Universal Medallions should apply to conclave

[(PSN)NewcastleDisease]

vor einer Stunde schrieb WhiteMarker:

One day people will use search function.
One day people will post feedback in the feedback section and not in general discussion.

😂 you! you made my day - thanks 🤣

[Stormdragon]

2 hours ago, (PS4)EuphoricStamen said:

I'll cut to the chase, I'm not a fan of being unable to use these Standing Tokens in Conclave, it's a broken, meta laden, poorly balanced mode, but I don't blame DE

They are the ones at charge of balancing, and believe it or not, balance was quite finely tuned before the changes made back in late 2017 (PoE sniper changes) and early 2018 (primary and secondary weapons balance pass) that DE hasn't gone back to rebalance. If you won't blame DE, then who?

2 hours ago, (PS4)EuphoricStamen said:

Think of it this way, if the people who bought the Prime Access packs for a modicum of exclusivity based flexing rights have to watch as those very packs are being handed out to everyone else for a quarter of the price they payed, payed with money mind you, then Conclave players bearing the "REEEE, IT'S MIIINE" attitude shouldn't be pandered to, they deserve the same treatment.

Well, whenever improvements to PvP are suggested all we hear from PvE players about development time is "REEEE, IT'S MIIINE", so if you think that said attitude shouldn't be pandered to, then i think you can agree with DE not pandering to PvE players on this one unless this post is a weird paradox.

2 hours ago, (PS4)EuphoricStamen said:

No one should be pandered to, ever.

That's impossible, no matter what change is made, in a huge community with lots of different opinions someone is always gonna be pandered to.

I personally don't mind medallions being accepted by Teshin, but would also love it if PvP got to be more integrated into the game loop.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Stormdragon

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, SneakyErvin said:

You find items through PvE and expect to use them in PvP?

So I guess you'd be fine if DE suddenly starts forcing PvP down your neck in order to finish something in PvE aswell?

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Agile_Aim

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Reflex_Draw

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Snap_Shot

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Soft_Hands

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spry_Sights

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Twitch

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Double-Barrel_Drift

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spring-Loaded_Broadhead

And those are just the conclave mods that drop from the Conculyst, the Battalyst has another 8.

In fact, lets not even mention the fact that you have to "find" items such as Warframes and weapons via PvE in order to use them in PvP.

1 hour ago, (PS4)FriendSharkey said:

Suddenly saying you can get everything these PVP players gutted through against each other while the PVE community who had no skin in the game can now just kill the dumb Ai is pretty insulting to players who have gutted through this

I wouldn't feel that insulted at all, tbh.

In fact, not even slightly.

Edited September 11, 2019 by DeMonkey

[(XBOX)COA Altair]

Just forget the conclave cosmetics, they are not worth it.  You want to know how many medallions you need to get EVERY weapon skin available from conclave?  To simply rank up to the max rank you need 240 medallions.  Then there are 32 weapon skins to buy, each costing 40-50 medallions per skin since they cost 40,000 for some secondaries and 50,000 for primaries, melees, and some secondaries.  After calculating it out 9 cost 40 medallions and the rest are 50 medallions each, totalling out to 1510 medallions required.  To get that many medallions you're going to play the game for thousands of hours to get all of that.  I can almost guarantee you can rank up faster in conclave just by playing conclave then doing all that.  

[844448]

As someone who have played the conclave, I can assure you there is no meta there.

There's no "best weapon" in conclave because everything is separately balanced from PvE so you don't have that low effort killing using ignis wraith or whatever meta you use.

Also, this is more to who can evade better and aim sharper because I got killed more often running on the ground while people are flying around shooting. I thought people want challenge? There's your challenge, an enemy with sentient thinking, adaptive behaviour and on the same level with you on agility, survival and sharpness

[(PSN)FriendSharkey]

20 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Agile_Aim

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Reflex_Draw

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Snap_Shot

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Soft_Hands

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spry_Sights

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Twitch

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Double-Barrel_Drift

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spring-Loaded_Broadhead

And those are just the conclave mods that drop from the Conculyst, the Battalyst has another 8.

In fact, lets not even mention the fact that you have to "find" items such as Warframes and weapons via PvE in order to use them in PvP.

I wouldn't feel that insulted at all, tbh.

In fact, not even slightly.

