Why Eidolon hunts shouldn't have a Time Gate.

[(PSN)NemitheNem]

What making a limited always available bounty?

Basically, once per Cetus day you can cue up special bounties in a night time instance of the plains. You can't stack them, unless you go day bounty-natural night bounties-day bounty. 

Get your fishing done, practice Eidolon hunts, just no taxis. 

Because it is only a single instance it will be much less toxic than normal Eidolon hunts, because you can't even do a 2x3, you leave and it's day, period. 

The idea is kinda a smash together of both the current event (limited tickets into a mission) and well, orb mother (special instances of the open world)

[TenStorms]

Why Warframe should have no time gate at all...

Its just unhealthy game design, providing steps putting you into danger of getting yourself game addicted, by einforcing you to plan your real life around it - of course only if you let this happen..

As someone who already was addicted many years to mmo style games (together with my wife) i can tell you this is the border you should never cross (at least i will never ever cross this border again).

Dont let ever a game decide when its time to play something.

More options for players are always good thing,  and time gating is the absolut opposite of giving a player a choice.

i have 3 accounts just af today (MR. 27, MR 26 and MR 25) because i really like warframe, and i still ignore this content with all of em.

Its you playing the game, not the game playing your real life !

Edited September 7, 2019 by TenStorms
typo

[Bling-Blong]

Lol what happened to this forum, ive created this to discuss the problems after the update like the weak Tridolons. 

Edit:(lol nvm got confused because we have same icon and 'hunt' in the title

My take if tridolon runs should be allowed in day is a big NONO, this will definitely ruin everything, it will stop people from pimping out their frames like i have done for my chroma that took me a good month of casual play and kept me very busy which i liked since many high level players dont know what to do anymore. Imagine if the tridolons spawn in day there will be no rush for people to do 5x3 runs which means no rush is building nice strong weapons, farm mods or basically build a beast. People will get bored of these runs within a week, and will be left like another survival or defence mission it will just be seen as another mission. The market will drop as low as my balls and removes arguably the most challenging mission in warframe which that requires a lot of preparation, skill, knowledge and practice.

So for people complaining about these being to hard or not having enough time relax just build up little by little u dont have to do every tridolon hunt that comes up in a day only 1 is enough just build up ur frames, weapons, focus, skill and practice we have all been in ur spot and now we r not, just a month ago i could only do 3x3/4x3 now i pimped my chroma, rubico, cerata and focus tree out and learned how to do eveyrthing efficiently. These runs were inteded to be completed like 1 or 2 times in a night is just people pimped them self so much that they can reach 5x3 or 

 

Edited September 8, 2019 by hey-guys-its-scarce-here

[DrivaMain]

Just make Tridolons can be tried anytime daily just like Sorties. So, time constrained people have a chance to fight them and not crash the already devalued arcane market.

Removing the night time gate is a bad idea because it will significantly devalue the arcanes in the process which is bad for DE (less platinum means less revenue for them). Not to mention the burnout of players because of the constant grinding.

[KaiserTom]

Time gates are terrible game design in the first place and like someone else said, it only fosters a dangerous addiction to the game where you build your life around the game rather than the game complimenting your life. Yes it's a persons personal choice for a person to do these things, but that doesn't mean it's right to exploit that and should be criticized when it's done by companies like DE. Taking advantage of a person's addiction to the game to make a quick buck is scummy through and through. Sitting here and protecting DE's income stream for their sake is ridiculous.

The worst this will do is double the amount of arcanes on the market and slash their prices by half. In reality it will push a lot more people into eidolon fights which require those arcanes which will keep prices up and increasing demand and price of the various weapons and frames the fights need to go smoothly.

Anyone getting burned out if the time gate is removed has no one but themselves to blame, as if those kinds of players weren't already grinding out the fights every time night comes around anyways and then proceeding to grind out arbs or kuva for an hour, on the dot, before turning around for eidos again.

[Chaincat]

Always available eidolons I don't think is a good solution, but a more balanced day and night is, I think. The only thing of note on the plains during the day is thumpers. Of a night, Dargyns don't harass you and Eidolons can be fought. As such, I say a balanced day/night cycle should be in effect, 2 hours each. Or maybe 1 hour each. Not a lopsided 50 minute night, 2 hour day.

[ZelUrk]

Agreed, force these Elitists to play with the OP. How dare they not carry him and his mote amp excal.

[nicolajtheking2]

On 2019-09-06 at 1:30 PM, JefTheReaper said:

Honestly the easier solution would just be to cut the Eidolon's shields to just 1/3de of their power (because its a dumb gimmick for the Operator's beam power) and cut their armor strength in half.
It takes WAY to much effort to take a Eidolon down with just a non specialized build and exploits.

