Jump to content
[DE]Connor

July 2019 Riven Disposition Updates

Recommended Posts

On 2019-09-23 at 6:24 AM, --Vampires_SE7EN said:

want a factor? they will nerf op weapons like rubico or tiberon to release a much more op weapon in the future an example of that is fulmin/accestral and ....

why they do this? so people will spend their plats on new meta weapons the riven market is so crazy these days for a unrolled riven sometimes you have to pay 1000plats which is too much

they should fix this broken riven market that would be good for all of us how they can do this? well i think they should give us freedom on what stats we want on a riven for example you give like 1k kuva for fully random roll,and you can give 5k for a guaranteed stat you want like (a guaranteed cc) this will make the whole riven market a friendly and much better one in my opinion because as of how riven market is today i have no interested in either rolling or buying rivens

This just means DE doesn't care about the product they sell. Imagine if you were to buy a new car, and that company comes to your house after a year and says "We have to downgrade your engine. But you can buy our new car with the same engine you already had". I've already gone in depth as to why buffs are better than nerfs several times, but I'll repeat it once more. When you nerf something, you're telling the person that their investment, be it financial, emotional, or hard work, in that thing isn't important. Yes, DE is a company and the goal of every company should be making money, but when you're sacrificing costumer relations and burn bridges between them and you, you lose money in the long run. You may make 100k the day, but you could make 1m that year instead. Could you make more money by milking? Sure, you may make 100k every day for the first month, but what happens when costumers finally had enough? Look at Konami, EA, and Activation. They burned some serious bridges in the pursuit of money. Konami is crawling back to the console market because gambling is getting more regulations in Japan, EA is hated by almost everyone for their loot boxes, and Activation drains the life out of fan favorite studios and games before shutting them down. DE needs to respect the players. We put time, effort, and money into this game. We farm Sorties for rivens, then farm the kills or resources for the mission, then Kuva to roll the riven, and more Kuva to keep rolling it. Just to give you an idea of the time required for the first roll, Kuva Survival gives 200 per tower, and towers take about 1.5 minutes to spawn, plus another 30 seconds or so to run to it, so roughly 2 minutes total. The first roll costs 900 Kuva, which means you're spending about 10 minutes for a single roll if you don't have any boosters or a cat buff. My Opticor riven have about 300 rolls on it, which means at minimum it has 1,015,000 Kuva in it. Using the baseline just established, that's 5,075 minutes spent farming enough Kuva for that amount, or just over 3 days of continuous play. But not everyone plays every waking second, so again, using the baseline of 4 hours (9.5 hours at work, plus 4 hours with the family, plus 6 hours for sleeping), it'll take you roughly 20 days. Forcing long grind sessions on players isn't how you maintain a healthy game. No, that doesn't mean you should be handed everything you want, when you want, but you shouldn't be forced this amount of grind for something as basic as a riven. Rivens aren't some raid reward you get for killing an epic boss.

 

Remember, nothing in this game is supported forever. Once you've all the Arbitration rewards, all the Disruption rewards, all the Arcanes, or at least all the rewards from these missions you care about, the only thing left to do is Fashionframe, and Kuva farming. If you take away value from one activity, what's left? If Kuva becomes worthless because the rivens are garbage, all you have left is Fashionframing, and I can go play Gaia Online to play dress up. If Fashionframing doesn't get anymore support, all you have left is Kuva farming, and that will burn you out in a hurry. I'm playing Destiny 2 right now, and while I'm still new to the game, I feel as though even once I max out my level, there's still stuff to do. Raids, PvP, farm gear, craft Masterworks, and so on. What does Warframe have right now? Well, newer players might find enjoyment in farming materials to craft weapons, but I'm a vet with millions of materials so I can craft almost any weapon day one, and any resource that's time limited I can easily get dozens of since I've every planet open and have farming setups. Raids are gone and despite DE constantly telling us "they'll return", we've yet to actually see any meaningful steps towards reintroducing them. Sorties are once a day, so they can't be farmed, and rivens are tied to Sorties so they can't be farmed (Unless you want to count Archwings, Sentinels, and other garbage rivens tied to Endless missions, but even those are timed, so you can't constantly farm the currency to buy them). Eidolons are timed events so if they're down you have to wait until they show up again, and even if you're in time to hunt them, you have a limited amount of time to farm them. The whole "We want players to take a break from our game so they avoid burnout" means literally nothing when not only combined with the absurd amounts of grind required, but the lack of any real endgame content that drives players back to the game. Great, we got freeroam, but when there's nothing to do that keeps us there, what's the point? And when "big releases" like Fortuna only happen once, maybe twice year, whose to say something else hasn't come out by then? The next big Switch game might come out that draws my attention away, or the next big expansion for WoW might come out and draw my attention away. When other big releases get released, what is there that DE has to offer that makes me say "You know, I haven't played Warframe in awhile, maybe I should pick it up again"? DE has yet to release anything like that. When PoE came out, people played it for like a month, then quit. Kuva farming is literally the only thing in this game that is continuous farming, and it's only continuous farming because new weapons get released. But if the rivens are so devalued, where's the incentive to farm?

