Last post wins

[Loza03]

7 hours ago, Aldain said:

Little did we know, Smash Bros was the real Great Keyblade War.

Would not put it past Nomura to do that, to be honest.

[lowgrav]

1 minute ago, Loza03 said:

Would not put it past Nomura to do that, to be honest.

oh it all makes sence now how could i not have seen it .......if you dont understand just look through the kingdom hearts lore.......it may take you a few years to understand it as well its kingdom hearts........but the lore all fits........well i think it does........its confusing

[Tali]

Whoever becomes a chiropractor can make fortunes of the sisters

[Yrkul]

Yeah. Their models are pretty bad. Someone needs to study anatomy a bit more.

[xombob89]

Thread been quiet for whole weekend, this is my chance. 

[MagPrime]

1 hour ago, xombob89 said:

Thread been quiet for whole weekend, this is my chance. 

[LillyRaccune]

*Sees this thread is still active*

 

[Loza03]

12 minutes ago, LillyRaccune said:

*Sees this thread is still active*

 

Tabaxi has wares, if you have- 

Wait.

Uh

Khajit has failed Khajit's wisdom sav-

Damnit!

[Loza03]

Just finished Metroid Dread.

 

Holy S#&$, this game is so goddamn good. Like it's just. *mwah*

[TeaHands]

17 hours ago, Loza03 said:

Just finished Metroid Dread.

 

Holy S#&$, this game is so goddamn good. Like it's just. *mwah*

Right??? The games movement was so silky smooth and every boss fight felt unique and challenging.

Spoiler for the final fight below

Spoiler

The only problem I had with the game was a glitch I didn't see anyone else run into.

For some reason the final boss fight would mess up on the cutscenes for me, like they either wouldn't activate to start the next stage of the fight, or stop the next stage from happening. I have a funny clip of the cutscene of Raven Beak ripping off his wing, and then proceeding to fly in the air wingless while tanking all the damage I threw at him. Had to reset after that.

 

[Kaotyke]

So, I havent seen any Content Drought thread in a while.

Half-tempted to make one so balance is returned to the forums.

[Loza03]

15 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

Right??? The games movement was so silky smooth and every boss fight felt unique and challenging.

Spoiler for the final fight below

  Reveal hidden contents

The only problem I had with the game was a glitch I didn't see anyone else run into.

For some reason the final boss fight would mess up on the cutscenes for me, like they either wouldn't activate to start the next stage of the fight, or stop the next stage from happening. I have a funny clip of the cutscene of Raven Beak ripping off his wing, and then proceeding to fly in the air wingless while tanking all the damage I threw at him. Had to reset after that.

 

I'm honestly really impressed with the variety of the bosses. The first didn't really impress (possibly because I saw it, and probably partly because it's a tutorial boss) but they all felt so incredibly different and unique. Each one felt downright impossible walking in, bouncing off them. Yet by the time you actually win, you feel a complete master.

Likewise, the movement is fantastic. I'm wandering about trying to find some of the last little nooks and crannies or solve some of the last puzzles, and it feels totally different to how you start, but no less good.

Spoiler

The ending in general had me just hyped. Everything was just... perfect.

The lore reveals, the plot twist, the fight itself... Raven Beak's fight was also an amazing back and forth just emotionally. You FEEL like both you and him are equally matched. You shoot off his wing? You feel like a Badass. Then he tears off the other remaining wing without breaking eye contact. And oh no, he's just as badass. Things like that and power bombing some of his bigger projectiles like the black hole shot or mini-sun. Not to mention that, whilst you clearly have the same basic power set and a couple shared abilities like the flash shift or shinespark, he has some stuff you don't have (hyper beam, shield, beam burst from Samus Returns), but you have some stuff he doesn't, mainly missiles and the aforementioned power bombs. You feel evenly matched, but not identical. 

Plus they had their cake and ate it too. You and Samus get the joy of giving him the beatdown he deserves but he also gets adequately hoist by his own petard when one of the X he let out infects him.

 

Also, from what I can tell, the Chozo language actually appears to be a proper conlang, with actual structure and stuff. Little stuff like that just goes so far

 

[TeaHands]

11 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Yet by the time you actually win, you feel a complete master.

