Jump to content
(PS4)InkCN

Veterans misunderstand why they don't enjoy playing the game anymore

Recommended Posts

25 minutes ago, (PS4)GEN-Son_17 said:

Here's what's weird: You guys are speaking as if there were no attempts AND that they're not continuing to attempt to make you guys happy. Raids and Dark Sector were NOT BEING USED and, somehow, you glorify it now? DE has the stats folks and justifyingly removed them to try something different! In a relationship, there is a such thing as a toxic partner. Some vets have become that. 

There was very little to nothing in the game that ever stated raids were a thing. I didn't learn about them until the Twitch streamer I started watching back when plains released said something about it or maybe looking into arcane. But don't worry raids are only TEMPORARILY removed. "This is NOT the end to Trials. Our Designers have put in an incredible amount of blood, sweat, and tears into creating, fixing, and maintaining Trials. Not to mention the blood, sweat, and tears YOU as a Community have put into them! The upkeep of the Trials in a world where so many bigger plans are in motion are taking much needed brainpower and time."

 

Warframe's twitch channel also said new raids will come into the game when commenting on WF stream by WF Partner RandomSurge but that was already a year ago or something silly time wise like that, plus we didn't really know who was using the account could it of been megan, rebbecca, danielle, scott, sheldon, I dunno. 

You want to talk about Dark Sector? Alright, lets talk about Dark Sector. In my personal experience I never got the chance to experience it because it was removed sometime before I started playing in around mid 2017. So my opinion on them is moot. 

You know what I will talk about? Conclave. I wasn't aroudn when it was introduced, but I heard it was because the community asked for PvP and even if that's not true. Look how it turned out. If Raids were removed from lack of players then certainly Conclave could and possibly if not likely should have met the same fate. if Red text could poll WF users, I'd bet logged in players at least 40% of them wouldn't even know what Lunaro is. Hell, DE could announce Lunaro as a new game mode on Dev stream on April 1st 2020 and people would be like " Wow, it isn't a joke!" 

Also I can only imagine many players want longer Octavia notes. But what does the game get this next update. Some weird guitar Steve likes. Fine, whatever it's HIS game, not the community. It generally only takes 2+ years of the community begging, pleading for something for DE to actually make it a reality. From Uni-Vac to "More Riven mod slot." 

 

 

Three things happen from here on out. 

1. players remain hyper casual never maxing out their MR only using frames they like (looking at you Rhino, Saryn.)

2. They hit MR cap, obtain "everything" and get bored like any other veteran player does and sees the flaws of catering most of dev work to cosmetics or something half baked like Dog Days, Frame Fighter, Shawzin. Maybe they'll log in every day to get the weapons and primed mods and play a mission if that. 

3. DE finally steps up and makes content for all three tiers of players. new, mid game and endgame. You know what I've ever seen from the community? Asking DE to leave players behind. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Fire2box said:

There was very little to nothing in the game that ever stated raids were a thing. I didn't learn about them until the Twitch streamer I started watching back when plains released said something about it or maybe looking into arcane. But don't worry raids are only TEMPORARILY removed. "This is NOT the end to Trials. Our Designers have put in an incredible amount of blood, sweat, and tears into creating, fixing, and maintaining Trials. Not to mention the blood, sweat, and tears YOU as a Community have put into them! The upkeep of the Trials in a world where so many bigger plans are in motion are taking much needed brainpower and time."

 

Warframe's twitch channel also said new raids will come into the game when commenting on WF stream by WF Partner RandomSurge but that was already a year ago or something silly time wise like that, plus we didn't really know who was using the account could it of been megan, rebbecca, danielle, scott, sheldon, I dunno. 

You want to talk about Dark Sector? Alright, lets talk about Dark Sector. In my personal experience I never got the chance to experience it because it was removed sometime before I started playing in around mid 2017. So my opinion on them is moot. 

You know what I will talk about? Conclave. I wasn't aroudn when it was introduced, but I heard it was because the community asked for PvP and even if that's not true. Look how it turned out. If Raids were removed from lack of players then certainly Conclave could and possibly if not likely should have met the same fate. if Red text could poll WF users, I'd bet logged in players at least 40% of them wouldn't even know what Lunaro is. Hell, DE could announce Lunaro as a new game mode on Dev stream on April 1st 2020 and people would be like " Wow, it isn't a joke!" 

