The old conclave mod rating was on to something

[(PSN)Double991]

This is not a conclave post.

As some of you older players may recall, the mods used to have a point rating that was supposed to indicate the value of your total build but it was scrapped because some of the mods had really high conclave point ratings which would distort your stat and essentially made it useless. Also with more and more mods coming out it was probably a nightmare to keep giving mods a rating.

However one thing that I thought was really good about this system were the missions that put a hard cap on the point rating you could go in with. So in order to just play the mission you had to take some of your top tier mods off.

This gave everybody in the mission a hard limit and created an extra challenge in making a competent build with what would fit.

If they ever adjusted the mods that had unusual point ratings would you like to see this system return?

[(XBOX)Skippy575]

Personally, no. I'd like to use all of the tool available to me.

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

The old conclave rating system was crap and you know it. 

It's gone, and we're better for it. It was just too clunky and awkward.

[Renegade343]

2 minutes ago, Hawk_of_the_Reborn said:

The old conclave rating system was crap and you know it.

Well, it kind of worked before Damage 2.0 came about, although that's a bit generous.

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

Just now, Renegade343 said:

Well, it kind of worked before Damage 2.0 came about, although that's a bit generous.

And?

[Renegade343]

Just now, Hawk_of_the_Reborn said:

And?

Saying that it's a system that DE just decided to ignore for a long time at the release of Damage 2.0 before entirely scrapping it.

[Tsukinoki]

17 minutes ago, (PS4)Double991 said:

it was scrapped because some of the mods had really high conclave point ratings which would distort your stat and essentially made it useless.

It wasn't just that though.

Its that mods were given a static value....which doesn't really work with the frames.
Take for instance Redirection.  That gave 40 CP.  What happens if you equip it on an Inaros?  It still gives you 40CP even though it doesn't do anything.  On a Hildryn?  It also gives her 40CP even though it has a much larger effect on her than any other frame in the game.
Sure those are frames introduced after the removal of the points but it still points out a glaring issue with the CP system.  A mod would give a certain number of points regardless of how useful it was on the frame in question.
Doesn't matter if you lower the points to only 10 or 20, it will still be an issue.

The CP system was useless because not all stats are equal on all frames and weapons, and yet the points did just that.
I mean, can you tell me honestly, how many frames Steel Fiber is actually worth putting on...and then tell me is it worth the 40 points with how niche of a use it really has?

21 minutes ago, (PS4)Double991 said:

However one thing that I thought was really good about this system were the missions that put a hard cap on the point rating you could go in with. So in order to just play the mission you had to take some of your top tier mods off.

Or you did what most people did: remove their companion, or take off a weapon or two.
After all a weapon can't count against you if you don't have it equipped.
And most missions can be easily cleared with only one well modded weapon and a half modded frame.

22 minutes ago, (PS4)Double991 said:

If they ever adjusted the mods that had unusual point ratings would you like to see this system return?

No.
It was a pointless system that didn't do much except cause people to demand unreasonably high CP before they would recruit you.
It didn't have any positive benefits to the game, and with the core problem of the system being that not all mods apply equally to all frames/weapons its not really a tenable system.

[Hawk_of_the_Reborn]

3 minutes ago, Renegade343 said:

Saying that it's a system that DE just decided to ignore for a long time at the release of Damage 2.0 before entirely scrapping it.

However that has been irrelevant for the longest time now. 

[Tsukinoki]

6 minutes ago, Renegade343 said:

Well, it kind of worked before Damage 2.0 came about, although that's a bit generous.

Except that it didn't really work.

The mods had a static point value when how useful a mod was depended on the frame/weapon that you put it on.
That made the system broken from day one in all honesty, especially when the system was ostensibly built around a score of how poweful/useful the mod was in your build.  And with how many exceptions to the power/use of a mod existed even back before Damage 2.0....

Edited August 5, 2019 by Tsukinoki

[Annnoth]

If they wanted to restrict the power of your gear just make those special enemies much tougher. By limiting the mods you can put on something all you do is potentially ruin certain weapons which might have their builds hurt notably.

All this acheives is making enemies take more bullets to kill, higher HP does that too and at least lets you use your full arsenal.

Besides, with things like bleed being so powerful with relatively small mods it would just reign supreme. If not with hunter munitions you could just bring garuda and still be at full power.

Limiting ones arsenal purposefully just to have a challenge in a game like this is just a bad idea and admits they know full well they lost control of their game. If the game was already a bit of a challenge and only made harder for bonus rewards then itd be a different story.