I like that they fully embrace this feeling with the absolute swagger Samus has in some of the cutscenes.

 

11 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Likewise, the movement is fantastic. I'm wandering about trying to find some of the last little nooks and crannies or solve some of the last puzzles, and it feels totally different to how you start, but no less good.

Some of those Shine Spark puzzles were BRUTAL. But spending 15 minutes to perfectly execute a 15 second puzzle was absolutely satisfying. It's also cool watching other people play and do these puzzles and fights in a completely different way than I did. There's a sense of challenge to this game, but it's not railroading you into doing something the way the game wants it. 

 

18 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

 

  Hide contents

The ending in general had me just hyped. Everything was just... perfect.

The lore reveals, the plot twist, the fight itself... Raven Beak's fight was also an amazing back and forth just emotionally. You FEEL like both you and him are equally matched. You shoot off his wing? You feel like a Badass. Then he tears off the other remaining wing without breaking eye contact. And oh no, he's just as badass. Things like that and power bombing some of his bigger projectiles like the black hole shot or mini-sun. Not to mention that, whilst you clearly have the same basic power set and a couple shared abilities like the flash shift or shinespark, he has some stuff you don't have (hyper beam, shield, beam burst from Samus Returns), but you have some stuff he doesn't, mainly missiles and the aforementioned power bombs. You feel evenly matched, but not identical. 

Plus they had their cake and ate it too. You and Samus get the joy of giving him the beatdown he deserves but he also gets adequately hoist by his own petard when one of the X he let out infects him.

 

Also, from what I can tell, the Chozo language actually appears to be a proper conlang, with actual structure and stuff. Little stuff like that just goes so far

 

Spoiler

That ending was INSANE, Samus going full berserk on Raven Beak was unexpected and cathartic. Then they top it off with you Hyper Beaming him and the X into ash in such a hype way.

It really did feel like you were both equals. Just two forces of nature throwing everything they had at each other.

That Raven Beak fight smashed any and all expectations I had for a Metroid game. It was cinematic and stylish, it was hard as hell, and unrelenting. It was a perfect finale fight that never overstayed it's welcome.

 

[Yrkul]

21 hours ago, LillyRaccune said:

 

(Chin scratching urge intensifies)

[Loza03]

29 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

I like that they fully embrace this feeling with the absolute swagger Samus has in some of the cutscenes.

Samus it's so good. Samus's body language in general is just excellent.

33 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

Some of those Shine Spark puzzles were BRUTAL. But spending 15 minutes to perfectly execute a 15 second puzzle was absolutely satisfying. It's also cool watching other people play and do these puzzles and fights in a completely different way than I did. There's a sense of challenge to this game, but it's not railroading you into doing something the way the game wants it. 

Still trying XD.

Apparently you can work Shine Sparks into certain boss fights, and there's something about the shinespark that just convinces me that it's the most disrespectful move you can pull on an opponent.

37 minutes ago, TomCruisesSon said:

  Hide contents

That ending was INSANE, Samus going full berserk on Raven Beak was unexpected and cathartic. Then they top it off with you Hyper Beaming him and the X into ash in such a hype way.

It really did feel like you were both equals. Just two forces of nature throwing everything they had at each other.

That Raven Beak fight smashed any and all expectations I had for a Metroid game. It was cinematic and stylish, it was hard as hell, and unrelenting. It was a perfect finale fight that never overstayed it's welcome.

 

Spoiler

Whoever's idea it was for the final boss to also be in a power suit, they need a promotion.

We've talked about how much swagger Samus has, but Raven Beak has just as much. And it pays off just as well as Samus's because the game establishes throughout that he's just as big of a badass - and his fight does too. It takes a lot to make a player really feel powerful, and a lot to make a boss feel powerful without being cheap too. To do BOTH... I don't understand it, but they succeeded.