Also I can only imagine many players want longer Octavia notes. But what does the game get this next update. Some weird guitar Steve likes. Fine, whatever it's HIS game, not the community. It generally only takes 2+ years of the community begging, pleading for something for DE to actually make it a reality. From Uni-Vac to "More Riven mod slot." 

 

 

Three things happen from here on out. 

1. players remain hyper casual never maxing out their MR only using frames they like (looking at you Rhino, Saryn.)

2. They hit MR cap, obtain "everything" and get bored like any other veteran player does and sees the flaws of catering most of dev work to cosmetics or something half baked like Dog Days, Frame Fighter, Shawzin. Maybe they'll log in every day to get the weapons and primed mods and play a mission if that. 

3. DE finally steps up and makes content for all three tiers of players. new, mid game and endgame. You know what I've ever seen from the community? Asking DE to leave players behind. 

Ouch...I'll have to prepare my husband for leaving the game if raids become a thing in WF.  I'll have to tell him maybe he shouldn't spend the kind of money he's spending on the game.  We both went to play another game because they said there wouldn't be raids, and he left that game when they rolled raids out as a major part of an expansion that he wouldn't have bought if he had known.

  • Woah 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Lutesque said:

Yes... but in all the examples you mentioned (except for Dark Souls) those games weren't challenging at the expense of being Fun...

LoL.... you can't bring an Unranked Frame to ESO.... The game wont let you.... 

 

All these games had different interpretations of challenge but don't confuse challenging with difficult.You would be suprised at how many people never defeated the 1st Super Mario game but that didn't make the game to fail.That was the message i wanted to pass with my examples.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The reason he says stop is every game reaches an end. Endgame content or not you will exhaust the game and you will hate it if you play more

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really don't understand these kind of threads. At one side we have : " new players are overwhelmed by contect! DE do something!" and on the other side : "old players have no content to play! DE do something!"

DE has been pushing updates regularly with small/big content for us to grind our teeth out.

Does it last long until we finnish it? Ofcourse not. What game has a sustainable endgame? 99% of games, the endgame is either lacking or simply not even there.

The thing that warframe has, and it will always have an advantage over other titles, is regular updates with more and more content.

Also, we should aproach the term "vet" with caution. What exactly does a "vet" mean?

Because latetly a lot of people calling themselves vets, bring their ideas to the forum about changing the basic aspects of the game without consideration about what warframe really is.

We are playing an ever evolving game. With new updates coming. New missions, new story, new stuff.

But we never say "hey! This is amazing. I'm playing this game for so long and it still bringing new stuff every year!"

Everyone wants Warframe to fit their own perspective of what fun is.

Let's make warframe like fortnite or sekiro or minecraft. Better yet, let's make warframe like Starcraft!

But warframe isn't those games. Warframe is warframe. And you like it. Instead of playing other games, you want yo play warframe with a game mode LIKE the other game. That's how mich you like warframe.

Also, noone ever said " hey guys, all these updates, all these bug fixes, all this new content with story and items and balancing, takes a lot of time for the devs to code, implemeny, test, fix, optimize etc.

All i see is "why isn't DE launching the update now?! I want it now! Those lazy bastards are delaying again! How hard can it be?! Just push some buttons there DE! "

But no, we enjoy to complain. We enjoy to receive their updates and piss on their work because, somehow, we expect more and more and more. Ironicaly , we get more and more and more, but still we complain.

Why?

Because we're vets?

No.

Because we're NOT vets.

A vet would know how the game began and how it is at this point. How much it evolved, how much work has been put to optimize, to create comtent, QoL, etc .

A vet would know how awful was before and how much much better is now.

A vet would know how to not burn himself and end up saying " i have nothing left to do"

 

 

 

 

  • Like 2
  • Haha 1
  • Applause 3
  • Upvote 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Melkfet said:

 

Let's make warframe like fortnite or sekiro or minecraft. Better yet, let's make warframe like Starcraft!

I'd vote for year 2007 EVE Online, but no one knows what that was like anymore. 😞

  • Applause 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

btw...props to DE for all the bug fixes...we get bug fixes in a week or two where some other games, especially those that are PC only have bugs for months or years or ones that have never been fixed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, DeathDweller said:

All these games had different interpretations of challenge but don't confuse challenging with difficult.You would be suprised at how many people never defeated the 1st Super Mario game but that didn't make the game to fail.That was the message i wanted to pass with my examples.