We are led to believe that the Tenno killed the Sentients by the hundreds during the old war and that they were quickly turning the tide.
Meanwhile these Eidolon's are just hollow husks of what they used to be yet we can't even damage them properly or fight them without wasting 30 min of our life.

Leave alone they are immune to Warframe powers, so how were Warframes considered the best weapons against Sentients if they can't even scratch them with their powers?

The main Warframe appeal for me in the past was that you could quickly start up a game with random other players who don't even know what to do, with a frame and weapons purely build for just fun and the lolz, and you would do a 5-10 minutes match and get a reward.
THAT, was fun.

Today if you want a 3% chance on something you want, you need to go through 30 minutes in a single match with people who have specialized builds for that type of match, then fall asleep due to boredom, slip up once and fail the entire thing.

 

I mean just make everything easier and faster, that will keep it fun.

I have been playing this for a few years now and I don't care for "endgame" I just want "fun".
And currently fun is very hard to find.

 

(and to those who want to say "its to balance the bosses", making bosses bullet sponges and immune to all powers is not balancing.
Just give them a healthbar, armor and shields on a reasonable level so that even a new player can defeat them, but also give them a max damage cap so that veteran's can't one shot their limbs or shields.

this will keep giving the impression that these bosses are "so powerful" that they can withstand a blow from a Veteran that can wipe out a entire grineer army with a single gunshot, but not that godlike that a new player can't join into the fun and fight them too)

Also cutting the mission time down to reasonable amounts so you don't need to waste the entire cetus night time to fight just a single match.

I personally think that this guy has the right idea (i'm fairly new to eidolons) and i believe that what he wrote deserves to be in a future update.

[DrivaMain]

13 hours ago, KaiserTom said:

The worst this will do is double the amount of arcanes on the market and slash their prices by half. In reality it will push a lot more people into eidolon fights which require those arcanes which will keep prices up and increasing demand and price of the various weapons and frames the fights need to go smoothly

Looks like you weren’t here when the arcanes got moved from the currently retired “Trial” Missions to The Three Eidolons. For example Rank 3 Arcane Energize used to cost 8000 (800 platinum for unranked) platinum during the trial missions era, now it’s less than 2000 platinum (200 platinum or lower for unranked). You can see the arcanes already devalued significantly here.

If you don’t know, Trial missions are 8 player raid type mission that you can attempt twice daily anytime (Normal and Nightmare) that can give you 1 random arcane in Normal and 1 rare random arcane in Nightmare. You can still repeat the missions beyond the daily cap for credits and rare containers.

Removing the time gate completely will only be the final nail in the coffin.

Edited September 8, 2019 by DrivaMain

[Bling-Blong]

1 hour ago, nicolajtheking2 said:

I personally think that this guy has the right idea (i'm fairly new to eidolons) and i believe that what he wrote deserves to be in a future update.

LOL how ? Giving elite players damage camps so they do as much as damage as new players lmao, there is no point in progressing to the game unless u want to know the story line which lets be honest thats the least of interest for most players. You might as well give as level caps too because they wont matter as well unless u want a different skin for a weapon that will do the same amount of damage as new players. 

and btw pretty sure tridolon were essentially created for the veterans because there was nothing else to do for them, and ofc they added the option to be new player friendly too which the terry captures. 

[5p33dy_01]

2 hours ago, nicolajtheking2 said:

I personally think that this guy has the right idea (i'm fairly new to eidolons) and i believe that what he wrote deserves to be in a future update.

with the right group, you can kill all 3 in about 10/15 minutes (maybe even less) the key to speed things up, is everyone knowing what they need to do and having the right build (walks in with unguilded mote amp and says "why am i not doing any damage? please nerf" ).
if the group dont know what they should be doing, its like walking into a mission and people dont know what the objective is or bringing only a sniper rifle to infested survival and expecting to clear groups of enemies with ease.

most people that want eidolons all the time, just want to try farm arcanes without interruption.
as for planning your life around the game, thats just dumb, if you miss a few nights, its not the end of the world.
its like complaining about boosters timer still going down when you're not playing, which is actually a more valid complaint (buys 7 day booster and goes to work every day for 8 hours a day and sleeps for 4 to 8 hours, thats 84 to 112 hours or more that it can not be used, out of 168 (feels cheated))

as someone already stated, once you have the arcanes, you probably wont be back, its just like every other mission (people only go back to get stuff to sell on the market or to collect resources for what ever reason)

this topic goes both ways, people complain about them being too easy as an end-game event, people complain about them being too hard.
the same goes for anything in the game (until YOU are in a position to do it yourself with ease) then the complaint goes from being too hard to being too easy (walks in with redeemer prime modded for CO and says,"why everything get 1 shotted in 1+ hours survival? please buff").

bottom line, arcanes are powerful, like extremely powerful in some cases, (yes 2x Arcane Guardian r3 on rhino, im looking at you) so the difficulty of framing them is understandable.

