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Inaros rework (A new 4th skill, and 3rd skill interaction with 2nd skill reworked. And a rework to the 4th skill augment mod)

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Posted (edited)

If you're an Inaros user, you probably know that some of his skills are useless (like the 3rd) and some of them even though they are indeed useful, they can be discarded because the bonus is very mediocre (the 4th one. This one is only powerful with the Negation Swarm augment). So i decided to give Rhino a break (yeah it's me, if you have not noticed yet) and try to offer a rework for those skills of Inaros, here we go: 

1- Sandstorm (interaction): enemies affected by Quicksand will have their armor devoured, reducing their armor by 20% and increasing Inaros base armor by 30 for every enemy with a cap of 500 (not even nullifiers can remove it, and it never goes out naturally. Also, increasing strenght will only increase the stack per enemy, not the cap). It will not halve your movement speed anymore, everything else remains the same. 

  • Info: This skill has a very bad interaction, no one would bother using this to recover health when there's 2 ways to do it better (finishers with the 1st skill, and just using the 2nd one). And since the skill itself was useless, combining with the fact that even the interaction was useless, this definitely needed the Rework Hammer. 

2- Sand Graveyard (new skill): Inaros puts his hands on the ground and spread out sand in a large area, reducing enemy movement speed, and filling their bodies with sand. If you cast this skill again, Inaros will perform Sand Coffin. Wrapping all targets inside the radius in a coffin and causing damage to them (proportional to how much sand they have inside, there will be an icon with a sand-like color above them, with a %), while also increasing your health (proportional to enemies killed).

--- Range: 20m.

--- Cost: 50 energy (second cast is 75).

--- Movement speed reduction: 25% (not affected by strenght).

--- Duration: 20s.

--- Sand percentage p/s: 3% (affected by strenght, increasing duration will also increase how much you can stack. But damage will not scale above 90%).

--- Damage (p/ sand percentage): 500 (true)(not affected by strenght)

--- Each enemy killed will increase health by 10% (to a max of 500%. It's additive, so it won't be too much)(strenght will affect the rate that it goes up). This can be removed by nullifiers.

--- Note: the sand percentage can still go above 90% on enemies, but it will not increase the damage any further. Instead, every 2% above 90% will add to the skill a chance to instantly kill enemies, exploding them from inside with a brutal death (ex: if you stacked 150%, you'll have 30% chance to 1-shot them). That is a counter measure for high level enemies that obviously won't die with so little damage. 

  • Info: I wanted Inaros to be more of an active frame, and also have more build options. So i not only reworked it, i made an entire new skill for my emperor. 

And at last, the new augment mod for the 4th skill: 

  • Scarab Armor (R5): Each enemy killed by Sand Coffin will also give allies 1% of your max health as armor, to a max of 5%. It lasts 2 minutes.  

About this, i really wanted Inaros to have the possibility of having a support role, so i thought this was perfect. The buff will range from 300~700 depending on how much health you have. Which is not so high for most tanky frames, considering how much armor they can stack with some abilities, but definitely help some squishy ones. Important note: this bonus will not be affected by mods, it's a fix number.

Edited by (XB1)XG1anBl4derX

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The main controversy of Inaros getting a rework was always his OP base stats.
Yet this just makes him even more OP.

While I'm open for a Inaros rework, I think the went a tad too much.
Either for this to happen he has to get all his base stats nerfed, or DE just produce a completely new (and possibly OP) warframe.

 

I've been rattling about the same concept for some time in the forum, but I think he should interact with his big base stats.
Trade off that giant health pool if he wants to do more then just be immortal.
In short, he should have more 'drain health' mechanics.
I propose to add this for his 2 & 3

While his 2. Devour is great for securing survival, his sandshadows are again and again forgotten.
I propose that Inraos can instantly summon the last enemy he devoured by sandshadow at any time.
In return of more damage, he must sacrifice a portion of his health to let them be.  They fight until they die
I prefer having the shadows be strong and scale with power strength, but instead Inaros loses get his max health reduced for every sandshadow that has been summoned (capped at 6)
This would also help his passive if they are around while Inaros is in his coffin.

His 3.Sandstorm has always been something a lot of people agreed about. Whether its minor changes or complete remake.
I suggest it uses Inaros' health instead of energy, and the lower health Inaros has, it gains more range/cc/movement speed.
In lore he killed himself while protecting mars by using a sandstorm. Why not here too?
Additional changes can be that Sandstorm now pulls in enemies and immobilize them while they are in the center of the storm.
Enemies within sandstorm take extra damage, while Allies take less damage.
This will make Inaros actually contribute to the team. Sandstorm itself will still just be a pull in CC, but with teammates it will help them greatly by amping their dmg and protecting them.

