How about shields not attached to one weapon.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

Like sigma and ocantis. What I'm wondering about here is what if the sword was a separate weapon. The blueprint would build both, only as separate entities. Abd then, similarly to glaives, the ability to use any one-handed weapon with a shield. It's worth noting that this wouldn't require a ton of work to do since you basically just need to unfold the shield and the animations and stuff already exist. Seems simple enough. So: spearguns, one handed melee, and one handed secondaries. Probably not too OP, but even then then it would just make lesser used as well as generally squishy frames more usable, so I don't see any reason not to do this.  It would be too much to allow normal primaries unless it debuffed mobility like how the grineer with riot shields work. But I'll admit, ember being useable against ranged enemies in long runs is tempting.

Also a riot shield would be cool, also a weapon with a functional blast shield would be cool.

 

[peterc3]

6 hours ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

It's worth noting that this wouldn't require a ton of work

It's worth noting you have literally no way to know this.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

4 hours ago, peterc3 said:

It's worth noting you have literally no way to know this.

It's worth noting that I do 🙂

[Alvengerz]

15 hours ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

It's worth noting that this wouldn't require a ton of work

Something so simple from the outside doesn't always mean it's also simple on the inside.

15 hours ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

So: spearguns, one handed melee, and one handed secondaries

I wouldn't say that it wouldn't require a lot of work. They never tell/show us how they develop their game technically. So please never underestimate their work.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

9 hours ago, Alvengerz said:

Something so simple from the outside doesn't always mean it's also simple on the inside.

Since you guys are so fixated on that, I'll say "relatively easy". 

[-AoN-CanoLathra-]

12 minutes ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

Since you guys are so fixated on that, I'll say "relatively easy". 

I don't think you understand just how twisted up the game's internal code is. Just getting glaives + 1-handed pistols working was a major endeavor that had a lot of bugs on release, and they technically had some old code to adapt for that. They still haven't managed to bring that functionality to other 1-handed melee weapons, which is what they mentioned wanting to do when they devstreamed the glaive+pistol system.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

6 hours ago, -AoN-CanoLathra- said:

I don't think you understand just how twisted up the game's internal code is. Just getting glaives + 1-handed pistols working was a major endeavor that had a lot of bugs on release, and they technically had some old code to adapt for that. They still haven't managed to bring that functionality to other 1-handed melee weapons, which is what they mentioned wanting to do when they devstreamed the glaive+pistol system.

Thats beside the pojnt. If you refuse to talk about the actual topic l, I'm not going to respond. 

[Dreddeth]

11 minutes ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

Thats beside the pojnt. If you refuse to talk about the actual topic l, I'm not going to respond. 

Actually, they're using a real-life example of how hard it is to code little tweaks such as this into the game, to illustrate and support their point, which is that you literally have no idea what you're talking about. By doing so, they are presenting a valid argument.

In stark contrast, your proposal is full of assumptions about not only the ease with which it could be implemented, but also the degree to which it might upset balance, and your replies are nothing but empty sniping with no basis in reality.

[NekroArts]

Here's one that's real.

This can be seen in two different ways, since this response is from 2015:

• we may have better technology/methods to implement it now than before or
• it took too much time to make it work and still does and they decided it wasn't worth pursuing

[-AoN-CanoLathra-]

5 hours ago, Dreddeth said:

Actually, they're using a real-life example of how hard it is to code little tweaks such as this into the game, to illustrate and support their point, which is that you literally have no idea what you're talking about. By doing so, they are presenting a valid argument.

In stark contrast, your proposal is full of assumptions about not only the ease with which it could be implemented, but also the degree to which it might upset balance, and your replies are nothing but empty sniping with no basis in reality.

[Aldain]

It would be better just to implement a new weapon class as a "Combat Shield" after melee 3.0 drops and we can dual wield one handed secondaries with one hand melee weapons.

Plus even if not dual wielded it would be fun to swing a slab of metal around to beat enemies.

