Rework Kubrows.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

Kubrows need to be a non stop maiming machine. They should NEVER be standing still. They should be always busy looking for work. Instead sadly they often stand still and take repeated punishment by everything. It kinda pisses me off that Kubrows are this bad. 

100% of the time Kubrows need to be ripping hands, arms, legs off enemies. Causing them to stagger. And take bleed procs.  Maybe even taking the occasional head. Also even throwing those dismembered parts at other enemies. Causing them to stagger and be blinded opening them up to finishers. 

I really don't like how the Kubrow AI and animations are just poorly thought out and implemented. Have you ever seen how Kubrows jump over things/gaps? It's horrendous and embarrassing. 

Also why can I not max out my Kubrow's mods? 

I mean come on! 

(Slova and her $60 Kubrow Prime) 🤬🤦

This is embarrassing.

I want to like Kubrows, but it's vary hard. Kubrows need love, ALOT OF LOVE! 

Please make the Kubrows bad ass death dealing dismemberment machines! Because right now they kinda suck. 

Edited August 24, 2019 by (XB1)SixGunLove

[DrivaMain]

A huge buff to their stats is a good starting phase for a rework without a major AI overhaul (Venari is a good example of this). I mean 10% Crit chance and 5% status is laughable and does not have a place in the current state of the game.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

1 minute ago, DrivaMain said:

A huge buff to their stats is a good starting phase for a rework without a major AI overhaul (Venari is a good example of this). I mean 10% Crit chance and 5% status is laughable and does not have a place in the current state of the game.

Agreed, this game is a dps monster. Kubrows need to be dps/tanks. Especially the way thier lore reads. 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

I'd also like it if power/strength/speed/armor was based on Kubrow sizes. 

Smaller skinnier Kubrow's are more agile faster and stealthier. 

Bigger Kubrow's deal more dps and are tankier. 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

On 2019-07-14 at 2:00 AM, DrivaMain said:

A huge buf

But yeah a huge buff to thier stats would be a good jumping off point.

[Caine2112]

I haven't brought a Kubrow out of stasis in 3+ years, if not more.  If anything, their AI needs a boatload of overhauls and fixes to make them more useful.  I feel the only one of any good use is the stealth puppy.

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

Bump. DE needs todo something about Kubrow stupidity. 

[(PSN)BenHeisennberg]

I got a Sunika with the Lotus fur, I feel your pain.

[5H4DE]

Thing is, Kubrows are very old and their AI is extremely outdated, I agree companions should have a rabid AI that attacks everything that approaches as long as you are in combat. That AI should work a little different based on the breed tho:
- Huras will focus on sticking close to you and only go for stealth finishers on enemies that detect you so they can't raise an alarm.

- Raksa should always be by your side and take care of enemies in your immediate vicinity

- Sunika should just go batS#&$ crazy and strike everything within 30m

- Sahasa and Chesa should first go around and break containers, open lockers and collect that loot and then focus on fighting enemies.

There should be NO DOWNTIME inbetween a Kubrow's actions, always active, always looking to do something, always sprinting so they can consistently keep up with you, ignore enemies and follow you the moment you move more than 25m from them.

[DrakeWurrum]

I think companions as a whole need an overhaul, not just kubrow.

[PollexMessier]

The entire pet system needs a rework. not just kubros. (this includes kavats and moas) the AI for all of them is just pure garbage, and they have next to no survivability whatsoever. on top of their abysmal stats that have absolutely no damage avoidance system, often times just standing in poison gas, or in the path of an eidolan beam until they die. even a simple "detect damage, move untill damage isn't begin taken" command would go a long way in these things not dropping dead every 10 seconds. the way they use abilities is annoying, having more than one ability equipped should not reduce the frequency at which any of them are cast

they could also use a big cosmetic overhaul. being able to use normal color pallates instead of the extremely limited dna mask colors on pets since the current system doesn't even remotely prevent garish color combinations which is literally the only reason to limit color options like this, the ability to equip armors on moonless katat and drahk kubro skins, and a complete retexture of the moas so the materials between "non-matching" parts are cohesive

[(PSN)Onder6099]

Like in RL: I bought pet but I put it into Animal shelter because I forgot it’s living being and need effort, so I must assimilate my life to it.