 

As for locking in stats, I personally would've liked rivens to have never been a thing and instead we got augments, like what the Penta has with the Napalm and Tether Grenades. Since it's too late for that, next best thing is like you said, put more Kuva in to get a roll you want. Or do a Prestige system, after 100 rolls, you can reset the rolls to 1, 1, and so on, to select a stat you want and have an increased chance of getting that stat with each roll.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Il y a 23 heures, Hawk197 a dit :

(...)

DE is responsible for one thing, nerfing/buffing items because of their popularity only. That's their own choice, good or bad, and we can't do anything about it until they change their mind, if they do.

But players are also responsible, going systematically for the next brand new popular gun is also what makes this whole system nerf the same weapons, over and over. I'm not using an upteenth Ignis wraith and if i want to i also may use a Phantasma. This game is not idiotproof, DE can't do a thing if all players are doing the same stupid thing.

Blaming DE all day long as if they were an upteenth evil corp is not much productive, every angry player is doing the same in every single game these days. Sure this disposition mechanics is flawed since DE is designing content that makes some weapons mandatory, and thus makes them nerfed a minute later (sniper rifles and Eidolons, Catchmoon or Arca plasmor for Index or arbitrations etc.) and tbh i wish they solve that one day cause they're designing the whole game, not us.

But when it comes to nerf other weapons, you can blame players cause knowing what disposition will be nered isn't rocket science, play the game and you'll see that lots of players are using the same guns - which is a good thing for the smarter playerbase who's seeing their own rivens being buffed each month.

  • Woah 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Le 16/07/2019 à 01:13, (XB1)Muttz v2 a dit :

I've put money into this game, surported it as i thought it was worth it. Brought every prime accses and unvaulting weather i had the stuff in them or not. But now i see my investment slipping away, my perfect builds ruined, my time effort and money wasted. its demoralising to say the least. Warframe is no longer my only game, my money goes elsewhere now. I'll buy the Nekros Unvaulting when it happens as I want the noggle, but apart from that i doubt i'll be spending much if any money here. Atleast not untill you realise PvE isn't meant to be ballanced, thats why most single player campaign games let you chose easy, medium, hard etc. My hard setting was running round with a stug and heat sword seeing how far i could solo hydron. My easy setting was Saryn. I just cant be bothered with it any more, that stupid eidolon chicken thing was the last straw, shoot its elbows, ride it around like a drunken camel, yeah smashing de, gg, just gg. 

Access prime have nothing to do with rivens, what you do with your own platinium is your own concern only. And i'm always sceptical about people who spend cash in a game speaking about "investment", DE owns everything you buy and that's how it works in every single game. There are no investments, in any game, at all.

Edited by 000l000
  • Woah 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, 000l000 said:

Access prime have nothing to do with rivens, what you do with your own platinium is your own concern only. And i'm always sceptical about people who spend cash in a game speaking about "investment", DE owns everything you buy and that's how it works in every single game. There are no investments, in any game, at all.

I think as English is obviously not your native tongue you completely missunderstood what i was sayin. 

The short version is i surported this game as i thouught it was well run and had the interests of the players at heart.

The investment i made was in DE so that they can pay the bills and keep this game going. 

Also what you say about never owning anything in any game is not true. The games industry would like you to think you have no rights but if they take your money they enter into a contract governed by consumer law. Weather it be a product or a service you buy you have rights to acsess that product or service. A lot of the wording in most countrys use words like reasonable or whatever making a lot of it a grey area but they are there and have been used many time in computer software cases which is what a game is.

People like you who tell others what they do or do not own should check your facts first.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, 000l000 said:

DE is responsible for one thing, nerfing/buffing items because of their popularity only. That's their own choice, good or bad, and we can't do anything about it until they change their mind, if they do.

But players are also responsible, going systematically for the next brand new popular gun is also what makes this whole system nerf the same weapons, over and over. I'm not using an upteenth Ignis wraith and if i want to i also may use a Phantasma. This game is not idiotproof, DE can't do a thing if all players are doing the same stupid thing.

Blaming DE all day long as if they were an upteenth evil corp is not much productive, every angry player is doing the same in every single game these days. Sure this disposition mechanics is flawed since DE is designing content that makes some weapons mandatory, and thus makes them nerfed a minute later (sniper rifles and Eidolons, Catchmoon or Arca plasmor for Index or arbitrations etc.) and tbh i wish they solve that one day cause they're designing the whole game, not us.