This way current Inaros builds don't have to change but it will open newer builds for him.
my 2 cents.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Shaburanigud said:

The main controversy of Inaros getting a rework was always his OP base stats.
Yet this just makes him even more OP.

While I'm open for a Inaros rework, I think the went a tad too much.
Either for this to happen he has to get all his base stats nerfed, or DE just produce a completely new (and possibly OP) warframe.

 

I've been rattling about the same concept for some time in the forum, but I think he should interact with his big base stats.
Trade off that giant health pool if he wants to do more then just be immortal.
In short, he should have more 'drain health' mechanics.
I propose to add this for his 2 & 3

While his 2. Devour is great for securing survival, his sandshadows are again and again forgotten.
I propose that Inraos can instantly summon the last enemy he devoured by sandshadow at any time.
In return of more damage, he must sacrifice a portion of his health to let them be.  They fight until they die
I prefer having the shadows be strong and scale with power strength, but instead Inaros loses get his max health reduced for every sandshadow that has been summoned (capped at 6)
This would also help his passive if they are around while Inaros is in his coffin.

His 3.Sandstorm has always been something a lot of people agreed about. Whether its minor changes or complete remake.
I suggest it uses Inaros' health instead of energy, and the lower health Inaros has, it gains more range/cc/movement speed.
In lore he killed himself while protecting mars by using a sandstorm. Why not here too?
Additional changes can be that Sandstorm now pulls in enemies and immobilize them while they are in the center of the storm.
Enemies within sandstorm take extra damage, while Allies take less damage.
This will make Inaros actually contribute to the team. Sandstorm itself will still just be a pull in CC, but with teammates it will help them greatly by amping their dmg and protecting them.

This way current Inaros builds don't have to change but it will open newer builds for him.
my 2 cents.

Not being uneducated or anything, but you clearly don't know how EHP works or probably doesn't even know that Inaros barely reaches the 100k+ EHP. While Nidus for example, can go past 1kk EHP, he is far from being OP with my changes. Why am i saying this -> because everyone overestimates Inaros tanking capabilities, i was one of those like 3-4 days ago until i discovered that a support frame like Trinity, can tank at least 5 times more than Inaros, a frame DESIGNED to tank.

My advice is: instead of being like the majority around here, go search EHP calculations, and analyze all the buffs + the numbers behind them. It's really hard to do all that work just for someone to come up with " lol it's OP" whitout even knowing the outcome. Put yourself in my place, i have spent 3h planning all of this and someone barely analysed what i said and already concluded it's OP.  

To be honest, Inaros will still be below 1kk EHP even with my changes. Specially because the only noticeable one is the armor increase. 

Just further info, so you don't think i'm trolling: every 90% reduction is equal to x10 EHP (Efficient Health Points), Nidus has 1 for the skill, can reach another 1 with pure armor increase through Arcanes, and another one through Adaptation. That means => x10x10x10 = x1000 EHP.  

Inaros doesn't have natural 90% DR (Damage Reduction), and can only reach 2 (one with arcanes, another one with Adaptation). So in fact Inaros is much weaker, while also having a worse pack of skills.

Edited by (XB1)XG1anBl4derX
Just editing for better interpretation.

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34 minutes ago, (XB1)XG1anBl4derX said:

Not being uneducated or anything, but you clearly don't know how EHP works or probably doesn't even know that Inaros barely reaches the 100k+ EHP. While Nidus for example, can go past 1kk EHP, he is far from being OP with my changes. Why am i saying this -> because everyone overestimates Inaros tanking capabilities, i was one of those like 3-4 days ago until i discovered that a support frame like Trinity, can tank at least 5 times more than Inaros, a frame DESIGNED to tank.

My advice is: instead of being like the majority around here, go search EHP calculations, and analyze all the buffs + the numbers behind them. It's really hard to do all that work just for someone to come up with " lol it's OP" whitout even knowing the outcome. Put yourself in my place, i have spent 3h planning all of this and someone barely analysed what i said and already concluded it's OP.  

To be honest, Inaros will still be below 1kk EHP even with my changes. Specially because the only noticeable one is the armor increase. 

Just further info, so you don't think i'm trolling: every 90% reduction is equal to x10 EHP (Efficient Health Points), Nidus has 1 for the skill, can reach another 1 with pure armor increase through Arcanes, and another one through Adaptation. That means => x10x10x10 = x1000 EHP.  