 

I only have one problem, I think with the ending, and that's that I don't get how Quiet Robe 'survived'. Did he fight off the X infection, or did the X that took him just figure 'yeah my only way off the planet has the most powerful incarnation of my only natural predator that will ever be. Self preservations off the table, might as well leave off my species with honour'. Neither really jives. But it's still only a minor problem in what's overall an awesome setpiece, and frankly, being sent off by, as far as can be concerned, one of the last remaining Chozo in any respect is still a great moment in and of itself. Plus it facilitates future games because I don't really think that people would buy Metroid Suit Samus losing her powers by some random event very much, and I very much want more Metroid. I suspect my Wii U's virtual console will be getting some use.

 

[TeaHands]

57 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Samus it's so good. Samus's body language in general is just excellent.

Right? Mercury Steams appreciation and respect for Metroid absolutely shines in every aspect of Dread.

57 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

Apparently you can work Shine Sparks into certain boss fights, and there's something about the shinespark that just convinces me that it's the most disrespectful move you can pull on an opponent.

I saw the clip, it's so sick and makes perfect sense to do in the fight. And the fact they let you do it is sooooo cool.

 

Spoiler

Yeah, top to bottom Raven Beak's design, background, and fight was masterfully executed. Whoever came up with him deserves so much praise.

I've read multiple explanations and theories on why Quiet Robe was still himself and made that sacrifice. But it's been pretty common in the past few games for these things we've hunted down to show an element of humanity at the end and sacrifice themselves for better of everyone. Like the Super Metroid saving us from Mother Brain, SA-X saving us from the Omega Metroid, and then they ended it with an X parasite saving us from ourselves. It felt pretty appropriate and leaving it vague for us to fill in the blanks is probably the best way to handle it for a series known for its few words.

 

[MagPrime]

4 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

So, I havent seen any Content Drought thread in a while.

Half-tempted to make one so balance is returned to the forums.

Toss in an Excal Prime thread as well.

[xombob89]

5 hours ago, Kaotyke said:

So, I havent seen any Content Drought thread in a while.

Half-tempted to make one so balance is returned to the forums.

Its because everyone's in the Granum Void trying to get the last Tenet weapon RNG gods refuse to give. After that, its time to farm 5000 forma for them. 

[vanaukas]

So I played Metroid Dread and it's by far the worst official metroid ever made, I can't understand the praise on this, probably it's from Metroid Prime fans since this abomination S#&$s on everything that made the 2d ones a genre defining pieces in gaming. It's like they managed to #*!% it up even more after Samus Returns, which was already bad compared to AM2R which is far more better, even if it's fanmade.

Wanna play a good metroid game? Play Hyper Metroid. It's impressive how fans can design tiles even better than the ones in charge of metroid right now. What a sad day.

[TeaHands]

11 hours ago, vanaukas said:

So I played Metroid Dread and it's by far the worst official metroid ever made, I can't understand the praise on this, probably it's from Metroid Prime fans since this abomination S#&$s on everything that made the 2d ones a genre defining pieces in gaming. It's like they managed to #*!% it up even more after Samus Returns, which was already bad compared to AM2R which is far more better, even if it's fanmade.

Wanna play a good metroid game? Play Hyper Metroid. It's impressive how fans can design tiles even better than the ones in charge of metroid right now. What a sad day.

Gonna have to hard disagree with that statement, also note with I grew up on the 2D Metroid games and absolutely loved Dread. This one was definitely more akin to Fusion than Super in terms of exploration though, so I can see why someone wouldn't like that aspect of Dread. 

But what didn't you like about it?

Edited October 12, 2021 by TomCruisesSon

[Loza03]

11 hours ago, vanaukas said:

So I played Metroid Dread and it's by far the worst official metroid ever made, I can't understand the praise on this, probably it's from Metroid Prime fans since this abomination S#&$s on everything that made the 2d ones a genre defining pieces in gaming. It's like they managed to #*!% it up even more after Samus Returns, which was already bad compared to AM2R which is far more better, even if it's fanmade.

Wanna play a good metroid game? Play Hyper Metroid. It's impressive how fans can design tiles even better than the ones in charge of metroid right now. What a sad day.

