Regarding Space Mom

[RubbleRain]

Just an idea, but I'm hoping that after we save/retrieve/defeat Natah in the New War quest we sort of prove our independence, "grow up" if you will. Basically just show that we can fight for our own beliefs. What this will mean, ideally, is that we don't need lotus as our mission voice-over, instead being able to choose who vocalizes the objectives. Voices could include Lotus, Teshin, Ordis, a faction leader (offering unlock?), or our own tenno. Thoughts?

Edit: it would also be cool to have your clan's warlord tenno voice mission status. Or possibly random tenno from within your squad. Really anything to show off operator fashion 🙂

Edited July 18, 2019 by RubbleRain

[DrakeWurrum]

3 minutes ago, RubbleRain said:

Just an idea, but I'm hoping that after we save/retrieve/defeat Natah in the New War quest we sort of prove our independence, "grow up" if you will. Basically just show that we can fight for our own beliefs. What this will mean, ideally, is that we don't need lotus as our mission voice-over, instead being able to choose who vocalizes the objectives. Voices could include Lotus, Teshin, Ordis, a faction leader (offering unlock?), or our own tenno. Thoughts?

I suspect we will have to choose what to do with her.

But it will work out like it did with Ballas and the Queens. Whichever choice we make won't affect the actual plot.

But, yes, I have been asking for us to customize our "mission support" for over a year now!

I even made a list. The idea for some of this is that Ordis would "simulate" them with a hologram, like he currently does for Lotus (namely the bosses).

List of characters I'd like to see for this mission support role

• Kressa Tal of the Steel Meridian
• Ergo Glast of the Perrin Sequence
• Palladino of the Red Veil
• Amaryn of the New Loka
• (Currently unidentified leader) of the Arbiters of Hexis
• Cephalon Suda of... Cephalon Suda...
• Cephalon Simaris of the Sanctuary
• Cephalon Sark (from the Index! Platinum purchase most likely)
• Cephalon Apnar (from the Conclave)
• Cephalon Vull (from the Conclave)
• Darvo (platinum purchase)
• Maroo (platinum purchase)
• Clem! (platinum purchase)
• Konzu (Ostron standing)
• Saya (Ostron standing)
• Quill Onkko (Quill standing)
• Baro Ki'Teer (ducats)
  
  More fun options that could happen - as boss drops?
• Vay Hek
• Tyl Regor
• Alad V
• Mutalist Alad V
• Frohd Bek
• Captain Vor
• Corrupted Vor
• Sargas Ruk
• Kela de Theym
• Nef Anyo
• Cephalon Jordas

Edited July 18, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[Sean]

I do hope we at least get the option to finish off the Lotus. Personally I think that character has ran its course and only really holds things back.

But... I don't think we'll get that.

After Tennocon and also thinking about it some more, it would be easier (for DE) to just have the sentient part of Lotus be "killed", which then would leave Margulis as the replacement. This would allow DE to not have to re-record any dialogue as they can continue using all of Rebecca's previous lines, then just with a handful to say "Margulis" isn't of "Lotus", though even then, they can probably just keep calling the character "Lotus". Then there's also how having the mission-voice-over be a different character potentially throwing a lot of things off since now players aren't being told information by the same character.

Edited July 18, 2019 by Sean

[RubbleRain]

5 minutes ago, DrakeWurrum said:

 

 

• Kressa Tal of the Steel Meridian
• Ergo Glast of the Perrin Sequence
• Palladino of the Red Veil
• Amaryn of the New Loka
• (Currently unidentified leader) of the Arbiters of Hexis
• Cephalon Suda of... Cephalon Suda...
• Cephalon Simaris of the Sanctuary
• Cephalon Sark (from the Index! Platinum purchase most likely)
• Cephalon Apnar (from the Conclave)
• Cephalon Vull (from the Conclave)
• Darvo (platinum purchase)
• Maroo (platinum purchase)
• Clem! (platinum purchase)
• Konzu (Ostron standing)
• Saya (Ostron standing)
• Quill Onkko (Quill standing)
• Baro Ki'Teer (ducats)
  