Inaros doesn't have natural 90% DR (Damage Reduction), and can only reach 2 (one with arcanes, another one with Adaptation). So in fact Inaros is much weaker, while also having a worse pack of skills.

Yet he is constantly picked and is nominated for one of the most powerful and immortal frames in the entire game.
With the only one that exceeds him in the area is a full stacked Nidus.

Are you sure you weren't using his kit properly? Even when I use a sword(which finishers are currently bugged and not working), I barely have any problem surviving long endurances thx just for his 2 and insane amount of base health. I don't even need to use arcanes for that.
In theory yes his EHP is lower, but with his passives and current kit it makes much more. EHP ain't everything.
Inaros proves that and one must consider such when designing skills and frames.

I saw similar problems with you Rhino rework suggestions that you tune all of them to 11 if not just changing the frame completely.
And if  you're not here to discuss, but to just spat your ideas and belittle any kind of discussion that goes against you, this isn't the place for you.

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vor 2 Minuten schrieb Shaburanigud:

Yet he is constantly picked and is nominated for one of the most powerful and immortal frames in the entire game.
With the only one that exceeds him in the area is a full stacked Nidus.

Here are some more that have more EHP:
Shield Refresh Baruuk.
Tank Mesa.
Trinity Team.
Hyldrin (!!!)
Revenant.

Inaros has only 1 thing that i will give him: He is easy to build for, and by far the easiest tank to get. Besides of that? Bad kit(other will do the job way better), bad team play, low EHP, boring design.

p.s.: Yes i am biased regarding Inaros cause a lot of ppl are calling him "tank-demi-god-bs"

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vor 46 Minuten schrieb (XB1)XG1anBl4derX:

Not being uneducated or anything, but you clearly don't know how EHP works or probably doesn't even know that Inaros barely reaches the 100k+ EHP

Not quite right. A min maxed Inaros can reach 360k EHP (when my mind is not tricking me in this one). Still not that much tho.

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33 minutes ago, -VS-Zany said:

Here are some more that have more EHP:
Shield Refresh Baruuk.
Tank Mesa.
Trinity Team.
Hyldrin (!!!)
Revenant.

Inaros has only 1 thing that i will give him: He is easy to build for, and by far the easiest tank to get. Besides of that? Bad kit(other will do the job way better), bad team play, low EHP, boring design.

p.s.: Yes i am biased regarding Inaros cause a lot of ppl are calling him "tank-demi-god-bs"

Not saying he's the strongest, but I was pointing out that EHP isn't everything.

besides his OPness comes from the fact that he is basic to build.
Which something I love and hate cause it got in the way of my Mummy fantasy. (Yes I agree his kit is really boring)

I just like to call him a demi-god because of his lore. Just hope his skill sets would follow them as well.
#Sandstorm that covered all of Mars.

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Gerade eben schrieb Shaburanigud:

Not saying he's the strongest, but I was pointing out that EHP isn't everything.

besides his OPness comes from the fact that he is basic to build.
Which something I love and hate cause it got in the way of my Mummy fantasy. (Yes I agree his kit is really boring)

I just like to call him a demi-god because of his lore. Just hope his skill sets would follow them as well.
#Sandstorm that covered all of Mars.

I totaly agree with you. And this basicness lead ppl to believe, "HE IS TANK! I LIKE TANK! I PLAY TANK!"

When is Kit would be good and impressive. Ye I would change my mind. Like i dont know. Its #*!%ing SAND and Aegypt.
Lets summon him Sand Soldiers like Azir in LoL. Or a Sandstorm attack that is actually DOING something. Or a team wide armor buff.

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Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, -VS-Zany said:

I totaly agree with you. And this basicness lead ppl to believe, "HE IS TANK! I LIKE TANK! I PLAY TANK!"

When is Kit would be good and impressive. Ye I would change my mind. Like i dont know. Its #*!%ing SAND and Aegypt.
Lets summon him Sand Soldiers like Azir in LoL. Or a Sandstorm attack that is actually DOING something. Or a team wide armor buff.

Thus why I always bring up sandshadows and sandstorm.
Wish his augment with Devour actually involves making his Devour an AoE skill and instead remove the invulnerability part.

I wouldn't mind having Inaros' Face popping up in the sandstorm now and then either. (Like in the Mummy movies)

Edited by Shaburanigud

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Yeah no. He doesn't need a rework at all. He is one of the strongest overall warframes in the entire game. 