Edited September 8, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[JefTheReaper]

1 hour ago, hey-guys-its-scarce-here said:

LOL how ? Giving elite players damage camps so they do as much as damage as new players lmao, there is no point in progressing to the game unless u want to know the story line which lets be honest thats the least of interest for most players. You might as well give as level caps too because they wont matter as well unless u want a different skin for a weapon that will do the same amount of damage as new players. 

and btw pretty sure tridolon were essentially created for the veterans because there was nothing else to do for them, and ofc they added the option to be new player friendly too which the terry captures. 

Your words not mine, its not my fault you misinterpret what I wrote and somehow gained the fantasy that I meant a Veteran can only do the same amount of damage as a unmodded Mark-1 kunai.

Its not a bad idea, nothing except big bosses like Eidolons get a max damage cap, not a incredibly low cap, but a "you can't one shot me" cap.
If anything that will keep the challange interesting for veterans.

While i'm all for the god complex in games, you can't tell me that Veteran's "Enjoy" one shotting bosses again and again and again, sounds boring as hell.

as for the second part of your comment, new players can easily access these missions, if the dev's did not intend new players to have access to this content, they it would have been locked behind prerequisites like "complete the second dream first" and "minimal level 10 mastery".
Considering they did not do that, it means that Eidolons were "supposed" to be for everyone, but are horribly balanced.
Likely as new players don't find themselves to the forums very easily, and only the voices of veterans are heard by the devs.

Heck I tried to get my friends into playing the game, but they quit after just a month due to reasons like this.
They think they are able to take on Eidolons only to be absolutely stomped, and then having the seasoned players either insulting them or just constantly leaving the party without they themselves even knowing what or why as they assume this is content they should be able to beat (as they have access to it)

[JefTheReaper]

1 hour ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

with the right group, you can kill all 3 in about 10/15 minutes (maybe even less) the key to speed things up, is everyone knowing what they need to do and having the right build (walks in with unguilded mote amp and says "why am i not doing any damage? please nerf" ).
if the group dont know what they should be doing, its like walking into a mission and people dont know what the objective is or bringing only a sniper rifle to infested survival and expecting to clear groups of enemies with ease.

most people that want eidolons all the time, just want to try farm arcanes without interruption.
as for planning your life around the game, thats just dumb, if you miss a few nights, its not the end of the world.
its like complaining about boosters timer still going down when you're not playing, which is actually a more valid complaint (buys 7 day booster and goes to work every day for 8 hours a day and sleeps for 4 to 8 hours, thats 84 to 112 hours or more that it can not be used, out of 168 (feels cheated))

as someone already stated, once you have the arcanes, you probably wont be back, its just like every other mission (people only go back to get stuff to sell on the market or to collect resources for what ever reason)

this topic goes both ways, people complain about them being too easy as an end-game event, people complain about them being too hard.
the same goes for anything in the game (until YOU are in a position to do it yourself with ease) then the complaint goes from being too hard to being too easy (walks in with redeemer prime modded for CO and says,"why everything get 1 shotted in 1+ hours survival? please buff").

bottom line, arcanes are powerful, like extremely powerful in some cases, (yes 2x Arcane Guardian r3 on rhino, im looking at you) so the difficulty of framing them is understandable.

And there is the problem.
Is this viable for veterans? sure.
Will it work for new players or even people who have been playing it for a few months?

hell no, they don't have the mods and gear for it.

And you know just as well as everyone else that most people with this supposed "right kit" will automatically leave the group when they see new players or those with a non meta frame/weapon kit as they don't want to waste their time on a mission that will likely fail or have them carrying the team the entire way.

Many players play this game for the fun, I like a challenge, but lets not go overboard.

As for the ability to make this argument go both ways, I've already been there, bosses I could not beat in the first place that I can now one shot, while new players are supposed to have their trail by fire at this point, but instead I swoop in, shoot it one time in its weak spot and it crumbles to the ground, giving the new players an anticlimactic moment where they only just entered the boss room and now get to run to extraction.

THAT'S exactly why I suggest the max damage cap on bosses.

It will keep the "challenge" going for vet's as you can't cheese a boss with exploits or overwhelming amounts of gear you gathered, sure you can still do the most damage out of the entire party, but you can't just demolish them in a single shot.

along with that the newer players can actually build up some experience and enjoy the thrill of a new boss and learn from that.

[5p33dy_01]

1 hour ago, JefTheReaper said:

And there is the problem.
Is this viable for veterans? sure.
Will it work for new players or even people who have been playing it for a few months?

hell no, they don't have the mods and gear for it.

