(XBOX)CaligulaTwily Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, Padre_Akais said: Once again proving that any reference can be a JoJo reference I'm still hoping for that Revenant DIOSAMA Deluxe skin lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Ok I’m genuinely convinced you’re just trolling at this point. High tier trolling. But trolling nonetheless. Convincing yourself of such just proves my point if truth be told. On 2019-08-27 at 5:42 PM, Padre_Akais said: You don't like Revenant because he doesn't fit what you expected him to be and rationalize accordingly. 20 hours ago, Padre_Akais said: It doesn't make sense to you because the frame isn't what you wanted it to be to begin with. 20 hours ago, Padre_Akais said: Rather you feel they are wrong because they don't harbor your view. Simply put...You've fallen prey to the Wizard's First Rule merely by thinking you haven't imo. I, otoh, merely feel you are wrong for berating others because the frame isn't what you want it to be. I present facts directly to you, offer specific directions for confirming these things for yourself and you still dismiss these things in favor of your fantasy instead. You aren't being trolled bud...You are in denial. What you call "high tier trolling" is merely facts that are inconvenient to your persistent fiction. Personally, I don't even care that you harbor the fantasy insomuch as it would be nice if you laid off the random insults to players who don't prescribe to it. ...Just sayin' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 7 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said: Convincing yourself of such just proves my point if truth be told. I present facts Those are not facts. They’re your own opinion on what you think happened. Well I’m going to debunk every possible theory that tries to justify Revenants illogical theme. Unspecified Warframe + Eidolon Energy = Vampire: we’ve been over this. It makes no sense. End of story. Vampire Warframe + Eidolon Energy = still a vampire?: what tf was the point of creating this lore of a Warframe being captured and corrupted by Eidolon energy for thousands of years, for so long that it remolds it’s very appearance, If they aren’t going to take advantage of that? What’s the point of saying “this Warframe is corrupted with Eidolon energy” if they had no intention of representing that in the abilities design? 5 hours ago, Padre_Akais said: How does the notion of dual themes evade you in a game where it's depicted by: Oberon, Valkyr, Banshee, Equinox, Hydroid, and Limbo (off the top of my head) manage to so readily escape you? Dual Themes: Dual themes are used when a single theme requires something to help make it practical i.e. Atlas. Rocks require being smashed into things to do damage. So Atlas is also a Brawler who punches with rocks. Brawler/Rock theme. What benefit do Vampire powers give to Eidolon/Sentient powers? What logical restriction do Eid/sentient powers have that would require aspects of vampire powers to work? The other aspect is just creating a unique look for the frame while making that secondary “theme” not conflict with the frames overall design. Valkyr is a Berserker. It was probably logical that her berserker mode would be an exalted weapon, so they needed a weapon. They decided on claws and to give Valkyr’s design aspects of cats to make the claws make sense. Oberon: Nature. Deer. Self explanatory. Banshee: dual themed? She’s the sound frame. All her abilities revolve around sound. She’s not dual themed. Equinox: her theme is literally duality. That’s 1 theme about 2 things. Not two themes. Hydroid: squids live in water. Pirates sailed over water. Hydroid casts water. Limbo: Eh I’m not going to get into that. The tuxedo look doesn’t really fit Warframe in general and my next points going to cover the gap in this anyways. And because I somehow always end up comparing things to him. Nidus (that’s right he gets to be his own category): Nidus was the first frame who’s visual design is completely based off an enemies faction. And yes it is true that none of his powers are directly derived from infested enemies. Nidus’s powers follow the theme of a growing and spreading infestation. With his stacks increasing his power and growing the infestation on his body. His 3 latching onto enemies or allies casting his 1 from their location as well. Him planting down a circle of infestation, spawning infested maggots (hey something that an infested unit does that Nidus also does). Growing and spreading is something the infested do. So his abilities theme actually matches his visual theme. It wouldn’t make a lick of sense for there to be vampire powers on Nidus. So why does it suddenly make sense for there to be vampire powers on Revenant? You cannot create a Warframe who’s design is based off of an established faction with known attributes, powers, and lore. And not apply any of those to the frames abilities. It’s illogical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Those are not facts Yup..They are. An Eidolan is a spectre...By definition. Revenant literally means returned from the dead Eidolans aren't Sentients...Eidolans were Sentients and are now what's left of a dead sentient. The quest outright tells you the things are basically Undead. Vampires are Undead...Again by definition. The Revenant quest outright tells you that it was a normal warframe until it became corrupted by Eidolan energy. Whether it was a Vampiric frame or not is subjective. But the rest definitely isn't. All of these are facts...Feel free to continue ignoring them but you won't be rationalizing your way around them with me. 