[vaarnaaarne]

I feel using a giant pavise as a bludgeon has a nice feel to it.

[(PSN)big_eviljak]

On 2019-07-23 at 4:59 PM, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

Since you guys are so fixated on that, I'll say "relatively easy". 

You dint kno that it would be relatively easy. Don't trivialize the work required for them to develop content.

[(XBOX)Architect Prime]

2 hours ago, Aldain said:

It would be better just to implement a new weapon class as a "Combat Shield" after melee 3.0 drops and we can dual wield one handed secondaries with one hand melee weapons.

Plus even if not dual wielded it would be fun to swing a slab of metal around to beat enemies.

Lmao I like It!

[(PSN)True_Reclaimer]

23 hours ago, NekroArts said:

Here's one that's real.

This can be seen in two different ways, since this response is from 2015:

• we may have better technology/methods to implement it now than before or
• it took too much time to make it work and still does and they decided it wasn't worth pursuing

It boggles my mind that my EXTREMELY LOGICAL suggestions from years ago still are NOT implemented

 

DE does NOT care about the community. Or they would overhaul CRITICAL FOUNDATIONS such as mods, polarities, formas, riven data and limits, etc etc

DE is lazy and more focused on cosmetics than anything else. We still do NOT have Armor 2.0, universal modless vacuum, or universal shieldgating even though all three were proven both possible and effective

[Shalath]

1 hour ago, (PS4)True_Reclaimer said:

It boggles my mind that my EXTREMELY LOGICAL suggestions from years ago still are NOT implemented

 

DE does NOT care about the community. Or they would overhaul CRITICAL FOUNDATIONS such as mods, polarities, formas, riven data and limits, etc etc

DE is lazy and more focused on cosmetics than anything else. We still do NOT have Armor 2.0, universal modless vacuum, or universal shieldgating even though all three were proven both possible and effective

Wow, so many wild and baseless statements in one post!

DE said that the underclocking is not simple to do and would use up a huge chunk of dev time when you can simply use a duplicate mod so it isn't worth it. We already have a solution.

By overhauls on mods, polarities and formas I'll assume you are the "all slots should be multi-polarity" camp which would definitely not lead to a massive power creep. Definitely not.

Riven capacity has been talked to death. We know they take up a lot more database space by their very nature and there has to be a limit because collectors absolutely want to collect them all. They will have hundreds if not thousands in their collections which results in huge amounts of database space sitting there doing nothing. Do you really need 45 Gorgon rivens? You will say Yes. Are you ever going to use any of then? No. Pointless and expensive for DE.

I have no idea what Armour 2.0 is but DE has flat out said no to univac. You may as well just remove any companion that isn't Smeeta. You may as well argue that all frames should have all auras without mods since you want everything convenient without any costs. You want Vac, choose a sentinel. You want Charm, pick a Smeeta. Cake is not a dual purpose food.

I'd like you to quote your source that says that shield gating was proven both possible and effective because even my limited understanding says it isn't and I know DE have said the same. You have 600 shield and 600 health. A shot hits you for 900 damage so shield is removed but the gating negates the extra 300 so your health takes no damage. Shot 2 kills you. How is that "effective"?

[Guest]

40 minutes ago, Shalath said:

I'd like you to quote your source that says that shield gating was proven both possible and effective because even my limited understanding says it isn't and I know DE have said the same. You have 600 shield and 600 health. A shot hits you for 900 damage so shield is removed but the gating negates the extra 300 so your health takes no damage. Shot 2 kills you. How is that "effective"?

You have the same 600 shield and 600 health.

You take 2000 damage.

Shield is removed, you can still get out of the way.

Without gating, you just die.

How is that not effective?

42 minutes ago, Shalath said:

DE said that the underclocking is not simple to do and would use up a huge chunk of dev time when you can simply use a duplicate mod so it isn't worth it. We already have a solution.

If you give me your three Umbrals or your Primed Fury maybe we will talk about duplicate mod to solve it.

43 minutes ago, Shalath said:

--stuff--

I do not have to disagree with the rest since I don't really disagree with the rest.