  More fun options that could happen - as boss drops?
• Vay Hek
• Tyl Regor
• Alad V
• Mutalist Alad V
• Frohd Bek
• Captain Vor
• Corrupted Vor
• Sargas Ruk
• Kela de Theym
• Nef Anyo
• Cephalon Jordas

Holy crap never thought about Clem that's an amazing idea. For the bosses I'm reminded of betternamepending's video, if you've seen it. I forgot that Darvo also already has mission status voice lines as well.

[DrakeWurrum]

1 minute ago, Sean said:

I do hope we at least get the option to finish off the Lotus. Personally I think that character has ran its course and only really holds things back.

But... I don't think we'll get that.

After Tennocon and also thinking about it some more, it would be easier (for DE) to just have the sentient part of Lotus be "killed", which then would leave Margulis as the replacement. This would allow DE to not have to re-record any dialogue as they can continue using all of Rebecca's previous lines, then just with a handful to say "Margulis" isn't of "Lotus", though even then, they can probably just keep calling the character "Lotus".

I think it may depend on what part the Lotus helmet plays in her identity. She didn't start being Natah until it was removed.

[Sean]

Just now, DrakeWurrum said:

I think it may depend on what part the Lotus helmet plays in her identity. She didn't start being Natah until it was removed.

That part of identity isn't really the point though. It's just that we will kill the "bad" part, leave the "good", and then we go back to the status quo.

Looking at Warframe as a game with a heavy multiplayer side (and not just like a book where the story can go literally any direction), it will always come down to the feasibility, ease, and cost when implementing such a wide-spread change. Thing like PoE, Fortuna, and Railjack don't have the multi-year long background, so they can easily slide into the game and fit without disrupting other parts of the game. The Lotus as a character goes back to Day 1 of Warframe after all, the game has changed a lot, but the Lotus is the one constant, and is practically cemented in countless areas of the game.

[TARINunit9]

13 minutes ago, RubbleRain said:

What this will mean, ideally, is that we don't need lotus as our mission voice-over, instead being able to choose who vocalizes the objectives. Voices could include Lotus, Teshin, Ordis, a faction leader (offering unlock?), or our own tenno. Thoughts?

12 minutes ago, DrakeWurrum said:

 

But, yes, I have been asking for us to customize our "mission support" for over a year now!

 

Unless DE is willing to make a full-on Warframe 2.0 and tear down and rebuild everything that actually needs it (touch up the models and animations, new textures, redo most of the tilesets, rebalance the mods and weapons, rebalance the preparation-vs-skill dynamic, new tutorials -- especially regarding how mandatory upgrading mods is -- etc. etc.) DE has neither the need nor the motivation to create Mission Control 2.0

 

[DrakeWurrum]

Just now, TARINunit9 said:

Unless DE is willing to make a full-on Warframe 2.0 and tear down and rebuild everything that actually needs it (touch up the models and animations, new textures, redo most of the tilesets, rebalance the mods and weapons, rebalance the preparation-vs-skill dynamic, new tutorials -- especially regarding how mandatory upgrading mods is -- etc. etc.) DE has neither the need nor the motivation to create Mission Control 2.0

 

Oh, they have plenty motivation and need: revenue stream

[TARINunit9]

1 minute ago, DrakeWurrum said:

Oh, they have plenty motivation and need: revenue stream

Not really. Their money comes from Prime Access and plat coupons. It's part of the reason we don't get Tutorials 2.0 in the first place

[DrakeWurrum]

3 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

Not really. Their money comes from Prime Access and plat coupons. It's part of the reason we don't get Tutorials 2.0 in the first place

Diversifying revenue streams is how companies maintain good profit, especially when it's a product that customers want.

If you give players more things to spend Plat on, they will need more Plat to spend, and thus buy more.

