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Ninja Game With No Stealth...


spinestomper
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just to get that ball rolling.... but that is the only thing that bothers me about this game, is a game based on space ninjas and outside of haveing shade there is no stealth in this game what so ever...

 

yes you can pull of some finishers but if there are 2-3 in the same room they will see you after the initial stealth attack...

 

i want to go through a whole level just taking ppl out (mark of the ninja style)

 

but i still love this game and what they are doing with it... so just my only complaint...

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The functions of the ninja included espionage (Spy Missions), sabotage (Sabotage Missions), infiltration (Capture Missions) and assassination (Assassination Missions), and open combat.

 

I literally just copy and pasted this from wikipedia. Although ninja are often associated with stealth, they did not wholly rely on it. Ninja are meant to be adaptive and open to many forms of combat. They are not solely bound to stealth.

 

That said, I can agree that stealth needs to be fixed up. It's not entirely viable at the moment, but still possible.

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You know i feel like asking DE to just pull out the ninja slogan because down-right there is not much ninja in this game, more like parkouring.

 

DE should have a pamphlet to pass around, defining what the difference between a ninja and special operative is.

Edited by Jacate
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First of all, this isn't advertised as a stealth game nor was it ever a focus.

 

With update 10 they did add suppression mod and while enemies do easily detect you, stay gameplay works in the way of planing each room, through killing everyone without letting the alarm being triggered. There's also Loki/ash and shade which can be used to further be used in order to make the whole stealth gameplay easier.

 

I too complained, with friends, at the thing you said "Ninjas with no stealth". Heck, I even questioned why there is an necromancer warframe, since when did ninjas start using their enemies as undead? Best answer I got is that they use "everything" they can get their hands on. Anyhow, the point is that the ninja part of this game is the maneuverability and looks. Whereas you are more like a terminator or wandering meat grinder rather than assassin.

 

So, if you are really bothered by "no stealth" you should look for another game, since this game isn't stealth game and that's a simple fact.

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Warframe is primarily an action game. Sure it also has some stealth functions, but those are underwhelming when playing with three other trigger-happy dudes. And currently, stealth play isn't as rewarding, as you avoid kills in order to be Super Sneaky Ninja.

 

I'd love to see actual stealth in Warframe, but I'll also want it be done right. Still waiting for cooldown on enemy alarm state. Only then we can switch between action and stealth playstyle, instead of "Stealt- nope you got spotted, action mode on"

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Let me answer this like any other post about stealth.

 

Tenno you are no ninja but space pirates

 

Arrgg argg yahaaarg, loot ahoy! ready yar master thief and loot radar you unstealthy silly spacelubbers. (ate too many sweets ugh)

Edited by Fammia
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For the end result of the game, I'd like to see you have the ease of mobility like you find in Assassin's Creed, the range of mobility like what you find in Splinter Cell, and a lot more of what warframe has started on to be ninja like (the wall running, for example).

 

That would be pure awesome.

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just to get that ball rolling.... but that is the only thing that bothers me about this game, is a game based on space ninjas and outside of haveing shade there is no stealth in this game what so ever...

 

yes you can pull of some finishers but if there are 2-3 in the same room they will see you after the initial stealth attack...

 

i want to go through a whole level just taking ppl out (mark of the ninja style)

 

but i still love this game and what they are doing with it... so just my only complaint...

seeing how i have done a assassination mission with a rhino and no alarms where tripped.  there is stealth in the game and the devs have said they they will be working on improving it. i hope it will be improved in update 11. if you want to be stealthy use ash or loki with silent weapons.

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"There is stealth... no one can see you if they're all dead!" - Ash on a tuesday

 

---

 

But seriously, I think the devs are revising the stealth system. As it stands now, it works on a room to room basis : get detected in a room and they go after you. If you can manage to take down anyone going for a terminal, then the next rooms will still have not taken notice of you. It's both a matter of not being seen and a matter of taking control of the area when you are.

Edited by Wiegraf
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yeah im just looking for at least some type of implementation of it, besides a maybe stealth attack that goes unnoticed and be able to has some type of distracting other then ablitiys that when there over just alert them anyways....

 

or even special missions where you only have a melee, can you imagine a game of 4 ppl having to plan how to silently take out a room full of guys....be a blast....

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Actual ninjas were more stealth-oriented. The combat-oriented kind were the samurai.

 

Ninja lacked equipment and numbers to engage the enemy head-on and win. Samurai were Japanese version of European knights, so yeah. Tons of cash and resources to get decent armor and equipment and infantry to cover their back.

 

 

And yeah, so far the game is more like Parkur Pirates In SPAAACE! More stealth-oriented game modes or even stealth-oriented missions would be VERY welcome.

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Someone's never played Shinobi or Ninja Gaiden...

Also, the current most popular manga in the world is Naruto. 0 Stealth in that entire manga. Current plot is a fight with a full army and the destruction of an entire coastline, preceded by a fight destroying an entire village, preceded by multiple outright wars.

Ninja =/= stealth.

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The new stealth mods are close to useless as of now because of the mechanics. Stealth skills such as Banshee's silence are a joke.

There is absolutely no way to revert the AI's alerted status, once you're detected that's it, no more stealth attacks or sneaking.

There should also be a way to better see where enemies are focusing their attention, maybe with vision cones on the minimap?

Plus, even IF you take the great pains and sneak your way through a level to your objective, there is no real benefit as of now.

The closest thing to being a ninja in Warframe you can do is rush the crap out of maps and flip your way through hordes of enemies.