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Unspecified Warframe + Eidolon Energy = Vampire: we’ve been over this. It makes no sense. End of story. See my post above in regard to why I think you can't grasp it....Almost any of my posts in this thread speak to my opinions on precisely why you aren't catching on in fact. 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: What’s the point of saying “this Warframe is corrupted with Eidolon energy” if they had no intention of representing that in the abilities design? But since 3 of his abilities do just that I don't see where you have a point. 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Dual Themes: Dual themes are used when a single theme requires something to help make it practical Equinox is about the only frame that fits this description...The rest of the designs have dual themes as flourishes to make the frame stand out as unique regardless of the power's theme. In other words, what you think is, again, un-true. 1 hour ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Nidus is fan service. Sure his theme is consistent but the lore explaining it makes Nidus the most antithetical frame in the game. 2 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: It wouldn’t make a lick of sense for there to be vampire powers on Nidus. So why does it suddenly make sense for there to be vampire powers on Revenant? Because Nidus isn't an undead frame and Revenant (by definition) is? Should all cats have orange fur too? 2 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: You cannot create a Warframe who’s design is based off of an established faction with known attributes, powers, and lore. And not apply any of those to the frames abilities. It’s illogical. Except the "known faction" you speak of doesn't have any of those traits...They have similar looks. Their powers have barely anything in common with each other. Applying what you call logic means all the kvetching you did this last year was for no reason at all given that you readily admit Revenent's art style specifically reminds you of Eidolans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nslay Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 14 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said: Vampires are Undead...Again by definition. Vampires from fiction are lame. And Vlad the Impaler was known for implaing his own people (putting heads on pikes) and even animals while he was imprisoned... not drinking blood. How he came to drink blood in fiction is definitely a mystery to me. And while I could probably find out, I'd rather not since the fictional concept is lame. On the other hand, the very real (and alive) vampire bat that does really drink blood for sustenance is really cool and amazing! Oh yes... and the obvious reference for fictional vampires is that they only roam at night. Well, gee, that's something Eidolons do now and something the living sentient originally did (why did it always avoid the day?). How did you miss this? Not that any of this is relevant... But I have to be honest, Revenant doesn't thematically strike me as any obvious vampire in terms of his abilities. Sure, his Reave can drain health and shields, but life steal mechanics aren't something unique to Revenant or vampires. And while I don't recall ever seeing fictional vampires mind controlling anyone, I have seen forum posts mentioning that a word like "Enthrall" or "Thrall" was somehow implicit or unique to vampires. A brief inspection shows that a 'thrall' does not originate from Romania or Transylvania but rather is a serf or slave of the Vikings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrall Disambiguation leads to an entry on Incantations... but I don't ever recall vampires using magic. The vampire article on wikipedia certainly doesn't mention vampires having these abilities to control someone. Contemporary vampire hunting movies that I've seen like 'Blade' don't show them having mind control powers either! The word 'Enthrall' on the other hand does have a definition that includes words reminiscent to Halloween themes like 'bewitch', though its second definitely very plainly states 'enslave' or 'subjugate'. I could see the developers scouring a thesaurus for cool-sounding synonyms for something like 'mind control' (Nyx). https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/enthrall Lastly, Reave has no obvious connection to vampires or Halloween or Romania or Vikings or anything like that... See for yourself! https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/reave If it was a vampiric ability, wouldn't it have a more ominous name like "Drain" or "Life Steal"? Anyway without having known that Revenant may have been code-named 'Vlad', I could honestly never have connected him to the concept of vampires! It's really not obvious to me at all that Revenant's theme is vampiric. But I will concede that most of his abilities are not reminiscent of Eidolons! Only his Reave is similar to Vomvalysts while his other abilities are more reminiscent to Hunhow and Battalysts and the general non-Eidolon sentient ability to adapt to damage (only Mesmer Skin works differently and better than that). Finally, you're arguing over an opinion. He doesn't like Revenant, his thematic discrepancies or his skills. It's as simple as that. There's no point in arguing over a preference. His attempts to try to discredit Revenant's skills as trash to rationalize his opinion have largely been debunked repeatedly though (he has made some good points about oddities and flaws in his design!)