[Dezeption]

I wrote a very long and detailed post about this about 7-12 months ago where I suggested very detailed changes for each and every kubrow breed to make them viable - unfortunately not many showed interest in the topic so my post is nowdays in the archive... 😞

Long story short: YES. Kubrows DEFINITELY needs some attention brought to them. I am absolutely furious over the fact that there are rumors about two new kavat breeds when all kubrows share the very bottom of the list when it comes to companion usage since Fortuna (with huras being slightly more used than the other breeds). The kavats on the other hand, ESPECIALLY the smeeta, has been almost meta since the Fetch mod came.

I'll copy/paste a reply that I made for another post about the subject:

"I am especially sad about the fact that the Chesa - that is supposed to be a loot oriented companion - is inferior to the smeeta in all terms, INCLUDING the section that is supposed to be the very core of the Chesa's identity. More kuva? Bring smeeta. More loot while just doing your thing? Bring smeeta. Damage buffs? Bring smeeta. A little bit more exp while leveling MR fodder? Bring smeeta. Want bonus fish/mining when visiting Cetus/Fortuna? Bring smeeta! Smeeta, smeeta, smeeta.

And that is not even addressing the fact that kavats got a much better mechanic than kubrows ONLY because of the simple fact that they grant their masters BUFFs. Most kubrows have long animations tied to their abilities - like the Chesa "retrieve", Sahasa "Dig" and Raksa "Howl"... If a kubrow gets stuck during a mission, then it literally won't do anything. A smeeta will still grant you buffs whenever it feels like it."

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

18 hours ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I think companions as a whole need an overhaul, not just kubrow.

 

31 minutes ago, Dezeption said:

YES. Kubrows DEFINITELY needs some attention brought to them.

Feel free to copy and paste anything from your archive threads here. These dogos need all the attention they can get. Maybe we can get some traction going. 

Edited July 17, 2019 by (XB1)RDeschain82

[Dezeption]

Sure, I can paste it here - beware the wall of text (posted 6th of April - turns out it was 3 months ago xD Certainly feels like a lot longer.)

______________________________________________________________________

Greetings, tenno and possibly (hopefully) DEs!

Sooo, yesterday when I was reading the patch notes, I noticed that the chesa got nerfed:

"Chesa's new Retrieve functionality can no longer stack with Desecrate and other looting Augments (Pilferdroid/Ore Gaze). This was creating some unintended double dips from a single corpse - the dead can only give so much!"

While I understand the reasoning behind this nerf, I feel absolutely saddened by the fact that the devs choose to nerf a kubrow breed that is considered being rather (or extremely) weak. The chesa's budget desecrate has a hilariously long CD, does not prioritize targets and fails more often than not when retrieving loot (from a SINGLE corpse), making the smeeta a superior choice when it comes to loot companions - EVEN THOUGH the smeeta also outshines the chesa in terms of damage and utility (energy reg buff, shield buff, AoE damage with swipe, crit buff etc)...

The chesa was made for hoarding and was supposed to be THE companion of any player prefering loot before defense, CC and/or utility (aka. people like me - I am kinda like a treasure goblin from D3) - but yet, the chesa is outshined by the smeeta in every aspect. Currently I am playing with a smeeta just because of the loot buffs (double pickup / free rare material delivery), but I do prefer kubrows in general cause bulky kubs ❤️ (... and I am more of a dog person than a cat person even though I really like both).