Edited by NIL0S
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Lets set aside misconceptions stemming from romanticized ninja for a moment and welcome the OP.  Hello OP, you must be new here.  Have you explored the search function yet?  It's a marvelous invention. 

 

In short, stealth is a low priority that has been getting very, very incremental updates such as a mod here and finishing moves there.  This has also been stated countless times by DE. 

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just to get that ball rolling.... but that is the only thing that bothers me about this game, is a game based on space ninjas and outside of haveing shade there is no stealth in this game what so ever...

 

yes you can pull of some finishers but if there are 2-3 in the same room they will see you after the initial stealth attack...

 

i want to go through a whole level just taking ppl out (mark of the ninja style)

 

but i still love this game and what they are doing with it... so just my only complaint...

 

the "job" space ninja can mean anything in the distant future. Same goes for engineer. An engineer could repair a ship while killing invaders or such stuff. Just because you connect ninja with the feudal japan meaning doesnt mean it has to be the same thing. And ninja basically used everything to get the job done. So please dont try to bring up this old cliche of a guy who is only sneaking through shadows and nothing else.....

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The new stealth mods are close to useless as of now because of the mechanics. Stealth skills such as Banshee's silence are a joke.

There is absolutely no way to revert the AI's alerted status, once you're detected that's it, no more stealth attacks or sneaking.

There should also be a way to better see where enemies are focusing their attention, maybe with vision cones on the minimap?

Plus, even IF you take the great pains and sneak your way through a level to your objective, there is no real benefit as of now.

The closest thing to being a ninja in Warframe you can do is rush the crap out of maps and flip your way through hordes of enemies.

 

Well, always willing to discuss mechanics a bit.  

 

Lets be honest here, the status reversion system as a concept is patently $&*&*#(%&.  Like full retard.  

 

Guard 1 - "OH NOZ THIS GUYS MURDERED SOME PEEPS" 

:5 minutes later:

Guard 1 - "Heh....I'm sure he's like a billion miles away by now."

Guard 2 - "Hey pete, lets go make hot pockets"

Guard 1 - "Totes."

 

Stealth is possible btw, and the mods actually aren't useless.  It's just not EASY which I think is your real complaint.  It is very much possible to stealth certain mission types (really something that should be done solo). 

 

Don't really feel vision cones or overt indicators are a great idea, it's a cheap gimmicky crutch.  Perhaps decibel a indicator on your side and maybe limited ECM of sorts to jack up their communications temporarily. 

 

Stealth rewards are a definite must without doubt, and they have to match the time it takes to perform missions stealth.  That is to say, stealthing takes so much longer (lets say 3x for argument) so we should get 3x the (average) resources/mods as a reward. 

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Stealth IS a mechanic in the game... just not very polished and definitely not worthwhile.  Maybe it is kinda back burner'd but it is there and is kinda a core mechanic of a few frames.  There are a few issues, one being it is much more effective to either flash past all the enemies with shade or loki/ash + shade than it is to sneak and kill.  OR better to simply stomp the whole room before they can reach the alarm.

 

There are possibilities to make stealth useful but maybe not as rewarding.  Things like the repeated phrase from the oracle in assassinate and capture missions "we don't want them to know you're coming"  well they could ramp up the difficulty if you are detected before reaching the target?  Would that make the general player base cry though?

Or a spy mission where if you are detected before you gather all the data units they get locked down and you fail.  Challenging... but would that make the general playerbade cry?

Same with a rescue mission if you are detected before you get there then the room with the prisoner is chalk full of heavies/ancients waiting for you?

 

The mechanics are there.  But right now the implementation/balance/rewards are lacking.

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Someone's never played Shinobi or Ninja Gaiden...

Also, the current most popular manga in the world is Naruto. 0 Stealth in that entire manga. Current plot is a fight with a full army and the destruction of an entire coastline, preceded by a fight destroying an entire village, preceded by multiple outright wars.

Ninja =/= stealth.

 

This. Ninjas encompass many different genres and "jobs". Long story short - they do what they need to do to get the job done. That could be from direct attack, subterfuge, or blowing S#&$ up.

 

As for Warframe, all I'm hoping for is a stealth only mission being implemented at some point. Maybe have the whole area be "Low Light" and thus Grineer/Corpus are unable to see as well. Can even give them a "Cone of Vision" on the radar. If the Tenno is caught, the mission automatically restarts. Or they forfeit part of the reward in some way. Infact...

 

Example: The Grineer got ahold of a powerful artifact, but simply rushing in and busting heads is not viable, as they are willing to destroy it if they detect any Tenno on board. Your job is to get to the artifact undetected. Detection = loss of the reward. The leeway would be that, if an enemy spots you, instead of immediately shooting you he'll rush towards the nearest alarm. If he's able to get to the alarm and stay there for a set amount of time, you lose the artifact. You'll be told to head to extraction.

 

This makes things both challenging and fun, and stops people from just bumrushing this particular mission.

 

Edit: of course... Melee/silent weaponry only. And maybe give it its own Challenge (You know, where you kill 30 things with rifles and etc) -  Melee only.

Edited by SoulEchelon
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Someone's never played Shinobi or Ninja Gaiden...

Also, the current most popular manga in the world is Naruto. 0 Stealth in that entire manga. Current plot is a fight with a full army and the destruction of an entire coastline, preceded by a fight destroying an entire village, preceded by multiple outright wars.

Ninja =/= stealth.

so much time on the ninja Gaiden games

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