While in the conclave forums you are negated by another player who feels they are...

Without anything to go on when it comes to the racing that's being talked about. I suspect when it or If that drops in the game then PVE players will have a fair road map to getting whatever it is in conclave they are looking for...Somebody won't be happy, but like the Eidolon Hunt for Trial players that will be the new layout of the land till further notice...

[Umquaptovis]

A better use of time in GD would be to think about how these non rewards could be changed to be something useful. Or you know be a high-end reward that people would want at a 5%drop rate.

[DeMonkey]

1 minute ago, (PS4)FriendSharkey said:

While in the conclave forums you are negated by another player who feels they are...

Irrelevant, I was just remarking on your generalisation that it would be insulting to people who've played through pvp.

[Uhkretor]

Title -> "Universal Medallions are a lie"

 

... So is the cake.

[SneakyErvin]

5 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Agile_Aim

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Reflex_Draw

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Snap_Shot

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Soft_Hands

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spry_Sights

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Twitch

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Double-Barrel_Drift

https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Spring-Loaded_Broadhead

And those are just the conclave mods that drop from the Conculyst, the Battalyst has another 8.

In fact, lets not even mention the fact that you have to "find" items such as Warframes and weapons via PvE in order to use them in PvP.

I wouldn't feel that insulted at all, tbh.

In fact, not even slightly.

But those mods arent PvP exclusive when it comes to their use.

Skipping the whole point of PvP (which I already personally do in this game) while reaping the rewards simply dont seem right to me. The mods and frames are no different from the grind you go (went) through in WoW before hitting up PvP. But you are still required to PvP in order to get the rewards locked behind the game mode. Be it for gear or post-transmutation simply for skins it really doesnt matter. You need to participate one way or another, world pvp or bgs.

[PatternistSlave]

8 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

But telling them to farm a low drop rate for minuscule standing is okay?

It's fun enough I wouldn't have to is the point.

8 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

it just feels like it cause you don’t want to put the effort forth

Quite the contrary.  I've done a good bit of PvP.  Why I understand how important supplementing the pathetic grind for standing would have been.

8 hours ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

Do you really even want these items or just the ability to say you can get them?

If all I wanted was the items I would have cheated to get them like I was told repeatedly to do.  What I want is the game improved so players don't feel it necessary to cheat.

[DeMonkey]

29 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

But those mods arent PvP exclusive when it comes to their use.

And? Your post was,

"You find items through PvE and expect to use them in PvP?" 

This isn't an unreasonable assumption at all. You find Warframes in PvE that you use in PvP, you find mods in PvE that you use in PvP.

Why would it be unreasonable at all to expect a universal syndicate medallion to apply to the PvP syndicate? There are a number of items found in PvE that apply to PvP.

[(PSN)OmegaSlayer]

Loads of people who maxed Conclave played in close lobbies trading kills

So yeah, it's really unfair for them

There's load to do in Warframe and Conclave is the less entertaining thing in a toxic envyronment

[seprent]

Fast way: Actually playing conclave
Slow way: Medallions as they on a 5% drop chance for 1000 rep 

The fact this exception exists irks me since the only thing i want from conclave is the syandana and that isnt enough to encourage me to play last time i actually participated was when we had that pvp snowball fight event i'd be totally willing to take the slow route since there is nothing in that game mode(s) are of actual interest to me. Also everything in conclave mods wise can be traded further invalidating people's need to play it for those things when you can trade or farm for them. The only real thing Conclave has going for it is Cosmetics that are Meh at best, a syandana that's fashion is locked behind playing conclave, and the starter warframes. 

[(PSN)Lei-Lei_23]

On 2019-09-10 at 11:20 PM, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

... the skins??? Aren’t something that most Tenno really care about in terms of fashion frame because there’s plenty of other options. And the sigils while nice, are completely optional and other then personal achievement nobody really cares. 

As much as I don’t want to say this, but please do not assume nor regulate player interests where Fashion Frame is concerned. Aside from the Syandana which I’m sure the majority of the playerbase is aware that it only activates when you complete Conclave challenges to activate the fires, the weapon cosmetics and sigils can be desirable for those that want to achieve a certain type of aesthetic on their weapons/frames and shouldn’t be argued that “there’s plenty of other options” to compromise for them.