And you know just as well as everyone else that most people with this supposed "right kit" will automatically leave the group when they see new players or those with a non meta frame/weapon kit as they don't want to waste their time on a mission that will likely fail or have them carrying the team the entire way.

Many players play this game for the fun, I like a challenge, but lets not go overboard.

As for the ability to make this argument go both ways, I've already been there, bosses I could not beat in the first place that I can now one shot, while new players are supposed to have their trail by fire at this point, but instead I swoop in, shoot it one time in its weak spot and it crumbles to the ground, giving the new players an anticlimactic moment where they only just entered the boss room and now get to run to extraction.

THAT'S exactly why I suggest the max damage cap on bosses.

It will keep the "challenge" going for vet's as you can't cheese a boss with exploits or overwhelming amounts of gear you gathered, sure you can still do the most damage out of the entire party, but you can't just demolish them in a single shot.

along with that the newer players can actually build up some experience and enjoy the thrill of a new boss and learn from that.

90%-95% of the game already caters to new players.. now you want that to be 100%?
and furthermore, the game doesnt even have the option to change starting difficulty for veterans (probably because of NEW players too), so even if you do want something harder you have to sit through 1 hour or more in the missions.

why stop at damage caps on just eidolons, do it everywhere, so it doest matter if you are MR1 with 0 mods or MR27 with a all the mods, that level 1 enemy will still take 3 hits (and take out any type of rapid-fire or multishot).
it doesnt matter if your amp does 1 damage or 1 billion damage.. shield will still take 100 shots (and make all amps 1 attack per second, in-case someone cant get parts for high fire-rate) 
lets not forget frames... all frames must die in 500 hits, so people that prefer playing a weak frame die just as fast as people with a strong frame.

maybe just give everyone 1 weapon and 1 frame... (sounds like fun... FOR 5 MINUTES)
that way everyone can have fun because nobody will feel left in the dust.

maybe im using ridiculous things, im just pointing out that you need to work on your gear if you have a problem with content (its not like there isnt a whole bunch of videos on youtube telling you EXACTLY what to do)

its a long term game, if you cant handle the time consumption, nobody will be holding a gun to your head.

Edited September 8, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[SquireAngel]

How about we all slow down here? I'm seeing a bunch of toxicity being thrown around about number adjustments, difficulty adjustments, and a bunch of stuff that isn't at all what is up for discussion here. 

For those talking about anything being adjusted beyond times, No. The Eidolons as is are fine as is in terms of difficulty for the actual fights. You should have your arsenal prepared for challenges that are meant to be challenging. While I am trying to discuss accessibility on merit of time management, that does not equate to accessibility in terms of actual content challenge rating. The time that something is available does not inherently impact it's actual challenge within warframe, and as such, is not the point of discussion here. 

To put the point to rest, I am not asking for the difficulty to be lowered or other such none sense, and I'm not a low rank without equipment and means to challenge the Eidolons. I am MR27, have every frame built and forma'd to allow a maximized build that can fit all but the most pigeonholed build that doesn't allowed for a few builds if there are several options for that frame. I have over 1k forma across 150+ weapons with Eidolon meta weapons such as Rubico Prime, Lanka, etc and rivens for them, and various amp configurations with -27. Admittedly I am lower on the grind side of focus, which is a limitation to the big boi club of 5x3's and such forth, but I accept that they have better loadouts for such matters and not asking for the wall to be lowered for my own regard. This is not me boasting, this is me trying to address the concerns and claims that I am a mewling newbie with absolutely no ability to challenge the content.

To bring the issue back to the main topic originally posted, the times that the content is available does not change the challenge of the content itself. It merely opens the content up for those who have differing play times and play schedules. There would be some shift in the systems dependent on it, such as arcane gathering and the like, but these things are already subject to demand shifts and the like. The trade market is not some immovable object that would be destroyed by a singular item having it's price shift slightly, or even entirely. Speaking of which, I highly doubt it would for arcanes, seeing as how those who wanted those arcanes and are willing to grind will do so regardless of the times available, and those who wont wont put the effort forth but will still buy anyways. Supply would increase by a small margin, so indeed the price would be driven down, but there aren't a whole lot of traders who deal solely in arcanes anyways. Even if they were, the ability to freely farm them would put less per set but more sets in their pockets, meaning they would have more supply and more diversity IN supply. It's a trade off, sure, but it's not all negative.  

[GibsonPrime]

23 hours ago, SquireAngel said:

To bring the issue back to the main topic originally posted, the times that the content is available does not change the challenge of the content itself. It merely opens the content up for those who have differing play times and play schedules. There would be some shift in the systems dependent on it, such as arcane gathering and the like, but these things are already subject to demand shifts and the like. ,,,. It's a trade off, sure, but it's not all negative.  