I find the smeetas overall usefulness compared to all other companions outrageous because currently, from a loot perspective:

Going for kuva? Bring a smeeta.
Going for cryotic? Bring a smeeta.
Going fishing or mining? Bring a smeeta.
Going to farm a specific material like mutagen mass? Bring a smeeta.
Want some extra rare loot while just doing your thing? Bring a smeeta.
Want some hilariously strong red crits that is not limited to where your kavat is? Bring a smeeta.
And on top of this, you'll get a great defensive mod to keep your kavat alive, plenty of utility buffs and loads of options for damage via swipe, pounce and sharpened claws.

This is just not fair - even the adraza falls behind in usefulness unless you're relying on a heavy crit weapon or you're running eidelon hunts. But, at the same time - nerfing smeeta to the point where it feels useless is not the right thing either. Smeeta is exactly what a companion should be: USEFUL. Let the smeeta be a jack of all trades - but buff the kubrows that were supposed to specialize in these different areas so that the smeeta stops outpreforming everyone. I have some ideas when it comes to what DE could do to make kubrows viable (without touching either kavat):

First of all, regarding most kubrows - their animations are very clunky and slow compared to the smeeta buff animations and puts the kubrows in a very vulnerable situation while using their abilities (ESPECIALLY sahasa, like bloody seriously - that companion has an AI thinking it is a good idea to start digging at the feet of lvl 120 heavy gunners). We also have the fact that the companion AIs are rather meh and both kavats and kubrows tend to get stuck in different places: the difference is, however, that kubrows do not use their abilities when they're stuck - but the kavats will still throw their buffs even when they're stuck.

Raksa - the concept of this companion is to be a bodyguard. They can currently fear enemies with Howl and replenish shields with Protect. While I actually do not see a lot of issues in the raksas kit, I rather feel like most frames do not require a dog body guard - especially not now when we have MOAs that got all the great shields and HP reg buffs along with superior CC. So what can we do for the raksa? As their description says "their mighty howl can paralyze enemies with fear"... A stun-like paralyze could be better than having the mobs run in the opposite direction. The raksa has longer range than the moas, but making the opponents run in the opposite direction is in many cases more annoying than useful. Let it paralyze enemies, just like the description says it will. As for Protect - why not let the raksa replenish shields for nearby allies as well (while prioritizing it's master) - and to make it an actual bodyguard, why not add a small armor buff to the mod? So that whenever the raksa rushes to it's master's or a nearby ally's aid it'll restore their shield by a set value (just like it does right now) but will also add set amount of armor for a duration. At max rank the shield restore has a 7s cooldown - so I'd suggest an armor buff for like 10 seconds (which does not stack, but just refreshes duration) considering that the raksa might be jumping a lot between allies. This would make the raksa a very valid option for high-leveled enemies, bosses and arbitrations.

Sahasa - the sahasa was made for ammo, energy and HP restore, making it easier to camp while having a slight chance of getting mods and some credits along the way. Ever since they fixed the CD of Dig, the sahasa digs rather often and is a VERY useful companion for those who struggle with energy and those who prefer to remain stationary. It also digs up life support which certainly is great for survival missions. While all of this is actually rather good - I mean the sahasa is my second most used companion overall (including sentinels) - I feel like they could bring a few buffs to the table for the sahasa since energy is rarely an issue because of both zenurik energy dash and Arcane Energize: 1) more credits, the credit amount that the sahasa digs up is actually rather hilarious (and not in a good way) - even for new players. I mean, you make way more credits with the smeeta double pickup. 2) Add a chance to dig up rare materials (appropiate for the planet) - mods are super rare and 9.5/10 times it is going to be a trash bronze mod. It should dig up rare materials about as often as the smeeta grants it's master free rare materials. And yes, the sahasa would give this material to all players - BECAUSE the sahasa is made for looting, the smeeta is supposed to be a jack of all trades. 3) Rework or replace Ferocity (the finisher for the sahasa) - it is absolutely garbage and the sahasa stuns itself more often than not using it at medium to high level missions - I don't even use it. Personally, I would prefer if we just forgot about the idea of trying to make kubrows deal damage with finishers - they simply do not scale well enough. As the sahasa is a loot-based companion, I'd rather like to see a merge between the sahasa and the chesa since I think that the description of the sahasa basically describes the chesa as well. Retrieve (aka budget desecrate) still needs a buff though (more details about that below).