That’s lowballing the Typhoon rank and why some if not most players want to achieve that rank: For the cosmetics that you can earn in it.

[(PSN)AotoSatou14]

7 hours ago, seprent said:

Fast way: Actually playing conclave

Only if you find a match.

[(PSN)sweatshawp]

3 hours ago, (PS4)Lei-Lei_23 said:

As much as I don’t want to say this, but please do not assume nor regulate player interests where Fashion Frame is concerned. Aside from the Syandana which I’m sure the majority of the playerbase is aware that it only activates when you complete Conclave challenges to activate the fires, the weapon cosmetics and sigils can be desirable for those that want to achieve a certain type of aesthetic on their weapons/frames and shouldn’t be argued that “there’s plenty of other options” to compromise for them.

That’s lowballing the Typhoon rank and why some if not most players want to achieve that rank: For the cosmetics that you can earn in it.

If that’s the case why not play the mode... a lot of issues would be less prevalent if a lot of you did so... 

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, (PS4)sweatshawp said:

If that’s the case why not play the mode... a lot of issues would be less prevalent if a lot of you did so... 

This argument is absurdly circular, and given all the presented complaints about PvP, rather disingenuous.

[SneakyErvin]

14 hours ago, DeMonkey said:

And? Your post was,

"You find items through PvE and expect to use them in PvP?" 

This isn't an unreasonable assumption at all. You find Warframes in PvE that you use in PvP, you find mods in PvE that you use in PvP.

Why would it be unreasonable at all to expect a universal syndicate medallion to apply to the PvP syndicate? There are a number of items found in PvE that apply to PvP.

I guess I should have worded it better.

And it is unreasonable because you skip the PvP and go straight for the rewards. The rewards are there for those that PvP. Being able to turn in a PvE found standing items is like being able to grind X faction standing in something like WoW and then converting it to honor. And afaik there are no basic conclave medallions either, so it would be even more unreasonable to start introducing them to PvP.

And it is good they keep PvP and PvE as seperate as possible, otherwise we will eventually end up with Nightwave PvP weeklies/elites, frames locked behind conclave or lunaro etc. in the future. It is also good in the sense that DE wont see a skyrocket increase in PvP standing gained and think "hmm this mode may not be as dead as we expected" and start wasting more resources on it and introducing new, never to be played modes.

edit: If anything, they should move (or well add) the PvP items to a new and completely seperate vendor that just accepts unimeds. That way there would be no confusion about actual participation and so on, no risk that DE will think conclave is more popular than it isnt etc.

Edited September 12, 2019 by SneakyErvin

[DeMonkey]

8 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

And it is unreasonable because you skip the PvP and go straight for the rewards.

The same as anywhere else, to a point?

Skip Toroid/Orb farming with the Vox Solaris, skip Eidolon hunting with the Quills, skip the tiresome scanning for Simaris etc etc. You're skipping something no matter which faction you give it to.

14 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

And it is good they keep PvP and PvE as seperate as possible, otherwise we will eventually end up with Nightwave PvP weeklies/elites, frames locked behind conclave or lunaro etc. in the future.

Please don't be absurd... You know that's fallacious.

14 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

It is also good in the sense that DE wont see a skyrocket increase in PvP standing gained and think "hmm this mode may not be as dead as we expected" and start wasting more resources on it and introducing new, never to be played modes.

Because they wouldn't be able to see how much of that came from universal medallions, or the fact that every increase was consistently 1,000? They'd just see an increase in standing gained, think conclave is magically good now and move straight on to developing it further and locking frames behind it?

[SneakyErvin]

8 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

The same as anywhere else, to a point?

Skip Toroid/Orb farming with the Vox Solaris, skip Eidolon hunting with the Quills, skip the tiresome scanning for Simaris etc etc. You're skipping something no matter which faction you give it to.

Please don't be absurd... You know that's fallacious.

Because they wouldn't be able to see how much of that came from universal medallions, or the fact that every increase was consistently 1,000? They'd just see an increase in standing gained, think conclave is magically good now and move straight on to developing it further and locking frames behind it?

Toroids and everything else are part of the PvE side of the game. All of those activities are also far more beneficial than trading them for dis runs and hoping for a medallion. But yes, if you really hate one of those game modes you can do it through disruption. But in reality you arent skipping anything, because you go out of your way to do dis for the chance of a drop. If that same time would have been spent doing the intended activity you would have several thousands more standing in the same amount of time. In the end you still need to do them all for the actual rewards aswell as advancement towards those rewards. The unimed does afterall only give standing.

