Time to stop the absurd of the foundry

[adek183]

"What is that a mobile game?" Many people (Especially new players) have a hard time dealing with all these tiresome foundry craftings. "I have to grind all the resources AND wait 24 hours? No thanks!" I think it's time to finally put an end to this and either make the crafting time reasonable (Maximum 30 minutes) or get rid of it entirely. There's absolutely no reason to block out potential new players with this old and flawed system required amount of resources is a sufficient block already. No need to top it with ridiculous mobile-game worthy crafting times and I'm 100% sure DE has enough money to take the hit from rushing the craftings for the sake of greater good. Warframe afterall is all about the grind and what's the worst possible grind? Time-gates. Before you'll say "People will gain mastery too fast!!!!!!!! My 100% profile will be worthless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" So what? There's already a yet another timegate of 24 hours between each mastery rank test so a "Maxed" profile will still be pretty impressive and the general quality of life will be improved. If you think this system should stay as-is then give me one valid reason (Besides money. DE already demonstrated that they aren't some EA-like scum many times) to keep the timers.

PS: Bulk-crafting would be nice by the way.

Edited August 23, 2019 by adek183
Bolded out some important parts. Because people apparently just read the title and maybe first two sentences.

[Dr_Shadox]

I play since 2013 (with some break) and to be honest , the time in foundry isnt a big issue at all for me.

It's an issue if for example you want craft Octavia , you start craft 3 piece then you wait 24h (or 12h i've forget about parts) , in this case YES it's boring , you may feel like "i waste my time" , because you did it wrong.

The thing to do is you start your craft then you do something else , warframe have a large amount of content, you want Octavia so you craft her, you don't want limbo so you don't do his quest/craft ? Soon or late you'll need it , for play or even only for mastery, so during octavia craft , go farm for something else , it's never a waste of time, simple as that.

And i've speak about getting part of frame , but you can get mods you want , unlock the starmap if you  still have blue mission, farm credit, kill boss in open world, idk we have plenty of thing to do.

In the worst case play an another game and come back tomorrow.

[Uhkretor]

... From what I can tell...

 

... Its a problem for him/her, apparently...

 

 

And yes, bulk crafting for resources only would be appreciated, with respective time increment... After all... Higher quantity requires more time.

Edited August 23, 2019 by Uhkretor

[Catacomb]

1 minute ago, Dr_Shadox said:

snippysnoopsnoop

True, it's not that big of a deal but why work around it when it doesn't really bring anything positive to the game. There is already plenty of grind to pad out gameplay. Maybe there is some sort of adventage from a game dev point of view but not from a player's.

[peterc3]

22 minutes ago, adek183 said:

Besides money. DE already demonstrated that they aren't some EA-like scum many times

So they must swear off their material possessions to make your game? Why is it that this same system is in probably every other free game? There must be something that connects this free game with other free games. Feel free to respond.

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

Or maybe that's just people getting overwhelmed by it all, and wanting a more instant gratification since they can't have everything right then and there. Which is biased to say the least if they advocate for this change.

But there are good news. People don't have to really wait for the foundry to finish. They can bypass the waiting times by paying up. Such is the sacrifice in a Free to Play game. There is a choice to be made, at the very least. And people must decide what's more important to them - their money, or their time.

Edited August 23, 2019 by (PS4)Hikuro-93

[Nez-Kal]

Meanwhile I'm sitting here in my Elder Scrolls Online, only able to feed/train my Horse/Mount 1 point at a time, per 20 hours. X'D
 

[Nykerios]

11 minutes ago, adek183 said:

If you think this system should stay as-is then give me one valid reason (Besides money. DE already demonstrated that they aren't some EA-like scum many times) to keep the timers.

Player retention for a longer period of time. DE has gone over this before, the wait times gives you a reason to log back in the next day and check on it to keep you engaged. Making everything craft in 30 mins or less would just lead to more people whining about "lack of content" because they can craft everything in a short window of time. Not to mention if people were crafting new weapons/frames/etc. in a much shorter amount of time, they'd be running out of slots faster and then some would just start complaining about not having slots. The point of the game isn't to rush through everything as fast as possible.

[Tiltskillet]

31 minutes ago, adek183 said:

I'm 100% sure DE has enough money to take the hit

Only 100% sure?

[Clats01]

Welcome to the modern gamer, an entitled person who thinks they deserve everything in a game now. This is how free to play games keep people around by making crafting times that will make people come back if they want to use the item.

I too have played since 2013 and the time gating of the foundry has never been an issue to me.

[adek183]

14 minutes ago, Nykerios said:

Player retention for a longer period of time. DE has gone over this before, the wait times gives you a reason to log back in the next day and check on it to keep you engaged. Making everything craft in 30 mins or less would just lead to more people whining about "lack of content" because they can craft everything in a short window of time. Not to mention if people were crafting new weapons/frames/etc. in a much shorter amount of time, they'd be running out of slots faster and then some would just start complaining about not having slots. The point of the game isn't to rush through everything as fast as possible.

 

That's not really a problem. Like I said in the OP there is a grindwall in form of resources. This you CAN'T rush. Even with a resource booster you still need to unlock the planets which the resource comes from and farm it.

