Making MR Better?

[(NSW)Riophilip]

I recently made a post in which I talked about how I think MR requirements are too high. But then I realized, keep the MR requirements - I think it's gaining MR that makes no sense. MR really just represents your ability to grind, or how effectively you can do it. I guess they were thinking; "You Max rank the item, ergo you "master" it." But I think MR should be more skill based. I think one should be required to meet certain requirements, and then they can take the test. But not stuff like "Reach 95 waves on any defense mission", but rather something like Complete "Natah" and kill Tyl Regor. And then the tests would be much harder than the ones now, and they would test things like parkour, modding etc. They would actually test your skill. Any thoughts?

[(PSN)jaggerwanderer]

The mastery rank tests are fine as they are. Then there are frames, weapons, that are making those tests easier than having the starter gear. Ranking up MR fodder gear does expose a player to said weapon even if s/he doesn't like the weapon. A test is just really saying, "We give you this problem. Find a solution to it with all thing stuff you got up to this point."Then there's also the Junction issue. That's mostly just a way to impede players progress.

[Gabbynaru]

4 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

 They would actually test your skill. Any thoughts?

That's what the MR tests are currently. Sure, the early ones are easy (as they should be), but every now and then you see someone faceplanting into that one Archwing MR test because they never played archwing, or the shooting the orbs one cause they are terrible at shooting, or have poorly modded weapons. The skill checks are there, but generally the gap between MRs allows people to usually breeze through them cause they have enough time to master the mechanics at hand. Which is the point of the Mastery Rank tests, show that you have mastered the mechanics. So on that front, it's working as intended.

[WhiteMarker]

7 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

Any thoughts?

Yes: Why?

Even if the tests were "harder", there will always be tutorials. There will always be ways to cheese it. There is no real "skill test". And why would there in a PvE game?
Just keep things as they are.
Don't try to fix a problem that isn't even a problem...

[Hixlysss]

Technically you do reach a lot of requirements, that's what the junctions do, which in turn limits your MR...unless you throw money at the game and buy stuff. As for completeing quests to unlock the next MR, that's...kinda backwards to how similar systems work. Usually you have to be X level to do certain things, which is what the MR is primarily for. Also the MR tests, as people have pointed out, are kinda the "skill" checks.

Personally I wish you got more with your higher MR beyond just "Oh, more daily cap to grind more, more mod capacity on my weapons when I forma them, more loadout slots." IMO MR should give you warframe/weapon slots, which currently the only way to get is to sell prime gear for plat...or spend RL money. They are currently the one thing that I feel is needed for progression that doesn't pop up as a thing you get in game, unlike the catalyst, reactor, forma.

[(XBOX)KayAitch]

6 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

And then the tests would be much harder than the ones now, and they would test things like parkour, modding etc. They would actually test your skill. Any thoughts

They do try to be, especially later ones. There are even a couple that took me more than 1 attempt.

8 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

MR really just represents your ability to grind, or how effectively you can do it

It doesn't, I mean, given long enough everyone will gain every rank.

It's a measure of how much of the game's content you've unlocked and then played enough to 'master'.

That said, there are a ton of MR fodder weapons I've levelled in one ESO and then chucked, some without firing a shot.

10 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

Complete "Natah" and kill Tyl Regor

Well, you have to do that to complete the star chart, and there are a load of things you won't get without getting past that anyway.

11 minutes ago, (NSW)Riophilip said:

I think it's gaining MR that makes no sense

Being high MR is pretty useful. At MR25 I can forma an item, still put a pretty good build on it and then go kill high enough enemies that I don't need to re-level specifically.

Other than that I would like to see other perks, but I think that will put some players off. I like learning everything, but loads of players (probably a majority) level a very limited set of gear and then stop with new gear entirely. That's why you see MR8 players doing sorties and the like.

Honestly though, I'm not sure how you make a test that's going to challenge players to progress without being a) annoying and b) easy to cheese with the right gear.

[(NSW)Riophilip]

Of course, we've gone too far to implement this idea, but hey, maybe it'll be in Warframe 2!

(Yes, that's a joke)

[yilmazdurmaz]

with hundreds of frame/weapons/companions etc, if you try to put more limits on game play it would take your whole life in the game. 

so, it is fine enough as it is right now. just max weapons you will use very rare and forget about them.

I only wish that some MR tests were switched numbers, because I learned some skills very late in a higher MR level, while some advanced ones very early

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

MR restrictions means that if you want to use that Supra Vandal you have to play as opposed to simply paying for it.

[kikasnoob]

MR16 is all you need to unlock all playable content (except higher Mastery tests) and game items and it only requires you to have a mediocre knowledge of the games mechanics and skill level to achieve.

Im not say that if you are MR16 you have mediocre skill and knowledge, 

Im saying that Mastery Rank is something that a huge majority of the player base have unwittingly attached to skill level for no real reason.

Are any of the Mastery Tests as difficult as the Profit Taker?

How difficult is the MR27 test really?

Does an MR16 who has levelled every weapon, Warframe, companion, archwi,,,,,,,,bleh,,,,bleh,,,meh but chooses not take any more tests (and there are some out there) have less skill than an MR27? The only difference between the two are 11 missions (MR tests are basically just MR locked missions) or less than 30 minutes of game play.