I agree with @TomCruisesSon. I'm admittedly a much newer fan to Metroid specifically (I've been observing for some time, but haven't had the opportunity to play Metroid itself due to not owning consoles that had Metroid on them), but I have played several other Metroidvanias like the Ori games, Hollow Knight, and if you're willing to count it, Dust: an Elysian Tail. I can't see much that's outright wrong with Dread from that persepective. I can see why it'd be disappointing that it's a case of several disconnected maps, and I'll admit after Hallownest sported a shockingly interconnected world (with minimal loading) that was disappointing to me too. However, the practice is also hardly unusual, so it was less a 'this is an area Dread is bad' disappointment and more that it's an area where Dread failed to be amazing. Both Fusion and AM2R incorporate this style of mostly self-contained maps as well, and Dread's areas themselves are less linear than other examples like Ori or Dust, so I'd hardly complain too much in that respect. Dread, I feel, makes up a lot in game feel and excellent puzzle and boss design. I just recently finished cleaning up all the collectibles, and several puzzles, especially the speed booster ones, were tough but satisfying.

I'm planning on doing a hard mode run some time in the future so I suppose that'll test whether the bosses really stand up on repeat playthroughs, but at least from what I've currently done, they're excellent. I'd certainly accept Dread being disappointing to some, but frankly speaking, if the 'worst official metroid ever made' is this good, that just raises my expectations for the rest of the series.

 

Also, I feel that jab at Prime fans is unnecessarily rude.

[vanaukas]

1 hour ago, TomCruisesSon said:

Gonna have to hard disagree with that statement, also note with I grew up on the 2D Metroid games and absolutely loved Dread. This one was definitely more akin to Fusion than Super in terms of exploration though, so I can see why someone wouldn't like that aspect of Dread. 

But what didn't you like about it?

(I've been ranting a lot and deleting stuff for the sake of simplicity, so I'm gonna do a little list because looks like a wall of text right now)

- Fusion is the third worst of the series for me, the most linear with almost non existent secuence breaks to avoid the script, was the first that completely ruined the wall jumps and the most notorious in bad level design, like when there are zero visual cues on "what to do" so you start bombing everything if you never played it (something a lot of fans call "the fusion moment").

- Dread exacerbates those issues and also mix them with the awful additions for Samus Returns, as the "parry system" (now you can even do a shoryuken, what the hell is that), the "aiming system" (IDK if it's my gamepad but I've tried diferent dead zone values and no matter the value the mechanics goes from bad to worse, in 3ds was also bad) and the "badass cutscene system".

- Everything is too much scripted for a metroid game (it's like they also took the worst from Other M regarding cutscenes), the first time samus uses the omega energy she touch the main frame for no reason for example. The game is plagued for "look at this" for no reason and it's so badly done that they need to explain with a textbox what the hell just happened. This is the worst part IMHO, since even metroid fusion was better on visual design to narrate something, here they are unable to do it properly and they need to use text. I don't think it's "because it's aimed for everyone", since almost every single NINTENDO game it's made for everyone from all ages. 
TL;DR: Sucks on visual narrative.

- There is no point for secrets to exist right now. I think they added it to resemble old metroids, but SECRETS ARE SHOWN IN THE MAP!! (not directly, but it highlights the zones where secrets are) What's the point then? At least doesn't make your ears bleed as the radar on Samus Returns. I understand that using powerbombs on everything isn't good but this is just too much

- Visuals. Holy S#&$, everything is overexposed, too much contrast and too much bright neon lights. Looks more like Tron than any other Metroid game. It honestly looks like warframe when the overexposition issues where mroe common and everything turned white for moments. For me it looks like they tried to achieve some Cell Shading design but they backpedaled in the end but they were too commited already so they kept the light and shadows for that system anyway.
Also the #*!%ing pose when Samus saves it's this exact same one and I cannot unsee it:

Spoiler

TL;DR: Dread took the worst aspects from the worst metroid 2d games and mixed it with more bad stuff.

I'm too tired to continue but I have more things to say regarding this game. I still don't finish it so I'm not gonna talk about enemy design/level design until I see everything. I couldn't force myself to keep playing.

