mange additional drain?

Firm "no" to Exilus.

What I had in mind for Exilus mods on weapons was to try to use something to help a weapon somewhat with a shortcoming or offer a unique feature. An example being many how energy weapon's projectile speed make them less usable than a hitscan based weapon beyond a medium range (ex. Tetra or Dera vs Karak), and heavy recoil weapons with a dramatic screen shake to be more manageable on a person's senses. I can't think of the long list of weapons we have available that may have such an issue off the top of my head. But what I do remember is that the Pyrana prime settles back to a normal aim pretty quickly, so subtracting recoil for a less dramatic screen shake and easier on a person using it which in itself wouldn't affect  gun performance that much in terms of its accuracy and damage output anyways. I do however recognize how such a difference in recoil could for example make an Aklex prime more spammable. I also did not properly consider launcher based weapons, as they are so little used by me or around me at any time playing that they fell out of consideration. Basically I forgot about them.

 

Regular Exilus mods has inspired some new builds yes, I am surprised you think otherwise. An example of which I could think of is how in profit taker 3rd phase can be an absurd amount of staggering and knockdown. Staggering and knockdown that can come from units that leap at you over a distance, or melee you repeatedly, or the giant shield walls that fly at you from profit taker, a combination of which can that almost stunlock you even with one of the two between Handspring and Pain Threshold. Of course there is Resolute Focus which gives +100% resistance to both, but is only available on an archgun which unfortunately you wouldn't have access to in your first run of phase 3 as it must be completed before obtaining an Archgun deployer. Things often quickly spiral out of hand and essentially your best option is to run away as much as possible and shoot at the profit taker in this mission, fighting head on is even substantially more difficult than most arbitrations! Essentially what I am trying to say though, is that fighting head on in this mission is probably one of the most difficult things to do, especially when the large raknoids start showing up on top of what feels like an Elite Sanctuary Onslaught amount of higher level enemies and a boss shooting at you, there are builds to try to do so, but each has their weaknesses and shortcomings, and simply escaping is probably one of the best options in general.

Meanwhile for regular use of Exilus mods. For me at least I use a wide variety for many different situations, which even then I switch based on preferences at the time. An example being max speed volt for capture missions? Might use Rush, but maybe I get knocked down occasionally like say from a fire eximus enemy or hooked from enemies that drag you to them so I might swap Rush for Handspring. A Saryn in Elite Sanctuary Onslaught might use Cunning Drift to capitalize on range, or handspring to prevent being knocked down for long, which can be risky if you also use a build that tries to capitalize on hunter adrenaline or rage. Almost certainly not Primed Sure footed since it costs way more capacity and uses a significantly less used polarity. I even know of a small niche thing gaining some interest and traction using the Synth set mods starting with synth reflex and others you might want to fit in to not have to reload as well as offering an interesting way to play. I am even considering trying that to spice things up with something unique. Its true people have preferences on what they would usually use or not use in Exilus, there is always an old reliable to each thing, kind of like Vitality, even on the lowest HP frames you might want that over a Primed Vigor, even if just to be a bit more resilient to things that bypass shields. Overall I think the difference there is people just using what they find to be old reliable and leaving it as is, even though there are other things that add more benefits over time yet unseen, or an interesting new build that works but is not explored.

 

As for acquiring the new slot and the additional drain. Assuming it would follow Exilus slots and Exlius mods, the regular Exilus adapater. Its not a good answer given how many weapons a person may use on top of all the different war frames on top of what it takes to obtain one adapter. But they could probably see more use than just the roughly 40 warframes. Some Exilus mods definitely need adjustment like Primed Sure Footed, up to 16 drain with a  D polarity that not much uses, and polarizing the Exilus slot would add some options while removing others.

Making an Exilus weapon mod slot to be like an aura and adding polarity would be excessive, but might offer more diverse builds from not limiting the overall capacity requiring as much polarities. This is just an idea that came to mind when thinking how one might be able fit everything in or to expand what might be able to add more flexibility to overall weapon builds, at least where mod capacity is concerned.

On 2019-06-07 at 6:12 AM, Lone_Dude said:

When is DPS increase "too large?". People above stated why adding exilus slots to weapons is a bad idea in the first place. This comment of mine should clarify why it's a bad idea even if it's not discarded outright.

• Less recoil = easier to land shots = higher DPS. Slap -recoil on Pandero and it's alt-fire will suddenly be super easy to use and allow you to land 8 shots easily.
• Same applies to Punch Through. You can hit more enemies with it per shot, so it effectively doubles or tripples the damage you deal in general, since Warframe is not about fighting 1 enemy in an open field. It's about fighting 10 dudes at the same time, sometimes in an open field, but more often in some corridor.
• Projectile Velocity can be a great increase in damage for weapons like Zarr and Plasmor - projectiles travel further, can hit more enemies on a longer distance.
• Status duration can increase duration of Slash and Viral procs, these are already meta damage types/status procs. Why would you want to buff weapons that can utilize them even further?
• As for silencers - Ivara exists. Other invi frames will benefit from it greatly, when it comes to their survivability. It would replace one of Lokis augments for example.
• Target acquired is +60% headshot multiplier. Exilus mod? Whot. Maybe we should make Serration an exilus mod as well, lmao?