But when it comes to nerf other weapons, you can blame players cause knowing what disposition will be nered isn't rocket science, play the game and you'll see that lots of players are using the same guns - which is a good thing for the smarter playerbase who's seeing their own rivens being buffed each month.

I don't think you understand the original meaning I was putting across (I wouldn't blame you, those posts are months old now). I don't care when and if buffs or nerfs happen, I just want the why. Like you said, DE creates content that mandates certain gear, which is why these weapons are popular, but DE doesn't seem to understand those reasons, else they would fix the issues those weapons are solving. Weapons like the Arca Plasmor, Ignis, Amprex, and such are used to delete large amounts of enemies, we all know that. Why do we need to delete large amounts of enemies though? Is it because Index is the only viable credit farm? Well, there are easy fixes for that, like increasing the credit gain from Chroma, alerting new players they can sell their unused equipment, or simply by changing how rewards work. Is it because Arbitration is the only "farmable endgame"? Well, make more endgame. But we don't know what DE is thinking when they nerf and/or buff certain gear, we can only assume what their reasons are because their "grading scale" isn't public knowledge. We know "x weapon is popular", but we don't know where they got that data and what portion of the game that weapon is popular in.

 

We jump around weapons because it's the "Most Effective Tactic Available", or the META. When/If the current deletion weapon is nerfed, we look for the next. What happens when/if the Ignis is no longer the META for Arbitration? Well, we look for the next best thing that's stronger, like the Lenz, Ogris, or whatever. These weapons are solving a problem the game has, which is the inability to quickly farm for the things required for x thing. If you look at a game like Borderlands, you can farm whatever as whatever, because you're not jumping through hoops. You need to kill a badass Vermivorous? Well, you have to make it spawn, but you don't have to get farming gear, or use specific strategies, or whatever. You jump on your Mechromancer or your Psycho, and you kill it. You can do things like luring it in front of the train to instantly kill it, or a weapon with bouncy bullets to melt it, but you don't need to. With Warframe, you have to collect enough of x material to fun y research, then farm more x material to build z gun. And if you're a newer player, you also need to farm a mod, then farm endo to rank up a mod to use on z gun. Sometimes you'll need to farm forma to use on z gun to fit a mod, then farm more material to build that forma. We put time and effort (My favorite two words, I know) into our gear. Some of us, like myself, are walletwarriors, who will buy everything, at that point it's effort and money, but the point remains the same. Warframe is about how long you play, and how much you care. It's not a game you pick up for a few hours a week, it's a game that requires you to constantly farm, and sometimes the only way to make the farm bearable is to speed up the process by using these powerful weapons, which like you said, is a flaw that needs addressing.

 

The other major issue that MANY people have voiced is the lack of content. You can look at Reaper Hunter, Iflynn, Mogamu, AGGP, DK, and many other creators who've said the same thing. We don't have any thing to use our awesome gear against. I put forma after forma after forma into my gear, testing builds or simply to fit new mods on, yet I've nothing right now to use that gear against. The only way to truly test my gear is to spend an hour or more in an endless to get lv 100+ enemies. DE needs to focus on content right now, instead of nerfing and buffing content. Rivens, Arbitration, Kuva Disruption, all of these things are fine as is right now, give us something to look forward to. Yes, deal with the issues, like overpowered rivens, but when you don't have a reason to keep playing, and now you're told "That 1 million Kuva you spent on this riven is wasted lol", why bother? If all you're going to experience is a negative without any benefits, why keep coming back? Maybe if we got a story quest along with these nerfs, the after taste wouldn't be so bad. But no, we're told all negatives with no positives. The first two people I named have quit the game entirely, with many other creators already saying this was the end of content creation for the game because there's no content to talk about. Will Railjack bring people back? Maybe. But Destiny 2 is releasing Shadowkeep in a few days. How many people can DE draw back when there are other games? If people feel burned by a game, why should they come back to more of the same treatment, when a company like Bungie is out here saying "We heard your complaints, and we're working to fix our product"?

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
il y a une heure, Hawk197 a dit :

We jump around weapons because it's the "Most Effective Tactic Available", or the META. When/If the current deletion weapon is nerfed, we look for the next. What happens when/if the Ignis is no longer the META for Arbitration? Well, we look for the next best thing that's stronger, like the Lenz, Ogris, or whatever.

That's exactly what i said, there's absolutely no meta in this game. In most content all weapons are perfectly viable up to sortie level - even if you want to kill tougher enemies you can pretty much kill anything with tons of well built weapons. Melee only can obliterate anything for now. Meta is only for sheeps who don't have a clue about what's really going on in this game, and for people who like shiny stuff and expensive rivens. You know what happened when the Wolf of Saturn Six spawned a few months ago ? Every single team i was playing with was struggling to kill him for one only reason - they were all stupidly shooting at him with an Ignis Wraith.

