Dynamic Teamwork Missions/Tilesets

[PopTartZombie]

I've noticed that a lot of players are very fast, as I mozy my way through a mission enjoying the combat, I see a lot of people skipping 90% of the mission. The 10% is the objective and extraction. I get left in the dust. I'm no new player either. Is this 100% my choice. Yes, I enjoy the enemy variations, I like using the weapons I invested a lot of time into improving, I like the 1, 2 and 3 abilities on most frames. I actually use Volt's speed as a tactical advantage, moving myself into a different locale fast. The door unlock requiring another Tenno to progress only slows down the other noom Tenno. Yet there's potential left in that ideal.

Maybe I'm just a slow old man Tenno. Maybe I'm just too slow. Maybe I suck at nooming. Say what you gotta say, but I have a suggestion on mission design that can improve the enjoyment substantially.

I've seen a mission type change to exterminate, when it was a spy or whatever, but how about every time an alarm is set, there's a predetermined chance that mission becomes a sabotage, or exterminate, or spy, or two at once, exterminate and capture. Then, increase the limit of zones that can impede the noom. More doors, maybe a "hold this spot for 30 sec" mini-objective. There would definitely need to be a cap on how many times per one mission this could change the objective or give an additional objective and how many mini-objectives can appear.

With this mission type a lot of players wouldn't necessarily be inclined to play, because at first thought, it sounds like a chore. But, if there is an added incentive to these mission types. It can payoff for the increased amount of work.

The incentive:

I know there's increased credits, resource related bonuses on each planet. Considering this, maybe an increased rare resource drop, mod drop, or maybe even increased chance for ayatan to spawn. Also including a multiplier for mission reward, credits and affinity. 

Regular mission x1.25 credit+affinity (no alarm 1 objective)

Mission + second objective x2 credit+affinity

Mission + mini-mission x1.5 credit+affinity

These statistics would be applicable in any order depending on the dynamic nature of the mission.

Edited July 27, 2019 by PopTartZombie

[5p33dy_01]

there is a solo option that lets you enjoy (daydream) to your hearts desire, without worrying about anyone else's objective.

bringing your unranked weapon to Arbitrations or Sorties, that's just dumb.
bringing your unranked/useless weapon to pub games and being a leech, that's just inconsiderate.

if you feel like stopping to smell the roses, or want to attempt at trimming those bushes with a blunt tool, consider using that solo option.

some people have played that very mission 10 times, maybe even more.

if you're not new, then you haven't played that much, either way, try look at it in other peoples perspective.
i could say the reverse things you have said.
------
for completing your objective and extracting in a certain time, you get bonus rewards
------
as for your idea, that involves HUGE mission rework on a grand scale. so i will be HUGELY surprised if it's even considered anytime soon.

my idea however, is just a matter of a script to trigger bonus rewards for objective time.

Edited July 27, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[PopTartZombie]

12 minutes ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

there is a solo option that lets you enjoy (daydream) to your hearts desire, without worrying about anyone else's objective.

bringing your unranked weapon to Arbitrations or Sorties, that's just dumb.
bringing your unranked/useless weapon to pub games and being a leech, that's just inconsiderate.

if you feel like stopping to smell the roses, or want to attempt at trimming those bushes with a blunt tool, consider using that solo option.

some people have played that very mission 10 times, maybe even more.

if you're not new, then you haven't played that much, either way, try look at it in other peoples perspective.
i could say the reverse things you have said.
------
for completing your objective and extracting in a certain time, you get bonus rewards
------
as for your idea, that involves HUGE mission rework on a grand scale. so i will be HUGELY surprised if it's even considered anytime soon.

my idea however, is just a matter of a script to trigger bonus rewards for objective time.

I can see exactly what you mean. I'm not saying I want to stop and smell the roses, I'm just suggesting a way they can better display mission content to players in an optional way. It wouldn't necessarily be a HUGE change. All the assets are already there. For example when a spy mission becomes an exterminate, or at the end of an interception. I'm only speaking about adding or changing one node per planet. I also was only using other player speed as an example you also used. The other person in that party may have ran it 10 times already. I've sped through missions plenty. On strictly a preference standpoint, I would always prefer a mission that took work and had me thinking quickly on my feet while working with other Tenno at the same pace in a more dynamic and unpredictable setting. As for how much work it would be for DE, script 5-6 nodes to pay out more rewards depending on 1, 2, 3 objectives completed Y/N? 1 or 0 for yes or no. Using the same script assets in the spy/interception as stated above, have Rebecca voice 1-3 more sentences for those mission change dialogs. Make a new script for a mini-objective (script the size of having to hack an alarm to make it silent again, maybe a few more lines). Alarm triggered, yes/no? Yes. Alarm reset yes/no? Yes (script start in 20sec, player undetected). Except, it would be a room lockout, with enemy's breaching and you could only hack alarm until all the enemies were killed. All this would be doing is give way more depth to the currently very shallow mission types available. This system would not be forced on anybody, being given its own mission node.