The only thing he needs is QoL changes such as...

His 4 CC duration currently has no indicator of how much time is left, instead it shows the armor buff both in the top left of the screen and above the ability icon. Change one of them to show the CD duration. Maybe add some indicator to the healing aura as well so then players know when they are in range? 

His 2 and 4 cc are extremely similar in terms of looks. Make it more apparent that an ally can eat a target afflicted by his 2.

His 3, it actually is useful, but not enough to justify the cost. You can hit a group of enemies with your 4, tap 3, and spread the enemies around leaving living mines that further spread your cc. However since cc in this game lost it's place to damage, it's incredibly rare you would ever want this. Doesn't help that just to cast it you need half your energy pool.

His 2, ignore. His sand shadows suck and are not worth using at all. Make them scale with duration and make it so you don't have to kill them with 2 to turn them. Shouldn't be op as you rarely use 2 and even when you do it takes 25/150 energy.

This is coming from an inaros main who has mained him for years. And I know the op might have multiple accounts, but this one at least has only been around since this month (july). So my advice to you op is to build a bit more experience before you suggest changes to frames. Inaros is obscenely strong when you get him fully built with arcanes. He is also one of the few frames that can go solo for crazy hours if you use a CL and arcane trickery build. 

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too OP won't wo- aww you again 😗

i'm sorry, this time I WAS BEING SARCASTIC

 

but in all seriousness so you won't loose your marbles; what makes inaros tick isn't his abilities it's his stats

some warframes work for their abilities, while others; abilities work for them

inaros is part of the latter group...his powers work for him but are expendable 

the thing is, this is his playstyle ...he's a walking pile of health with all of his abilities just supporting that 

IN MY OPINION i think if you give him too much additional powers like reducing armor and more CC affects and more ways to gain health will makes him a bit too overpowered...maybe even more than overpowered, but oversaturated with unnecessary powers  

again it's a gift that DE never takes our rework ideas into consideration...we tend to make everything too overpowered 

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Simple way to make Inaros' gameplay more involving and interesting rather than existing just for the sake of his base stats:

Make sandshadows be clones of Inaros instead of enemies, together with weapons and mods.

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7 hours ago, -VS-Zany said:

Not quite right. A min maxed Inaros can reach 360k EHP (when my mind is not tricking me in this one). Still not that much tho.

Inaros can't go past 100k EHP whitout Adaptation, Nidus just needs to use 1 skill. Literally 1 skill.  

That's what this dude doesn't get, no matter what he says, Inaros is still mediocre compared to other tanks.

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1 hour ago, (PS4)Hopper_Orouk said:

too OP won't wo- aww you again 😗

i'm sorry, this time I WAS BEING SARCASTIC

 

but in all seriousness so you won't loose your marbles; what makes inaros tick isn't his abilities it's his stats

some warframes work for their abilities, while others; abilities work for them

inaros is part of the latter group...his powers work for him but are expendable 

the thing is, this is his playstyle ...he's a walking pile of health with all of his abilities just supporting that 

IN MY OPINION i think if you give him too much additional powers like reducing armor and more CC affects and more ways to gain health will makes him a bit too overpowered...maybe even more than overpowered, but oversaturated with unnecessary powers  

again it's a gift that DE never takes our rework ideas into consideration...we tend to make everything too overpowered 

Inaros is still Mediocre compared to other tanks. The only thing that goes for him is that he is easy to build.

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Posted (edited)

It seems you guys are much more worried about:  

-> It works as tank? 

Rather than:

-> Why does a support tanks better than him?  

There's no other explanation, no one here even bothered to calculate is EHP with the 500 armor buff from the skill and his 500% health, I'LL MAKE IT MUCH MORE SIMPLE, OK?

Inaros with my build (actual state, with 1 steel fiber, and Vitality+Gladiator Resolve+Vigor): 

510 armor (63DR rounded up), 6270 health. EHP = 6270÷(1-0,63) = near 17k EHP. 

With Scarab Armor, he goes from 510 to 710 (63DR to 70DR), new EHP:  6270÷(1-0,7) = 20'900.

With my buffs: 

1010 armor (77DR rounded down), 9020. EHP = 6270÷(1-0,77) = 39'000 Health (rounded down).  

A little bit more than double the EHP, when he uses Scarab Armor otherwise, it's LESS than the double. But you still have to spend at least 3~6 minutes in the mission stacking those stats. The purpose of those skills was to give Inaros a more active kit and better support skills.

Edited by Haldos
Edited by Moderator.

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