Sunika - the sunika is already a heavily specialized kubrow that was made for VIP missions - buuut... For whatever reason, the sunika tends to miss the VIP rather often making it rather useless. They are actually so freaking useless that I have not even bothered maxing their mods out - I leveled it for MR and then I put it away for good. So what can we do? According to their description, the sunikas were bred for aggression and you could make use of this by using the same kind of logic that you used for the kavats...  As a pet specializing in aggression - give it offensive BUFFS instead of trying to make the kubrow itself a damage dealer (because that won't happen, they simply do not scale well enough to be decent damage dealers). The adarza already provides crit buffs for everyone, so what about a kubrow providing ability power for the team regularly? Their second ability could be something like a movement-speed and reload buff (yknow, like "CHAAARGEEE!!!") or why not something completely different like a form of bloodlust - increasing fire rate of all guns and/or some form of weaker life steal on hit (but not melee exclusive, thanks - we already have kub mods for that)?

Huras - the huras is by far the most used kubrow and is already pretty well balanced. HOWEVER, the huras is supposed to be a hunting companion - isn't this the perfect opportunity to grant it a mod for Eidelon / Fortuna hunting? Maybe the huras could be used to grant the hunter a second chance by holding the down quarry (like the sunikas VIP chasing, but yknow... More successful), if it attempts to escape? Or simply add a slight chance of the huras catching an additional prey whenever it's master successfully put a creature to sleep?

And for the star of the show, the Chesa - ... While the budget desecrate was a move in the right direction, the chesa is still among the weakest (together with the sunika) of all kubrows because of all the reasons I mentioned in the beginning (long cd, no prioritizing, single target and fails more often than not). EVEN with 100% success chance, a 10second CD would still be way too long and hence very weak compared to the double pickup of the smeeta. As I've already mentioned, I am absolutely up for a merge between the sahasa and the Chesa since their "job" is basically the same thing, but executed differently - but the Retrieve still has to be buffed. I realize that since Chesa's retrieve affects all team mates (in terms of that in brings loot for everyone, not just for the master) that they cannot make it as powerful as the smeeta buffs - but I agree with the statement that the current situation of the chesa is a joke. But instead of reducing the cooldown, causing the chesa to dig 24/7 without ever being able to even slightly keep up with the kills per second. I would suggest something like this...

Every 20th (up for adjustment, obviously) second the Chesa will attempt to recieve extra loot from all corpses within maybe... 40m? With a 30% chance of success with one roll for each corpse within the radius of 40m: That would remove the annoying single-corpse thing - you could keep the current animation, but make an expanding circle around the corpse that stretches for (if you go with my example) 40m, causing more enemies to (potentially) drop loot. The obvious issue is tuning it - if 4 players would bring 4 chesas like my example, that would be A LOT of loot and would risk making it the new meta companion - which is not my intention. But at the same time - if you tweak the numbers down too much, it'll never be worth to just have one chesa, making it useless unless it is used in organized runs. So, the solution I thought of could be a unique stacking mechanism so that bringing additional chesas only increases the chances like following:
One chesa: 20 seconds CD, 40m radius, 30% chance of success
Two chesas: 20 seconds CD, 45m radius, 35% chance of success
Three chesas: 18 seconds CD, 50m radius, 40% chance of success
Four chesas: 17 seconds CD, 50m raidus, 45% chance of success
While adding a global cooldown for the ability so that the 20-17 seconds cooldown goes for ALL chesas and that the ability usage just rotate starting with Chesa A, then Chesa B can cast retrieve after the global cooldown, then Chesa C, and lastly Chesa D - then repeat from Chesa A.