Im not surprised at all... IM ONE OF THOSE PEOPLE !!! 😞

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Fire2box said:

3. DE finally steps up and makes content for all three tiers of players. new, mid game and endgame. You know what I've ever seen from the community? Asking DE to leave players behind. 

And there is the failure of every vet...scratch that, of every endgame or "I'm bored" vet. This game is gigantic but, if played for years and years and years, no amount of development time can provide a "fix" for those types of players. The focus, therefore, shouldn't be on players they will not be able to please. 

Here's the thing: Disruption is a great game mode but it's a game mode within the same game with a difficulty level most can't handle past the second round. Those "hardcore vets" that have reached 4k+ points there have already gotten the rewards and are demanding more content while the new and average players are struggling. So, what do you do? Would you create harder stuff that would satisfy the few vets for a while but piss off the new and mid level players or would you stay with what made Warframe one of the greatest games ever made? 

Lastly, don't be fooled folks. DE has worked harder than most AAA companies and have cursed themselves by openly keeping us in the loop of progress. We are spoiled to demand sustainable content that could last every type of player till another update while STILL DEMANDING EVERYTHING IN BETWEEN. Try as hard as you may but there is no maturity in a demand to continually feed an addiction. Taking a break is the best and most logical advice and you guys are fighting it as if Warframe somehow cheated you? This entire vet thing will go down in history as the dumbest issue in millennial gaming history. I still place the blame squarely on a few content creators though. Bashing a business that placed you on the map is dumb as hell. 

  • Haha 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Personally I think right now there are two core issues:

  • Veteran players remember a time when Warframe was getting regular, small parcels of content. Yes, a lot of those were simple things like new weapons, but it meant almost every week there was something new to try out. Right now Warframe has become something more akin to a conventional triple A game, like Destiny, with large parcels of content delivered infrequently, with long content droughts in between punctuated by updates with cash shop items only.
  • From a business perspective, veteran players do not enrich Warframe as they are far less likely to spend real money than new players, as they have already likely invested money into the game and have reach a stage where they are now grinding for all the items they want. There will always be exceptions to this, but as with Games Workshop and the transition from it's 2nd to 3rd Edition of Warhammer 40,000, the focus has shifted to the detriment of veteran players.

The fact that a number of the Content Creator for Warframe are either abandoning it entirely due to burnout, or are simply not making videos and streams due to a lack of things to talk about indicative of this transition and it honestly makes me worried about the long term future of the game unless DE pauses to look at what is happening and actively decides to try and do something to slow the departures.

  • Like 1
  • Applause 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

STOP !! Stop playing Warframe (at least for some amount of time). Playing a game countless of hours every day isn't sustainable unless unlimited amount of content (spoiler: it's impossible).

Revelation

I totally agree as a vet i mean out there is a crazy amount of games you can play with. If you are not interested into an other game a will give an adivice if an Big Update releases just STOP grind that hard i mean gauss is not going to be removed from the game after a while so chill don't grind for the weapons just don't you have a lot already as a vet already owning broken weapons so no point , Just play for an hour a day(if you are so desperate and you want to play warframe) you will have time to do your grind for a little bit and you play the game as you want. I was the player who i would play(had warframe running) 10 hours per day so i had a lot of time to do stuff with the result to start seeing warframe as a boring game (playing 5 years)I Just have done all of it Let me Give you an example, You have purchased a single player game you finished the story= you have finished the game unlocked all the customizations collected all the collectables so dead end nothing to do ITS NORMAL after a while you don't have something to do with it so you move on starting playing an other game.I mean yeah sure all players want more content but NO you don't want more content YOU want More BIG Content we get Updates like Tusk thumpers, POE remaster, Jovian Concord, but they we don't get the Game Changer we want we only get changes to some stuff like new UI and all that sure but this is not what we want maybe the solution should be release Big Updates With A LOT content like fortuna not only a new gamemode with slightly new mods and no rewards for the vets to play.But this is IMPOSSIBLE SO JUST TAKE A BREAK . Play other games learn new stuff that you are interested with.