 

[vanaukas]

9 minutes ago, Loza03 said:

I agree with @TomCruisesSon. I'm admittedly a much newer fan to Metroid specifically (I've been observing for some time, but haven't had the opportunity to play Metroid itself due to not owning consoles that had Metroid on them), but I have played several other Metroidvanias like the Ori games, Hollow Knight, and if you're willing to count it, Dust: an Elysian Tail. I can't see much that's outright wrong with Dread from that persepective. I can see why it'd be disappointing that it's a case of several disconnected maps, and I'll admit after Hallownest sported a shockingly interconnected world (with minimal loading) that was disappointing to me too. However, the practice is also hardly unusual, so it was less a 'this is an area Dread is bad' disappointment and more that it's an area where Dread failed to be amazing. Both Fusion and AM2R incorporate this style of mostly self-contained maps as well, and Dread's areas themselves are less linear than other examples like Ori or Dust, so I'd hardly complain too much in that respect. Dread, I feel, makes up a lot in game feel and excellent puzzle and boss design. I just recently finished cleaning up all the collectibles, and several puzzles, especially the speed booster ones, were tough but satisfying.

I'm planning on doing a hard mode run some time in the future so I suppose that'll test whether the bosses really stand up on repeat playthroughs, but at least from what I've currently done, they're excellent. I'd certainly accept Dread being disappointing to some, but frankly speaking, if the 'worst official metroid ever made' is this good, that just raises my expectations for the rest of the series.

 

Also, I feel that jab at Prime fans is unnecessarily rude.

You are confusing AM2R (fan made) with Samus Returns (official game). AM2R its totally interconnected.

It's ok being new to something tho, but I need to ask, have you completed every single 2d game on 100%? I ask it because the most impressive one for puzzles (imho) it's Zero MIssion and Fusion (Fusion probably more badly done since restorts too much on "fake floors" than Zero Mission, but both have a lot of shinespark puzzles (also I forgot to mention in the previous post how the whole speed booster and shinespark were ruined before Super Metroid, because it's automatic and you can't pull quick shinespark to traverse the levels).

I play 2d Metroid games in my hacked 3DS almost 3 or 4 times a year, I know them deeply (and I still sucks on bomb jumps, despite playing it that much) and for me, Super Metroid was the master piece on metroid games. The "manual" Samus mode as I like to put it. The "jab at Prime fans" it's mostly on the approach on action they try to emulate on newer 2D games, and also on visual aspects. I hate the Metroid Prime series BTW.

[LillyRaccune]

My first exposure to Metroid (Prime?) was on the Game Cube. I hated the controls, but enjoyed the overall experience. I'm glad that some people enjoy side-scrollers, but shocked that big game companies continue to make them. I hope Metroid Dread had a good story.

I found this while I was googling:

[TeaHands]

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

- Fusion is the third worst of the series for me, the most linear with almost non existent secuence breaks to avoid the script, was the first that completely ruined the wall jumps and the most notorious in bad level design, like when there are zero visual cues on "what to do" so you start bombing everything if you never played it (something a lot of fans call "the fusion moment").

I feel like this will be where you and I diverge the most on Dread, I deeply appreciate linearity in games nowadays. I don't have the patience to get lost in games anymore. I really liked the short n sweet feel of this game. Instead of dragging it out and endlessly back tracking. I managed to 100% this game on my first run in 10-12 hours. Which felt very rewarding.

I honestly thought the level design of Dread was wonderfully done, There are points in the game where the background gives hints on where to go and what to do. Like the thermal tubes in the background that run to the nearest door so your not panicking while being chased by an EMMI. Or in the water level, there's little lights in the background that give you an idea of how to do the timing for space jumps. Certain areas have clues and teasers for enemies to let you know they may come up later. I really enjoyed how they used the 2.5D maps.

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

- Dread exacerbates those issues and also mix them with the awful additions for Samus Returns, as the "parry system" (now you can even do a shoryuken, what the hell is that), the "aiming system" (IDK if it's my gamepad but I've tried diferent dead zone values and no matter the value the mechanics goes from bad to worse, in 3ds was also bad) and the "badass cutscene system".