All of that stuff affects DPS, some of it directly.

It is good you offer explanations on what and why. To be honest there are so many weapons in Warframe it would take nothing short of one crazy flow chart to figure out every repercussion to each one, let alone remember how every single one of them and used and how they behave.

I do not use a Pandero and have not for a very long time. It is likely just one of the weapons I used but didn't like much.

From the weapons with higher recoil I remembered however the recoil was on the steeper side but reset back to its initial position pretty quickly. Such as the Pyrana Prime, Lex Prime, Aklex Prime. Granted the Aklex needs its shots paced out about a second and required more time between shots to retain its accuracy. However it was relatively easy to just aim further down to just retain most of that accuracy, a fairly simple action to manage its recoil. One of my main thoughts on proposing less recoil is to lessen the strain on players such as myself who have issues with a regular more dramatic screen shaking which prevents the use of some good guns. I would have to rebuild a Pandero to see what you mean about how minus recoil would affect it. My next best suggestion on the previously mentioned issue being along the lines to just lower recoil in general but increase the amount of time for the gun to recover from recoil, however  that could be boiled down to the same effect by different but probably better means leaving the player to learn and manage the recoil under constant firing. Each option has its own complex repercussions in ways we can miss out on, or never think of, and its tough trying to find something good enough for everyone.

 

Projectile velocity. To be frank I had about completely forgotten about launcher weapons. I never use them, now that I think back on it though, I didn't like how most of them felt, kind of like how I don't like having to manually detonate each Penta round. I think the tonkor required a direct hit to reliably explode on enemies too. I never really see anyone using any kind of launcher weapon either

As for the Plasmor as a shotgun I would imagine damage falloff would take care of maximum range effectiveness issues and under that scenario projectile velocity wouldn't do much for it to begin with given its short range shotgun effectiveness. The main thing I had in mind was how about any energy based weapon like the Dera, Supra, Tetra, etc. Its been a long time but from what I remember the dual Cestra was pretty inaccurate so a faster projectile speed wouldn't really do much for it. Meanwhile its counterparts such as the Karak, Gorgon, dual vipers etc are that much easier to use even at the least due to difference between projectile velocity and hitscan weapons.

 

Status duration I agree could be a big issue lasting longer if you think only about viral and slash, however even using between those two, far more often than not the enemy would die before the status effects fade. Corrosive being a permanent thing upon proc and especially after stripping all armor off. Meanwhile other status effects such as puncture, impact, radiation, maybe gas? among others would be welcome to having more pronounced or longer lasting effects. So I can agree currently that longer lasting status as they are now wouldn't be all that good a change, but certainly better or longer lasting effects for other less desired status effects would be welcome. As to which ones, how long, and to what extent is likely something to cover another time as that is a few pages of itself on the changes that would be involved.

 

Silencers. With Ivara I actually use silent battery on a hard hitting shotgun so it can actually get rid of obstacles like enemies in the way hopefully with minimal alerts being raised or in destroying those electric mines the Grineer have. the newly released Fulmin makes for a decent substitute but doesn't quire compare with say a Corinth, Tigris or a Hek. I suppose when doing a stealth mission most often one would take one of the roughly 3 suitable stealth based frames. My thoughts were in allowing more ability for those frames and other frames to attempt stealth based approaches, but not specifically only stealth missions. As for the Loki augment being rendered redundant from it, that does sound a like a problem I can't offer much helpful feedback on.

 

Target acquired. Yea that one was a mistake that slipped through, that one is an obvious huge damage boost for anything with a head. I had wrote down a list of mods that covered all the major effects listed in the points, which quickly got redundant so I had to try to simplify it. As well as whatever unique mods offered unique effects to weapons. I started generalizing into types and just a list of mods with unique affects. I also now noticed I missed the one that gives launchers bigger explosion radius. I had intended along the lines of things like Sharpshooter which gives energy on headshot kill, and Harkonar scope to increase combo multiplier duration. Guardian derision which essentially taunts enemies is another unique one.

[Lone_Dude]

8 hours ago, Silvarz said:

It is good you offer explanations on what and why. To be honest there are so many weapons in Warframe it would take nothing short of one crazy flow chart to figure out every repercussion to each one, let alone remember how every single one of them and used and how they behave.

I do not use a Pandero and have not for a very long time. It is likely just one of the weapons I used but didn't like much.