... But he so dislikes Revenant that arguments about his abilities have even devolved into silliness like 90% damage reduction being better than 100% damage reduction because 90% already works for the star chart... or even flat out ignoring screenshots or videos of amazing Revenant feats that should not be possible for a trash frame! I guess now since Revenant is not the absolute very best at the star chart, he's trash... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 8 minutes ago, nslay said: Vampires from fiction are lame. And Vlad the Impaler was known for implaing his own people (putting heads on pikes) and even animals while he was imprisoned... not drinking blood. How he came to drink blood in fiction is definitely a mystery to me. And while I could probably find out, I'd rather not since the fictional concept is lame. On the other hand, the very real (and alive) vampire bat that does really drink blood for sustenance is really cool and amazing! Oh yes... and the obvious reference for fictional vampires is that they only roam at night. Well, gee, that's something Eidolons do now and something the living sentient originally did (why did it always avoid the day?). How did you miss this? Not that any of this is relevant... But I have to be honest, Revenant doesn't thematically strike me as any obvious vampire in terms of his abilities. Sure, his Reave can drain health and shields, but life steal mechanics aren't something unique to Revenant or vampires. And while I don't recall ever seeing fictional vampires mind controlling anyone, I have seen forum posts mentioning that a word like "Enthrall" or "Thrall" was somehow implicit or unique to vampires. A brief inspection shows that a 'thrall' does not originate from Romania or Transylvania but rather is a serf or slave of the Vikings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrall Disambiguation leads to an entry on Incantations... but I don't ever recall vampires using magic. The vampire article on wikipedia certainly doesn't mention vampires having these abilities to control someone. Contemporary vampire hunting movies that I've seen like 'Blade' don't show them having mind control powers either! The word 'Enthrall' on the other hand does have a definition that includes words reminiscent to Halloween themes like 'bewitch', though its second definitely very plainly states 'enslave' or 'subjugate'. I could see the developers scouring a thesaurus for cool-sounding synonyms for something like 'mind control' (Nyx). https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/enthrall Lastly, Reave has no obvious connection to vampires or Halloween or Romania or Vikings or anything like that... See for yourself! https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/reave If it was a vampiric ability, wouldn't it have a more ominous name like "Drain" or "Life Steal"? Anyway without having known that Revenant may have been code-named 'Vlad', I could honestly never have connected him to the concept of vampires! It's really not obvious to me at all that Revenant's theme is vampiric. But I will concede that most of his abilities are not reminiscent of Eidolons! Only his Reave is similar to Vomvalysts while his other abilities are more reminiscent to Hunhow and Battalysts and the general non-Eidolon sentient ability to adapt to damage (only Mesmer Skin works differently and better than that). Finally, you're arguing over an opinion. He doesn't like Revenant, his thematic discrepancies or his skills. It's as simple as that. There's no point in arguing over a preference. His attempts to try to discredit Revenant's skills as trash to rationalize his opinion have largely been debunked repeatedly though (he has made some good points about oddities and flaws in his design!)... But he so dislikes Revenant that arguments about his abilities have even devolved into silliness like 90% damage reduction being better than 100% damage reduction because 90% already works for the star chart... or even flat out ignoring screenshots or videos of amazing Revenant feats that should not be possible for a trash frame! I guess now since Revenant is not the absolute very best at the star chart, he's trash... If someone says his opinion is fact you do have all the rights to argue with him. Btw ppl should just stop with this vampire crap. It's so over used as an excuse. Rebecca was the only person to my knowledge who was saying vampire all the time. But also why give a crap about this? It's such a meaningless argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Adaptabilty Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 On 2019-08-24 at 12:50 PM, KazuXSora said: Mesa is trash. I don't need to pity or anything but, serious she's weak af and his 4th ability made my game crash. Yep, trashier than trash. How is Mesa trash? Damage buff, 90 damage reduction, jams enemy weapons, and does massive damage with 4 I'm actually confused. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldain Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 2 hours ago, (XB1)Adaptabilty said: How is Mesa trash? Damage buff, 90 damage reduction, jams enemy weapons, and does massive damage with 4 I'm actually confused. It is either sarcasm or stupidity in that post. Because anyone who thinks Mesa is trash is literally criminally insane. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 4 hours ago, nslay said: Vampires from fiction are lame. And Vlad the Impaler was known for implaing his own people (putting heads on pikes) and even animals while he was imprisoned... not drinking blood. How he came to drink blood in fiction is definitely a mystery to me. And while I could probably find out, I'd rather not since the fictional concept is lame. On the other hand, the very real (and alive) vampire bat that does really drink blood for sustenance is really cool and amazing! Oh yes... and the obvious reference for fictional vampires is that they only roam at night. Well, gee, that's something Eidolons do now and something the living sentient originally did (why did it always avoid the day?). How did you miss this? Not that any of this is relevant... But I have to be honest, Revenant doesn't thematically strike me as any obvious vampire in terms of his abilities. Sure, his Reave can drain health and shields, but life steal mechanics aren't something unique to Revenant or vampires. You can find some version of the vampire in most country's books of legends and they don't all do the same stuff or get dispatched the same ways so I took the most basic of basics (stuff shared by most) and ran off that. An undead revenant who maintains the state by stealing the lifeforce from the living. Blood? Discarded it as too specific. Sunlight? Same thing. All those things open up a conversation steeped in irrelevancies imo because the real question regards whether Revenant (as-is) fits the intent behind his story and theme. Truth told, we could completely toss the notion of the frame being vampiric out completely and the powers and skills still work as it relates to almost any kind of spectral frame. ...The difference in this case is that someone at DE dubbed it "vampiric" and players apparently expected it to sleep in a coffin and explode when sunlight hit it. 4 hours ago, nslay said: And while I don't recall ever seeing fictional vampires mind controlling anyone, I have seen forum posts mentioning that a word like "Enthrall" or "Thrall" was somehow implicit or unique to vampires. A brief inspection shows that a 'thrall' does not originate from Romania or Transylvania but rather is a serf or slave of the Vikings. Stoker used the notion in his book. King used the concept in Salem's Lot in a few places. Frankly, the concept is so common in the fiction that I am surprised you missed it. That said, I don't think the concept is implicit to vampires though as I can think of animals and insects who's patterns, features, colorations, function, or tactics exist for the intent to either entice prey to get closer or put them under their control. 5 hours ago, nslay said: Lastly, Reave has no obvious connection to vampires or Halloween or Romania or Vikings or anything like that... See for yourself! It doesn't actually have to given that it describes an act. The act, in this case, would be stealing by force. Since the act in this case involves stealing lifeforce by force...That's a fit. 5 hours ago, nslay said: Finally, you're arguing over an opinion Not particularly...I've been pretty clear on the point that I don't really care about his opinion differing insomuch as I do find his need to berate, belittle, and insult others for not sharing it rather foul. I don't think I have seen one thread discussing Revenent that this dude hasn't derailed with bullcrap and random insults lobbying for changes to fit this vision he maintains regardless of whether it fits any of the facts we know or not. Normally, I keep my comments to myself on stuff like this most days as I've spent so much time in this forum over the years that I know where most interactions are going to wind up pages before it finally gets there. But I stumbled over these on a frisky day instead...Hence the fact checking. If I could be DEMonkey and do it in a sentence you'd probably see more of me but I am neither that succinct nor witty unfortunately. Sorry for the book folks! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)caffinated_flame Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 9 hours ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: I really dont understand y u hate rev so much Sure I wasnt the the frame that what promised but I dont see how that make him bad Edited August 29, 2019 by (PS4)caffinated_flame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nslay Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 20 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said: You can find some version of the vampire in most country's books of legends and they don't all do the same stuff or get dispatched the same ways so I took the most basic of basics (stuff shared by most) and ran off that. 21 minutes ago, Padre_Akais said: Stoker used the notion in his book. King used the concept in Salem's Lot in a few places. Frankly, the concept is so common in the fiction that I am surprised you missed it. Well, that explains it. I'm not well read in books (and especially vampires)! 