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(XB1)Architect Prime

Am I the only one why thinks that MR is stupid?

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MR doesn't seem to be telling like it's supposed to be. I wish there were more important things that went into a displayed rank than weather or not I leveled trash weapons. Probably a topic that's been posted a million times, but I don't care. I think MR rank is meaningless as it is... just my opinion, don't freak out, fam.

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Under the assumption people believe that it currently has meaning for skill and experience? No, you're not the only one.

Something to pursue for it's perks and to get access to weapons/rivens/content that are locked behind it? It's alright.

Wishing that it be a meaningful indicator of how good you're at the game? Honestly, no. Too many things that could be used to contribute MR, but most are better off with it's own category of stats.

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I mean, that’s what it is: “mastery rank.” How much of the game’s gear have you “mastered,” a term associated with fully leveling an item up. I don’t think it is in any way supposed to be an indicator of how good you are at the game, it’s just supposed to encourage you to try new things. The idea that it’s meant to be anything else is a false assumption of the players. And frankly I’d rather it not be some kind of skill rank, because I don’t want to see players e-peening about how theirs is so much higher than everyone else’s. I had enough of that in Overwatch.

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MR has never been a sign of how good a player is to me. 

For me it's just a way for the game to reward players for collecting and playing with different weapons and warframes. 

I also don't think that an indicator of how good a player is would be beneficial to the game. Right now, there are only a few MR elitist in the game and I do see them pop up in the recruitment chat, but it's not really what a lot of players do because most players know that MR doesn't represent skill. However, if DE adds something that highlights, for example, how many Hydrolist Captures a players has done (which I think is in the profile already), it would just make it easier for those people to be more elitist and that kind of idea would spread much faster in the community. 


That's just my opinion, and I'm sure there are good reasons to have skill indicators that I have not thought of.

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I see Mastery as "it's likely the best we'll get as far as a single number defining overall progression goes" and nothing more.  If anything, I think it should mean less than it does now and that there shouldn't be any weapons locked past rank 10 at the latest.  I really don't like it as a gating mechanic for a number of reasons, foremost that it fails to actually track mastery of gear, since it's so easy to level a weapon without ever using it, and many players tend to act as though the intended way to play the game is to twiddle your thumbs in ESO while someone else carries and never pull the trigger of anything but the usual elsewhere.

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3 часа назад, (NSW)KentInkOVanheim сказал:

I also don't think that an indicator of how good a player is would be beneficial to the game.

I double this and everything you said after this sentence. No "skill metrics" please.

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I wonder how DE will handle MR30, it's going to happen, and when it does it'll be interesting to see how they address the fact you will never need to level another weapon again. Not because there won't be a MR31+ but because at 30 any weapon you get essentially starts out maxed. You'd only ever do it when you have a gun you want to actually maximize which would only be few and far between compared to how many weapons there are.

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It is definitely not an indicator of skill, the only time I though that was when I was a new player. 

But it works well enough for an indicator of progression of how much "mastery " over weapons you have. 

The better query would be how affinity should be gained for weapons and how it ties to MR. 

Leeching and affinity sharing kinda makes it a moot statistic. And is only good for standing, load out, starting mod capacity limits, weapon use ability and quest locks.

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4 hours ago, Vox_Preliator said:

I see Mastery as "it's likely the best we'll get as far as a single number defining overall progression goes" and nothing more.  If anything, I think it should mean less than it does now and that there shouldn't be any weapons locked past rank 10 at the latest.  I really don't like it as a gating mechanic for a number of reasons, foremost that it fails to actually track mastery of gear, since it's so easy to level a weapon without ever using it, and many players tend to act as though the intended way to play the game is to twiddle your thumbs in ESO while someone else carries and never pull the trigger of anything but the usual elsewhere.

Why settle for a number when you can get a personalized badge or something? Like details on it for different feats and stuff. It would be very telling of playstyle and capability.

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1 hour ago, Annnoth said:

I wonder how DE will handle MR30, it's going to happen, and when it does it'll be interesting to see how they address the fact you will never need to level another weapon again. Not because there won't be a MR31+ but because at 30 any weapon you get essentially starts out maxed. You'd only ever do it when you have a gun you want to actually maximize which would only be few and far between compared to how many weapons there are.

If you make it to 30, then you deserve a goddamn perk like that.

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6 hours ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

MR doesn't seem to be telling like it's supposed to be. I wish there were more important things that went into a displayed rank than weather or not I leveled trash weapons. Probably a topic that's been posted a million times, but I don't care. I think MR rank is meaningless as it is... just my opinion, don't freak out, fam.

MR is in place so it will pad the content, is one of the many time gates the game has.

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I don't use it as a way to see how good people are, but I do use it as an expectation of how good they should be. If I'm in a mission with a player who clearly has no clue, I look at the mastery rank, if it's lowish, I try to help them as they are clearly just learning, if it's like 18 or so, the player in question clearly has no desire at all to learn about the game and I don't spend any time worrying about them keeping up or dying somewhere 10 rooms back.

So in my opinion, Mastery Rank doesn't show at all how good or experienced someone is, but it sets an expectation.

I'm always happy to play with and help out newbies, but if you're anywhere close to MR20, you damn-well better know at least how the missions work and know enough about your current loadout to not get downed every 30s.

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1 hour ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Leeching and affinity sharing kinda makes it a moot statistic

Yup, whatever significance MR does have, this kills it. I see it more now as a cosmetic.