And finally, as for Chesa's Neutralize (disarm) - it is not AS useless as the sahasas finisher - but still pretty damn useless. My solution would (still) be to merge the sahasa and the chesa so that we can get both dig and retrieve ALTERNATIVELY keep the sahasa focused on resupplying energy, hp and ammo and simply remove these from the Chesa's loot table so that the Chesa can focus on resources.

HOWEVER - THERE IS ANOTHER SOLUTION FOR ALL KUBROWS: Do the same thing you did to MOAs - allow all kubrows to use any kubrow mod (but limit the race-specific mods to 2 per setup) so players can mix and match however they want. However, this is the lazy approach - because this would just mean that abilities like Neutralize and Ferocity would get left behind. But I would, either way, prefer this compared to what we have right now...


So, I realize this is a lot of text and that most people will not bother reading it all - but if you did (especially if you happen to be a Warframe Dev) I very much appreciate your time. I am obviously open for suggestions and feedback - I just want something done to balance out the usage between companions ❤️

______________________________________________________________________

[DrakeWurrum]

6 hours ago, Dezeption said:

Sure, I can paste it here - beware the wall of text (posted 6th of April - turns out it was 3 months ago xD Certainly feels like a lot longer.)

All of that definitely sounds like a good direction to improve breed variety and usefulness for kubrow, though I might personally take a different approach. I think a balance pass is something they need to do for ALL companions, and they need to find a way to give every breed and model it's own unique combat niche/role/utility. (Seriously, does ANYBODY feel the Shade actually does what it is supposed to?)

The actual ability design of the different breeds/models isn't the only problem, though - there's also their AI, and the immense clutter of mods. You have to mod for survivability, and damage, and utility - all at once! It's nearly impossible to come up with a focused build using any of the new mods they've come up with as a result, (Synth, Hunter, Mecha, Tek, the damage/status dual mods, etc.) Warframes don't have the same problem because the abilities are no longer mods, and we separately mod weapons for damage. Sentinels and MOAs are partially easier to use because they have weapons, but the beasts do not.

I'll include some tidbits from my old post, tweaked a little bit...
You might notice that the most common benefit from what I propose is reduced mod clutter for companions, particularly Beasts, because there are just too many mods that are "required"

COMPANION AI:
Companion AI is absolutely horrible. Part of the problem is we have absolutely NO way to control them or direct them.
The best way to solve this, I think, is to draw inspiration from how games like Dragon Age: Origins or Final Fantasy XII handle "companion" AI where the system doesn't give you direct control of your whole party... but you can set how they behave in certain situations through a "tactics" screen where you set what decides their behavior in a priority list. We could have a console near where robotic companions stand in the Orbiter that gives us a way to "program" or "train" precepts for our companions, directing their behavior based on different conditions.
The conditions could be, say, number of enemies with in a certain range, or enemies attacking their master, or allies getting low health, or a number of enemies grouped in one spot, or the companion loses it's shields, etc. Then you could choose what it does - attacks, uses an ability, activates a specific precept, runs behind cover for safety, etc. Maybe companions could even be trained to activate gear items for us in certain conditions. This would solve most complaints about companion behavior, since we could then decide what that behavior is for our own playstyles. It doesn't need to be as robust, of course, because companions only have so many possible actions.
This change would also finally make mods like Thumper and Striker obsolete, since you could then manually set their attack range, and the appropriate behavior for it.
 

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Companion abilities as precepts:
Companion abilities need to be built-in to the companion, just as warframe abilities are built-in to the warframes (and the abilities are gained/leveled up from leveling them). This doesn't change too much beyond freeing up mod slots, but it's weird that companions still use the old model of adding abilities with mods, and frankly, it feels lame that we have to assign mod slots to what abilities the companions are capable of.
If the abilities are interchangeable, like with Guardian, Sanctuary, Shield Charger, or Sacrifice - I can understand keeping them as modded precepts. Alternatively, these abilities could be specifically linked to the companion type: Kubrow, Kavat, Sentinel, MOA.
But abilities like Ammo Case and Fatal Attraction and Trample should absolutely be part of the companion itself, tied to the breed/model, same as with warframe abilities.
All companion breeds/types should get two built-in abilities that they can actively use to give each type a unique purpose.