Edited August 5, 2019 by Annnoth

[(PSN)Double991]

@Tsukinoki that was a thorough analysis that really showcases the various flaws in their system.

As I was thinking of the ways DE could challenge us it seemed like that system had potential but it requires a lot of polish and is probably why they scrapped it instead of making it better.

[Renegade343]

1 minute ago, Tsukinoki said:

Except that it didn't really work.

The mods had a static point value when how useful a mod was depended on the frame/weapon that you put it on.
That made the system broken from day one in all honesty. 

Given the choice of weapons and frames the game had before Damage 2.0 came about and pretty much solidified its uselessness, I would think it worked a bit under that small set.

[Firetempest]

Would likely take DE just as much effort making a proper, accurate, system knowing how powerful your mods are on a particular frame or weapon to then be used to throttle you. As it would be just rebuilding a proper damage system and rebalancing the allowed mods and their multiplicative effects.

[Renegade343]

11 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

especially when the system was ostensibly built around a score of how poweful/useful the mod was in your build. 

And with how many exceptions to the power/use of a mod existed even back before Damage 2.0.... 

Let's be fair, some of the mods' Conclave rating made sense in general (e.g.: All the damage mods, the multishot mods, the chance to stagger mods etc.), given how much power they provide in general.

My point is that the Conclave rating is a sorta-kinda working system at the start that got practically ignored at the advent of Damage 2.0, and then we killed it because frankly, we don't need it anymore.

[0_The_F00l]

Probably not ,

I don't play conclave cause there is really no significant reward , and the gameplay is vastly different from the PVE component,

 

 

i also dislike my ass handed to me .... repeatedly ....

 

Its a niche system , few people enjoy it (good for them) but a point system for modding will not be the reason i will take it again,

 

[0_The_F00l]

1 hour ago, 0_The_F00l said:

 

Accidental post. 

Edited August 5, 2019 by 0_The_F00l

[(PSN)Onder6099]

Iirc it had nothing to do with PVP Conclave, Conclave rating was used to build up Specters.

Edited August 5, 2019 by (PS4)Onder6099

[Renegade343]

5 minutes ago, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

Iirc it had nothing to do with PVP Conclave, Conclave rating was used to build up Specters.

Nah, it had a use in Conclave 1.0 (higher Conclave ratings would put you in a different tier to fight in).

[(PSN)Onder6099]

22 minutes ago, Renegade343 said:

Nah, it had a use in Conclave 1.0 (higher Conclave ratings would put you in a different tier to fight in).

With “Regular Mods”?

[Renegade343]

Just now, (PS4)Onder6099 said:

With “Regular Mods”?

Yeah.

So in Conclave 1.0, there were certain nodes in certain planets, and those nodes are the Conclave duels. Each of them has a Conclave rating minimum and maximum, and your Conclave rating is determined by the sum of the Conclave rating of the mods.

Rather small playerbase at the time though. I played a few of them, then Dark Sector Conflicts came about.

[(PSN)Onder6099]

4 minutes ago, Renegade343 said:

Yeah.

So in Conclave 1.0, there were certain nodes in certain planets, and those nodes are the Conclave duels. Each of them has a Conclave rating minimum and maximum, and your Conclave rating is determined by the sum of the Conclave rating of the mods.

Rather small playerbase at the time though. I played a few of them, then Dark Sector Conflicts came about.

Oi, it was long time ago, I can’t even remember, Dojo duels were more popular in that era. Lol, find my first vid from WF: How to reach highest Conclave thru Autoimstal to make strongest Specter

 

[0_The_F00l]

1 hour ago, (XB1)GaussPrime said:

Why did you quote yourself? 🤔

Accident 🙂

[Radagosh]

I'd prefer the good old conclave rating over mr rank to judge players by, any day. Then again in current warframe there is no real need to judge players anymore eitherway.

However, the idea of having a limited cc rating for tactical events was something that made some of them especially fun. So maybe we could build on that idea and add some sortie or nightwave challenges that limit your cc rating, which certainly would be more challenging (and to me more fun) than just doing 5 boring bounties in the plaines or fishing some fish.

Still, having big numbers under your name, always made me feel proud of my overformad builds, even though in the end they were just slightly better than what my teammates had. I'm also really wondering how far my rating has increased since those days without primed and umbral mods, am I sitting at around 3.5k? 4k?