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(PS4)Hopper_Orouk

Ember is a decent warframe, and you complain way too much...

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the warframe forum section is filled with mediocre ember reworks, that never fix any of her presumed problems and just add a flashy useless new ability that she does not need

it usually goes like this...

-DE nerfs a warframe ability

-most of the community freaks out, goes to forums and type a long thread about how said warframe is the worst in the game

-then the forums gets bombarded with rework ideas that...let's face it, DE will NEVER read

let's compare ember to another warframe that nobody talks about or ever complain about her, banshee 

passive- ember: gets 35% ability strength and 10 energy per second while on fire, in my opinion a useful passive if you equip a mediocre weapon that deals self damage, with the energy regeneration  she can keep spamming her first 3 abilities with ease, as much many people might think damaging yourself to get a buff is a horrible idea...in game...it's actually not that horrible...but if you  equip like serration and all the damage and crit mods on your self damaging weapon, and go complain in the forums that she dies too quickly when i activate her passive, then the fault is on you 

banshee:innate silence on all weapons, a very redundant and useless passive when banshee can already do this with her 3 that has a very high duration

first ability:

 fireball-a chargable ability that both deals decent damage and CC enemies with fire procs, 

 banshee-ragdolls the crap out of your enemies...i don't know about you but i'd take a fire proc before a ragdoll anytime 

second ability:

 accelerant-a spammable ability that A-can stun enemies for a long period and reapply that stun on recast so you stunlock all enemies, B-multiplies your fire damage,C-increases your casting speed

 sonar-a spammable ability that can multiply your damage by a LOT 

 yes for a damage buffing ability sonar does a better job, but in my opinion accelerant provides a lot more utility, you can spam this ability over and over and keep all enemies stunned while you         do the damage, something that banshee does not have or can't do it properly, also you don't really spam banshee's abilities unless you want to die or run out of energy, that's not the case  with  ember

third ability: fireblast- an area lockdown ability that knockdowns all enemies in range and gives you multiple stacking fire damage buff 

silence- a high range stun that lasts for a second then you have to move away from the enemy to reapply that stun again, cannot recast, exists only to make banshee's passive useless

and finally it all comes down to this 

fourth ability: world on fire-Aoe damage over time ability that consumes a bunch of energy, can move freely, the range decrease crippled the ability a little bit, but still functions wonderfully especially if you recast at around 50% overheat ...WITH AUGMENT: another THIRD WAY way to passively CC enemies  

sound quake- aoe damage over time ability that consumes A TON of energy, cannot move AT ALL, and damage is horrible and diminishes over distance, WITH AUGMENT:a good  technique to clear low levels but still doesn't function as great as WOF

 

so there you have it...a complete breakdown comparison between banshee and ember...so far the only thing that banshee can do better is how far she can multiply her overall damage, but at the end of the day, banshee is till a support warframe that requires you to move a lot to survive,none of her other abilities synergies with each other, and she's a horrible at CC, and very squishy  

while ember can stun lock enemies, deals tons and tons of fire damage, excel at any level and any mission, and her CC capabilities helps her survive 

so tell me why she's the "worst warframe" again???           

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk
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ember is a great frame still even after her little nerf you just have to rework the way you play her to get the same effect as before ...

and banshee i use her for silence i dont use her 4th much at all ....

but i use frame how i want to use them not how others tell me to and if they dont like it well tough luck ....

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Both frames have been nerfed hard, so you are comparing one nerfed frame to another

And yet, Banshee is a requirement for 1hr+ endurance, while Ember isn't. Banshee (pre-nerf) was used for 2 methods of focus farming (and occasionally still is), while Ember (even pre-nerf) never was.

Why?

Because while Ember may have more synergy, Banshee relates more strongly to the current state of the game: she provides CC/Damage to clear trash, while also buffing her weapons enough to deal with heavy units. Ember has no counter to heavy units, and loses range as she gains damage.

Even with all of her synergy, Ember loses to Banshee in-mission, even if she wins on paper.

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Both are squishy frames, but banshee is what allows you to even go on endurance runs for 5+ hours with the damage output she provides.  What you deal in one shot on a sonar spot with a properly built banshee it takes ember literal minutes to hours to deal with her world on fire.  And her world on fire is trash ever since they made it so the range is reduced as the ability continues as less range means less damage as you're hitting less enemies.  She's also garbage against any heavy units like bombards and heavy gunners.  Ember prior to the nerf was a decent frame but fell off as her abilities didn't scale then and they don't scale now.  She needs a full rework to be anything more then a frame you bring to activate easy mode against very low level exterminate missions where you don't want to shoot and instead run through the map activating and deactivating your 4.