[Shalath]

1 hour ago, Datam4ss said:

You have the same 600 shield and 600 health.

You take 2000 damage.

Shield is removed, you can still get out of the way.

Without gating, you just die.

How is that not effective?

Assuming you can stay out of the way until your shields recharge you stand a small chance of staying alive true. If the enemy has a full auto weapon or you are taking fire from several enemies you aren't likely to get out of the way though. DE have tested this and said it doesn't really work. A mod to implement something similar to Wukong's passive would be far more effective really.

1 hour ago, Datam4ss said:

If you give me your three Umbrals or your Primed Fury maybe we will talk about duplicate mod to solve it.

Yes we can't get more Umbrals (yet) and Primed Fury isn't easy to get duplicates of but that is 4 mods out of a very big set compared to the number of dev hours implementing underclocking would take. I'm not saying that underclocking wouldn't be nice to have and I don't know how many dev hours would be needed to implement it but to me it would seem a waste to spend those hours just for these 4 mods when that time could be spent on something else.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Shalath said:

Assuming you can stay out of the way until your shields recharge you stand a small chance of staying alive true. If the enemy has a full auto weapon or you are taking fire from several enemies you aren't likely to get out of the way though. DE have tested this and said it doesn't really work. A mod to implement something similar to Wukong's passive would be far more effective really.

Ya know, it's better to have than have not. Even a 1% chance of surviving is better than a 0% chance. Given the devs have proven they can program it successfully, there is no reason to leave it out.

1 hour ago, Shalath said:

Yes we can't get more Umbrals (yet) and Primed Fury isn't easy to get duplicates of but that is 4 mods out of a very big set compared to the number of dev hours implementing underclocking would take. I'm not saying that underclocking wouldn't be nice to have and I don't know how many dev hours would be needed to implement it but to me it would seem a waste to spend those hours just for these 4 mods when that time could be spent on something else.

I wouldn't assume these would be the last of the unique mods.

Also, I wouldn't be so quick to just believe that underclocking is as hard as DE makes it out to be - there are people who suggested viable ways to implement it code wise. We don't exactly know the code structure of the game in the first place. 

You already assumed many dev hours would be needed, but who knows, really?

[Shalath]

24 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:

Ya know, it's better to have than have not. Even a 1% chance of surviving is better than a 0% chance. Given the devs have proven they can program it successfully, there is no reason to leave it out.

I can't really think of any reasons why they would leave it out having tested unless it would introduced issues elsewhere. Ropey's insta-kill red beam is the only one I can think of but there must be other things in the game we aren't supposed to survive that gating would save us from against DE's intent.

27 minutes ago, Datam4ss said:

Also, I wouldn't be so quick to just believe that underclocking is as hard as DE makes it out to be - there are people who suggested viable ways to implement it code wise. We don't exactly know the code structure of the game in the first place. 

You already assumed many dev hours would be needed, but who knows, really?

Well DE nixed the idea knowing it was a popular suggestion which makes me assume it would not be a couple of hours but yes, we really don't know. One thing I am sure of is that it wouldn't be just one bit of code that needed changing as most would assume. Mod stat calculations permeate the whole game and unlike some games where there is only one main character with mostly fixed stats we have over 60 frames that all handle stats differently, not to mention things like sortie/arbitration buff/debuff conditions and the like. I would be very surprised if there weren't several dozen areas it would need to be implemented in if I am honest. Again, I'm just guessing but for DE to completely shut down the idea rather than saying "we'll look into it" makes me think it is a tough sell to those that manage dev time.

[Guest]

1 minute ago, Shalath said:

I can't really think of any reasons why they would leave it out having tested unless it would introduced issues elsewhere. Ropey's insta-kill red beam is the only one I can think of but there must be other things in the game we aren't supposed to survive that gating would save us from against DE's intent.

Or you know, it can just be "but I don't even want to program this..."