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9 hours ago, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

MR doesn't seem to be telling like it's supposed to be. I wish there were more important things that went into a displayed rank than weather or not I leveled trash weapons. Probably a topic that's been posted a million times, but I don't care. I think MR rank is meaningless as it is... just my opinion, don't freak out, fam.

Well, think of it this way, atleast your not like the players that think the opposite and that MR means anything.

The MR system is simply a way for DE to gate a system, like trading or a specific mission, it never meant anything, it's one of those goals (like the many in warframe) that players can choose or not, it's an optional objective that many consider as the only goal in warframe, if excalibur prime can't be mastered, they will trow in a complaint about missing mastery and how it's unaceptable.

I personally use MR to unlock content, but i won't grind things for the sake of it and i certainly do not dare to use MR as a way to value someone, for that the profile and actual gameplay will suffice.

I do however use the MR as an expectation, i know high MR takes time so i tie it with a performance requirement, if the player is high MR, certain questions or mistakes are out of the question, just like certain things are not acceptable in sorties or arbitrations.

Just like someone who hasn't played the regular mission isn't allowed in a sortie, i also do not accept MR 25 players asking if a riven mod is good or bad, or running away from a defense objective so far away that enemies spawn in the gap that the player leaves behind.

When basics or objectives are clearly compromised, i use the MR to try and see how lenient i should be, it can go from a simple sugestion like "help us out" to a more direct "you can exit squad before the next mission", i often force myself as the host, so i have full control of who stays and who needs to give up their slot to someone else, i am not in a mission to explain how does a mobile defense work to a MR 20 player, i simply assume you do know and if you don't you need to spend time learning, outside the squad i'm in obviously.

I like to help out newer players, but my help isn't exactly to do things for them, it's to do things with them, same goes for more experienced player.

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My gripe here is that it oversells the prestige of people who simply acquire and level, while under recognizing those who are skilled and those with intelligent builds that have spent years perfecting their loadouts. 

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On 2019-08-28 at 4:11 PM, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

MR doesn't seem to be telling like it's supposed to be. I wish there were more important things that went into a displayed rank than weather or not I leveled trash weapons. Probably a topic that's been posted a million times, but I don't care. I think MR rank is meaningless as it is... just my opinion, don't freak out, fam.

Well, in Warframe you get mastery from leveling gear used like weapons and frames. So Mastery Rank seems to fit.  It's just what they chose to display .  Not to be confused with a ranking/display system that would show game content progression or kill count. 

When you think about it,  most games give ranks based on kills or just passing a level even if you get carried. Still doesn't show skill. 

Best I can see for Warframe is a badge symbol for average warframe type used like defensive, offensive, supportive . Maybe also a colored number for maintaining efficiency in a mission like average kills/buffs and heals/damage blocked per min or something. Color would be average difficulty , number would be the average of your role per min. Like green 10k meaning 10k team health healed per min (not including self heals) but a sword symbol meaning you play dps most often. And one role cant get ranking for another. Like dps can't get stats toward support or defense for example just to be fair. So on and so forth

 

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On 2019-08-29 at 8:10 PM, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

My gripe here is that it oversells the prestige of people who simply acquire and level, while under recognizing those who are skilled and those with intelligent builds that have spent years perfecting their loadouts. 

You are awarding prestige where none exists. 

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I think the issue is really just the name. Mastery implies skill, whereas xp farming to level things requires none of that. If they were to simply rename it to "Progression Rank" instead it would probably fix a lot of the elitist and misplaced assumptions and bragging based on no real accomplishment.

In most games that track accomplishments, something like our "MR" (progression rank) would only be a single category in the full scheme of things. Then there would be things like Hours Played, Achievements, Eidolons Captured, Nodes Completed, etc. to determine an actual "Mastery" rank. But in that case, the actual MR should be unnecessary for weapon locks since it would be purely for bragging rights, and keep the "progression rank" with all of the current perks we currently have from that. 

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MR is required to keep people from getting the best weapons in the game or try activities they should not be doing. They should add more benefits to MR if you ask me to push people to get as high a MR as possible. We need more things noobs cant access as well and MR locks, quests, and solo queue gear checks are the way to go about it.

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On 2019-08-28 at 7:18 PM, (XB1)Architect Prime said:

Now if your sigil or badge change it's appearance based on things you do like feats and merit, that would be much better. 

The Stratos Emblem does that, but it's for the number of operations you've completed so it's really more of an indication how long and regularly you play the game to have participated in those.

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On 2019-08-29 at 1:17 AM, Vethalon said:

I don't use it as a way to see how good people are, but I do use it as an expectation of how good they should be. If I'm in a mission with a player who clearly has no clue, I look at the mastery rank, if it's lowish, I try to help them as they are clearly just learning, if it's like 18 or so, the player in question clearly has no desire at all to learn about the game and I don't spend any time worrying about them keeping up or dying somewhere 10 rooms back.

So in my opinion, Mastery Rank doesn't show at all how good or experienced someone is, but it sets an expectation.

I'm always happy to play with and help out newbies, but if you're anywhere close to MR20, you damn-well better know at least how the missions work and know enough about your current loadout to not get downed every 30s.

I could not agree more with this. I'm MR 17 right now and I've played with some MR 20s that didnt know how basic mission objectives worked and I basically just ignore them or leave the squad. But if it's like an MR4 or MR5 player I'll try to help them understand the mission and what is going on. 

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