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At What Part of The Game Do You Think The Majority of NEW Players Quit The Game?


VotumPrime

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On 2019-09-22 at 5:15 AM, FrostDragoon said:

I have to disagree that complexity alone is responsible for that difference. Partially because older games taught you how to play through design and expected you to try all the buttons to learn the controls. The other part is because you can compartmentalize every system in Warframe into something that isn't hard to understand. I think it's more that players are too lazy/entitled to believe they should have to go look for their own answers these days, because there isn't a question that a newbie could reasonably ask that the answer hasn't been provided hundreds of times.

 

The one thing DE could do to resolve a lot of the "Vor's Prize, now what?" syndrome is to have the Lotus inbox you some tutorial directions in the form of:

-Explain what MR is and how it is raised, why it's important, and the cheap/easy methods to get more early (MK1 weapons, for example).

-Explain how the Star Chart works and how to progress in it, including Junctions.

-Explain in more depth how mods work, polarities, and the importance of increasing mod rank. Maybe even provide about 200 Endo to get them started and some pointers on how to get more.

That's it. Most of these are self-explanatory enough that just these instructions would give enough direction for players to branch out and explore to progress their game. The game itself wouldn't really need anything changed on this front.

I like that and maybe as they get better make the Orokin things less difficult. I mean I don't have much endo but I could use my excess mods to do it.

 

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On 2019-10-03 at 3:03 AM, IIWingSaberII said:

Unfortunately in the hindsight, I don't work for DE nor have comprehensive stats for it that exist before me in front of my desk where the grind is endless and RNG is my cruel mistress. 

If the player wishes to skip the progression by the paying and winning the game easily, you do realize the obvious fact, no mind will love to stick is the simple rule in the textbook which is a given fact as a dopamine in their brains being registered and shall keep seeking new content in order to get attracted. 

Essentially, here are the following thoughts of new players and vets will quit at any junction in this game according to my opinion :-

  • If you give everything for free, like a father who gives to the child who never works hard, they will definitely quit at any junction in order to skip challenges be in any context of a human life. Literally, spoiled minds can never appreciate anybody's work and process behind it unless the kindness is brought to halt and Devs will face endless misery of  creating new content for each update rather patching the previous ones in order to satiate every players mind. Hence, the community stays divided and starts playing spartans to conquer over here or in-game for that matter. In a nutshell, kindness is your enemy and don't go overboard with it, please.
  • Excessive payment wall like booster packages is fruitful to company in terms of microtranscations as we all deliciously love food arriving from branded fast food corner in a single purchase which serves as another dopamine factor of any player's brain and brag about it to other players after joining the random public session. Seriously, are these kind of players trying to assist with salty thoughts placed towards rest of squad members, just because you bought a booster or received it for free from the sortie rewards.This point of this thinking is still bizarre apart for obvious point unless you wish for everyone to reciprocate on each statement I came across during my grind in all years of playing with randoms especially new players talk like I won a biggest lottery of my life and waiting for me to respond in false positive manner - "Hey, it's awesome to have your booster and will assist during our grind, join in, please". The cold reality truth of being vet is that we want to you to join in our squad in order to improve the drop rate that is set by game design regardless your booster and I don't try to objectify in any angles like a PvP player does for K/D in a match.
  • The biggest spicy talks has been all about grind for both new players and vets as we rock in the same boat yet for some odd reason, we are united on this part. Sadly, DE turns a blind eye while drinking their wine having smug faces on the camera during a livestream. Is this some of canadian trait or culture, I prefer not to delve into this anymore over the years and remain stoic as usual nor have a choice in this matter to begin with. 
  • DE loves to hear you out, if you're a star studded or a mini celebrity on the social media. If not, they are completely dismissive about giving any response to any individual unless your post get rated as hot in order to get their attention. Ultimately, what is the point being vocal on the forums since our opinions doesn't matter to them in the end. In all cases, I can never speak to a human being who shut their minds towards me and placed a wall of ignorance in front of my eyes. 
  • The developers of this game has been on the following corroded path by bringing in, the true gambling factor such as riven mods which is no different from loot boxes which has made it worst in terms of grinding factors rather to focus on curtailing it anytime soon. However, the choice we have in our hands is that either accept or leave it. 

In conclusion, as I speak here from my experience and knowing the DE over the years, they couldn't care less about being any individual being vocal in any format, they will dismiss it at their discretion. As they say, give them a cake of grofit, people will listen. If not, nobody cares in the end is the cold reality we live in this world. 

P.S. I do sincerely apologize as my above points may have crucified and not a vent rather speaking my genuine experiences as individual player out here in this forums. 

I think this man deserves a Gold Medal of Honor 

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3 hours ago, Excaulibar said:

Yeah so I was thinking, maybe depending on the difficulty of getting the frame it would vary how much time should be spent...