2 minutes ago, Shalath said:

Again, I'm just guessing but for DE to completely shut down the idea rather than saying "we'll look into it" makes me think it is a tough sell to those that manage dev time.

Either they wrote some really messy code that should not be there, or they are just lazy, really. Then again, there are a lot of whinyboys who won't give DE the chance to fix any system, by constantly breathing down their neck for new content.

I maintain, though, just because you can understand why they do it, doesn't mean you have to agree to it or not criticize it.

[(PSN)True_Reclaimer]

22 hours ago, Shalath said:

Wow, so many wild and baseless statements in one post!

DE said that the underclocking is not simple to do and would use up a huge chunk of dev time when you can simply use a duplicate mod so it isn't worth it. We already have a solution.

By overhauls on mods, polarities and formas I'll assume you are the "all slots should be multi-polarity" camp which would definitely not lead to a massive power creep. Definitely not.

Riven capacity has been talked to death. We know they take up a lot more database space by their very nature and there has to be a limit because collectors absolutely want to collect them all. They will have hundreds if not thousands in their collections which results in huge amounts of database space sitting there doing nothing. Do you really need 45 Gorgon rivens? You will say Yes. Are you ever going to use any of then? No. Pointless and expensive for DE.

I have no idea what Armour 2.0 is but DE has flat out said no to univac. You may as well just remove any companion that isn't Smeeta. You may as well argue that all frames should have all auras without mods since you want everything convenient without any costs. You want Vac, choose a sentinel. You want Charm, pick a Smeeta. Cake is not a dual purpose food.

I'd like you to quote your source that says that shield gating was proven both possible and effective because even my limited understanding says it isn't and I know DE have said the same. You have 600 shield and 600 health. A shot hits you for 900 damage so shield is removed but the gating negates the extra 300 so your health takes no damage. Shot 2 kills you. How is that "effective"?

So if underclocking is too hard, and rivens take too much data - either DE doesn't care, OR they are too lazy to fix 

Yes thanks for proving my points! 👏

Perhaps they shouldn't add mod systems that arent actually modular? Adding collectible mods that take too much data to collect... galaxy brain dev work 🧠

Quote

I'd like you to quote your source that says that shield gating was proven both possible and effective because even my limited understanding says it isn't

Shield gating is what Hildryn has - even though your "limited understanding" was ignorant to that concept - temporary invulnerability when shields are depleted to prevent getting one shotted. Works fine with her - facts. Should be universal - also, facts.

 

Quote

DE has flat out said no to univac.

Univac is literally already in game.... you mustve missed the memo again.. 😴

Univac is on all frames and archwings, but limited to only 4m. It should be increased, or simply allow all items to drop without physical pickup like Kuva. 

Quote

You want Vac, choose a sentinel. You want Charm, pick a Smeeta. Cake is not a dual purpose food.

... Ive got a mod called Fetch that will blow your sweet little mind 🤯

 

Quote

I have no idea what Armour 2.0 is

Armor 2.0 - yet another critical topic you are unsurprisingly ignorant to. It was supposed to be the Armor rework component included with Damage 2.0, but nope all we got was Corrosive as a band aid fix... you do know what Corrosive is right?... Right??

Quote

Wow, so many wild and baseless statements in one post!

I think the problem is Mr Shalath simply hasnt logged into warframe since 2015, otherwise all my concepts wouldn't be so wild and baseless, as they've been here for literal years ❌

Solution - take a break from forums, then update and go play Warframe ✔️

 

Now I will rise back to the altar of enlightenment, only to be summoned by chance again when someone necros my old posts. Godspeed tenno 

 

 

[Loza03]

On ‎2019‎-‎07‎-‎25 at 8:42 AM, Shalath said:

I have no idea what Armour 2.0 is but DE has flat out said no to univac. You may as well just remove any companion that isn't Smeeta. You may as well argue that all frames should have all auras without mods since you want everything convenient without any costs. You want Vac, choose a sentinel. You want Charm, pick a Smeeta. Cake is not a dual purpose food.

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Fetch