To make this work for moas, we just simply select which two abilities our moa has when we build it, or else they're strictly tied to the head piece.

Beast damage:
Kubrow and kavats should gain the ability to equip different kinds of "attacks" in the way that we can currently equip different robotic weapons onto sentinels and moas. So we should be able to equip "Claw" or "Bite" or "Tackle" or whatever else we can come up with to count as melee weapons for our beast companions. This way, rather than completely relying on Maul for their damage, we can mod their "melee weapons" for our own build variety. This would make the beast companions much more desirable.
I understand this may be more difficult to implement than simply adding different guns, since the animation for the pet's attacks would need to be done for each attack we could equip - but I think the payoff would be huge.

Beast maintenance:
We really should do away with the need to constantly stabilize and interact with our beast companions, as well as the entire system we have for stasis. When we can immediately switch around which moa or sentinel we use, it seems absurd that we have to wait when switching to different kubrow or kavat. There are a lot of players who don't bother with beast companions just because that's annoying.
As well, the upkeep on beast companions is absolutely worthless and doesn't add anything to the game. I know it's not hard or even expensive. It just doesn't add any level of fun to the game whatsoever. It both takes and adds nothing. It's a neat gimmick for flavor that makes it more lore-friendly, but that's it. I like being able to pet/play with our beast companions, but it shouldn't be some required chore to make sure they have maximum damage.

Fetch:
Just get rid of Vacuum and Fetch. At this point, it's just an automatic required mod. Sure, some players are willing to go without, and can act all elitist about not NEEDING it, but why even bother having this as an option in a game like Warframe where gathering loot, ammo, and health/energy is so essential? Just build that vacuum effect directly into warframes, no companion needed. 

Edited July 18, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[(PSN)Valaois]

I took a 2 year break from Warframe and it's been a few weeks since I've returned and I quickly realized how popular Kavats are compared to Kubrows. Besides the charger pup, I honestly haven't seen a single Kubrow. All I've seen are either Kavats or Sentinels. I'm sure DE isn't blind to this so I'm hoping they catch on to Kubrows being in need of some lovin. It'd also be nice if they worked on animations a bit for both Kubrows and Kavats. It looks really wonky when you see how they launch across spaces and slide through walls to catch up with their masters.

[Dezeption]

11 hours ago, DrakeWurrum said:

All of that definitely sounds like a good direction to improve breed variety and usefulness for kubrow, though I might personally take a different approach. I think a balance pass is something they need to do for ALL companions, and they need to find a way to give every breed and model it's own unique combat niche/role/utility. (Seriously, does ANYBODY feel the Shade actually does what it is supposed to?)

The actual ability design of the different breeds/models isn't the only problem, though - there's also their AI, and the immense clutter of mods. You have to mod for survivability, and damage, and utility - all at once! It's nearly impossible to come up with a focused build using any of the new mods they've come up with as a result, (Synth, Hunter, Mecha, Tek, the damage/status dual mods, etc.) Warframes don't have the same problem because the abilities are no longer mods, and we separately mod weapons for damage. Sentinels and MOAs are partially easier to use because they have weapons, but the beasts do not.

I'll include some tidbits from my old post, tweaked a little bit...
You might notice that the most common benefit from what I propose is reduced mod clutter for companions, particularly Beasts, because there are just too many mods that are "required"

Very well written post! I most definitely agree! Especially about freeing up more mod slots by making their abilities... Abilities? instead of mods. Same with Fetch. I also VERY much approve of having a way of getting beast companions to equip some kind of weapon or stance to separate utility and tank mods from offensive mods...