Ex. MR1 starts to build a frame say Rhino, if he or she doesn't quite have godly weapons for their MR then the time for the blueprint should be taken down. However if the same MR1 has the godly weapons for their MR then make the components crafting time 3 hours shorter and the build time for the blueprint vary. 

Now for a MR 27, it is different. they know that they basically have found the godly weapons required to get them the components and blueprints faster. But the lessen the grindiness for some of them. but they will still have to wait 3 days for it since they have a higher rank.

Now making the grindiness for everything slightly lower, by increasing the percentages. 

Ex. Ash. You farm the same mission, yet have a small chance of getting a part then a low chance of getting the one part you need.

Ex. Primes. Farming bounties should have a greater chance of getting a part, a better chance of getting the relic of the prime you want, a change might help. Same goes with missions

I like the approach, but not the how.

I would actually simplify it according to the drop source.

Star Chart boss drop frames: Parts build in 1 hour, complete frame builds in 3. 

Star Chart mission mode frames: Parts build in 3, complete frame in 6. (This is stuff like Ivara, Harrow, Octavia, etc)

Open world bounty frames: parts in 6, complete in 12.

Quest frames: parts in 6, complete in 12.

Post-game frames: Parts in 12, complete in 24. (This is stuff like ESO, Arbitration, Sorties, Eidolons, etc if/when they have frames from these sources.)

Clan Dojo and NightWave frames: parts in 12, complete in 36.

Prime and special variants (such as Vandal, Prisma, Wraith, etc): same as now.

Weapons should all be reduced to 12 or less, except for the variants mentioned above.

 

Granted, this is based on the assumption that DE actually wants to keep their arbitrary long build times. I'd rather remove build times entirely and remove the cash-grabby, p2w-looking "Rush" option outright.

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19 hours ago, FrostDragoon said:

Granted, this is based on the assumption that DE actually wants to keep their arbitrary long build times. I'd rather remove build times entirely and remove the cash-grabby, p2w-looking "Rush" option outright.

I see that part as well.

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On 2019-10-18 at 7:43 PM, FrostDragoon said:

Warframe does better than most of them.

Yeah, you're utterly hopeless. Somehow implying that Warframe does better than Breath of the Wild, Xenoblade 2, Code Vein, FFXIV, etc.

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On 2019-10-25 at 1:26 PM, Ephemiel said:

Yeah, you're utterly hopeless. Somehow implying that Warframe does better than Breath of the Wild, Xenoblade 2, Code Vein, FFXIV, etc.

I think they mean in terms of some of the mechanics and the fact that the feel is somewhat better. But i see mostly why you would say that.

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I think I spend more time watching youtube and the wiki to figure things out than playing. But coming from more survival games I am used to minimal hand holding. But that in its self is daunting for new players.  

I made way to many mistakes in warframe.  I am MR 10 now.  I just unlocked Saturn lol.  

Like all games that offer crafting I have just stuck with that model.  Make stuff. Constantly at my foundry making things.  Anything and everything.  Then running missions to make more things.  I have sooo many weapons.  

But I suck at using them.  I'm not great in missions. I didn't play the game.  Instead I grind forma to make weapons and frames better.  

But that does not make you a decent player.  I have so many tricked out weapons and toys to play with but cant even manage a proper slide attack.

But I do this in every game. 

I am now at a point where is just die during missions. 

If I just stuck with the Braton and a sword or basic stuff and practiced like others told me to do then I would be less frustrated.  

I'm not a quitter though. But in all seriousness if I learned more about elemental types and how and when to use them I would be in a much better state.

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3 hours ago, Hexsing said:

I think I spend more time watching youtube and the wiki to figure things out than playing. But coming from more survival games I am used to minimal hand holding. But that in its self is daunting for new players.  

I made way to many mistakes in warframe.  I am MR 10 now.  I just unlocked Saturn lol.  

Like all games that offer crafting I have just stuck with that model.  Make stuff. Constantly at my foundry making things.  Anything and everything.  Then running missions to make more things.  I have sooo many weapons.  

But I suck at using them.  I'm not great in missions. I didn't play the game.  Instead I grind forma to make weapons and frames better.  

But that does not make you a decent player.  I have so many tricked out weapons and toys to play with but cant even manage a proper slide attack.

But I do this in every game. 

I am now at a point where is just die during missions. 

If I just stuck with the Braton and a sword or basic stuff and practiced like others told me to do then I would be less frustrated.  

I'm not a quitter though. But in all seriousness if I learned more about elemental types and how and when to use them I would be in a much better state.