 

[Steel_Rook]

I'm honestly not a fan of this game's MR system at all. These kinds of deliberate self-reset systems always have the same effect - you only ever get to play with your toys while they're incomplete. By the time they're done, it's time to move onto the next toy or reset it again. MR is simply a measurement of your inventory. How many items you've found and/or crafted. It's a naked attempt to push you into either grinding for gear or straight-up purchasing it. The mere fact that a term like "MR fodder" exists is indicative of the negative effects this is having.

Yeah, sure, it encourages us to try out more gear and find new favourites, I won't deny that. However, MR still encourages players to play with gear they hate, for quite an extended period of time. That can be soul-draining in the long run.

[Birdframe_Prime]

Mastery Rank literally doesn't mean anything until it does.

You're absolutely right about it only showing off your ability to grind and attain things. Though... to reach maximum MR does require a few things that aren't readily available to the average player right away, so there is a certain amount of status to be had from it.

DE have previously said that MR is not supposed to be a way to be elitist to other players. That's why the benefits of high MR are limited to things like starting mod points when your gear is rank 0, the number of trades you can do, the amount of Focus/Standing you can gain per day, your maximum capacity of Void Traces and so on.

Useful, able to help with grind, but that's it. There's genuinely not supposed to be any real in-game ranking system applied to it.

[(XBOX)KayAitch]

9 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

MR16 is all you need to unlock all playable content (except higher Mastery tests)

Except rivens, which go to MR18

9 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

Does an MR16 who has levelled every weapon, Warframe, companion, archwi,,,,,,,,bleh,,,,bleh,,,meh but chooses not take any more tests (and there are some out there)

I really doubt that there are. You need to level twice as much gear to get from MR16 to MR27, and all that gear is much easier to level the higher MR you are.

Someone who sat on MR16 but went on to level everything would be very weird.

9 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

The only difference between the two are 11 missions (MR tests are basically just MR locked missions) or less than 30 minutes of game play

So, following on from the previous point - while many players don't immediately do the MR test, most do before they more than a rank out of sync.

There are probably hundreds of hours between MR16 and 27 - if you don't spend thousands of plat you're going to need to get a lot of resources, and even if you do it's thousands of hours of levelling every amp, every zaw, every archwing, getting every prime, every wraith (each takes an hour or two if your get lucky with invasions).

9 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

less skill than an MR27

Probably not, but the MR27 has played a lot more of the game.

And let's be honest, Warframe is not a game of skill. There's not a single element of the game that you can only achieve through skill. It's a game of grinding and building the right tools for the job, and an MR27 player has definitely done that.

9 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

Are any of the Mastery Tests as difficult as the Profit Taker?

Maybe? I know there are some that players really struggle with, and it's not like Profit Taker is hard.

Like most things in this game: it's easy with the right gear, figure out what that is and get it.

MR is not an indication of skill, but an MR27 player will have gone through that process as many times as anyone in the game, an MR16 might have, but it's unlikely.

 

Edited June 12, 2019 by (XB1)KayAitch

[Rogunz]

10 hours ago, kikasnoob said:

 Are any of the Mastery Tests as difficult as the Profit Taker?

Does an MR16 who has levelled every weapon, Warframe, companion, archwi,,,,,,,,bleh,,,,bleh,,,meh but chooses not take any more tests (and there are some out there) have less skill than an MR27? The only difference between the two are 11 missions (MR tests are basically just MR locked missions) or less than 30 minutes of game play.

MR tests are harder than pretty much any other piece of content in the game because they can do things like prevent you from using your operator and fail you instany if you are too slow/get seen/go down once. Having a high MR doesn't mean that someone has more "skill" since video tutorials that tell you how to cheese them exist but it's likely they do since even if they cheese the tests a high MR player has usually been playing longer and has more resources/experience because of that.

 

It really doesn't matter much though since Warframe really isn't a hard game and pretty  much everyone is competent by the mid teens for normal missions. The only place I assume high MR players will perform much better is archwing missions since unlike most people they should have archwing mods from spending the time to level all their archwing gear.

[KnightOwl_]

On 2019-06-11 at 8:58 AM, (XB1)Thy Divinity said:

MR restrictions means that if you want to use that Supra Vandal you have to play as opposed to simply paying for it.

I just wish that “having to play” meant getting rep, doing sorties and missions and less about running around ESO getting yelled at for holding a bunch of throwing knives I’ll never use again. 

[(XBOX)zThulsaDoomz]

32 minutes ago, OmegaDonut said:

I just wish that “having to play” meant getting rep, doing sorties and missions and less about running around ESO getting yelled at for holding a bunch of throwing knives I’ll never use again. 

I agree.  It's definitely not fun, but it's what we have for now.

[George_PPS]

Passing MR tests requires skills and knowledge. So the current MR system works but it’s by no means perfect. I have seen players with just 500 hours and already MR25. So all they do the most is ranking up their gears. Which is fine. 

[(NSW)Riophilip]

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Edited July 10, 2019 by (NSW)Riophilip