Ninja Game With No Stealth...

[YouHaveShamedYoFamory]

just to get that ball rolling.... but that is the only thing that bothers me about this game, is a game based on space ninjas and outside of haveing shade there is no stealth in this game what so ever...

 

yes you can pull of some finishers but if there are 2-3 in the same room they will see you after the initial stealth attack...

 

i want to go through a whole level just taking ppl out (mark of the ninja style)

 

but i still love this game and what they are doing with it... so just my only complaint...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Cortot]

After the bad change with the Mag's Pull, I came to think that the developers should not touch the things going well enough. Stealth matter is good indeed but it should be implemented in Warframe2. I've seen many games which introduced 'brand-new system' got spoiled.

 

Sorry for serious and uninteresting conclusion, but I believe it's true.

[Relkin]

After the bad change with the Mag's Pull, I came to think that the developers should not touch the things going well enough. Stealth matter is good indeed but it should be implemented in Warframe2. I've seen many games which introduced 'brand-new system' got spoiled.

 

Sorry for serious and uninteresting conclusion, but I believe it's true.

Warframe 2? The games still in beta/active development lol geeze its something they're adding over time, bit by bit.  Yes though, base your decision off a single change.  It's not like they're constantly changing and re-balancing things based on our feedback or anything. 

[NalkorRN]

Warframe is primarily an action game. Sure it also has some stealth functions, but those are underwhelming when playing with three other trigger-happy dudes. And currently, stealth play isn't as rewarding, as you avoid kills in order to be Super Sneaky Ninja.

 

I'd love to see actual stealth in Warframe, but I'll also want it be done right. Still waiting for cooldown on enemy alarm state. Only then we can switch between action and stealth playstyle, instead of "Stealt- nope you got spotted, action mode on"

Wanna know a game that does Stealth right? Batman: Arkham City. Batman is more of a ninja than the Tenno.

[Skeptic]

I personally would like to see more stealth based game-play too.  Maybe special maps where it's more workable?

How about smaller rewards if you complete the special stealth mission but fail to do it quietly?

Maybe as a special single-player alert, so other players don't mess it up?

Why not an invite only stealth mission map for groups where each of the 4 players have to try and stealthily take out 2-4 different targets at almost the same time making them work together over distances?

Edited September 24, 2013 by Skeptic

[NalkorRN]

I personally would like to see more stealth based game-play too.  Maybe special maps where it's more workable?

How about smaller rewards if you complete the special stealth mission but fail to do it quietly?

Maybe as a special single-player alert, so other players don't mess it up?

Why not an invite only stealth mission map for groups where each of the 4 players have to try and stealthily take out 2-4 different targets at almost the same time making them work together over distances?

The biggest problem to any stealth game-play or taking your time in general is how once the enemy is alerted, it stays that way and they are infinite in number and resources.

[NIL0S]

I don't expect mobs to pretend nobody ever trespassed. I'm okay with heightened alert state. What i don't understand is that, if they spot you once, they will forever know your position anywhere in the map and rush it. You can't do stealth attacks anymore. That's nonsensical. I should be able to slit a guy's throat if he isn't looking in my direction, even if he is aware that there is somebody around out to get him.

 

[NIL0S]

(...)  It's just not EASY which I think is your real complaint.  (...)

You're making assumptions right there. Stealth is not viable, even if you bother with it, it has absolutely no purpose, it's just a gimmick as of now.

[spinestomper]

i think the biggest thing is able to string kills as well as it just being not so easy to be noticed.... if you could combo/string kills then it wouldnt matter if there is more then 1 or 2 enemies in a room... and since its int the distant future, i feel teleportation is a option, almost like ash's ability...

 

but make it more streamlined with stealth kills, like a meter of sorts to keep it going... or a mod that for every stealth kill you stay (without shade or with) invisable for X amount of seconds per kill.....

 

just would love to see it utilized more without the frustration of the first awesome stealth kill, and A. there was a guy 100 feet away that still saw you, or B. he gets up with half health to have everyone be alerted.....