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The problem with ember is that fire damage sucks, and self triggering her passive requires you to bring javlok, can't think of other weapons that can self inflict heat proc easily enough.

WoF was always used for cc, unless in under lvl 40 content, so reducing the range to increase the damage is something no one actually cares of.

Accelerant must have the augment, unless you bring a heat loadout, which is useful only against infested.

Fireball by the time I charge it I killed with my weapon way more enemies (and death is the best CC)

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57 minutes ago, (XB1)COA Altair said:

Both are squishy frames, but banshee is what allows you to even go on endurance runs for 5+ hours with the damage output she provides.  What you deal in one shot on a sonar spot with a properly built banshee it takes ember literal minutes to hours to deal with her world on fire.  And her world on fire is trash ever since they made it so the range is reduced as the ability continues as less range means less damage as you're hitting less enemies.  She's also garbage against any heavy units like bombards and heavy gunners.  Ember prior to the nerf was a decent frame but fell off as her abilities didn't scale then and they don't scale now.  She needs a full rework to be anything more then a frame you bring to activate easy mode against very low level exterminate missions where you don't want to shoot and instead run through the map activating and deactivating your 4.

ok so you just compared WORLD on FRIGGIN FIRE to sonar? a CC/damage ability to a damage multiplication ability? why didn't you compare sonar to accelerant? 

also you either never used ember or never used accelerant because she can handle heavy units quite easily...a 5x times damage multiplier is no joke, also if you expect to kill enemies with world on fire then honestly this warframe is not for you...you obviously just want a press 4 to win warframe...thus making your opinion...invalid 

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12 hours ago, (NSW)Fiftycentis said:

The problem with ember is that fire damage sucks, and self triggering her passive requires you to bring javlok, can't think of other weapons that can self inflict heat proc easily enough.

WoF was always used for cc, unless in under lvl 40 content, so reducing the range to increase the damage is something no one actually cares of.

Accelerant must have the augment, unless you bring a heat loadout, which is useful only against infested.

Fireball by the time I charge it I killed with my weapon way more enemies (and death is the best CC)

accelerant can work fine even without the augment...and if you don't use corrosive and heat on ember IT'S YOUR FAULT...also fire while it's status damage tick is weak, it's damage type it neutral to all health types except shields(the only weak one) so fire is a good balanced damage type...if you equip fire and corrosive damage on your weapon and use your 2 and 3...you'll melt enemies...stun them constantly and get crazy damage numbers

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk
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1 hour ago, (XB1)COA Altair said:

Both are squishy frames, but banshee is what allows you to even go on endurance runs for 5+ hours with the damage output she provides.  What you deal in one shot on a sonar spot with a properly built banshee it takes ember literal minutes to hours to deal with her world on fire.  And her world on fire is trash ever since they made it so the range is reduced as the ability continues as less range means less damage as you're hitting less enemies.  She's also garbage against any heavy units like bombards and heavy gunners.  Ember prior to the nerf was a decent frame but fell off as her abilities didn't scale then and they don't scale now.  She needs a full rework to be anything more then a frame you bring to activate easy mode against very low level exterminate missions where you don't want to shoot and instead run through the map activating and deactivating your 4.

it also looks like you did not actually read my comparison, please do

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I agree that's she's not the worst out there, and that people are really exaggerating this whole thing, but she is a bad frame: 

1- you're basically giving up a weapon slot just to use her passive. this is just straight bad design and should be removed. give her a way to set herself on fire manually (through her 1st's AoE I suggest) while reduce/change the affect of the passive to compromise 

2- the charge on her first is abysmal. takes too long for little to no gain 

 

3- the 3 isn't worthwhile enough. either add a better effect to it or reduce it's cost. knockdown for 1-3 sec for 75 energy and a ring that doesn't do anything is useless 
 

4- if the ability concept is bad design (which DE admitted themselves) then change/remove the ability, don't make band-aid fix that isn't even fixing the problem of 'stealing' kills and 'set it and forget it' and 'no interaction'....literally none of these problems are fixed with reduce the range and increase the consumption 


she does need a rework imo, especially after their joke of an attempt at one a year or so ago 

also...stop comparing frames, it's a crap way to try and make a point which you aren't really doing 