Yes, you can trade for it from other players... but all that Plat comes from somewhere, and if you shove it into the market to new customization fun, it disappears from the player market.

[TARINunit9]

Just now, DrakeWurrum said:

Diversifying revenue streams is how companies maintain good profit, especially when it's a product that customers want.

If you give players more things to spend Plat on, they will need more Plat to spend, and thus buy more.

Yes, you can trade for it from other players... but all that Plat comes from somewhere, and if you shove it into the market to new customization fun, it disappears from the player market.

Those all fall under "plat coupons"

Things to buy that aren't Prime Access all fall under one big umbrella: buying convenience. This is the ethical way to run a free-to-play game: letting everyone grind their way to the top of the power curve for free, but having inherent limitations that are annoying (but not debilitating). You sell conveniences so that the player still feels good about the game but isn't buying outright power. This is stuff like weapon and warframe slots, warframes themselves, etc.

DE doesn't need to rebuild the game to keep selling these, because we're all still here spending money on plat without it

[SkornedBeef]

29 minutes ago, RubbleRain said:

Just an idea, but I'm hoping that after we save/retrieve/defeat Natah in the New War quest we sort of prove our independence, "grow up" if you will. Basically just show that we can fight for our own beliefs. What this will mean, ideally, is that we don't need lotus as our mission voice-over, instead being able to choose who vocalizes the objectives. Voices could include Lotus, Teshin, Ordis, a faction leader (offering unlock?), or our own tenno. Thoughts?

Yea or we ditch the old and find someone new. but i want them to make it an option that we could make Lotus into a warframe ourselves.

[DrakeWurrum]

35 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

DE doesn't need to rebuild the game to keep selling these, because we're all still here spending money on plat without it

DE doesn't need to rebuild the game to offer customized mission supports. We've had Ordis and Darvo backseat before. We've had Teshin do it. Soon we will have Cephalon Cy.

They don't need to build any special code to make it happen, when they clearly now how to swap others in already.

35 minutes ago, TARINunit9 said:

Those all fall under "plat coupons"

Things to buy that aren't Prime Access all fall under one big umbrella: buying convenience. This is the ethical way to run a free-to-play game: letting everyone grind their way to the top of the power curve for free, but having inherent limitations that are annoying (but not debilitating). You sell conveniences so that the player still feels good about the game but isn't buying outright power. This is stuff like weapon and warframe slots, warframes themselves, etc.

And cosmetics.

And it doesn't matter if there's coupons. People will still need to spend more money on getting plat, thus more income for DE.

Edited July 18, 2019 by DrakeWurrum

[TARINunit9]

24 minutes ago, DrakeWurrum said:

DE doesn't need to rebuild the game to offer customized mission supports. We've had Ordis and Darvo backseat before. We've had Teshin do it. Soon we will have Cephalon Cy.

I should have led with my thesis: Warframe is a design by landfill game. And DE is not willing to go digging if they don't have to

DE is certainly willing to add new mission control voice actors, but ONLY for entirely new content. This is why Jupiter 2.0 uses old Lotus voice lines for everything except Sabotage and Disruption. But are DE willing to go back and add Ordis voiceovers to, say, Earth missions? Venus? Europa? Of course not. Those are buried way deep belowground in the landfill. They aint gunna dig down there, just leave the old Lotus lines there. They work fine. New voice lines are only for new content

This is why Raids kept failing until DE was forced to just disable them. Oh they had a playerbase, but that alone wasn't success. They were constantly bugged and unbalanced because they were only designed for the layers they were inside of or on top of. Layers above them, they couldn't work with. So they bugged out and broke, and DE decide nixing them was better than fixing them. Because fixing requires digging. DE doesn't dig, they only build

And why would DE go digging? We're still buying Prime Access, we're still using our Plat coupons. We are still giving them money to not dig. So they won't dig

[(XBOX)Salty Ginger]

I will only accept Clem as my lotus replacement. 😬

[TheGodofWiFi]

I personally hope we kill Natah/Lotus. It feels like the only natural way for her character by this point. I also do want the opportunity to have a new mission announcer/advisor after a good six years.