In short, the current missions are boring and outdated, no they're not challenging unless it's a sortie(sometimes), depth sells, and a rework is necessary but I'll take a few nodes for now until they maybe get popularized.

[5p33dy_01]

6 minutes ago, PopTartZombie said:

I can see exactly what you mean. I'm not saying I want to stop and smell the roses, I'm just suggesting a way they can better display mission content to players in an optional way. It wouldn't necessarily be a HUGE change. All the assets are already there. For example when a spy mission becomes an exterminate, or at the end of an interception. I'm only speaking about adding or changing one node per planet. I also was only using other player speed as an example you also used. The other person in that party may have ran it 10 times already. I've sped through missions plenty. On strictly a preference standpoint, I would always prefer a mission that took work and had me thinking quickly on my feet while working with other Tenno at the same pace in a more dynamic and unpredictable setting. As for how much work it would be for DE, script 5-6 nodes to pay out more rewards depending on 1, 2, 3 objectives completed Y/N? 1 or 0 for yes or no. Using the same script assets in the spy/interception as stated above, have Rebecca voice 1-3 more sentences for those mission change dialogs. Make a new script for a mini-objective (script the size of having to hack an alarm to make it silent again, maybe a few more lines). Alarm triggered, yes/no? Yes. Alarm reset yes/no? Yes (script start in 20sec, player undetected). Except, it would be a room lockout, with enemy's breaching and you could only hack alarm until all the enemies were killed. All this would be doing is give way more depth to the currently very shallow mission types available. This system would not be forced on anybody, being given its own mission node.

In short, the current missions are boring and outdated, no they're not challenging unless it's a sortie(sometimes), depth sells, and a rework is necessary but I'll take a few nodes for now until they maybe get popularized.

wow....

i cant make heads or tails from that... even your first post.

please try be more to the point, instead of a long story that leads to confusion.

summed up.

you want a new mission node with various objectives?

[PopTartZombie]

Okay.

Want dynamic mission nodes

More than one objective

Teamwork

Yeahhhh

[PopTartZombie]

12 minutes ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

wow....

i cant make heads or tails from that... even your first post.

please try be more to the point, instead of a long story that leads to confusion.

summed up.

you want a new mission node with various objectives?

I'm using my personal player experience to describe what exactly it is I'm going through in various missions. Then, proposing descriptive way to help apply more content with somewhat little effort.

I don't space out my words, I should use paragraphs, and yes I do agree I could be more to the point on a couple subjects. I'm not trying to miss an explanation where it may be needed. That's all.

[5p33dy_01]

17 minutes ago, PopTartZombie said:

Okay.

Want dynamic mission nodes

More than one objective

Teamwork

Yeahhhh

well done... so much easier to understand.

first post looked like you wanted various objectives put into the current missions as additional challenges/objectives (to slow people down, so you could catch up).
second post was just ridiculous jumbled text slapped together.

it's a OK idea, not good nor bad.

i personally think it wont happen for a while, maybe wait and see what their next big update brings. that should involve some new stuff to play with (mission wise).

coding new nodes will be a lot of work, and with everything they seem to be working on, any additional nodes will be stuck on the back burner for a long time.

they don't even modify the current nodes for more enjoyment, let alone creating new ones.
for the one they did recently make as well as the boss fight, they got some serious flack
 

6 minutes ago, PopTartZombie said:

I'm using my personal player experience to describe what exactly it is I'm going through in various missions. Then, proposing descriptive way to help apply more content with somewhat little effort.

I don't space out my words, I should use paragraphs, and yes I do agree I could be more to the point on a couple subjects. I'm not trying to miss an explanation where it may be needed. That's all.

the way you space out your explanation is serious when you are trying to get your point across.
if everything is smashed together, it becomes a pain to even consider reading.