I mean, at least two (maybe more, depending on your frame) defensive mod slots is required. In general, both of the ability mods wanna be used as well. And of course, Fetch... Then Some people, like myself, really want Animal Instinct ontop of this. Finally, you have Maul and Bite that's pretty much mandatory if you want any form of damage. Counting all of these slots, we got 8 out of 10 filled. That is 2 slots to use stuff like Scavange, extra defensive mods, Hunter Recovery, Mecha / Tek mods, Pack Leader, Hunter mods, Shelter and the elemental damage / status mods. And let's not even start with the kavat damage mods (Pounce, Swipe and Sharpened Claws)... It is just not enough. I remember when the new elemental mods for beasts came and I was just sitting here like "Yeah, that's great and all... But there is no way in Cetus that I can spare two mod slots for my companions - one, maybe, depending on the companion. But two? No way."

[DrakeWurrum]

4 hours ago, Dezeption said:

Very well written post! I most definitely agree! Especially about freeing up more mod slots by making their abilities... Abilities? instead of mods. Same with Fetch. I also VERY much approve of having a way of getting beast companions to equip some kind of weapon or stance to separate utility and tank mods from offensive mods...

I mean, at least two (maybe more, depending on your frame) defensive mod slots is required. In general, both of the ability mods wanna be used as well. And of course, Fetch... Then Some people, like myself, really want Animal Instinct ontop of this. Finally, you have Maul and Bite that's pretty much mandatory if you want any form of damage. Counting all of these slots, we got 8 out of 10 filled. That is 2 slots to use stuff like Scavange, extra defensive mods, Hunter Recovery, Mecha / Tek mods, Pack Leader, Hunter mods, Shelter and the elemental damage / status mods. And let's not even start with the kavat damage mods (Pounce, Swipe and Sharpened Claws)... It is just not enough. I remember when the new elemental mods for beasts came and I was just sitting here like "Yeah, that's great and all... But there is no way in Cetus that I can spare two mod slots for my companions - one, maybe, depending on the companion. But two? No way."

I recently was trying to play with a kubrow build to see if I could use a decent status build using the Kubrow-only Mecha set mods... and I just can't see a way to do it not without gimping it in other ways. I put on Fetch, Link Health, Medi-Pet Kit, Maul, Bite, it's 2 ability mods, Animal Instinct...
Then "Oh... I can only fit 2 more mods."

I was hoping to include Flame Gland and Shock Collar in addition to the Mecha mods, but then I'd have to give up some other mods. I suppose I could give up Bite for a status-chance build, but... it's at that point that I realize "I don't have to freaking do this for my warframes."

Kavats are even harder to build for, since you also have to consider whether or not to include Swipe, Pounce, and other mods. It's at this point that I stopped caring about hunting down the final elemental beast mod - I haven't found the Toxin one yet, and I frankly can't care about until they overhaul companions.

What's worse is I have to Forma practically every freaking slot to be able to make a decent build, because every mod is just so high cost!

Edited July 18, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[(PSN)Onder6099]

1 hour ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I recently was trying to play with a kubrow build to see if I could use a decent status build using the Kubrow-only Mecha set mods... and I just can't see a way to do it not without gimping it in other ways. I put on Fetch, Link Health, Medi-Pet Kit, Maul, Bite, it's 2 ability mods, Animal Instinct...
Then "Oh... I can only fit 2 more mods."

I was hoping to include Flame Gland and Shock Collar in addition to the Mecha mods, but then I'd have to give up some other mods. I suppose I could give up Bite for a status-chance build, but... it's at that point that I realize "I don't have to freaking do this for my warframes."

Kavats are even harder to build for, since you also have to consider whether or not to include Swipe, Pounce, and other mods. It's at this point that I stopped caring about hunting down the final elemental beast mod - I haven't found the Toxin one yet, and I frankly can't care about until they overhaul companions.

What's worse is I have to Forma practically every freaking slot to be able to make a decent build, because every mod is just so high cost!