[Veridian]

Too much work, maybe add an alternative down the line, but a long list is too much for too little.

That said, there's already a clear pattern of how things are being approached by DE, no new content has the Lotus narrating it, so eventually she'll remain a star chart hologram.

Edited July 18, 2019 by Ver1dian

[Scissorsmith]

4 hours ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I suspect we will have to choose what to do with her.

But it will work out like it did with Ballas and the Queens. Whichever choice we make won't affect the actual plot.

But, yes, I have been asking for us to customize our "mission support" for over a year now!

I even made a list. The idea for some of this is that Ordis would "simulate" them with a hologram, like he currently does for Lotus (namely the bosses).

List of characters I'd like to see for this mission support role

• Kressa Tal of the Steel Meridian
• Ergo Glast of the Perrin Sequence
• Palladino of the Red Veil
• Amaryn of the New Loka
• (Currently unidentified leader) of the Arbiters of Hexis
• Cephalon Suda of... Cephalon Suda...
• Cephalon Simaris of the Sanctuary
• Cephalon Sark (from the Index! Platinum purchase most likely)
• Cephalon Apnar (from the Conclave)
• Cephalon Vull (from the Conclave)
• Darvo (platinum purchase)
• Maroo (platinum purchase)
• Clem! (platinum purchase)
• Konzu (Ostron standing)
• Saya (Ostron standing)
• Quill Onkko (Quill standing)
• Baro Ki'Teer (ducats)
  
  More fun options that could happen - as boss drops?
• Vay Hek
• Tyl Regor
• Alad V
• Mutalist Alad V
• Frohd Bek
• Captain Vor
• Corrupted Vor
• Sargas Ruk
• Kela de Theym
• Nef Anyo
• Cephalon Jordas

One other thing - we've seen in the duviri paradox that the tenno grows up. So maybe the tenno becomes the announcer himself? Going like "My life support is getting low", "more life support has arrived" "okay, lets find that capture target" "I will need to break into the enemy data vaults" "Oops, triggered the alarms" and etc.

Because I don't imagine the lotus situation will resolve itself until about the time either new war or duviri paradox resolves itself.

Edited July 18, 2019 by Scissorsmith

[lighthoof]

At this point I view Lotus not as a person (that is Natah), but as a status or a rank among tenno. And the helmet is a symbol of that rank, so I have no issue with replacing Natah with any other mission ops. Would gladly finish Natah if we get that opportunity tbh.

[FlusteredFerret]

4 hours ago, RubbleRain said:

Just an idea, but I'm hoping that after we save/retrieve/defeat Natah in the New War quest we sort of prove our independence, "grow up" if you will. Basically just show that we can fight for our own beliefs. What this will mean, ideally, is that we don't need lotus as our mission voice-over, instead being able to choose who vocalizes the objectives. Voices could include Lotus, Teshin, Ordis, a faction leader (offering unlock?), or our own tenno. Thoughts?

Edit: it would also be cool to have your clan's warlord tenno voice mission status. Or possibly random tenno from within your squad. Really anything to show off operator fashion 🙂

Well, for starters, regardless of how the New War pans out, we're never going to be "independent".

We are, at the end of the day, just footsoldiers, carrying out the orders of our superiors. There will always be someone telling us what to do...or at least giving us choices to make (would be nice to have some mission branches, where we can decide one way or another).

 

What you're basically saying is that you just don't like Lotus and would rather have someone else doing the mission dialogue.

 

Thing is, it would have to make sense, lore-wise. Lotus has done it so far, because she is the one who rescued us, woke us and guided us to this point in the game.

If it turns out Lotus dies in the New War, then its quite possible Teshin, or someone else...possibly even Ballas, if he continues his "face turn", will be our new guide / mentor / leader. Only see Ordis doing it if he is somehow transferred into a human body and has his memories restored...basically goes back to being Ordan Karris.