Edited by GinKenshin
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Ember is not a decent warframe. You clearly play her at a level which is so minuscule that anything goes. I will happily take you to run tests of ember where she absolutely fails on every level. I would be happy to watch you die repeatedly while you realise her kit has nothing you can use against sortie enemies. Her damage does absolutely nothing, spamming her 2 only works on very few enemies and is unreliable. Her 3 does nothing, her 4 does nothing. I literally sat and watched her 4 deal damage to level 80 enemies, and my entire 600+ energy pool ran out before 4% of their health was down. She has no ground at all, she’s built  for damage but she ain’t got none, so there’s a problem.

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4 hours ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

the warframe forum section is filled with mediocre ember reworks, that never fix any of her presumed problems and just add a flashy useless new ability that she does not need

it usually goes like this...

-DE nerfs a warframe ability

-most of the community freaks out, goes to forums and type a long thread about how said warframe is the worst in the game

-then the forums gets bombarded with rework ideas that...let's face it, DE will NEVER read

let's compare ember to another warframe that nobody talks about or ever complain about her, banshee 

passive- ember: gets 35% ability strength and 10 energy per second while on fire, in my opinion a useful passive if you equip a mediocre weapon that deals self damage, with the energy regeneration  she can keep spamming her first 3 abilities with ease, as much many people might think damaging yourself to get a buff is a horrible idea...in game...it's actually not that horrible...but if you  equip like serration and all the damage and crit mods on your self damaging weapon, and go complain in the forums that she dies too quickly when i activate her passive, then the fault is on you 

banshee:innate silence on all weapons, a very redundant and useless passive when banshee can already do this with her 3 that has a very high duration

first ability:

 fireball-a chargable ability that both deals decent damage and CC enemies with fire procs, 

 banshee-ragdolls the crap out of your enemies...i don't know about you but i'd take a fire proc before a ragdoll anytime 

second ability:

 accelerant-a spammable ability that A-can stun enemies for a long period and reapply that stun on recast so you stunlock all enemies, B-multiplies your fire damage,C-increases your casting speed

 sonar-a spammable ability that can multiply your damage by a LOT 

 yes for a damage buffing ability sonar does a better job, but in my opinion accelerant provides a lot more utility, you can spam this ability over and over and keep all enemies stunned while you         do the damage, something that banshee does not have or can't do it properly, also you don't really spam banshee's abilities unless you want to die or run out of energy, that's not the case  with  ember

third ability: fireblast- an area lockdown ability that knockdowns all enemies in range and gives you multiple stacking fire damage buff 

silence- a high range stun that lasts for a second then you have to move away from the enemy to reapply that stun again, cannot recast, exists only to make banshee's passive useless

and finally it all comes down to this 

fourth ability: world on fire-Aoe damage over time ability that consumes a bunch of energy, can move freely, the range decrease crippled the ability a little bit, but still functions wonderfully especially if you recast at around 50% overheat ...WITH AUGMENT: another THIRD WAY way to passively CC enemies  

sound quake- aoe damage over time ability that consumes A TON of energy, cannot move AT ALL, and damage is horrible and diminishes over distance, WITH AUGMENT:a good  technique to clear low levels but still doesn't function as great as WOF

 

so there you have it...a complete breakdown comparison between banshee and ember...so far the only thing that banshee can do better is how far she can multiply her overall damage, but at the end of the day, banshee is till a support warframe that requires you to move a lot to survive,none of her other abilities synergies with each other, and she's a horrible at CC, and very squishy  

while ember can stun lock enemies, deals tons and tons of fire damage, excel at any level and any mission, and her CC capabilities helps her survive 

so tell me why she's the "worst warframe" again???           

The fact that you made this post means you are complaining about people complaining soo...bravo👏👏.

But in all seriousness, you can tell how good a Warframe is by how far they can make it in higher content using their abilities more than their weapons. Fire/Heat damage scaling is as cancerous as your thought process. You don’t want fire procs either because you would be on here complaining about it yourself for sure.

If you can provide me with a video with Ember killing a level 120 heavy gunner with just her abilities (especially fireball or fire blast) I’ll have nothing left to say. Her Accelerant only prolongs the inevitable unless you have an OP weapon and I dare you to say otherwise. 