There's no meta, just lazy pre-made stuff for lazy people or brand shiny stuff for bored players (since every new stuff is automatically popular for some obvious reasons even if it sucks or doesn't please anyone). Only Eidolons need optimal weapons and even they can be killed with many weapons and not one only. Tbh i don't care if i'm shooting one or twice in its limbs and wouldn't spend 15k platinium to be sure i need one less shot to save me 1s of a fight.

Warframe isn't idiotproof.

Edited by 000l000
  • Woah 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Il y a 12 heures, (XB1)Muttz v2 a dit :

Also what you say about never owning anything in any game is not true.

People like you who tell others what they do or do not own should check your facts first.

Quite ironicallly "people like me" know better their own rights than you. Fact is everything you buy in this game is not your property. If they want to remove every single riven from the game right now, you can't do a thing about that. That's called a End User License Agreement.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, 000l000 said:

That's exactly what i said, there's absolutely no meta in this game. In most content all weapons are perfectly viable up to sortie level - even if you want to kill tougher enemies you can pretty much kill anything with tons of well built weapons. Melee only can obliterate anything for now. Meta is only for sheeps who don't have a clue about what's really going on in this game, and for people who like shiny stuff and expensive rivens. You know what happened when the Wolf of Saturn Six spawned a few months ago ? Every single team i was playing with was struggling to kill him for one only reason - they were all stupidly shooting at him with an Ignis Wraith.

There's no meta, just lazy pre-made stuff for lazy people or brand shiny stuff for bored players (since every new stuff is automatically popular for some obvious reasons even if it sucks or doesn't please anyone). Only Eidolons need optimal weapons and even they can be killed with many weapons and not one only. Tbh i don't care if i'm shooting one or twice in its limbs and wouldn't spend 15k platinium to be sure i need one less shot to save me 1s of a fight.

Warframe isn't idiotproof.

You don't seem to grasp the concept of a META. The MetaGame as people call it isn't about the most powerful, but the Most Effective Tactic Available. That's literally what META stands for. What is the most effective tactic available when doing a Sniper Only Sortie? What's the most effective tactic available when clearing large amounts of enemies in Elite Onslaught? What's the most effective tactic available when dealing with Corpus Nullifiers? And like you witnessed, what is the most effective tactic available when trying to kill Wolf? THAT is what a MetaGame is. I'm not using the newfangle meaning, because cookie cutting isn't a "Meta". Yes, a Dakra Prime can kill everything, but is it the most effective tactic available when doing so? There is a clear difference between using the most effective, and the most popular. The difference, if you don't already know, is the effectiveness. Can Rubico Prime take out Eidolons? Sure, it's a popular choice. But is it more effective when compared to the Lanka? No. In this instance, the Rubico Prime isn't the, once again, most effective tactic available.

 

Also, Warframe is pretty idiotproof. There are plenty of ways to screw up, and not be punished for said screw up. Why? Because the game has literally no challenge. Raids brought challenge to the game, and if you screwed up, well, the team was pretty screwed. Now? We got 6 revives per game, instead of 4 revives per day, we got tons of frames that can become immortal (Like Hildryn with Aegis), we got Umbra Forma so we can use those mods on any frame and weapon, we got frames and weapons that can kill lv 150s in mere seconds, and so on. You have to be trying to screw up to fail in star chart missions, and even in Arbitration. Heck, even when vanilla Stalker was a thing, I could easily solo him with my Boltor Prime, and I was barely MR 5 at the time. Something that should've scared me as a new player, without Forma mind you, was barely a threat to me. There's a reason people like me go at least an hour in endless, we want to push our gear and truly see what the fruits of our labor brought.

 

Like I said, Warframe doesn't need nerfs and buffs, it needs content. Even Rebecca agreed with that sentiment. And when you fail to release content, on top of nerfing weapons, warframes, powers, focuses, mods, rivens, whatever, you decrease the players willingness to return. Connor needs to leave rivens alone right now. Is he not apart of the teams working on content? Doesn't matter. Let the others give players something to look forward to before filling up the salt shakers, that way players are less angry since they have new stuff to do.

  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-09-27 at 6:51 AM, 000l000 said:

Quite ironicallly "people like me" know better their own rights than you. Fact is everything you buy in this game is not your property. If they want to remove every single riven from the game right now, you can't do a thing about that. That's called a End User License Agreement.

Most (or at least many) EULA's are or would be overturned in court due to being unreasonable or even illegal in the countrys they were acted on.

EULA's ain't worth the paper there not wrote on. Consumer law trumps all as any other agreement has to comply with it, which most EULAs do not.

 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-07-05 at 9:25 PM, [DE]Connor said:

 

  Hide contents

Stradavar: 1.15->1

 

 

jus when i GOT my riven and forma-ed my weapon 3 times. 

THANKS DE. 

  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...