Yes because we obviously havent already gotten NW tasks that are far out of our way compared to regular gameplay. All part of very niche modes.

Yeah but they may also think that people actually like the things locked behind the conclave, so add even more crap there since we can technically get it for unimeds.

[DeMonkey]

5 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

All of those activities are also far more beneficial than trading them for dis runs and hoping for a medallion. But yes, if you really hate one of those game modes you can do it through disruption. But in reality you arent skipping anything, because you go out of your way to do dis for the chance of a drop. If that same time would have been spent doing the intended activity you would have several thousands more standing in the same amount of time. In the end you still need to do them all for the actual rewards aswell as advancement towards those rewards. The unimed does afterall only give standing.

You realise that all applies to conclave as well, right?

Universal Medallion farming won't magically surpass actually playing conclave. There's no salient point here.

5 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yes because we obviously havent already gotten NW tasks that are far out of our way compared to regular gameplay. All part of very niche modes.

Were any of them conclave? No? Okay then.

5 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Yeah but they may also think that people actually like the things locked behind the conclave, so add even more crap there since we can technically get it for unimeds.

They only need to look at the feedback to see that people 'actually' like the things locked behind conclave.

Edited September 12, 2019 by DeMonkey

[SneakyErvin]

4 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

You realise that all applies to conclave as well, right?

Universal Medallion farming won't magically surpass actually playing conclave. There's no salient point here.

Were any of the conclave? No? Okay then.

They only need to look at the feedback to see that people 'actually' like the things locked behind conclave.

How will it not surpass it? You get standing, you reach tier cap, you turn in generic non-PvP related sacrifice and then you repeat that for 5 tiers. Where exactly does it require a player to ever set foot in conclave? As opposed to Vox where you actually need to go and get items from OV to increase your tier.

No but we got K-Drives which is a mini-game on its own.

Feedback is only posted by a minority, data tells more than that.

[DeMonkey]

6 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

How will it not surpass it?

Because it's a 5% chance to get 1,000 standing.

That means that 1 in 20 rounds Round 3 and upwards will give you a medallion, if you save enough conduits. For the sake of math, lets say it's a 1 in 20 chance at every single round.

It will require on average 100 rounds just to get through the first rank, 540 total rounds to reach rank 2, 1,420 rounds to reach rank 3, 2,820 rounds to reach rank 4 and a staggering 4,800 total rounds to reach rank 5. That's not including the further rounds required in order to even get the skins people want.

And you claim that this will surpass actually playing conclave? I hope you're trying to be funny.

13 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

No but we got K-Drives which is a mini-game on its own.

Which is still not conclave.

13 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

Feedback is only posted by a minority, data tells more than that.

And?

You posted a concern that DE will see that people actually want these cosmetics, I pointed out that the feedback already shows that. In game metrics will show it easier, certainly, but your concern is already alive and well, so it's a rather moot point.

[SneakyErvin]

1 minute ago, DeMonkey said:

Because it's a 5% chance to get 1,000 standing.

That means that 1 in 20 rounds Round 3 and upwards will give you a medallion, if you save enough conduits. For the sake of math, lets say it's a 1 in 20 chance at every single round.

It will require on average 100 rounds just to get through the first rank, 540 total rounds to reach rank 2, 1,420 rounds to reach rank 3, 2,820 rounds to reach rank 4 and a staggering 4,800 total rounds to reach rank 5. That's not including the further rounds required in order to even get the skins people want.

And you claim that this will surpass actually playing conclave? I hope you're trying to be funny.

Which is still not conclave.

And?

You posted a concern that DE will see that people actually want these cosmetics, I pointed out that the feedback already shows that. In game metrics will show it easier, certainly, but your concern is already alive and well, so it's a rather moot point.

Yeah as of now it wont really matter. But DE have also said they will expand on the unimed system. So it is better they take the stance now instead of waiting for when it is too late to revert it.

My point regarding K-Drives is that they arent afraid to add niche modes to NW.

And while feedback and metrics go hand in hand we are still talking about a company that bases their riven balance on player usage. I cant say I trust a company like that to base their future decisions correctly on feedback and data.