For elemental, you don't have to get too fancy. First of all, if you're frame can run Corrosive Projection, do it. Secondly, lots of frames have armor strip as part of their kit these days. If yours does, you can probably focus on something other than Corrosive (though it's still strong vs Grineer). Otherwise, Corrosive + Fire or Cold, but preferably not Blast, is a pretty general purpose element that's good against most things. Radiation + Viral is too, except certain things (like Heavy Gunners). That's probably the "tl:dr" version.

Learning how to min-max them can be a lot more involved, especially if you know what faction you'll be going against ahead of time. Learning when to use status weapons and when to use crit weapons plays into this too, and your frame's capacity for armor stripping will as well (Frost, Ash, Saryn, etc). Inversely, if your frame has a damage amplifier, that might influence it the other way (like Nova, Chroma, Rhino, Octavia, Banshee, etc). As a general rule, if you lack armor stripping or damage boosting on the frame, I would lean toward status weapons. The scaling on Crit with those multipliers gets so ridiculous that heavy status effects isn't so necessary. Ofc, you could use a hybrid weapon if you just want something more general purpose. Hybrids generally don't tend to have as high of top end potential, but they are certainly enough for the star chart. It's also worth noting that if you're playing in a squad and coordinating your CP auras correctly, you can skip most of the status stuff outright in favor of those boosting frames and crit weapons. Nova + CP + Lex Prime is one easy example that is pretty affordable and accessible to most players.

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I've seen a LOT of people quit around MR2-3.  If they make it past that point, the next heavy loss is somewhere around MR8-9.
That's just from my experience mentoring new players and when they stop showing up for whatever reason. 

 

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4 hours ago, FrostDragoon said:

For elemental, you don't have to get too fancy. First of all, if you're frame can run Corrosive Projection, do it. Secondly, lots of frames have armor strip as part of their kit these days. If yours does, you can probably focus on something other than Corrosive (though it's still strong vs Grineer). Otherwise, Corrosive + Fire or Cold, but preferably not Blast, is a pretty general purpose element that's good against most things. Radiation + Viral is too, except certain things (like Heavy Gunners). That's probably the "tl:dr" version.

Learning how to min-max them can be a lot more involved, especially if you know what faction you'll be going against ahead of time. Learning when to use status weapons and when to use crit weapons plays into this too, and your frame's capacity for armor stripping will as well (Frost, Ash, Saryn, etc). Inversely, if your frame has a damage amplifier, that might influence it the other way (like Nova, Chroma, Rhino, Octavia, Banshee, etc). As a general rule, if you lack armor stripping or damage boosting on the frame, I would lean toward status weapons. The scaling on Crit with those multipliers gets so ridiculous that heavy status effects isn't so necessary. Ofc, you could use a hybrid weapon if you just want something more general purpose. Hybrids generally don't tend to have as high of top end potential, but they are certainly enough for the star chart. It's also worth noting that if you're playing in a squad and coordinating your CP auras correctly, you can skip most of the status stuff outright in favor of those boosting frames and crit weapons. Nova + CP + Lex Prime is one easy example that is pretty affordable and accessible to most players.

This is good advise for more new players.  For sure.  I am good now.  Just wish I would have known this much earlier.  I love denfense missions.  Which is basically how I did what I did and leveled my weapons.  

Still suck in a lot of situations.  Like darned slide attacks.  

I main Nyx and Nekros mainly.  With a hint of Wisp here and there.  

Nyx can strip armor with my modified Pacifying bolts.  So I usually use other elements for her like toxin, gas etc.  Because she can already bypass shields and armor with one hit.  

But I really appreciate the info.  Because its the one thing I needed.

Also.  The modding of status weapons vs crit.  I know now. But. I didnt know then.  Knowing the difference between the two are needed and not So well explained unless you Google everything or watch vids.

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4 hours ago, Rahlence said:

I've seen a LOT of people quit around MR2-3.  If they make it past that point, the next heavy loss is somewhere around MR8-9.
That's just from my experience mentoring new players and when they stop showing up for whatever reason. 

 

Very true. Most of the people I know leave at the MR 9 test. Due too the stealth mechanics.  

But you are correct.  Those appear to be when my friends who have played left.  I had someone leave after the pistol aiming test. 6 I think.  And the parkour test.   

Its the 24 hours before you can remaster or retry.  So some people dont progress for days or weeks.  This sends people running.  People are used to instant levels.  Which they get in other games.

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7 hours ago, Hexsing said:

Still suck in a lot of situations.  Like darned slide attacks.  

Want a protip for that one? Remap slide to Q. It's much easier to press frequently than Ctrl (assuming you use defaults). The fluidity is night and day.

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3 hours ago, Hexsing said:

Im left handed.  So I use c as my crouch.  Remapping is a good idea.  I will check that out.  Cuz...just dont slide. Lol.  

You might check out this thread. Someone in there posted an interesting Lefty layout that looks pretty good.

 

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  • 1 month later...

Actual new player here (31 hours), and there are several moments where I thought "existence is pain" and considered quitting. 