5 hours ago, JackHargreav said: If someone says his opinion is fact you do have all the rights to argue with him. Btw ppl should just stop with this vampire crap. It's so over used as an excuse. Rebecca was the only person to my knowledge who was saying vampire all the time. But also why give a crap about this? It's such a meaningless argument. I'm one of the posters that has been arguing with him for the past 6 months! What has it accomplished? We cannot change what he thinks or says... I mean he flat out says in this thread that anyone who likes Revenant "is wrong". That alone should be an indicator that arguing won't work on him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 7 hours ago, Padre_Akais said: But since 3 of his abilities do just that I don't see where you have a point. 1. Eidolons aren’t undead. They’re broken. If you then say “why do they return” my response is why does Sargas Ruk return every time you go to his boss fight mode? 2. Revenants initial reveal showed abilities that had nothing to do with Eidolons. Thralls, Charges based defense, a smoke dash, AOE sleep. It was obvious there was no intention to represent Eidolons in the slightest. It wasn’t until Steve stepped in saying “the Eidolon frame actually needs Eidolon abilities” that he finally got Danse Macabre and it wasn’t until people hated the flat wall of mist that they covered it up with a vombvalyst dash. 3. Revenant was a really dumb thing to name him. I remember one guy who went into vast depths to prove that he is not undead. Unfortunately I never read that original post so I can’t give details. Lore wise, I don’t believe it’s even possible for a frame to be Undead. You’re really stretching this illogical crusade you’re on to try and defend something that makes no sense. And until you can actually understand where my point of view is coming from I see no benefit in continuing this with out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyErvin Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 6 hours ago, nslay said: Vampires from fiction are lame. And Vlad the Impaler was known for implaing his own people (putting heads on pikes) and even animals while he was imprisoned... not drinking blood. How he came to drink blood in fiction is definitely a mystery to me. And while I could probably find out, I'd rather not since the fictional concept is lame. On the other hand, the very real (and alive) vampire bat that does really drink blood for sustenance is really cool and amazing! Oh yes... and the obvious reference for fictional vampires is that they only roam at night. Well, gee, that's something Eidolons do now and something the living sentient originally did (why did it always avoid the day?). How did you miss this? Not that any of this is relevant... But I have to be honest, Revenant doesn't thematically strike me as any obvious vampire in terms of his abilities. Sure, his Reave can drain health and shields, but life steal mechanics aren't something unique to Revenant or vampires. And while I don't recall ever seeing fictional vampires mind controlling anyone, I have seen forum posts mentioning that a word like "Enthrall" or "Thrall" was somehow implicit or unique to vampires. A brief inspection shows that a 'thrall' does not originate from Romania or Transylvania but rather is a serf or slave of the Vikings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrall Disambiguation leads to an entry on Incantations... but I don't ever recall vampires using magic. The vampire article on wikipedia certainly doesn't mention vampires having these abilities to control someone. Contemporary vampire hunting movies that I've seen like 'Blade' don't show them having mind control powers either! The word 'Enthrall' on the other hand does have a definition that includes words reminiscent to Halloween themes like 'bewitch', though its second definitely very plainly states 'enslave' or 'subjugate'. I could see the developers scouring a thesaurus for cool-sounding synonyms for something like 'mind control' (Nyx). https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/enthrall Lastly, Reave has no obvious connection to vampires or Halloween or Romania or Vikings or anything like that... See for yourself! https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/reave If it was a vampiric ability, wouldn't it have a more ominous name like "Drain" or "Life Steal"? Anyway without having known that Revenant may have been code-named 'Vlad', I could honestly never have connected him to the concept of vampires! It's really not obvious to me at all that Revenant's theme is vampiric. But I will concede that most of his abilities are not reminiscent of Eidolons! Only his Reave is similar to Vomvalysts while his other abilities are more reminiscent to Hunhow and Battalysts and the general non-Eidolon sentient ability to adapt to damage (only Mesmer Skin works differently and better than that). Finally, you're arguing over an opinion. He doesn't like Revenant, his thematic discrepancies or his skills. It's as simple as that. There's no point in arguing over a preference. His attempts to try to discredit Revenant's skills as trash to rationalize his opinion have largely been debunked repeatedly though (he has made some good points about oddities and flaws in his design!)