Anyway guys DE knows what is doing (i believe) they want to release 2-3 BIG Updates in 1 year like this year 1. Big Update Jovian Concord 2. Empyrean 3.New War and Last year we got 2 big updates 1.Sacrifice 2.Fortuna DON'T FORGET warframe will be here for a long time so chill if they release all the good stuff now (something they are not able to do) what they will release in the feature check overwatch for example i think has 1-2 Updates that they get new map and a new champion nothing else i am not sure i don't play overwatch i mean just chill guys and ENJOY LIFE ^^      oh that comment was a big one xD

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 2: Bring purpose to the "looter"

The entire looting aspect of Warframe follow this one rule: Everything you do or collect will turn out useful in your progression sooner or later. Nothing is actually useless in the game, and it helps giving the player a sense of accomplishment even tho he might not even know what he is grinding towards at the moment. You end up doing and collecting everything because you have the certainty you're not waisting your time whatever you're doing or will wanna achieve later. Except grinding has an inevitable limitation which is itself, you cannot farm more than what there is to be farm.

There are a plethora of useless items and mods in the game mate.  While I do agree that there needs to be more purpose  about 85% of the mods in the game are .... useless.... and as a vet myself I don’t appreciate the ideology that it’s our fault that we believe that DE puts out half baked content. Most of us feel this way because most of the content is... well half baked unpolished or an unfinished idea that gets left for them to pick up something else 

 

On 2019-08-22 at 9:02 PM, (PS4)GEN-Son_17 said:

Thus, the vets who are bored SHOULD step away, allow the new generation to begin their journey and wait until thegame has evolved enough to give you a fresh new feeling. Personally, I'm 5 years in and still haven't completed everything so I have nothing but respect for ANY form of entertainment that has kept me engaged this long. I can offer constructive criticism but never a complaint. DE's product is too good for that. 

Again telling us to leave because it’s nothing to do for us isn’t a solution. DE’s product is far from perfect and has been lacking in quality for a while at least in my opinion.

 

On 2019-08-22 at 8:42 PM, Bloop said:
On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 1: Turn the "rpg/shooter" into something unique

This point isn't exactly relevant to argue anything, especially given the topic title. We all liked it, we all LIKE it.

On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 2: Bring purpose to the "looter"

Everything you do or collect will turn out useful in your progression sooner or later. Nothing is actually useless in the game.

Tell that to the ammo drums, Sure Shots, and so on, useless mods that haven't been buffed after years, which even new players begin to understand how useless they actually are mechanically.

Or the millions of resources that have no use, especially when you own a clan and all research is done, because there is not much content that helps keep clans alive either.

On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 3: Draw attention away from the grind to break the "repetitive" loop

Trying this only gets you so far, and yet, I'm still trying to see what your point exactly is.

 

On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 4: The veteran dilemma

You call it hating as if we hated the game. I'm sorry to burst your bubble, we don't. We don't hate the game, being critic with a game doesn't by any means imply there's hate, some of us just don't like how things are being handled, and that's pretty much it.

 

On 2019-08-22 at 8:17 PM, (PS4)InkCN said:

Phase 5: The solution

This gives nothing new either, that's the first thing a lot of people resort to.

Frankly, the points given here are just assumptions with a very obvious answer, and then you finish it with a "nobody is in the wrong", which is not realistic.

Check the game activity from "big" updates, then check the three months afterwards, you'll see what's going on, it's certainly not just us, it's certainly not hating the game, it's the fact that people don't stick around for long enough because you can breeze through content like it's nothing.

And no, it doesn't take countless of hours every day to do this. Most nightwave acts can be done in less than 2 hours. Leveling a warframe, with your buddy: 3 minutes easily. Leveling and formaing a weapon? Less than 30 minutes. Then what's left? Nothing, no incentive to play at all until we get new content (that sadly, we'll breeze through in less than a month), and content, as you said, is taking longer and longer times, which is making even content creators either take a break or straight up leave.