20 minutes ago, peterc3 said:

So they must swear off their material possessions to make your game? Why is it that this same system is in probably every other free game? There must be something that connects this free game with other free games. Feel free to respond.

Well how comes Path of Exile (also a free to play) doesn't have any time-gates? Yeah it has a different problem with nickling people for stash space but apparently it's possible to not make artifical time gates and have a succesful free to play title.

10 minutes ago, Tiltskillet said:

Only 100% sure?

Even 1000% sure if that makes any difference.

 

22 minutes ago, (PS4)Hikuro-93 said:

Or maybe that's just people getting overwhelmed by it all, and wanting a more instant gratification since they can't have everything right then and there. Which is biased to say the least if they advocate for this change.

But there are good news. People don't have to really wait for the foundry to finish. They can bypass the waiting times by paying up. Such is the sacrifice in a Free to Play game. There is a choice to be made, at the very least. And people must decide what's more important to them - their money, or their time.

You're trying to tell me that getting an item in a 30 minutes window which you still need to max rank and probably forma a few times is "Instant gratification"? I can see your white armor blinding me from miles away. Talking about bias.

[adek183]

4 minutes ago, Clats01 said:

Welcome to the modern gamer, an entitled person who thinks they deserve everything in a game now. This is how free to play games keep people around by making crafting times that will make people come back if they want to use the item.

I too have played since 2013 and the time gating of the foundry has never been an issue to me.

Welcome to the internet. Where some random money-slave tells people they're entitled for not liking time-walls. May I remind you that you also need to get resources to craft the item?

 

Edited August 23, 2019 by adek183

[Uhkretor]

... I blame the fact that there's even lazyness towards waiting... And yeah, its just like it sounds... Waiting is too much of a work, so the thing must be accessed BEFORE starting to build because he/she is too lazy to wait... As if Warframe is the only game in life... 😛

[Clats01]

Just now, adek183 said:

Welcome to the internet. Where some random money-slave tells people they're entitled for not liking time-walls.

 

I have very little money hence why i play free 2 play games, apparently you also never learned patience if waiting a few hours is a big deal for you

[adek183]

Just now, Clats01 said:

I have very little money hence why i play free 2 play games, apparently you also never learned patience if waiting a few hours is a big deal for you

Apparently you never played Path of Exile. Which is also a free to play also free of any form of timegates.

[Clats01]

I have, I didnt really like it much, and left

[Tsukinoki]

31 minutes ago, adek183 said:

That's not really a problem. Like I said in the OP there is a grindwall in form of resources. This you CAN'T rush. Even with a resource booster you still need to unlock the planets which the resource comes from and farm it.

Does farming resources give you a reason to come back the next day?  And the day after?  And the day after that?
No.
What gives most people a reason to come back the next day and the day after and the day after is they go "Oh, I have something new to try tomorrow!  I need to sign in to pick it up and use it!"
For frames it becomes "In a few days I'll have a new frame to play with..."

That keeps people remembering the game.  It gives them something to look forwards to, it gives them a reason to come back day after day after day, and for a game like Warframe that is vital to the games survival.

The craft timers serve the very important job of giving you a reason to come back the next day.  It gives you something to look forwards to and a reason to remember the game.
It keeps the game at the top of your mind because you're looking forwards to the new thing that your crafting so you remember to check in the next day to collect it.

This serves to make the game into part of your daily routine.  A player learns to sign in every day to collect the new things they are building.  Eventually the player starts to sign in just because its part of their routine...and lots of studies have proven that once a game can make itself part of your daily routine you are far less likely to drop it.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

I think you forgot that this game is indeed free 2 play and it’s going to have time gates. They become far less intrusive as you progress through the game. But waiting for things to build means there’s a lot of time that you have to do other things in the game. Like farming resources to build more things.

[adek183]

3 minutes ago, Tsukinoki said:

Does farming resources give you a reason to come back the next day?  And the day after?  And the day after that?
No.
What gives most people a reason to come back the next day and the day after and the day after is they go "Oh, I have something new to try tomorrow!  I need to sign in to pick it up and use it!"
For frames it becomes "In a few days I'll have a new frame to play with..."

That keeps people remembering the game.  It gives them something to look forwards to, it gives them a reason to come back day after day after day, and for a game like Warframe that is vital to the games survival.

The craft timers serve the very important job of giving you a reason to come back the next day.  It gives you something to look forwards to and a reason to remember the game.
It keeps the game at the top of your mind because you're looking forwards to the new thing that your crafting so you remember to check in the next day to collect it.

This serves to make the game into part of your daily routine.  A player learns to sign in every day to collect the new things they are building.  Eventually the player starts to sign in just because its part of their routine...and lots of studies have proven that once a game can make itself part of your daily routine you are far less likely to drop it.