Edited July 27, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[PopTartZombie]

19 minutes ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

well done... so much easier to understand.

first post looked like you wanted various objectives put into the current missions as additional challenges/objectives (to slow people down, so you could catch up).
second post was just ridiculous jumbled text slapped together.

it's a OK idea, not good nor bad.

i personally think it wont happen for a while, maybe wait and see what their next big update brings. that should involve some new stuff to play with (mission wise).

coding new nodes will be a lot of work, and with everything they seem to be working on, any additional nodes will be stuck on the back burner for a long time.

they don't even modify the current nodes for more enjoyment, let alone creating new ones.
for the one they did recently make as well as the boss fight, they got some serious flack
 

the way you space out your explanation is serious when you are trying to get your point across.
if everything is smashed together, it becomes a pain to even consider reading.

Yeah exactly what I am trying to get at. The mission nodes are pretty dusty if you ask me, yet here comes DE with more expansive content. Applaudable yet cause for concern when speaking about the already neglected missions.

The tilesets and the way they're implemented is great, but taking data on how they're played isn't done. If it is, nobody takes a second glance at that information. I like to believe it's most important how we all play missions. That is the content.

Oh and yeah it's a curse I deal with, my brain has a super fast and receptive process, but it's not organized. At all, and it shows.

Let's put DE's possible priority and current projects aside, just given what's implied here, I want to hear your opinion on this. Do you think it would generate more time and more enjoyable content in mission. Or would it become just more of a chore?

[FireSegment]

9 hours ago, PopTartZombie said:

I've noticed that a lot of players are very fast, as I mozy my way through a mission enjoying the combat, I see a lot of people skipping 90% of the mission. The 10% is the objective and extraction. I get left in the dust. I'm no new player either. Is this 100% my choice. Yes, I enjoy the enemy variations, I like using the weapons I invested a lot of time into improving, I like the 1, 2 and 3 abilities on most frames. I actually use Volt's speed as a tactical advantage, moving myself into a different locale fast. The door unlock requiring another Tenno to progress only slows down the other noom Tenno. Yet there's potential left in that ideal.

Maybe I'm just a slow old man Tenno. Maybe I'm just too slow. Maybe I suck at nooming. Say what you gotta say, but I have a suggestion on mission design that can improve the enjoyment substantially.

I've seen a mission type change to exterminate, when it was a spy or whatever, but how about every time an alarm is set, there's a predetermined chance that mission becomes a sabotage, or exterminate, or spy, or two at once, exterminate and capture. Then, increase the limit of zones that can impede the noom. More doors, maybe a "hold this spot for 30 sec" mini-objective. There would definitely need to be a cap on how many times per one mission this could change the objective or give an additional objective and how many mini-objectives can appear.

With this mission type a lot of players wouldn't necessarily be inclined to play, because at first thought, it sounds like a chore. But, if there is an added incentive to these mission types. It can payoff for the increased amount of work.

The incentive:

I know there's increased credits, resource related bonuses on each planet. Considering this, maybe an increased rare resource drop, mod drop, or maybe even increased chance for ayatan to spawn. Also including a multiplier for mission reward, credits and affinity. 

Regular mission x1.25 credit+affinity (no alarm 1 objective)

Mission + second objective x2 credit+affinity

Mission + mini-mission x1.5 credit+affinity

These statistics would be applicable in any order depending on the dynamic nature of the mission.

i would say that DE already thought of that, and some of the newer mission type all have that kind of mini objective bake in it design. Fissure clearly is an example, kuva siphon is another, Sabotage variants all have mini objective. And yet, all that only result in making players split out to do 2 thing at one, or choose the least time consumed route (heat/cold reactor in sabotage one). It would took much more effort and a fundamental change in mission design approach to recreate the feeling that you want

A large amount of players desire the fast pace combat and action that the game capable of, even to the extreme like the saying "Given the opportunity, player would optimize the fun out of the game". I don't think that warframe has been successful at minimizing that behavior (although they do success sometime). We simply just have to live with that as long as warframe remain a looter, and that what these player want and what we who enjoy taking it all in want is different. Thus each would need a different type of reward. 

Reading your post, i kinda think it would not work like how you intended and that you are making the same mistake DE did with wisp (PoE wisp, not the frame) because in my opinion, how u acquire wisp in the natural way make it a fine reward for people that enjoy looking around and taking it all in. Instead, DE required players to farm a ridiculous amount of it for gear, which would unavoidably subjected wisp to the optimized mind set and farming it turn out no fun for anyone. It is not a good way to do it.