I actually think you don’t realize how much she’s in a bad spot. She has pretty much three useless abilities when facing certain enemies at 100+. World of fire is dead to me and the toggling isn’t really worth it anymore in my opinion.

People that made Rework threads make them with the intent of making a frame they enjoy perform better. Don’t you think if you see a lot of Rework suggestions for a particular Warframe it might be because it actually needs some serious help? Like...has that not crossed your mind? 

Anyway, Ember isn’t the only frame that needs help and we all realize this. I don’t know why you chose to take it out on Ember but she’s already beaten like a dead horse. 

Also, if anything, Banshee’s (Silence) ability has brief CC stun like Accelerant so she actually is in a better spot for her overall kit usefulness compared to Ember.

 

Just saying.

just saying dallas cowboys GIF

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The difference is that Banshee is actually good and Ember isn't.

I am a former Ember main.

Banshee Sonar was and still is the single best enemy debuff in the game.

That one ability alone completely outclasses Ember's entire kit by virtue of the fact that you can't possibly argue against 9x weapon damage.

Despite Banshee's weaknesses in her other abilities, they're just icing on the cake.

Edited by Xaxma
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8 hours ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

accelerant can work fine even without the augment...and if you don't use corrosive and heat on ember IT'S YOUR FAULT...also fire while it's status damage tick is weak, it's damage type it neutral to all health types except shields(the only weak one) so fire is a good balanced damage type...if you equip fire and corrosive damage in your weapon and use your 2 and 3...you'll melt enemies...stun them constantly and get creazy damage numbers

as you can tell from MANY ember threads some of these people have no clue about heat damage. they keep saying heat sucks when it doesn't. heat is bad vs ARMOR, and PROTO shield, but wrecks everything else. if DE added armor strip or made heat stack like toxin or bleed they would have to severely nerf accelerant because of how other factions just get destroyed by heat. you hit the nail on the head friend.

alot of these other ember is bad people also say range nerf was unjustified and should be reverted, and in the same breath claim you can keep the range by using max range mods. they want press 4 to win and are salty they cant do it easy and at the press of 1 button. the rest of the complaints dont even consider the other 3 factions which imo is absolutely ridiculous.

imo ember is balanced as i said in the other thread. the problem is both damage system and enemy scaling (which is cause by frame power scale due to power creep in modding).

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The reason that I find Ember bad, from a completely objective standpoint of 'how are you actually using a Warfarme in a mission' rather than from damage numbers or from the more subjective standpoints of 'fun'... is actually kind of many layered.

For a start, DE claims that they don't want her to have any direct damage reduction on her, which is why they took away Overheat originally. Frames can usually get by without that if they have other ways of mitigating damage or avoiding it. For example invisibility or even a more situational defense function like crowd control.

Banshee is actually a very good example of this trick because Silence can be cast for wide area stun, but is actually a real power-house when you use it for Neutral range and combine it with Melee, since you can place enemies into a temporary Unaware state again and again in order to exploit the 8x damage multiplier on first hit. Really fun when you scale that up actually...

Whereas Ember's stun not only has to be cast and recast in order to maintain it, the debuff it gives to enemies has to be cast and recast on every single new enemy that arrives.

That's the exact sin that DE fixed for poor Nekros players when they were spending mission after mission just pressing 3 over and over and over again every time an enemy died.

Outside of that her damage boosting is, again, based on casting and recasting and recasting and ability so that you can shoot through it to stack that damage onto weapons. This then combos with her 2, but again, only if you cast repeatedly to apply it to each new enemy.

If this were combined into an aura, where she simply added damage to weapons and applied a debuff to that damage type to enemies, just for being in range of her, that would actually be a pretty good function. If the stun on cast was incorporated so that you had a Duration for this ability and could recast to refresh at any time, stunning enemies, you could have the benefits of the boost without the repetitive constant casting to apply it.

Then there's the fact that the range nerf to her 4 doesn't hurt the damage, no, but it does completely ruin the other CC she had with the Fire Quake augment providing consistent knock down on enemies in range, and now if you want to get this CC at range, you have to cast, and recast and recast and recast. You can't use any of her abilities without casting and recasting and recasting.

But here's the real kicker; it doesn't matter what passive you have, it doesn't matter how good or how bad it is, no passive should rely on you bringing a gimped weapon specifically to be able to use it.