... But he so dislikes Revenant that arguments about his abilities have even devolved into silliness like 90% damage reduction being better than 100% damage reduction because 90% already works for the star chart... or even flat out ignoring screenshots or videos of amazing Revenant feats that should not be possible for a trash frame! I guess now since Revenant is not the absolute very best at the star chart, he's trash... Vlad isnt the OG vamp, so I would not use him as an example when it comes to vamp lore, which pre-dates him by 2000+ years. And the lore behind Revenant fits a vampiric theme as you can see very well presented by Padre. The lore about the vampire is rooted in ancient folklore about the different revenant creatures. The blood drinking is mostly a modern occurance. Where the idea of that blood drinking comes from is in the revenant lore. Practically all of them feed on life force, this doesnt mean they all drink blood. That is pretty much how it translates well over to the eidolon themed frame, since eidolons are in reality feeding on the life force from dead sentients aswell as the energy that is present in the plains and Revenant also fed on it/them. As for thralls. You are overthinking it. The skill is called enthrall, something that is enthralled is a thrall. A word that comes from old norse meaning anything from owned servant, slave, prisoner or concubine really. In short, someone without free will until the host sees fit to release you. Also, have you never heard of the mesmerizing abilities of several revenant beings? Mesmering eyes is a common thing with vampires, poltergeists have similar abilities and the draugr takes it to the extreme in certain regions by simply eating your brain and turning you into an undead slave. Vampires are also known for turning people into thralls by feeding on them. Reave is a common word, a synonym for ravish, rob or pillage. Which is pretty much what Rev does to his enemies. It also sounds more catchy and evil than Essence Rush, Ghost Rush, Hungering Mist or something else that would describe the skill. Reave is also very much something that has to do with vikings, the word comes from the old norse rov, which means practically anything from kidnapping to robbery, pillage and plunder. Viking itself also has an inherant meaning where reaving, pillaging and plundering are standard. It is a misconception that viking is synonymous to a people. The norse were a group of northern scandic tribes, viking was simply a seasonal occupation within one or several tribes joining together to raid or explore/settle. And when you say his skills arent ediolon like and that only reave is similar to a vomvalyst then I guess you've never encountered Garry, because he brings on the lightshow that is extremely similar to Danse. What you and angry Gears are also missing is that Revenant was an actual frame prior to becomes the thing that we build. He was a frame with his own powers before "dying" on the plains and getting corrupted. So not all skills need to fit an eidolon or a vampire on a 1:1 basis. Mesmer skin may have been a natural part of him prior to the plains, so may have enthrall and parts of his other skills. But I guess if the view of vampires comes from Vlad lore and later, yeah he doesnt really look or work the part. When you look at it with ancient myths in minds aswell as the natural theme of eidolons themselves then he is 100% spot on. My only real issue with him is. How will they ever explain a Revenant prime with the skills and looks he has now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SneakyErvin Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 4 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: 1. Eidolons aren’t undead. They’re broken. If you then say “why do they return” my response is why does Sargas Ruk return every time you go to his boss fight mode? 2. Revenants initial reveal showed abilities that had nothing to do with Eidolons. Thralls, Charges based defense, a smoke dash, AOE sleep. It was obvious there was no intention to represent Eidolons in the slightest. It wasn’t until Steve stepped in saying “the Eidolon frame actually needs Eidolon abilities” that he finally got Danse Macabre and it wasn’t until people hated the flat wall of mist that they covered it up with a vombvalyst dash. 3. Revenant was a really dumb thing to name him. I remember one guy who went into vast depths to prove that he is not undead. Unfortunately I never read that original post so I can’t give details. Lore wise, I don’t believe it’s even possible for a frame to be Undead. You’re really stretching this illogical crusade you’re on to try and defend something that makes no sense. And until you can actually understand where my point of view is coming from I see no benefit in continuing this with out. 1. They are undead, they are scattered reanimated pieces of a massive long dead sentient. Similar to what would be considered flesh or bone golems. 2. Hence why DE should never reveal WIP frames too early on, cos people will get their panties in a twist when the first or half itteration they got hypesessed over doesnt come true. 3. He is a ghost/shell of his former self, the name revenant fits him perfectly. He is also vastly changed and degenerated from the frame he was prior to all incidents on the plains. His "crusade" makes far more sense than your opinions though. Because he actually has valid points of reasoning and connections in the actual lore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Y’all need to rewatch the Revenant reveal devstream. They go into detail over how his abilities represent vampire powers. And if you’re wondering why they do that so poorly. Remember that Rebecca was the one who designed him. You’re just asking for it to be bad at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mediloric Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 Revenant to me is very interesting, concept wise both in his looks and powers he's pretty great! "Rise from the broken remains of the Eidolon