Couldn't agree more.  The right drop rate tweak would alleviate the trading issue.

I've joined two or three tridolon runs.  Killed many a terralyst.  I just hate how these runs are tied to real time.

[inappropriatename5877]

How about this then: Keep the 45 minutes time window, keep the countdown until day time, but do not transition to day no matter how much time passes. When someone enters the PoE, he is moved to an instance pretty much. So keep the time at night indefinitely (but also limit vomvalyst spawns) until the squad decides to leave. That way, people that are not good enough will still be able to try out stuff without feeling pressured by time, and people that are good enough will still be able to do 5x3 or 6x3. New players can thus learn how to fight the Tridolons at their own pace, while veterans can still get the rewards they get now.

[JefTheReaper]

On 2019-09-08 at 7:52 PM, 5p33dy_01 said:

90%-95% of the game already caters to new players.. now you want that to be 100%?
and furthermore, the game doesnt even have the option to change starting difficulty for veterans (probably because of NEW players too), so even if you do want something harder you have to sit through 1 hour or more in the missions.

why stop at damage caps on just eidolons, do it everywhere, so it doest matter if you are MR1 with 0 mods or MR27 with a all the mods, that level 1 enemy will still take 3 hits (and take out any type of rapid-fire or multishot).
it doesnt matter if your amp does 1 damage or 1 billion damage.. shield will still take 100 shots (and make all amps 1 attack per second, in-case someone cant get parts for high fire-rate) 
lets not forget frames... all frames must die in 500 hits, so people that prefer playing a weak frame die just as fast as people with a strong frame.

maybe just give everyone 1 weapon and 1 frame... (sounds like fun... FOR 5 MINUTES)
that way everyone can have fun because nobody will feel left in the dust.

maybe im using ridiculous things, im just pointing out that you need to work on your gear if you have a problem with content (its not like there isnt a whole bunch of videos on youtube telling you EXACTLY what to do)

its a long term game, if you cant handle the time consumption, nobody will be holding a gun to your head.

Please don't use the act of turning something minor into some kind of world shattering disaster.
I reposed a cap for bosses and ONLY large bosses (not even small time bosses) to reduce the power of veterans, while giving newer players a fighting chance.
You think its weird they would cater the game towards newer players? are you new to any business practice? happy players = paying players, the more new players they can rake in, the more they can earn, simple as that.
If new players were unable to access content before having farmed for 2 years, then obviously they would not keep those new players for very long.

Leave alone the damage cap is in itself nothing special, its pretty much the same as the energy bubble's and Eximus enemies, even if you are a vet, your energy will be drained and disabled.

Its called artificial difficulty, it keeps the game interesting, you can't tell me a vet honestly enjoys one shotting everything.

If you still need to put in the effort for a big boss despite being able to one shot everything else, that's when it remains a challenge.

I also dislike the fact that you go assuming things.
I myself don't have any real problems with the Eidolons, except that they are just extremely boring.

I started playing Warframe due to it being a fast passed game, your run, bullet jump, shoot and slash without stopping.
That's what I like about this game, and it is why I hate most of current new Warframe modes, Arbitration with double round times, Eidolons who are designed to be time consuming, Grind missions to grind for grinding for the item you want, I just want fast gameplay, quick match, quick rewards. (as a good example, the great improvement they did for PoE at the start, instead of 1 reward after finishing ALL missions, you now get 1 reward per mission of a bounty, what makes more sense, is much more rewarding, and thus more fun and worth the effort) and the gameplay is also just fast to boot.

Not dancing around a big bullet sponge for 5 minutes trying to break its shields that will not yield unless you use exploits like Volt's shield stacking or the Void strike buff.
Those are exploits that might still get patched at some point, just as a reminder that DE deliberately wants you to shoot at those shields for 5 minutes while dying of boredom.

And just as a fun mind#*!% for you all.
The Eidolon Shields are EXACTLY like the damage cap I am proposing.
Big difference is you can only damage the shields with operator beams, making it even worse then the cap I propose, as the eidolon can be damaged with all weapons rather then just some pea void shooters.

Eidolons could have been way more fun if they were focused on speed gameplay rather then constantly stunting progress with speed-bumps.

As for the whole youtube video's and whatnot, that's proof for me that it is broken and does not work as intended.
If you can only do this effectively with 2-3 frames and a handful of weapons instead of just everything? then it failed to be what it should have been.
Heck by your own logic, if that's the case lets just throw out all warframes and weapons except those few.

Edited September 9, 2019 by JefTheReaper

[5p33dy_01]

On 2019-09-08 at 9:14 PM, SquireAngel said:

How about we all slow down here? I'm seeing a bunch of toxicity being thrown around about number adjustments, difficulty adjustments, and a bunch of stuff that isn't at all what is up for discussion here. 