[onemoonlight]

Grab a sniper rifle with hush mod. Be stealthy... FROM 10 MILES AWAY!

[Eggus]

Assassination? Dont make me laugh. Thats not assassination, thats just boss fight.

Well...the boss will always know what's coming! It's like, they can speak to you even though the alarms are not even activated.

[Eggus]

I don't expect mobs to pretend nobody ever trespassed. I'm okay with heightened alert state. What i don't understand is that, if they spot you once, they will forever know your position anywhere in the map and rush it. You can't do stealth attacks anymore. That's nonsensical. I should be able to slit a guy's throat if he isn't looking in my direction, even if he is aware that there is somebody around out to get him.

They should crowd around the dead body of someone you killed and start looking around, not immediately know your location and rush over in a desperate attempt to wipe you out.

 

Anyway, even if stealth was well implemented, it would most probably still take more time. Ain't everybody got time fo dat. So we just go swords flashin' and guns blazin'

 

Someone's never played Shinobi or Ninja Gaiden...

Also, the current most popular manga in the world is Naruto. 0 Stealth in that entire manga. Current plot is a fight with a full army and the destruction of an entire coastline, preceded by a fight destroying an entire village, preceded by multiple outright wars.

Ninja =/= stealth.

Dude...it's a manga. Can you imagine a manga where the ninjas are stealthy, sneaking past all the guards, killing only the target and flying away? BAWring.

 

The stealth genre is slowly fading away into nothingness. Stealth games that used to be so fun like Splinter Cell 2, 3, have become run n gun games (see Conviction and Blacklist). Goodbye Stealth.

Edited September 25, 2013 by Eggsss

[Relkin]

I don't expect mobs to pretend nobody ever trespassed. I'm okay with heightened alert state. What i don't understand is that, if they spot you once, they will forever know your position anywhere in the map and rush it. You can't do stealth attacks anymore. That's nonsensical. I should be able to slit a guy's throat if he isn't looking in my direction, even if he is aware that there is somebody around out to get him.

Auto-magically knowing your position is a BS move on par with sight cones, exclamation marks, and other chintzy outdated mechanics I will grant you that.  Getting the stealth (silent) kill on him if taken from behind is something I'm personally OK with so long as it doesn't proc during normal combat (although we should have alternative melee combo's/executions we can perform imo during normal combat). 

 

You're making assumptions right there. Stealth is not viable, even if you bother with it, it has absolutely no purpose, it's just a gimmick as of now.

If you define purpose by a shiney cookie that's on you.  If you are looking to challenge yourself then yes it very much serves a purpose.

 

*EDIT* A caveat to this I just thought of, if they add a reward everybody will want it so stealth will get newbified to the ground like everything else so all the dirty filthy l2p scrubs will be able to get their shiney cookie. 

 

 

They should crowd around the dead body of someone you killed and start looking around, not immediately know your location and rush over in a desperate attempt to wipe you out.

 

Anyway, even if stealth was well implemented, it would most probably still take more time. Ain't everybody got time fo dat. So we just go swords flashin' and guns blazin'

 

The stealth genre is slowly fading away into nothingness. Stealth games that used to be so fun like Splinter Cell 2, 3, have become run n gun games (see Conviction and Blacklist). Goodbye Stealth.

1.  They shouldn't crowd around a dead body, the concept is ludicrous.  A room full armed guards that know there are ninja bad-asses out there waging war against their empire and one of them stumbles onto a body, the last thing they're going to do is crowd the F*** around it and gawk like retards.  

 

2.  The time thing is something that is up to the individual, there are those who enjoy the challenge.  Of course if a reward incentive was added it could attract more positive attention and ergo dev attention. 

 

3.  Most stealth games were pretty mediocre at best admit it.  Hide, wait for guard to go along predetermined path then make your way to the next conveniently placed hidey hole.  Oh you killed somebody?  Welp better hide for 2 minutes while everybody on this military base forgets there is a homicidal intruder and goes back to @(*()$ off.  Don't even get me started on the crippling UI indicators.... 