That passive, while powerful, is downright counter-intuitive due to that ruling that she doesn't have any damage reduction. Without it, she can't activate it with any kind of weapon at full strength, nor can she activate it using enemy damage beyond around level 30-40. It's suicide.

She needs to be able to use her passive without deliberately hobbling herself. And for as long as she does, Ember's passive will remain the least functional in the game.

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8 hours ago, (PS4)MyUnhealthyHobby said:

The fact that you made this post means you are complaining about people complaining soo...bravo👏👏.

But in all seriousness, you can tell how good a Warframe is by how far they can make it in higher content using their abilities more than their weapons. Fire/Heat damage scaling is as cancerous as your thought process. You don’t want fire procs either because you would be on here complaining about it yourself for sure.

If you can provide me with a video with Ember killing a level 120 heavy gunner with just her abilities (especially fireball or fire blast) I’ll have nothing left to say. Her Accelerant only prolongs the inevitable unless you have an OP weapon and I dare you to say otherwise. 

I actually think you don’t realize how much she’s in a bad spot. She has pretty much three useless abilities when facing certain enemies at 100+. World of fire is dead to me and the toggling isn’t really worth it anymore in my opinion.

People that made Rework threads make them with the intent of making a frame they enjoy perform better. Don’t you think if you see a lot of Rework suggestions for a particular Warframe it might be because it actually needs some serious help? Like...has that not crossed your mind? 

Anyway, Ember isn’t the only frame that needs help and we all realize this. I don’t know why you chose to take it out on Ember but she’s already beaten like a dead horse. 

Also, if anything, Banshee’s (Silence) ability has brief CC stun like Accelerant so she actually is in a better spot for her overall kit usefulness compared to Ember.

 

Just saying.

just saying dallas cowboys GIF

I'm not quite sure you payed any attention to my post...you just went full passive aggressive...well mmkay!

First of all...there are A LOT of warframes that can't use their abilities alone to deal damage on high levels..eg. chroma, mirage, banshee, ember, harrow, zephyr, rhino, volt, ash, mag, nidus, inaros...etc...so no a good warframe is determined "good" by how fun it's abilities are and effective at what they do...and if they provide synergy is it good or not?...also i would very much like if you'd not call my thought process cancerous lol...this is not 4 chan...if you don't have a proper toungue, just read the post and get out

 

 

Lastly 

"Also, if anything, Banshee’s (Silence) ability has brief CC stun like Accelerant so she actually is in a better spot for her overall kit usefulness compared to Ember."...this is a proof that you payed 0 attention at my comparison between bansher and ember's stuns

Yes silence does provide stun but it's very very short...and you constantly have to move away from the enemy so they can get touched by the aura and apply the stun once again...silence cannot be spammed and can't stunlock enemies

While with accelerant you can keep spam it and keep reapplying the stun over and over again...eventually stunlock the enemy...so no banshe only beats ember at her damage multiplier potential...but then again banshee always beats everyone at this job...but the problem is with ember...you actually have multiple choices...you have damage, CC, and you can actually survive more 

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk

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7 hours ago, Xaxma said:

The difference is that Banshee is actually good and Ember isn't.

I am a former Ember main.

Banshee Sonar was and still is the single best enemy debuff in the game.

That one ability alone completely outclasses Ember's entire kit by virtue of the fact that you can't possibly argue against 9x weapon damage.

Despite Banshee's weaknesses in her other abilities, they're just icing on the cake.

Would you rather have a 1 ability warframe or a full warframe with versatile kit? 

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1 hour ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

The reason that I find Ember bad, from a completely objective standpoint of 'how are you actually using a Warfarme in a mission' rather than from damage numbers or from the more subjective standpoints of 'fun'... is actually kind of many layered.

For a start, DE claims that they don't want her to have any direct damage reduction on her, which is why they took away Overheat originally. Frames can usually get by without that if they have other ways of mitigating damage or avoiding it. For example invisibility or even a more situational defense function like crowd control.

Banshee is actually a very good example of this trick because Silence can be cast for wide area stun, but is actually a real power-house when you use it for Neutral range and combine it with Melee, since you can place enemies into a temporary Unaware state again and again in order to exploit the 8x damage multiplier on first hit. Really fun when you scale that up actually...

Whereas Ember's stun not only has to be cast and recast in order to maintain it, the debuff it gives to enemies has to be cast and recast on every single new enemy that arrives.