For those talking about anything being adjusted beyond times, No. The Eidolons as is are fine as is in terms of difficulty for the actual fights. You should have your arsenal prepared for challenges that are meant to be challenging. While I am trying to discuss accessibility on merit of time management, that does not equate to accessibility in terms of actual content challenge rating. The time that something is available does not inherently impact it's actual challenge within warframe, and as such, is not the point of discussion here. 

To put the point to rest, I am not asking for the difficulty to be lowered or other such none sense, and I'm not a low rank without equipment and means to challenge the Eidolons. I am MR27, have every frame built and forma'd to allow a maximized build that can fit all but the most pigeonholed build that doesn't allowed for a few builds if there are several options for that frame. I have over 1k forma across 150+ weapons with Eidolon meta weapons such as Rubico Prime, Lanka, etc and rivens for them, and various amp configurations with -27. Admittedly I am lower on the grind side of focus, which is a limitation to the big boi club of 5x3's and such forth, but I accept that they have better loadouts for such matters and not asking for the wall to be lowered for my own regard. This is not me boasting, this is me trying to address the concerns and claims that I am a mewling newbie with absolutely no ability to challenge the content.

To bring the issue back to the main topic originally posted, the times that the content is available does not change the challenge of the content itself. It merely opens the content up for those who have differing play times and play schedules. There would be some shift in the systems dependent on it, such as arcane gathering and the like, but these things are already subject to demand shifts and the like. The trade market is not some immovable object that would be destroyed by a singular item having it's price shift slightly, or even entirely. Speaking of which, I highly doubt it would for arcanes, seeing as how those who wanted those arcanes and are willing to grind will do so regardless of the times available, and those who wont wont put the effort forth but will still buy anyways. Supply would increase by a small margin, so indeed the price would be driven down, but there aren't a whole lot of traders who deal solely in arcanes anyways. Even if they were, the ability to freely farm them would put less per set but more sets in their pockets, meaning they would have more supply and more diversity IN supply. It's a trade off, sure, but it's not all negative.  

im not trying to be toxic in any way, if people take it that way, thats on them.. they should read what ive said with a calm attitude and try understand what im saying, rather than assuming that im trying to take shots at them and put them in defensive mode... also just think about the whole community and how everything comes together.

i agree that the time could be a bit longer for new players, but those arcanes can be so powerful that they can be a game changer, to the point that a frame can go from dieing often to pretty much never dieing (Hildyrn +aegis +barrier or inaros +grace) (or 240% damage or 60% crit chance)
the reason i died a lot was because i just rushed the star chart (volt with bad damage and basic mods against level 40+ enemies is not easy)

so being able to farm them constantly, makes the game boring faster (take it from someone who started the game and bought hildryn +aegis r3 +barrier r3 set me back around 1500 plat because i got so annoyed with dieing often)
but once i could tank everything i lacked damage, which is no longer the case, but i hadnt even really done a single eidolon until MR 20

complaining about the time gate, is like complaining that forma's dont give MR points, but thats for another topic.

as for anyone complaining about market prices, they should go farm the arcanes themselves (also dont forget to pray to the RNGod), if they cant or find it boring, dont say you want a discounted price (dont be selfish) to someone else who has endured the difficulty or boredom of going through the process, its unfair to them.
i could probably guarantee that IF arcanes were added to the in-game market, you would see prices of 200+ plat for 1 r0 arcane (based on how insane prices are for things there)

my point is that they are intended to be time gated to reduce the constant farm, they are intended to have shield gate, all to force people to take time to get the arcanes that can make a game go from being difficult to being a breeze.
if you can constantly farm them, you just join a group doing them and then you are MR 1 with free r3 arcanes.
not to mention the increase in complaints regarding low rank players joining if its all the time, there will be no break that forces out a lot of new players that can not do anything.
 

3 hours ago, JefTheReaper said:

Please don't use the act of turning something minor into some kind of world shattering disaster.
I reposed a cap for bosses and ONLY large bosses (not even small time bosses) to reduce the power of veterans, while giving newer players a fighting chance.
You think its weird they would cater the game towards newer players? are you new to any business practice? happy players = paying players, the more new players they can rake in, the more they can earn, simple as that.
If new players were unable to access content before having farmed for 2 years, then obviously they would not keep those new players for very long.

Leave alone the damage cap is in itself nothing special, its pretty much the same as the energy bubble's and Eximus enemies, even if you are a vet, your energy will be drained and disabled.

Its called artificial difficulty, it keeps the game interesting, you can't tell me a vet honestly enjoys one shotting everything.

If you still need to put in the effort for a big boss despite being able to one shot everything else, that's when it remains a challenge.

I also dislike the fact that you go assuming things.
I myself don't have any real problems with the Eidolons, except that they are just extremely boring.