[ISMW]

At the begining game looked more like shooter, now it more like speedrun game, one reason is unbelievable warframe and op mobility, void dashes, bullet jumping makes speed incredible, Second one is faster=more rewards per time.

Maybee introducing more QTE with surroundings, or knockbacking enemies/systems like in orokin tyleset to other mission will make game a bit slower and players more careful.

[5p33dy_01]

14 hours ago, PopTartZombie said:

Yeah exactly what I am trying to get at. The mission nodes are pretty dusty if you ask me, yet here comes DE with more expansive content. Applaudable yet cause for concern when speaking about the already neglected missions.

you are right to an extent, they are old, but that's not all.

for whats involved with adding new content, it's a lot of work and anything they do to try speed up the process (copy/past node with different objective) people also complain about.
people say its not new enough because the environment is the same.
maybe thats why they have turned almost all their attention on other things (fashion frame FTW)... (RIP playable content)

its like a no win situation, either side will not be happy, people that want to look pretty or people that want mission content.

seeing as nobody (community manager/support team) even actively or at all respond to the forums, either confirming or denying viable content, it makes the forums look almost neglected too, which leaves me wonder why even bother with feedback.
 

15 hours ago, PopTartZombie said:

The tilesets and the way they're implemented is great, but taking data on how they're played isn't done. If it is, nobody takes a second glance at that information. I like to believe it's most important how we all play missions. That is the content.
 

yes they are great.

the data they collect, i think is more on how much a mission is played, rather than how it is played. the "how it is played" could be an extremely large amount of data to go through (considering playerbase).
 

15 hours ago, PopTartZombie said:

Let's put DE's possible priority and current projects aside, just given what's implied here, I want to hear your opinion on this. Do you think it would generate more time and more enjoyable content in mission. Or would it become just more of a chore?

as you requested my opinion, your pitch is basically every mission currently.

every mission gives you more based on objectives you complete as well as a chance for rare containers that have fully built forma and boosters.

(Nightmare/arbitrations/fissures)
all of which give you those specific rewards you mentioned and more (either in level of enemies being higher or even more on endless missions opening consecutive relics)

read about them here
https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Nightmare_Mode
https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Arbitrations
https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Void_Fissure

also for credit, affinity, resources and resource chance. they have boosters that give you 2x and smeeta kavat charm mod that stacks for 4x (with booster) for the duration of the buff as well as a chance for planet rare resource every 27sec.

not sure if all that stacks with fissure max 2x from endless fissure, making the total boosters 6x or 8x (i dont know if charm is multiplicative after fissure, but it is after boosters)

in a nutshell, you basically described some of the features the game already has on the entire star-chart (yet you finding it boring... lol)

the part i can agree on, is the new/updated content mission/gear wise, which is what your aim was (but i have my own perspective that will be rejected by the community)

most weapons need HUGE modifications, its not even fun leveling them to 30, let alone TRYING to make them fun by leveling them to 30 multiple times for forma.

even melee 3.0, the reaction in their last dev stream was almost like "we haven't done anything with that, but we cant tell the community" so yeah... everyone sit back and just wait, maybe 2022 melee 3.0 will be out.

anyway... sorry for the long post and thanks for reading if you bothered.

[5p33dy_01]

4 hours ago, ISMW said:

At the begining game looked more like shooter, now it more like speedrun game, one reason is unbelievable warframe and op mobility, void dashes, bullet jumping makes speed incredible, Second one is faster=more rewards per time.

Maybee introducing more QTE with surroundings, or knockbacking enemies/systems like in orokin tyleset to other mission will make game a bit slower and players more careful.

when you've played a mission 50/100/200 times or more... you really think people will enjoy being knocked down?
people just wont play that mission as much. introduce it in every mission, people just wont play that game or at the very least, fewer people will.

eximus and various other enemies already knockdown (to the point of stun lock sometimes).. go play 4 group Profit-Taker level 4 threat level with people that dont know how to play it, lets see how much fun you have without knockdown resistance.

as for your comment about speedrunning, you literally indicated ANY game capable of that, regardless of type.
even games like farmville, but it's about production efficiency.

meaning, no matter what you do, there WILL be people finding a FASTER way to reach a goal/objective, its up to you to decide to join the movement or leave.