From the weapons with higher recoil I remembered however the recoil was on the steeper side but reset back to its initial position pretty quickly. Such as the Pyrana Prime, Lex Prime, Aklex Prime. Granted the Aklex needs its shots paced out about a second and required more time between shots to retain its accuracy. However it was relatively easy to just aim further down to just retain most of that accuracy, a fairly simple action to manage its recoil. One of my main thoughts on proposing less recoil is to lessen the strain on players such as myself who have issues with a regular more dramatic screen shaking which prevents the use of some good guns. I would have to rebuild a Pandero to see what you mean about how minus recoil would affect it. My next best suggestion on the previously mentioned issue being along the lines to just lower recoil in general but increase the amount of time for the gun to recover from recoil, however  that could be boiled down to the same effect by different but probably better means leaving the player to learn and manage the recoil under constant firing. Each option has its own complex repercussions in ways we can miss out on, or never think of, and its tough trying to find something good enough for everyone.

 

Projectile velocity. To be frank I had about completely forgotten about launcher weapons. I never use them, now that I think back on it though, I didn't like how most of them felt, kind of like how I don't like having to manually detonate each Penta round. I think the tonkor required a direct hit to reliably explode on enemies too. I never really see anyone using any kind of launcher weapon either

As for the Plasmor as a shotgun I would imagine damage falloff would take care of maximum range effectiveness issues and under that scenario projectile velocity wouldn't do much for it to begin with given its short range shotgun effectiveness. The main thing I had in mind was how about any energy based weapon like the Dera, Supra, Tetra, etc. Its been a long time but from what I remember the dual Cestra was pretty inaccurate so a faster projectile speed wouldn't really do much for it. Meanwhile its counterparts such as the Karak, Gorgon, dual vipers etc are that much easier to use even at the least due to difference between projectile velocity and hitscan weapons.

 

Status duration I agree could be a big issue lasting longer if you think only about viral and slash, however even using between those two, far more often than not the enemy would die before the status effects fade. Corrosive being a permanent thing upon proc and especially after stripping all armor off. Meanwhile other status effects such as puncture, impact, radiation, maybe gas? among others would be welcome to having more pronounced or longer lasting effects. So I can agree currently that longer lasting status as they are now wouldn't be all that good a change, but certainly better or longer lasting effects for other less desired status effects would be welcome. As to which ones, how long, and to what extent is likely something to cover another time as that is a few pages of itself on the changes that would be involved.

 

Silencers. With Ivara I actually use silent battery on a hard hitting shotgun so it can actually get rid of obstacles like enemies in the way hopefully with minimal alerts being raised or in destroying those electric mines the Grineer have. the newly released Fulmin makes for a decent substitute but doesn't quire compare with say a Corinth, Tigris or a Hek. I suppose when doing a stealth mission most often one would take one of the roughly 3 suitable stealth based frames. My thoughts were in allowing more ability for those frames and other frames to attempt stealth based approaches, but not specifically only stealth missions. As for the Loki augment being rendered redundant from it, that does sound a like a problem I can't offer much helpful feedback on.

 

Target acquired. Yea that one was a mistake that slipped through, that one is an obvious huge damage boost for anything with a head. I had wrote down a list of mods that covered all the major effects listed in the points, which quickly got redundant so I had to try to simplify it. As well as whatever unique mods offered unique effects to weapons. I started generalizing into types and just a list of mods with unique affects. I also now noticed I missed the one that gives launchers bigger explosion radius. I had intended along the lines of things like Sharpshooter which gives energy on headshot kill, and Harkonar scope to increase combo multiplier duration. Guardian derision which essentially taunts enemies is another unique one.

Decreasing the initial kick and increasing recovery time will not help. It will instead make recoil feel weak and less dynamic. A better way to solve the problem would be to slightly decrease the kick on single shots, and leave recovery in it's current state. Would help players to not feel like they get smacked on the head every time they pull the trigger to kill a lonely grunt. Then devs would have to make another edit - recoil should be decreased when firing continuously. Basically, single shot recoil is strong, but recovers quickly and if the player decides to fire multiple shots in a row, they won't be punished for that - kick on following shots will be weaker than on the first shot, allowing to hit a chunky enemy consistently with ease. In short - we need 2 separate recoil stats, one much lower than another. Warframe is not Battlefield, it doesn't need guns kicking like mules when we have 0 recoil laser pointers that melt steel beams.

Most launcher weapons need some hardcore buffing or some kind of fix to self-damage issue. Damage fall off increases with projectile speed. Projectile doesn't just go faster, it also goes further and it's effective range is increased.

Longevity of viral and slash procs is usually important when dealing with high level enemies, there, duration of said procs might sometimes not be enough. So I was looking at it from that standpoint. Against low level foes slash damage is as good as any other, since flat damage values matter more than DoT. Gas(toxin) is a meta damage as well, but I'm in a slash camp. I'm an edgy person. Radiation proc doesn't serve much purpose aside from being a CC in a game where DPS is more important. It's also rather lengthy already. To be honest, even though status duration affects DPS in the long run, I would rework said mods to increase status intensity instead, that would somewhat level out flat damage and DoT, but that should be left for another post too.

[ShaKaL95]

Even if it is a bandaid,it would bring back some utility mods,but must be only utility. I had asked a while ago for the same thing,obviously because we never use most of them, even the newer sets are subjected to dust because they do not compete at all, maybe one or two,still most of them have no usage.  It is a "not great,not terrible" fix to mod usage if you ask me