I started playing Warframe due to it being a fast passed game, your run, bullet jump, shoot and slash without stopping.
That's what I like about this game, and it is why I hate most of current new Warframe modes, Arbitration with double round times, Eidolons who are designed to be time consuming, Grind missions to grind for grinding for the item you want, I just want fast gameplay, quick match, quick rewards. (as a good example, the great improvement they did for PoE at the start, instead of 1 reward after finishing ALL missions, you now get 1 reward per mission of a bounty, what makes more sense, is much more rewarding, and thus more fun and worth the effort) and the gameplay is also just fast to boot.

Not dancing around a big bullet sponge for 5 minutes trying to break its shields that will not yield unless you use exploits like Volt's shield stacking or the Void strike buff.
Those are exploits that might still get patched at some point, just as a reminder that DE deliberately wants you to shoot at those shields for 5 minutes while dying of boredom.

And just as a fun mind#*!% for you all.
The Eidolon Shields are EXACTLY like the damage cap I am proposing.
Big difference is you can only damage the shields with operator beams, making it even worse then the cap I propose, as the eidolon can be damaged with all weapons rather then just some pea void shooters.

Eidolons could have been way more fun if they were focused on speed gameplay rather then constantly stunting progress with speed-bumps.

As for the whole youtube video's and whatnot, that's proof for me that it is broken and does not work as intended.
If you can only do this effectively with 2-3 frames and a handful of weapons instead of just everything? then it failed to be what it should have been.
Heck by your own logic, if that's the case lets just throw out all warframes and weapons except those few.

you are welcome to make a topic regarding difficulty/damage cap, and we can then discuss this further, as this has no relation to "time gate".

 

Edited September 10, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[inappropriatename5877]

6 hours ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

so being able to farm them constantly, makes the game boring faster

I will disagree on that. Let me try to say it this way:
There are 2 options when farming to get something: Either get it quickly, or get it after like 100 tries.
Doing the same thing 100 times is boring. You won't be like "oh hey i got something rare out of that, neat!", you will most likely be like "ah fckin finally, the reward i wanted"
If you get it quickly though, you will also be able to try it out quickly. That way, if you don't ultimately like it, you won't feel like you wasted so much time, and if you do like it, then good for you. I really want to try some max rank arcanes, but i cannot be bothered with the whole tridolon farming process. When i first played plague star and was comfortable with doing the 4 hemocytes per run, i could calculate how much standing i would need to get 10 of each Exodia,and i was ok with that, because I was progressing towards a reward I was sure to get if I put in the effort.

I'd say that RNG is the problem more than the actual farming. I'd rather have a clear goal to work towards achieving (arcanes in this case), rather than mindlessly toil doing the same thing over and over HOPING for the reward I want to drop.

Which begs the question: How are you gonna make each of the 30 arcanes obtainable without RNG?
Well, there should be challenges for that. Challenges like "Defeat (Eidolon that drops the arcane you want) in X amount of time" or "While fighting (Same eidolon), make sure none of the lures die" or even "During (same eidolon) fight, kill X vomvalysts total".

That way, the player has a clear goal (that will still need to complete 10 times for a maxed arcane), and the farm goes from a droning task to something a bit more interesting, as you don't just have to kill the Eidolon, but also fulfill the requirements for the exact arcane you want. This is better for squads too, because players can find players that want the same rewards, so they know exactly what they have to do, without fear of leaving because one got the reward they wanted and the other one didn't.

[5p33dy_01]

4 minutes ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

I will disagree on that. Let me try to say it this way:
There are 2 options when farming to get something: Either get it quickly, or get it after like 100 tries.
Doing the same thing 100 times is boring. You won't be like "oh hey i got something rare out of that, neat!", you will most likely be like "ah fckin finally, the reward i wanted"
If you get it quickly though, you will also be able to try it out quickly. That way, if you don't ultimately like it, you won't feel like you wasted so much time, and if you do like it, then good for you. I really want to try some max rank arcanes, but i cannot be bothered with the whole tridolon farming process. When i first played plague star and was comfortable with doing the 4 hemocytes per run, i could calculate how much standing i would need to get 10 of each Exodia,and i was ok with that, because I was progressing towards a reward I was sure to get if I put in the effort.

I'd say that RNG is the problem more than the actual farming. I'd rather have a clear goal to work towards achieving (arcanes in this case), rather than mindlessly toil doing the same thing over and over HOPING for the reward I want to drop.

Which begs the question: How are you gonna make each of the 30 arcanes obtainable without RNG?
Well, there should be challenges for that. Challenges like "Defeat (Eidolon that drops the arcane you want) in X amount of time" or "While fighting (Same eidolon), make sure none of the lures die" or even "During (same eidolon) fight, kill X vomvalysts total".