DOOM 1... which is to this year 2019 PURE FPS, has people replaying a mission 50,000 times or more just to be the fastest record.

please consider other perspectives and aspects of the game. if you cant keep up or don't want to, please do everyone a favor and keep your solo intentions within solo mode, nobody is forcing public mode on you, or find people willing to make capture mission 10/20/30 minutes long.

or maybe you were just saying the same thing as the OP, in which case, why repeat something a different way, instead of just agreeing.

[ISMW]

43 minutes ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

when you've played a mission 50/100/200 times or more... you really think people will enjoy being knocked down?
people just wont play that mission as much. introduce it in every mission, people just wont play that game or at the very least, fewer people will.

eximus and various other enemies already knockdown (to the point of stun lock sometimes).. go play 4 group Profit-Taker level 4 threat level with people that dont know how to play it, lets see how much fun you have without knockdown resistance.

as for your comment about speedrunning, you literally indicated ANY game capable of that, regardless of type.
even games like farmville, but it's about production efficiency.

meaning, no matter what you do, there WILL be people finding a FASTER way to reach a goal/objective, its up to you to decide to join the movement or leave.

DOOM 1... which is to this year 2019 PURE FPS, has people replaying a mission 50,000 times or more just to be the fastest record.

please consider other perspectives and aspects of the game. if you cant keep up or don't want to, please do everyone a favor and keep your solo intentions within solo mode, nobody is forcing public mode on you, or find people willing to make capture mission 10/20/30 minutes long.

or maybe you were just saying the same thing as the OP, in which case, why repeat something a different way, instead of just agreeing.

I'm tryin to say that this game was about grind but 5? years ago there was not a lot of things to farm, so now it tends to infinity. So it is almost unreasonable to slow the game for players I WANT FARM A LOT AND FAST. But for gameplay such introductions will be fine i think.

And about speedruning, i know that all games capable of, but at almost all games it is not the way game mend to be played, but this one is.

[5p33dy_01]

5 hours ago, ISMW said:

I'm tryin to say that this game was about grind but 5? years ago there was not a lot of things to farm, so now it tends to infinity. So it is almost unreasonable to slow the game for players I WANT FARM A LOT AND FAST. But for gameplay such introductions will be fine i think.

TBH, the grind is STILL REAL, and will continue to be, as long as they have this annoying gear reset every time you forma.
yes there is potatoes, but i wont be putting one in everything and resetting them up to 8 times, JUST to see if i can make it fun to play with.

some weapons i like, i really couldn't be bothered to really invest in because of the reset grind

the faster you go through a mission, the less affinity you get and just makes it all feel like a serious chore.

starting out, OMG was the grind bad, but i pushed through all those useless weapons and then found that you dont even get MR points from formad weapons.

the whole design revolves around the grind, but now they are investing more time in fashion than other content, that is what im disappointed about.
i even recently decided not to buy plat even with my 60% voucher, because im not happy with the results of recent content and their reactions on the last dev stream.

you can NOT tell me its too hard to tweak a few weapons or add some much needed info on mods and various other things, every other day (its literally just a few values and text they could copy/past info from other websites).
instead it must be a WHOLE new weapon and they couldn't care less that mods and other things require people to go to third-party websites for that info.

 

[ISMW]

8 hours ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

TBH, the grind is STILL REAL, and will continue to be, as long as they have this annoying gear reset every time you forma.
yes there is potatoes, but i wont be putting one in everything and resetting them up to 8 times, JUST to see if i can make it fun to play with.

some weapons i like, i really couldn't be bothered to really invest in because of the reset grind

the faster you go through a mission, the less affinity you get and just makes it all feel like a serious chore.

starting out, OMG was the grind bad, but i pushed through all those useless weapons and then found that you dont even get MR points from formad weapons.

the whole design revolves around the grind, but now they are investing more time in fashion than other content, that is what im disappointed about.
i even recently decided not to buy plat even with my 60% voucher, because im not happy with the results of recent content and their reactions on the last dev stream.

you can NOT tell me its too hard to tweak a few weapons or add some much needed info on mods and various other things, every other day (its literally just a few values and text they could copy/past info from other websites).
instead it must be a WHOLE new weapon and they couldn't care less that mods and other things require people to go to third-party websites for that info.

 

 Leveling gear is not connected with level design we are talking here, and even so, it isn't that hard.

What about DE priorities, yes, they follow cosmetics way to get more profit i think