There's a mobile app to claim your crafted gear so the "reason to come back" argument is pretty weak. The real reason to come back is Nightwave because in that case you actually do get rewards for effort not waiting. And that's how the game should have been from the beginning. The Foundry system is terribly outdated and it needs a change. On a side note I have most of the stuff I like crafted and all what's left is pretty much farming prime gear and filling out the "MR fodders". So it's not like I'm affected by the crafting times in a mental way because I feel 0 attachment to the game. One of my friends tried out Warframe and got repelled by it's outdated crafting system and he's playing Destiny instead for now. Sure a small sample but it has got me thinking. It's pretty obvious that people are going to be defensive on this forum because that's just how it is with Warframe even when devs literally say to give them criticism not praise. Or maybe people just are afraid of change like it was with Season 1 of Nightwave (Hurr hurr only 60% hurr hurr it's optional) either way I'm sure i'll not be the only one thinking the foundry system is just ridiculous.

[peterc3]

8 minutes ago, adek183 said:

There's a mobile app to claim your crafted gear so the "reason to come back" argument is pretty weak.

Can you use that new Frost Prime in the mobile app?

1 hour ago, adek183 said:

There's a mobile app to claim your crafted gear so the "reason to come back" argument is pretty weak.

The game is a time gate in and of itself. Every season has something new to find, but an entire slog to get to that new thing. I very much prefer Warframe's model to PoE's.

[(PSN)Hikuro-93]

1 hour ago, adek183 said:

You're trying to tell me that getting an item in a 30 minutes window which you still need to max rank and probably forma a few times is "Instant gratification"? I can see your white armor blinding me from miles away. Talking about bias.

Unlike you, I'm definetly not biased. And I don't really require ad hominems for lack of an actual argument, so try again. Fresh from this week alone. (V)

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1122089-some-newbie-feedback/?do=findComment&comment=10980557

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1122470-with-umbra-echoes-on-the-way-will-umbra-forma´s-give-us-the-same-effect/?do=findComment&comment=10985091

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1122452-zealoid-bastion-and-zealot-prelate/?do=findComment&comment=10985215

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1122295-syndicate-glyphs-and-standing-gain-feels-outdated/?do=findComment&comment=10982892

---

Regarding the foundry itself, maybe a few touch ups. A few QoL stuff like a crafting Q, and even that would be highly debatable alone.. But hardly the level of de-grindification you suggest.

 

Edited August 24, 2019 by (PS4)Hikuro-93

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

OK OP

why don't you go and play Path of Exile instead then.

If you don't want to Support Warframe by Spending Plat on either Foundy Rush Fees, or on Buying Items Directly and skipping grind entirely; then you're just leeching off us "money-slaves" who actually do put up the money that keeps the company alive.

if microtransactions are going to put a player off from playing; then that's the kind of player we don't need anyway.

Edited August 24, 2019 by (PS4)haphazardlynamed

[Uhkretor]

... Well, if we all think about it, his precious PoE model is already applied in Warframe... its called "Nightwave", although the requirements (and the whole point of it) have absolutely nothing to do with it... After all, DE doesn't apply leagues on separate servers to beef up participating players as an "Early Access", like PoE Devs... Or come up with dumb reasons for leagues just because there's a leaderboard ranking behind each league that any prick will use it as ePeen comparison... This, to name a few of the turn-offs I felt directly from PoE...

... Although I do love to smack enemies with a two-handed hammer, it isn't engaging enough for me (personal case)... Either way, the de-grindification we will most likely get is something like what happened with Nightwave... A reduction on the requirement milestones for something... Nothing like "instant foundry build"...

... Hell, I had the trouble of reducing building speeds on Space Engineers to 0.5x and even THAT is too fast for me.

... so... I don't think your suggestion (if you want us to see it that way) isn't going to stick... No, it'll fly through faster than Itzal blinking FTL through the Universe, just to land right in the center of a black hole.

Edited August 24, 2019 by Uhkretor

[Dr_Shadox]

Infact my only complain about foundry it no button for hide mastered , hide part of frame already mastered , and hide helmet button.

Nothing else.

[(PSN)Black-Cat-Jinx]

8 hours ago, adek183 said:

"What is that a mobile game?" Many people (Especially new players) have a hard time dealing with all these tiresome foundry craftings. "I have to grind all the resources AND wait 24 hours? No thanks!" I think it's time to finally put an end to this and either make the crafting time reasonable (Maximum 30 minutes) or get rid of it entirely. There's absolutely no reason to block out potential new players with this old and flawed system required amount of resources is a sufficient block already. No need to top it with ridiculous mobile-game worthy crafting times and I'm 100% sure DE has enough money to take the hit from rushing the craftings for the sake of greater good. Warframe afterall is all about the grind and what's the worst possible grind? Time-gates. Before you'll say "People will gain mastery too fast!!!!!!!! My 100% profile will be worthless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!" So what? There's already a yet another timegate of 24 hours between each mastery rank test so a "Maxed" profile will still be pretty impressive and the general quality of life will be improved. If you think this system should stay as-is then give me one valid reason (Besides money. DE already demonstrated that they aren't some EA-like scum many times) to keep the timers.

PS: Bulk-crafting would be nice by the way.

They probably won't do anyhting until they see if this US loot box bill goes anywhere. Then will adjust their game mechanics as required by trade law to continue serving one of their biggest markets.