That's the exact sin that DE fixed for poor Nekros players when they were spending mission after mission just pressing 3 over and over and over again every time an enemy died.

Outside of that her damage boosting is, again, based on casting and recasting and recasting and ability so that you can shoot through it to stack that damage onto weapons. This then combos with her 2, but again, only if you cast repeatedly to apply it to each new enemy.

If this were combined into an aura, where she simply added damage to weapons and applied a debuff to that damage type to enemies, just for being in range of her, that would actually be a pretty good function. If the stun on cast was incorporated so that you had a Duration for this ability and could recast to refresh at any time, stunning enemies, you could have the benefits of the boost without the repetitive constant casting to apply it.

Then there's the fact that the range nerf to her 4 doesn't hurt the damage, no, but it does completely ruin the other CC she had with the Fire Quake augment providing consistent knock down on enemies in range, and now if you want to get this CC at range, you have to cast, and recast and recast and recast. You can't use any of her abilities without casting and recasting and recasting.

But here's the real kicker; it doesn't matter what passive you have, it doesn't matter how good or how bad it is, no passive should rely on you bringing a gimped weapon specifically to be able to use it.

That passive, while powerful, is downright counter-intuitive due to that ruling that she doesn't have any damage reduction. Without it, she can't activate it with any kind of weapon at full strength, nor can she activate it using enemy damage beyond around level 30-40. It's suicide.

She needs to be able to use her passive without deliberately hobbling herself. And for as long as she does, Ember's passive will remain the least functional in the game.

Use flame repellent 😂😂😂

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10 hours ago, (PS4)FK2P said:

Ember is not a decent warframe. You clearly play her at a level which is so minuscule that anything goes. I will happily take you to run tests of ember where she absolutely fails on every level. I would be happy to watch you die repeatedly while you realise her kit has nothing you can use against sortie enemies. Her damage does absolutely nothing, spamming her 2 only works on very few enemies and is unreliable. Her 3 does nothing, her 4 does nothing. I literally sat and watched her 4 deal damage to level 80 enemies, and my entire 600+ energy pool ran out before 4% of their health was down. She has no ground at all, she’s built  for damage but she ain’t got none, so there’s a problem.

This why i specifically compared ember with banshee...yet people still don't get the point

 

Wasting time watching world on fire try to kill high level high armored enemies is like watching sound quake try to do the same thing...

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10 hours ago, GinKenshin said:

I agree that's she's not the worst out there, and that people are really exaggerating this whole thing, but she is a bad frame: 

1- you're basically giving up a weapon slot just to use her passive. this is just straight bad design and should be removed. give her a way to set herself on fire manually (through her 1st's AoE I suggest) while reduce/change the affect of the passive to compromise 

2- the charge on her first is abysmal. takes too long for little to no gain 

 

3- the 3 isn't worthwhile enough. either add a better effect to it or reduce it's cost. knockdown for 1-3 sec for 75 energy and a ring that doesn't do anything is useless 
 

4- if the ability concept is bad design (which DE admitted themselves) then change/remove the ability, don't make band-aid fix that isn't even fixing the problem of 'stealing' kills and 'set it and forget it' and 'no interaction'....literally none of these problems are fixed with reduce the range and increase the consumption 


she does need a rework imo, especially after their joke of an attempt at one a year or so ago 

also...stop comparing frames, it's a crap way to try and make a point which you aren't really doing 

I specifically compared ember with banshee not to say who's better but to clear things up for people (obviously i failed horribly)...the idea is you can watch sound quake try to kill high level enemies...the same way you watch ember try to kill these same high level enemies with world on fire

What i'm trying to say is...look at the replies...they completely forgot about how useles banshee's other abilities are and say that she can't be beat because of how far she can multiply her weapon damage...the same people who say that ember suck because she can't kill high level enemies with her abilities alone(wof)...something that banshee can't do...hell even VOLT needs weapons to deal good damage and even with that volt doesn't multiply damage like ember

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2 hours ago, EinheriarJudith said:

as you can tell from MANY ember threads some of these people have no clue about heat damage. they keep saying heat sucks when it doesn't. heat is bad vs ARMOR, and PROTO shield, but wrecks everything else. if DE added armor strip or made heat stack like toxin or bleed they would have to severely nerf accelerant because of how other factions just get destroyed by heat. you hit the nail on the head friend.

alot of these other ember is bad people also say range nerf was unjustified and should be reverted, and in the same breath claim you can keep the range by using max range mods. they want press 4 to win and are salty they cant do it easy and at the press of 1 button. the rest of the complaints dont even consider the other 3 factions which imo is absolutely ridiculous.

imo ember is balanced as i said in the other thread. the problem is both damage system and enemy scaling (which is cause by frame power scale due to power creep in modding).