A game should avoid living off activity spikes

Ahh... never mind someone beat me to it

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hmmm.  Not sure if anyone has said this but maybe we should ask why some veterans like playing the game and some don't and what are the percentages.  It's possible that the percentage of mid-experience people who don't like playing is the same as that for vets, or noobs, in which case not sure whether DE can do anything about it if they each want something different.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Hououza said:

Personally I think right now there are two core issues:

  • Veteran players remember a time when Warframe was getting regular, small parcels of content. Yes, a lot of those were simple things like new weapons, but it meant almost every week there was something new to try out. Right now Warframe has become something more akin to a conventional triple A game, like Destiny, with large parcels of content delivered infrequently, with long content droughts in between punctuated by updates with cash shop items only.
  • From a business perspective, veteran players do not enrich Warframe as they are far less likely to spend real money than new players, as they have already likely invested money into the game and have reach a stage where they are now grinding for all the items they want. There will always be exceptions to this, but as with Games Workshop and the transition from it's 2nd to 3rd Edition of Warhammer 40,000, the focus has shifted to the detriment of veteran players.

The fact that a number of the Content Creator for Warframe are either abandoning it entirely due to burnout, or are simply not making videos and streams due to a lack of things to talk about indicative of this transition and it honestly makes me worried about the long term future of the game unless DE pauses to look at what is happening and actively decides to try and do something to slow the departures.

I understand where you're coming from but you have to remember that, at that same time, people were complaining about wanting something bigger as well. The bigger issue is still players expecting DE to give them content their multi year experience can be "tested on", frequently and without the optimal methods to do it. If all of those requirements are needed to please the same group that will eventually tell everyone how to win anyway, then why bother with it now. 

The best solution for DE is to continue what they're doing. If the content looks good then come back. If not, play Anthem the "Warframe killer".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Swagernator22663 said:

Imagine someone telling you why you dont enjoy the game, what a prophet.

A prophet for profit.

Isn't that wonderful?

  • Haha 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, RunsWithChainsaws said:

btw...props to DE for all the bug fixes...we get bug fixes in a week or two where some other games, especially those that are PC only have bugs for months or years or ones that have never been fixed.

Warframe has had bugs for years that they ignore as well and many of the big content added is usually delayed a bit to fix stuff and it still released extremely buggy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, (PS4)GEN-Son_17 said:

Would you create harder stuff that would satisfy the few vets for a while but piss off the new and mid level players or would you stay with what made Warframe one of the greatest games ever made? 

That's what DE wanted with sorties, that's the entire purpose of them. 

Edited by Fire2box

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, (PS4)GEN-Son_17 said:

This entire vet thing will go down in history as the dumbest issue in millennial gaming history.

Warframe is still a game that's barely spoken about the the zeitgeist of gaming. And honestly unless DE changes something or players just do the same content over and over and over being happy as the first time they played it, they'll get to the point where they've done everything too. 

For now the only people who can be happy in warframe are the newer players, because the longer you play and get to know the game the more the flaws will show. 

  • Applause 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Цитата

At some point the magic trick of phase 3 will stop working on you because there's literally nothing left for you to grind. 

Yeah if you create nothing new.

Ironically, Destiny 2 that is a worse game almost in all aspects doesnt have that problem. Because it keeps raisinng the bar and because armor and weapons mean something there.

In warframe tho they mean nothing.

But whatever, I personally could live on cosmetics, new warframes and lore missions alone but guess what, warframe manages to **ck all of those up, especially new missions.

It even manages to **ck up missions that are new and I enjoy somewhat like ESO and Arbitration by not having *anything* there as rewards and in case of arbitration not allowing you to play modes you actually want to.

  • Satisfied 1
  • Applause 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Swagernator22663 said:

Imagine someone telling you why you dont enjoy the game, what a prophet.

Can relate. I chuckled reading OP opening and first thing I thought was "great, someone who thinks he/she can explain to me my own opinions on the game, except that those are not my opinions and OP is just trying to convince of something I totally don't agree with".

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, Olphalarepth said:

Can relate. I chuckled reading OP opening and first thing I thought was "great, someone who thinks he/she can explain to me my own opinions on the game, except that those are not my opinions and OP is just trying to convince of something I totally don't agree with".

It does seem a bit, misguided in a way.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not a vet here, but the thing I hate most atm is the NPCs from chorewave coming in and spoiling my syndicate missions or invasion missions, making it so it's a risk to even go looking for syndicate marks in any of the missions.  I've had interceptions and spy mission fail several times just because of zealot whosises.  Not cool to have to repeat missions that I have already spent quite a bit of time on to find the marks.  I've even decided to not do the invasion spy or rescue missions AT ALL because they seem to be doomed to failure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×
×
  • Create New...