Warframe Loot & Supply suggestion.

[Apocryphos13]

Vaccum & Loot

Any loot dropped by an enemy would automaticaly be collected and added to all player's inventory in the squad.

Pretty straight forward, removing the physical presence of loot would remove the neccesity to track certain ressources position on waypoints and clean up the game of unnecessary visual informations.

  -  What happens to vaccum mods ?

They would still be quite useful, as "supplies" aka Health / Energy Orbs and Ammo pickups would remain ingame as drops, but with a couple of changes.

Orbs

Some of them could also restore a maximum pourcentage of ones Health / Energy on top of the base value, just to prevent orbs from barely doing anything to frames with high Health & Energy Values. (Something like 2% for health orbs and 5% for energy orbs ?)
  
 Ammo

Instead of belonging in a specific weapon ammo category, would supply all of your available firearms with a different amount of their respective ammo type. 
All ammo would be convertable to all weapons with different values to balance.

- Ammo conversion mods would be changed to increase the value of a specific weapon type's ammo conversion.

(Another posibility here would be to separated ammo types between primary and secondary instead, which would work perfectly fine,
I'd say that players could use to be more aware of their core stats pickups by some finely tunned oversimplicity).

Pickups Redesign (Maybe ?)

I would like to add that these pickups are in general very hard to notice (at the very least for me and some new players i introduce to the game). I rarely realise getting orbs, even from Nezha's abilities, until i see their values show up on my UI, the issue being especially noticeable with ammo that just seem to be there, passively refilling my guns with bullets, and i have completely no idea where they're coming from.

So, some form of visual change to these objects would be welcome in my opinion, i dunno, more emphasis on the Red Health/ Blue Energy /Yellow Ammo color chart, a more flashy visual, icons, a thin column of light like rare ressources currently have, just something.
 

Edited June 20, 2019 by Apocryphos13

[krc473]

40 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

Pretty straight forward, removing the physical presence of loot would reduce the importance of your sentinel (two birds with one stone, making other compagnons a bit more attractive)

You do know that Companions can use Vacuum now too right? It is called 'Fetch'. This really sounds like you do not know that.

 

Your suggestions for Orbs and Ammo seem a little strange.

1. I don't really see the benefit of the orb changes. We have enough ways to generate health and energy outside of orbs already. I am not sure if this would be worth the development time. 
2. Ammo should not be made universal, there are mods that do this. And generally, there is no issue with ammo.

 

44 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

So, some form of visual change to these objects would be welcome in my opinion, i dunno, more Emphasis on the Red Health/ Blue Energy /Yellow Ammo color chart, a more flashy visual, icons, a thin column of light like rare ressources currently have, just something.

I guess my question is: why? Why do we need to have additional visual clutter to tell us something that is largely irrelevant? What possible benefit would this provide? I do not believe there is one. But I am curious why you think this would be beneficial.

[Apocryphos13]

il y a 17 minutes, krc473 a dit :

You do know that Companions can use Vacuum now too right? It is called 'Fetch'. This really sounds like you do not know that.

You're absolutely right on this point, a misconception from my part.

 

il y a 17 minutes, krc473 a dit :

Ammo should not be made universal, there are mods that do this. And generally, there is no issue with ammo.

The intent here is to simplify ammo to it's essential function. We get ammo by killing enemies, quite simple, it's not something we really keep track of as it mostly happens in the background.

 

il y a 17 minutes, krc473 a dit :

Why do we need to have additional visual clutter to tell us something that is largely irrelevant? What possible benefit would this provide? I do not believe there is one. But I am curious why you think this would be beneficial.

I believe removing the 3D representation of non-supply pickups largely compensate for a gain in clarity. If you are looking for any of these pickups, you'll know where they are easily and you'll pick them when needed, which is what you'd expect from pickups. 

Edited June 20, 2019 by Apocryphos13

[krc473]

22 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

The intent here is to simplify ammo to it's essential function. We get ammo by killing enemies, quite simple, it's not something we really keep track of as it mostly happens in the background.

There is a logical flaw in this though. Ever tried to shoot an arrow out of an assault rifle? (I assume not because that would be a terrible idea) If DE wants to stick with some logic in the ammo this cannot happen. I am not really against it, but I am assuming there would be broad categories (Arrows, Primary bullets, Secondary bullets). It would invalidate a bunch of mods though, which requires extra work on DE’s part. I do think there would be minimal benefit, so it may not be worth their time.