I thought the parry system and aiming system was exactly what Metroid needed, (even Nintendo thought so, which is why they wanted Mercury Steam to be the ones to put out the first Metroid sequel in almost 20 years.) It rewarded accuracy and quick reflexes, There was so much less face tanking for my first boss encounters compared to the older games, I instead I was encouraged and rewarded to learn the boss with dealing out some massive damage and hyped interactive cutscenes.  They felt it felt like 2016 Doom or God of War moments. I also like that for the most part, you don't need to have perfect timing for parrying. The white flash would let you know you either need to dodge, or test your skill with a parry. And if a parry was necessary for a cutscene to play out, the timing was adjusted for those with not as good reflexes. (of course this is not true for the EMMIs but those QTE are supposed to be impossible.)

 (Changing my button mapping helped with the aiming system for me, using the face buttons instead of the shoulder buttons for shoot felt too awkward.)

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

- Everything is too much scripted for a metroid game (it's like they also took the worst from Other M regarding cutscenes), the first time samus uses the omega energy she touch the main frame for no reason for example. The game is plagued for "look at this" for no reason and it's so badly done that they need to explain with a textbox what the hell just happened. This is the worst part IMHO, since even metroid fusion was better on visual design to narrate something, here they are unable to do it properly and they need to use text. I don't think it's "because it's aimed for everyone", since almost every single NINTENDO game it's made for everyone from all ages. 
TL;DR: Sucks on visual narrative.

So the I think 2 reasons why Samus touched the mainframe involves a huge, end of game spoiler, so tread carefully on why I think she did that, especially the second reason.

Spoiler

This is never said, but those main frames were definitely the same race as Mother Brain, the fight with them is a huge indicator of that. With the walls shooting pellets and laser donuts. And the Super Metroid essentially gave you the Omega Energy at the end of 3. So I imagine she assumed something would happen via touching.

Biggest spoiler for the game for the second reason: Samus' Metroid instincts are kicking in throughout the whole game, her siphoning the central units energy was just basic Metroid thinking.

The beginning definitely a bit too hand holdy in the beginning, I agree with that, but later on in the game Adam straight up tells you he knows you need to move ahead, but doesn't know what you should do to do so. You have to figure it out yourself.

Also there are points where you can break the sequence and you actually get acknowledged and rewarded for doing so, but note it is a spoiler for the second boss.

Spoiler

Look up "Metroid Dread Kraid Quick-Kill" on google, the game straight up rewards you for sequence breaking.

 

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

- There is no point for secrets to exist right now. I think they added it to resemble old metroids, but SECRETS ARE SHOWN IN THE MAP!! (not directly, but it highlights the zones where secrets are) What's the point then? At least doesn't make your ears bleed as the radar on Samus Returns. I understand that using powerbombs on everything isn't good but this is just too much

I think the intent here was putting more emphasis on reaching the secret via a puzzle, which I really enjoyed, some of them absolutely test your skills with the Speed Boost.  Also I really appreciate the secrets here aren't going to make me search every inch of this game, I don't have the patience for that. Again I can see this is a huge divergence from Super, where exploration is put aside and they chose to streamline the game.

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

- Visuals. Holy S#&$, everything is overexposed, too much contrast and too much bright neon lights. Looks more like Tron than any other Metroid game. It honestly looks like warframe when the overexposition issues where mroe common and everything turned white for moments. For me it looks like they tried to achieve some Cell Shading design but they backpedaled in the end but they were too commited already so they kept the light and shadows for that system anyway.
Also the #*!%ing pose when Samus saves it's this exact same one and I cannot unsee it:

I really enjoyed the visuals, the only time I thought the contrast was too high was in the EMMI rooms. But that was definitely on purpose, it showed that EMMIs are cold blooded, overly efficient killers that leave no trace of their prey. To the point they've completely sterilized the areas they hunt in. There is some blurriness to the game, but I think that was done to save frames. 

Sadly the picture is not loading for me, what is it? I'll google it lol

I definitely think the developers had moments of straying away from what makes Metroid the genre defining game it is. But I saw those moments as a good thing. It felt fresh and new. But I can see where you are coming from, it has deviated from your usual Metroidvania and decided to go towards a more speedy, streamlined feel.