  • Crafting times (and time in general)

This actually did make me quit, a couple of years ago when I played on consoles. Waiting hours to days to make something is ridiculous, and the fact you can pay irl money to buy an in-game currency to speed up the process makes it feel p2w or like a mobile game, which obviously makes people not want to play anymore.

In addition, a lot of either money (for platinum) or grinding is needed to progress. Many players are fairly young, and so do not have much in terms of money. And to new players to the genre, the time required for grinding stuff is daunting, to say the least. Not to mention simply not feasible in many cases, as people have jobs, schools, social interactions and other games that require time being taken up. This is probably the number 1 reason for new players quitting.

  • The Mars Junction

I recently got back into the game a few days ago (day 6 today), on PC this time, and am enjoying it a lot. However, this was the least enjoyable thing ever, and I am convinced that whoever made scanning 3 cephalon fragments on Mars a requirement to use the junction there has no idea what the word 'fun' means, and has likely gotten it confused with the word 'tedious'. It adds nothing of value to the game, and serves only to kill new player's interest in the game. Of my 6 days playing so far, I spent the first 2 doing the quests, having fun, and trying to figure out how the game works. The next 2 days were spent trying to find the damned cephalon fragments. They spawned infrequently in stupid places, and I didn't even know what they looked like until 1 popped up on my radar (on earth). I should imagine a fair amount of new players look at this and nope out.

  • No idea what to do

Finally, many new players have no idea how to get better at the game. What mods do they use? What weapons do they use? How do they beat _? What frame(s) do they use? Are they supposed to use multiple frames? How do clans work? The game offers no answers. Which is why I've been stuck at the Ceres --> Jupiter junction for the last couple of days.

Some people have replied in the thread saying that platinum can be earned without paying for it (I have no idea how, apart from trade, and even then I have no idea what I can/should trade, for how much, etc.). Others have said to find a clan or just use recruiting chat to ask for help. The thing is, recruiting chat seems to just be general chat, which new players wouldn't know, and there's no actual recruiting going on, so new players (including myself) have no idea how to join one.

And before people reply, yes, I know I'm doing something wrong. The problem is that I don't know what it is that I'm doing wrong. I just don't know what I'm meant to be doing in general.

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On 2019-09-12 at 12:36 AM, VotumPrime said:

State what part of the game you think it is and why do you think they quit at that part and what DE should do to remedy it so that things stay interesting and keep these new players from leaving forever.

Well I can tell you from just recent experience: I did some marketing for warframe to three of my friends. They started playing - together - for around 6 hours. That was a few weeks ago, they didnt log in since. When I asked them "why, what didnt you like?". They all said same thing, the crafting and wait time for weapons and warframe. Then I remembered, when I started playing I did buy some plat from start and I did rush a few things in the beginning. If you are a new player and don't spend "some" money the game will just "make you quit" since you can't progress in a acceptable rate.

The change I would make is reduce the crafting time, from zero to max 30 min, on starter frames and weapon, up to M.rank 5 or so. At that point players are more invested into the game, have more stuff to play around with and can accept the 12-72 hour crafting.  

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23 minutes ago, AyeJimmy123 said:

Cleared for space reason. 

Crafting times: I mean yes they can be annoying at times but is not that bad, I mean, you really NEED the thing you are crafting right now? Because 99/100 times you can wait the craft time no problem. It seems more a problem about being impatient than a problem of p2w. Again, I started playing around Feb and I did not spent a single penny until late game, starting and try to adjust with what you had is what I found the most fun. 

 

Mars Junction: I mean is that really hard to go look up what they are? I agree that is not the most fun things ever but come on, if I get a mission that says like "find 10 x materials" and I don't know what it is I go look it up or play for myself and try to find it. I don't remember it being particularly hard, when I did it last year for the first time it took me and a friend's like 20 min total. 

 

Don't know what to do: I mean why you really NEED to min-max from day one? Why having a learning curve is bad? I discovered myself that shield is bad compared to hp by testing, by playing and trying mods. Imo trying yourself is one of the most fun things in the game, if a person don't like this imo they have more a competitive behavior that does not really belong in WF. 

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I feel like a lot of people download the game, play a bit, get bored because they don't have a regular squad to play with and leave.

 

Truly, if I didn't have my group of friends to play with I probably wouldn't have stayed until a full year or year and a half later when there was more content. 😛

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On 2019-09-21 at 1:09 PM, (NSW)Evilpricetag said:

 I'm a whale when it comes to this game, I know I shouldn't, but I feel at least a little entitled after plopping like $480 (not including plat sales) dollars a year on this game.

I am a free to play player. And I am very grateful to other players who do buy fashion things or pay to avoid grind or save time. I believe paying customers are, very much so, allowed to feel entitled.

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