22 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

I believe removing the 3D representation of non-supply pickups largely compensate for a gain in clarity.

My question was exclusively about the quoted bit. I am not sure your response addresses that. It seems to be more around the general loot changes (I.e, removing Polymer Bundles, Nano Spores pickups). I have no issue with this. It was the additional visual clutter around making orbs/ammo more flashy and obvious.

Edited June 20, 2019 by krc473
Typo

[Apocryphos13]

il y a 5 minutes, krc473 a dit :

Ever tried to shoot an arrow out of an assault rifle?

(Yes, my Boltor does that ^^) And i'd view it as ammo cases, you'd automatically pick the ammo type compatible with your current weapons. As for logic, it seems unlikely that grinner units would carry arrows to begin with, same for corpus crews with bullets or the infested any ammo at all.

 

il y a 12 minutes, krc473 a dit :

My question was exclusively about the quoted bit. I am not sure your response addresses that. It seems to be more around the general loot changes (I.e, removing Polymer Bundles, Nano Spores pickups). I have no issue with this. It was the additional visual clutter around making orbs/ammo more flashy and obvious.

I voiced my issue with orbs and ammo being difficult to see in general, especially for new players. (Btw a pulsing blob of blue goo doesn't really ring "energy" to me, but that's not really relevant right now).

When your frame is note a slaughtering machine on it's own, you "might" end up running out of ammo, and actually finding it and pretty tedious. Nowadays with some hours invested in the game, restoration stations kinda killed the value of pickups (beside specific mods that build mechanics around them), and you're running with a virtually infinite amount of energy/ammo. The idea is simple, if you can tell these ressources appart better, you'll be able to manage them better.

[krc473]

2 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

The idea is simple, if you can tell these ressources appart better, you'll be able to manage them better.

How much does this matter when you account for the majority of people using Vacuum now? It is not uncommon for Health/Energy/Ammo to be sucked up as soon as it is dropped. The only time this doesn’t happen is when you don’t need it. This is why I question how useful making them more obvious is. I find in general play that enemies tend to die before they can do much damage, and that abilities are not really required (I usually play Valkyr Prime). Making the orbs more visible is great if you need them. But what about when you don’t? I can run 20 minute missions and not need energy orbs after the first minute. This really will be a negative change for me. There may be some performance impact associated with this, more noticeable on lower end machines.

• I guess if you couple it with a “when required, make more obvious” system it could work. I can understand the frustration of need energy/ammo but not being able to see them. 
• I do accept that my lack of use for them might be just what I am doing. It could be useful for newer players.

7 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

Yes, my Boltor does that

Fair point. I was meaning more, in real life though. It is fairly illogical in real life. It just depends if anyone cares about this. I don’t personally, but I do think the minimum should be separating primary and secondary ammo. Mutation mods can make both work, plus what you said above.

[Apocryphos13]

il y a 36 minutes, krc473 a dit :

Making the orbs more visible is great if you need them. But what about when you don’t?

I can see how a level covered in shiny orbs would be the most annoying thing imaginable, but it doesn't have to be flashy in order to have a distinctive visual.

il y a 36 minutes, krc473 a dit :

I guess if you couple it with a “when required, make more obvious” system it could work. I can understand the frustration of need energy/ammo but not being able to see them. 

 Various mechanics such as this could work, more ideas include : "increased likelyhood to drop when needed", "Very minimal drop from most enemies, increased drops from heavy units or specific actions such as revisited melee finishers".

i suppose i just really like the way Doom handles that with Chainsaws showering you in ressources, and DE seems to have been inspired by this too lately.

The issue i tried to adress it that these pickups don't really have a purpose anymore, and are running in the background if you need them anyway, as vaccum acts as a constant toilet flusher when it's supposed to ease the process of collecting ressources that shouldn't be such an issue in the first place. Maybe if high level enemies were to put up more of a gameplay challenge to players instead of obliterating anyone that isn't a tank, and that restoration stations weren't so simple to abuse, we would have some time to breathe and think about orbs & stuff, maybe there would be a role to fill for pickups, perhaps.

Edited June 20, 2019 by Apocryphos13

[krc473]

26 minutes ago, Apocryphos13 said:

The issue i tried to adress it that these pickups don't really have a purpose anymore

I agree that they seem fairly pointless. I am not sure if what you are suggesting will fix this or not. I am also not sure how to fix this, or even if it is a problem.