You can’t expect from Kubrow to become “All in one”, it’s not a Solo unit it’s a part of Complex built from your WF, Arsenal and Kubrow himself. If you’re not willing to sacrifice few Slots on WF and Arsenal ( preferably Primaries), Formas and maybe slightly exchange your play style don’t expect miracles. I’m afraid that your ideas about implementing Precepts and few other things directly on Kubrow will not help, it will probably make things even worse like conversion from WF Ability Mods to WF Abilities. Tbh, there is no place for Fetch, Animal Instinct and Medi-pet Kit.

[DrakeWurrum]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

You can’t expect from Kubrow to become “All in one”, it’s not a Solo unit it’s a part of Complex built from your WF, Arsenal and Kubrow himself. If you’re not willing to sacrifice few Slots on WF and Arsenal ( preferably Primaries), Formas and maybe slightly exchange your play style don’t expect miracles. I’m afraid that your ideas about implementing Precepts and few other things directly on Kubrow will not help, it will probably make things even worse like conversion from WF Ability Mods to WF Abilities. Tbh, there is no place for Fetch, Animal Instinct and Medi-pet Kit.

I'm not expecting it to be all in one.

But it's damn near impossible to make a decent build at all without sacrificing some essential function. Like the ability to not die.

I'm not trying to stick the Mecha, Tek, and Hunter sets ALL in one build. I'm not even including Shelter, or Pack Leader, or Scavenge. I'd love to use Link Armor, but chose not to fit it for other mods, and I'm obviously not using Link Shields (really only worth it on Hildryn, imo). I'm only slotting in 2 of the elemental mods, because all 4 just sacrifices too much.

I'm still salty that Fetch and Vacuum are mods at this point. First they realized Vacuum made it so most people used Carrier. So they made it so all Sentinels used it. Then they belatedly realized that Beasts were nowhere near as popular as Sentinels because of Vacuum and put out Fetch.

It's about time they take the next step and realize that it should just be a baseline feature of companions, if not warframes.

Edited July 18, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[(PSN)Onder6099]

-Snip-

Edited July 18, 2019 by (PS4)Onder6099

[(PSN)Onder6099]

1 hour ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I'm not expecting it to be all in one.

But it's damn near impossible to make a decent build at all without sacrificing some essential function. Like the ability to not die.

I'm not trying to stick the Mecha, Tek, and Hunter sets ALL in one build. I'm not even including Shelter, or Pack Leader, or Scavenge. I'd love to use Link Armor, but chose not to fit it for other mods, and I'm obviously not using Link Shields (really only worth it on Hildryn, imo). I'm only slotting in 2 of the elemental mods, because all 4 just sacrifices too much.

I'm still salty that Fetch and Vacuum are mods at this point. First they realized Vacuum made it so most people used Carrier. So they made it so all Sentinels used it. Then they belatedly realized that Beasts were nowhere near as popular as Sentinels because of Vacuum and put out Fetch.

It's about time they take the next step and realize that it should just be a baseline feature of companions, if not warframes.

 

30 minutes ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

Loot Collector with both radars, Healer and Tank dealing DPS as high as possible with 2 Precepts, isn’t little bit too much for 1 Kubrow? Vacuum as baseline feature, i’m completely against, lots of players want to have control over pick ups, few reasons: Health and Energy Conversion, Equilibrium, Unairu Wisps, last Refinement for Relics.

Pack Leader and Link Health with Vitality on WF is must for me. Mecha set is amazing but if full and here is the Sacrifice I wrote about, I made a Vid but nobody cares, in bulk: You must use WF or weapon with AoE, Primary should have 100% SC without Multishot.

Edit: Yes Hildryn or Harrrow with Raksa is nice synergy. You can also use Link Shield with Mag or Trin with EV Augment.

Edited July 18, 2019 by (PS4)Onder6099

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

3rd armor set for Kubrows just released, and they still don't fit. Lol 

[(XBOX)YoungGunn82]

On 2019-07-18 at 1:22 PM, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

Pack Leader and Link Health with Vitality 

I hate that these to mods are a bit of a crutch for all builds, a bit mandatory. 

Edited July 21, 2019 by (XB1)RDeschain82