Edited September 25, 2013 by Relkin

[Eggus]

1.  They shouldn't crowd around a dead body, the concept is ludicrous.  A room full armed guards that know there are ninja bad-asses out there waging war against their empire and one of them stumbles onto a body, the last thing they're going to do is crowd the F*** around it and gawk like retards.  

 

Well at least be on alert when they see the body, not rush over to where the player is (it's like the dead body told them the tenno's exact location).

Edited September 25, 2013 by Eggsss

[Relkin]

Well at least be on alert when they see the body, not rush over to where the player is (it's like the dead body told them the tenno's exact location).

Definitely go alert, yeah.  I'd say at the very least have them secure the exits/entrances and then call a security team to fan through the room.  Would also be helpful if alerts weren't ship wide (I'm under the impression these ships are friggen massive) but more compartmentalized or at least give us the ability to hack into their network and localize and/or stop the alert.  ECM's to prevent radio chatter/alarm triggers for a small duration of time would be a really sweet gear piece too. 

[Vigilance]

As it was said before. Ninja's faught to protect themselves and used stealthy tactics to give them an edge against enemies far more powerful than them. Head to head combat was effectively suicide. Ninja's didn't really wear black jump suits either, they were spies, intelligence gatherers. So if you want to go "ninja fo realz", the warframes have to be significantly weaker, no power and nuke abilites, they should have special abilities that let them play their own stealth game while able to work within a team of ninja.

Right now, you are overwhelmingly more powerful than any single enemy, and even against waves of enemies, there are ways for each frame to blow the crap out of all of them. You weapons out match theirs. This is a reason stealth isn't viable, cause mowing through is faster, and more rewarding. You want to make stealth viable, at this point, you need a different game mode completely, like intel gathering missions. ACTUAL intel gathering, not hacking computers, and killing legions with a pistol or throwing knives with your free hand.

[magusat999]

The mechanics for stealth play are simply not here (yet). maybe in the futue DE will come up with something, but right now you just have to struggle through "forcing" a steath operation yourself. When I hear stealth - and there are supposed to be stealth missions in this game because the category exists, btw - I think a game more like Tenchu than Ninja Geidan. ninja Gaidan is more like Warframe, in that there is more open combat than actual stealth. Tenchu actually rewards you for stealth and has a glut of stealth-based mechanics.

 

For stealth play, you need to be able to hide and be undetected (another good example is the Manslaughter series). You should be able to use shadows, cover and out of the way places. There should be line of sight - enemies shouldn't "detect you" - they should have to see you. There should be some kind of indicator letting you know if your becoming detected. There should be silent kills - both melee and mid / long range weaponry. You should be able to escape and become undetected again. You should be able to stick to surfaces (stamina eliminates that). There could be a clone function, where you can disguise yourself as the enemy and pass through them undetected. Your stealth options should range from using stealth to kill everything in a mission, to sneaking your way to the objective and leaving completely undetected.

 

but like I said, that's not possible now - but who knows in the future?

[spinestomper]

even if its special mission type, "stealth" dun dun dunnnnnnnnnnnn..... were everything we are adding is in that mode.... not the entire game... but just something... i dont need cones or anyything like that.... just alittle more leeeeeeee way to them not detecting me.... if i throw a kunia and take one of them out, then hell yes they should be running around, maybe not hitting the alarm immediatly, but also not detecting me and taking cover before i even know THEY are there....

 

i just like a change of pace, insted of either rushing (usally what exterminate, capture, sabotoge are now) or defensive type mission... something alittle more relaxed with if you wanna say skill, or just awesome super epic ninja uber moves  TO THE FACE!

[AttackNitro]

just to get that ball rolling.... but that is the only thing that bothers me about this game, is a game based on space ninjas and outside of haveing shade there is no stealth in this game what so ever...

 

What about Loki and Ash? Two warframes dedicated to stealth play...

[WARLOCKE]

I hate everyone. Ninja = farmer who moonlights as a jerk.

 

Edit : And I mean the food growing type of farmer. yuk yuk.