Fire doesn't deal reduced damage to armor...it's bad against armor because it's armor

Just like how every other damage type gets weaker with armor 

Fire only deals 50% less damage to proto shields...so yea...it's very balanced

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Just now, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

Fire doesn't deal reduced damage to armor...it's bad against armor because it's armor

Just like how every other damage type gets weaker with armor 

Fire only deals 50% less damage to proto shields...so yea...it's very balanced

exactly my point. i agree with you.

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19 minutes ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

Use flame repellent 😂😂😂

That's not the point?

Ember's survivability is gimped through the basic mechanics of her abilities and DE's arbitrary decision that she doesn't have direct damage reduction casts. She uses CC that has to be spam cast to even keep her alive when she's not hiding behind other frames or other functions.

Meanwhile what could be one of the best passives in the game cannot be activated without gimmicked self-damage or specifically taking on enemies that happen to have flame throwers.

Oh and yes, Heat Repellent. If I knew you were going to literally burn yourself with this reply, I would have recommended it for you instead.

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2 minutes ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

That's not the point?

Ember's survivability is gimped through the basic mechanics of her abilities and DE's arbitrary decision that she doesn't have direct damage reduction casts. She uses CC that has to be spam cast to even keep her alive when she's not hiding behind other frames or other functions.

Meanwhile what could be one of the best passives in the game cannot be activated without gimmicked self-damage or specifically taking on enemies that happen to have flame throwers.

Oh and yes, Heat Repellent. If I knew you were going to literally burn yourself with this reply, I would have recommended it for you instead.

Chill(no pun intended)

But yea i think i agree with you on her passive

It's as worse as frost passive and only slightly better than hydroid's friggin tentacle passive

Until we get a decent way to lit her up...we just have to work with what we have

Edited by (PS4)Hopper_Orouk

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40 minutes ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

I'm not quite sure you payed any attention to my post...you just went full passive aggressive...well mmkay!

First of all...there are A LOT of warframes that can't use their abilities alone to deal damage on high levels..eg. chroma, mirage, banshee, ember, harrow, zephyr, rhino, volt, ash, mag, nidus, inaros...etc...so no a good warframe is determined "good" by how fun it's abilities are and effective at what they do...and if they provide synergy is it good or not?...also i would very much like if you'd not call my thought process cancerous lol...this is not 4 chan...if you don't have a proper toungue, just read the post and get out

 

 

Lastly 

"Also, if anything, Banshee’s (Silence) ability has brief CC stun like Accelerant so she actually is in a better spot for her overall kit usefulness compared to Ember."...this is a proof that you payed 0 attention at my comparison between bansher and ember's stuns

Yes silence does provide stun but it's very very short...and you constantly have to move away from the enemy so they can get touched by the aura and apply the stun once again...silence cannot be spammed and can't stunlock enemies

While with accelerant you can keep spam it and keep reapplying the stun over and over again...eventually stunlock the enemy...so no banshe only beats ember at her damage multiplier potential...but then again banshee always beats everyone at this job...but the problem is with ember...you actually have multiple choices...you have damage, CC, and you can actually survive more 

The entire point is that Banshee is still in a better spot than Ember. Also, ember is supposed to be a glass cannon frame for DPS only. You are comparing a list of frames that are not in that category. 

you can tell how good a Warframe is by how far they can make it in higher content using their abilities more than their weapons.“ 

That is what I said above. This is regards to damage, survival, CC you name it. What Ember is supposed to be good at, she isn’t very good at it. That is pretty much what it means.

If I misunderstood what you said then I apologize because I swear you said you would prefer Heat proc over ragdolling? Heat proc damage scaling is terrible. I also thought you were purposely singling Ember out for some type of reason and since I was one of the people that made a Rework, of course I would get upset. You said they were mediocre or useless so how do you think someone would retaliate?

Edited by (PS4)MyUnhealthyHobby

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