I would like to see our Operators having more dialogue, but we are always going to be taking orders from someone.

 

Edited July 18, 2019 by FlusteredFerret

[(XBOX)Predator Lupus1]

4 hours ago, DrakeWurrum said:

I suspect we will have to choose what to do with her.

But it will work out like it did with Ballas and the Queens. Whichever choice we make won't affect the actual plot.

But, yes, I have been asking for us to customize our "mission support" for over a year now!

I even made a list. The idea for some of this is that Ordis would "simulate" them with a hologram, like he currently does for Lotus (namely the bosses).

List of characters I'd like to see for this mission support role

• Kressa Tal of the Steel Meridian
• Ergo Glast of the Perrin Sequence
• Palladino of the Red Veil
• Amaryn of the New Loka
• (Currently unidentified leader) of the Arbiters of Hexis
• Cephalon Suda of... Cephalon Suda...
• Cephalon Simaris of the Sanctuary
• Cephalon Sark (from the Index! Platinum purchase most likely)
• Cephalon Apnar (from the Conclave)
• Cephalon Vull (from the Conclave)
• Darvo (platinum purchase)
• Maroo (platinum purchase)
• Clem! (platinum purchase)
• Konzu (Ostron standing)
• Saya (Ostron standing)
• Quill Onkko (Quill standing)
• Baro Ki'Teer (ducats)
  
  More fun options that could happen - as boss drops?
• Vay Hek
• Tyl Regor
• Alad V
• Mutalist Alad V
• Frohd Bek
• Captain Vor
• Corrupted Vor
• Sargas Ruk
• Kela de Theym
• Nef Anyo
• Cephalon Jordas

I can hear hek's voice already

"Tenno brothers, these rats want (insert mission objective here) and destroy it. Kill them at ONCE!"

[(XBOX)Almighty Deity]

You'll likely get a choice. Betting this one's a bit more lasting as DE has stated that your decisions will make a difference, although I'd like a way to replay and choose which outcome I like rather than a singular choice. As long as we get real space mom back and not holoLotus I'll be happy.

[(XBOX)Almighty Deity]

42 minutes ago, (XB1)Predator Lupus1 said:

I can hear hek's voice already

"Tenno brothers, these rats want (insert mission objective here) and destroy it. Kill them at ONCE!"

DE joked about doing that for April fool's but as sad as it sounds it was actually a genuinely good idea to me. No Kawaii lotus, give me hek!

[RubbleRain]

1 hour ago, FlusteredFerret said:

Well, for starters, regardless of how the New War pans out, we're never going to be "independent".

We are, at the end of the day, just footsoldiers, carrying out the orders of our superiors. There will always be someone telling us what to do...or at least giving us choices to make (would be nice to have some mission branches, where we can decide one way or another).

I would like to see our Operators having more dialogue, but we are always going to be taking orders from someone.

 

I disagree with this. Every major quest has contained elements of us "freeing" ourselves from control. Freedom from Vor, from the dream, from transference limitations, from the Queen's, from orokin limitations, and finally from our own dependence on Lotus. Considering even Teshin got his "freedom arc", I find it highly likely that the Lotus will also free herself, making the choice between Margulis, Natah, and the Lotus.

Yes we don't design and plan our own missions, but we do make the choice of going on them.

The final ball and chain we have to face is most likely the man in the wall.

[ant99999]

One thing that confuses me in every New War discussion is how some people consider imprisoning Natah in her helmet once again, torturing, distorting and enslaving her identity so she becomes the Lotus again... ahem... 'saving'.

Like you would 'save' a person from the dangers of the world by severing all his limbs so he would't get into trouble.

If I had such a choice I would go for killing out of pure mercy.

On the practical side though, doing the voice acting for all these character would require an immence amount of effort and time to the point it isn't worth it.

Either we are getting Ordis to replace the Lotus hologram or some basic choice between 2-3 characters with other added gradually.