Edited September 25, 2013 by WARLOCKE

[WARLOCKE]

What about Loki and Ash? Two warframes dedicated to stealth play...

 

I dont see how ash is :dedicated to stealth. He has one skill that lends itself to that idea. Ash is meant to be a hit and run fighter. Its why smoke bomb has such a short duration. And Loki is just in the game to troll other players be it in missions or the conclave.

[Wahooo]

I dont see how ash is :dedicated to stealth. He has one skill that lends itself to that idea. Ash is meant to be a hit and run fighter. Its why smoke bomb has such a short duration. And Loki is just in the game to troll other players be it in missions or the conclave.

Shuriken is a silent kill on multiple enemies.  The other two are to get close so you can melee them silently.  Ash is made to try and stealth, and kill silently.

[Primagen_VA]

The game has many Japanese inspired elements..

 

Skana, Bo, Paris, Shuriken, Kunai, Kogage, Bolto, Amphis, Gram, Lotus, Loki, Ash, Volt, Excalibur and Rhino ( Okay Rhino is mor likely a Samurai)

 

But for the most people they see Ninjas more as assasins than spies.

 

But what me brothers is... ninjas have a special training for assasinations on people. - And I cant silentkill grunts with my damn lvl 28 fangs with a 100% crit and + 100% melee damage..... thats just frustrating

 

Some times I think its possible to see some hidden paths for stealth play. Carriers on the celling, holes, etc.. mostly reach able as Loki, Ash, Excalibur and Nova. Only thing is.... you cant do s***** because ther is no possibility to stealthkill or oneshot them with a "death from above" move.

 

 

To stealth play it self there ar more possibilitys than we can see now... hidden paths, hidden places and great observations/ supressive fire points ( uranus - titania ceeling - I love it )

I would like to see a conection to each point.

 

Some kind of mod that makes it possible to have a MGS like radar with vision cones. Or like the Rainbow Six Radar ( old ones with the circle with the line )

 

Also ther would be, only without triggerted alert or higher alert status, a cover system that you can change cover more easely- trigger the alarm and be adaptive shoot/ rush you way throug the enemy base.

 

 

Just my 2 cents.... :p

[Relkin]

The mechanics for stealth play are simply not here (yet). maybe in the futue DE will come up with something, but right now you just have to struggle through "forcing" a steath operation yourself. When I hear stealth - and there are supposed to be stealth missions in this game because the category exists, btw - I think a game more like Tenchu than Ninja Geidan. ninja Gaidan is more like Warframe, in that there is more open combat than actual stealth. Tenchu actually rewards you for stealth and has a glut of stealth-based mechanics.

 

For stealth play, you need to be able to hide and be undetected (another good example is the Manslaughter series). You should be able to use shadows, cover and out of the way places. There should be line of sight - enemies shouldn't "detect you" - they should have to see you. There should be some kind of indicator letting you know if your becoming detected. There should be silent kills - both melee and mid / long range weaponry. You should be able to escape and become undetected again. You should be able to stick to surfaces (stamina eliminates that). There could be a clone function, where you can disguise yourself as the enemy and pass through them undetected. Your stealth options should range from using stealth to kill everything in a mission, to sneaking your way to the objective and leaving completely undetected.

 

but like I said, that's not possible now - but who knows in the future?

Please, can we NOT implement archaic mechanics like amnesiac guards and absurd magic indicators?  Silent kills already exist by the by. 

 

I hate everyone. Ninja = farmer who moonlights as a jerk.

 

Edit : And I mean the food growing type of farmer. yuk yuk.

Actually what you are talking about is the Oniwabanshu. 

[Vigilance]

Please, can we NOT implement archaic mechanics like amnesiac guards and absurd magic indicators?  Silent kills already exist by the by. 

 

Actually what you are talking about is the Oniwabanshu. 

You mean those silent kills that don't kill anything, or even barely scratch enemies higher then lv 30? After the laughable amount of damage I do slicing the guys throat, his friends are notified immediately. And while the stealth mechanics presented are archaic, it's still leagues better than the mechanic we have now, which is... barely existent.