to seduce a army of thralls"? He had this undead-like commander vibe to him which I think on paper come across really well but in practice eh.... I really wanted to like Rev, everything was looking great! I got him day one and everything. And I gotta admit, it really wasn't doing it for me. I was looking forward to the whole minion aspect he had but his strengths ended up being something else and that's fine. I don't think he's a bad frame at all, he's got problems true and does seem a little confused on what he is but he's for sure not bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 3 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said: His "crusade" makes far more sense than your opinions though. Because he actually has valid points of reasoning and connections in the actual lore. I’m pulling all the facts and lore I can. But one accusation of “You just hate him too much to see anything else” and you all clap for him like a bunch of seals. So tell me. Who’s really the biased one here? Edited August 29, 2019 by (XB1)GearsMatrix301 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 16 minutes ago, nslay said: I'm one of the posters that has been arguing with him for the past 6 months! What has it accomplished? We cannot change what he thinks or says... I mean he flat out says in this thread that anyone who likes Revenant "is wrong". That alone should be an indicator that arguing won't work on him! Well you actually have a point there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 13 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: You’re really stretching this illogical crusade you’re on to try and defend something that makes no sense. And until you can actually understand where my point of view is coming from I see no benefit in continuing this with out. This is the point where I feel you need to consider taking your own advice. 2 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: Y’all need to rewatch the Revenant reveal devstream. They go into detail over how his abilities represent vampire powers. And if you’re wondering why they do that so poorly. Remember that Rebecca was the one who designed him. You’re just asking for it to be bad at that point. I really don't... I only care about what appeared in-game as that's the only bit that counts. It's one thing to say you don't like something and an truly another to assert that the thing is bad merely because you don't like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 minute ago, Padre_Akais said: I really don't... I only care about what appeared in-game as that's the only bit that counts. When it comes to his theme prior incarnations of his abilities count. And you’re refusal to acknowledge them is again just showing how truly illogical your argument is since you’re just blatantly refusing to look at facts. Theres no point of making a frame look like an enemy faction if you aren’t going to put that same design in his abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 1 hour ago, (PS4)caffinated_flame said: I really dont understand y u hate rev so much Sure I wasnt the the frame that what promised but I dont see how that make him bad It’s simple. Terrible, illogical combination of themes. So much so that they tried to back track on some of it but it was far too late to save it. terrible abilities because of the complete disregard of of the Eidolon theme by the vampire addict. Revenant is trash. A truer statement there shall never be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
___Operator___ Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 As soon as I saw a revenant thread I knew I'd find Gears here to bash on him with nothing to back up the claims that hes bad. "You have to recast mesmer skin or you die" wow, are you actually serious? You can use that same argument for almost any frame in the game "Loki has to recast his invisibilty or he dies" its such a redundant statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rakosta_Kai Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 4 minutes ago, (XB1)GearsMatrix301 said: I’m pulling all the facts and lore I can. But one accusation of “You just hate him too much to see anything else” and you all clap for him like a bunch of seals. So tell me. Who’s really the biased one here? You...Because you have Zero Facts to support your stance. Even the dictionary strenuously disagrees with you at this point. What you think, feel, or believe is not fact is opinion unless it's supported by fact. The problem in this case is that the things you call facts aren't and the things you call logic actually isn't That said, I would rather see people clapping like seals for something they liked as opposed to barking at shadows instead. ...But that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 28 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said: My only real issue with him is. How will they ever explain a Revenant prime with the skills and looks he has now? Was valkyr ever explained? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)GearsMatrix301 Posted August 29, 2019 Share Posted August 29, 2019 (edited) 1 minute ago, JackHargreav said: Was valkyr ever explained? Nope. But just ask Padre. He’ll find some convoluted way to justify pre experimentation Valkyr having berserker powers despite how illogical it is. Edited August 29, 2019 by (XB1)GearsMatrix301 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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