That way, the player has a clear goal (that will still need to complete 10 times for a maxed arcane), and the farm goes from a droning task to something a bit more interesting, as you don't just have to kill the Eidolon, but also fulfill the requirements for the exact arcane you want. This is better for squads too, because players can find players that want the same rewards, so they know exactly what they have to do, without fear of leaving because one got the reward they wanted and the other one didn't.

you have responded to something that is out of context and is going off topic. please keep comments towards "time gate"

[Cerebrophage]

On 2019-09-04 at 10:35 AM, BiancaRoughfin said:

This and the fact that there are enough players crying on the forums complaining the game`s Market is broke for being too saturated. Imagine with people being able to endlessly farm for rare Arcanes?

So,  you're saying because  players want to make money, we shouldn't make it easier for players just to GET the chance to acquire the items themselves. Doesn't seem very legit.

[5p33dy_01]

17 hours ago, Cerebrophage said:

So,  you're saying because  players want to make money, we shouldn't make it easier for players just to GET the chance to acquire the items themselves. Doesn't seem very legit.

it is very easy to GET the chance. you HAVE the chance EVERY single night rotation.

disregarding market prices.
1) by removing the time gate, it takes away one of the very things that make the game interesting for a longer period for newer players.
2) by removing the time gate, it makes grouping with more experienced players more frequent, which means there is higher chances people wont even earn the rewards (it becomes participation rewards)
3) by removing the time gate, it makes RARE POWERFUL drops become more common (just join a group doing eidolons) because you will be carried through the process, which hinders any type of challenge to the event.
4) by removing the time gate, it makes way for a huge leeching player base. ESO/bounties is bad enough, we dont need more frequent leechers in eidolons too.

anyone that can do 2/3x3 or more in 45min, probably wont be complaining about the time gate.
if you or anyone else can not do the same, then you should build up to the point you can, this creates a goal to reach.
if you can not do that, then why should the gate be removed for the minorities convenience (minorities being the people with extremely limited time)? it is after all, designed for veterans.

something people also dont seem to be considering is, there is a lot of people that use this time gate as a challenge, to try do as many as possible in 45 minutes, they are not complaining about it, they are using it as a way to push themselves further.
the arcanes are no longer the real reward, the real reward is what they have managed to accomplish in such a short time.
maybe more people need to adapt to this type of view, instead of begging for an increase in the clock.

Edited September 13, 2019 by 5p33dy_01

[Cerebrophage]

On 2019-09-06 at 5:10 PM, PrismaCat said:

"moderate amount of toxicity"

that is a "moderate" amount of bull. i've replied to join a "casual 3x3" and been told to kill myself because i tried to explain to the group that i had no way i knew of how to gather 8 lures an charge 2 by the time hydrolist's first limb breaks.

like what? i know thats a extreme case with somone who had no idea how the fight works but still, every time i group for this S#&$ i get too stressed to do it because of the absurd amount of intolerance people have for the slightest mistake, lures bugged and didnt spawn? "fk you" vombs arent where they normally are and you cant get a lure charged in 30 seconds? "reee" its just too stressful to deal with. id rather just buy my arcanes with plat :l

That does represent a flaw within the community. It would make it hard for DE to do anything about that. How would you suggest they fix the issue?

[Cerebrophage]

3 hours ago, 5p33dy_01 said:

it is very easy to GET the chance. you HAVE the chance EVERY single night rotation.

disregarding market prices.
1) by removing the time gate, it takes away one of the very things that make the game interesting for a longer period for newer players.
2) by removing the time gate, it makes grouping with more experienced players more frequent, which means there is higher chances people wont even earn the rewards (it becomes participation rewards)
3) by removing the time gate, it makes RARE POWERFUL drops become more common (just join a group doing eidolons) because you will be carried through the process, which hinders any type of challenge to the event.
4) by removing the time gate, it makes way for a huge leeching player base. ESO/bounties is bad enough, we dont need more frequent leechers in eidolons too.

anyone that can do 2/3x3 or more in 45min, probably wont be complaining about the time gate.
if you or anyone else can not do the same, then you should build up to the point you can, this creates a goal to reach.
if you can not do that, then why should the gate be removed for the minorities convenience (minorities being the people with extremely limited time)? it is after all, designed for veterans.

something people also dont seem to be considering is, there is a lot of people that use this time gate as a challenge, to try do as many as possible in 45 minutes, they are not complaining about it, they are using it as a way to push themselves further.
the arcanes are no longer the real reward, the real reward is what they have managed to accomplish in such a short time.
maybe more people need to adapt to this type of view, instead of begging for an increase in the clock.

So, because you want to be able to push your maximization to greater heights, we should exclude those that can't.

Elitism doesn't solve them problem, we need another solution.